Thank you very much for the compliment, and I'll be glad to try to help. Keeping the subwoofer gain at 3/4 should be fine. If you hear the subwoofer make any noises that you think it shouldn't, such as obvious distortion or port chuffing, then you can back-off a little. It's a good idea to keep your AVR trim level in negative numbers (somewhere in the -3 to -5 range should be good).

You can do that by starting with a lower number during the calibration process, or you can lower your trim level after the calibration if you want to. Remember that negative numbers are different from positive numbers. -4 is a larger number than -9, so as you get closer to 0, you are raising the volume, not lowering it.

I don't understand your question about crossovers and the LFE setting. I assume that you are talking about a setting on your subwoofer. You can just leave it at LFE, as you really won't want your subwoofer trying to play higher frequencies than about 120Hz, anyway. That setting shouldn't have affected the distance that YPAO set. 3m is probably correct and you could manually set it back to that.

The distance setting is not an actual distance. The AVR is simply measuring the arrival time of the sound from the subwoofer. Due to the subwoofer's own internal processing, that sound will always take longer to arrive than the physical distance would indicate.

Room treatments can help with the higher bass frequencies played by our speakers, from about 120Hz up, and that can add clarity to the sound. It takes very thick bass traps, typically located in corners, to affect frequencies down to about 60 or 70Hz. Below those frequencies, even really thick bass traps will have little to no effect. Very low-frequencies will go right through concrete walls, much less through acoustic materials.

Just to put the Y-connector issue to bed again, for others who may be reading along, I will repeat that all the Y-connector does is to send an additional 6db from the AVR to the subwoofer to help turn-on the subwoofer from Auto mode. It doesn't actually add any extra output to the subwoofer. The subwoofer can only play as loudly as it can play, regardless of how strong the starting voltage from the AVR is. If your subwoofer turns on from Auto mode, when it should, then there is absolutely no advantage to using a Y-connector into both subwoofer inputs.

Regards,
Mike


Edit: Seeing the post just ahead of this one, you can experiment with the bass tone control if you want to. That will only affect the bass in your front speakers--not your subwoofer. I would leave the other subwoofer adjustment at 0, and make volume changes with the trim level in the subwoofer configuration menu, and with the subwoofer's gain control.

It is only the truth , weeks ago I read most of your subwoofer guide thread and will try to finish it asap and it was full of information and knowledge... and I was only thinking that a person who took God knows how many days or even weeks or more to write this and waiting nothing in return is an amazing person who deserve at least a compliment which is definitly not enough ... thank you for your answers and thank to you almost all your explanations I already knew from your thread

I am thinking to do the method you mentioned at your thread that a member done to get more SW gain by trimming other speakers .

Again thank you and really appreciate your effort and time .

Hi everyone,


First post. I just replaced a single REL T7 (8" driver/10" passive) with two SB12-NSDs because the amp died after 5 years. I am a two channel guy and have a integrated amp with no bass management. I connected the subs with the pre-amp out and just do not understand how to set this up. The sound is very underwhelming. My previous subs (the REL and before that a HSU vtf10 mk2) crossovers were set at 45hz and the gains have always been set very low (never past the 9 o'clock range) so that it just barely filled in the background. My mains are Magnepan 1.6s.


I have spent countless days scouring Google, AVS and audiogon for set up tips. Nothing seems to work. Either they are bloated or not there. I tried them in each front corner and also staggering them front to rear. Honestly, with the last two subs I just threw them in the corner and they sounded good with minimum placement. It seems that I have to run one 180° out of phase to get some bass. My room is 15x22x7.5. dry-walled, in the basement with carpet and pad over concrete. Ceiling is not finished but is filled with Roxul. I do not have a door hung yet but have a 36" doorway at the back (probably acting like a port).



Does anyone know what each hash mark on the crossover represents? It shows 30 htz or 150 htz. The gains are set at 12 O'clock on both SB12s with the crossover around 9 o'clock (I think around 45-50 htz?) Phase is 180° on one and zero on the other.



I have a radio shack analog sound meter but all I have found is instructions using the pink noise generator that I do not have. Although, I do have a CD that will play a pink noise. Do I put both subs in the listening spot and do the crawl?



Any help would be appreciated before I send these back.
Thanks!

Thanks guys, all of this was really helpful. So I havent had a lot of time to play with the settings, I'll have more time later this week, but I ran YPAO again, and YPAO set the sub to -9.0 this time. So I raised it up to -5.0 on the AVR. Then I raised the gain on the subwoofer to about 2'oclock and played with the sub trim in the options menu and I left the bass tone alone at 0, I also tend to think that the bass tone wont effect the sub. It's much better now! Now its about finding that sweet spot and I plan to try the sub crawl as well. I'll keep you guys updated.

One other comment on this one....If your Yamaha receiver has ‘Extra Bass’ feature, ensure you disable it. I found with it on it was choking the ULF output.....confusing as that may seem. I deactivated it at the same time I adjusted those Bass Trim and Tone settings under ‘Options’ befor re-running YPAO.....night and day difference.

Before, I was turning my PB16 volume up to -5dB to get any significant output....which seemed really high considering most folks have their PB16 volume set between -10 and -15. I almost thought I had a faulty amp issue. After making those adjustments in the Yamaha, my PB16 is cranking with the sub’s volume set at -15.

^^^

Unless your furniture is made of brick or concrete, the subwoofer won't even know it is there. [IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/wink.gif[/IMG]

For corners then will the rear ported sub of the PC2000 be ok then vs the top firing of the 4000? Does it matter?

For corners then will the rear ported sub of the PC2000 be ok then vs the top firing of the 4000? Does it matter?

For corners then will the rear ported sub of the PC2000 be ok then vs the top firing of the 4000? Does it matter?

It is only the truth , weeks ago I read most of your subwoofer guide thread and will try to finish it asap and it was full of information and knowledge... and I was only thinking that a person who took God knows how many days or even weeks or more to write this and waiting nothing in return is an amazing person who deserve at least a compliment which is definitly not enough ... thank you for your answers and thank to you almost all your explanations I already knew from your thread

I am thinking to do the method you mentioned at your thread that a member done to get more SW gain by trimming other speakers .

Again thank you and really appreciate your effort and time .

Also glad you have posted your compliment to Mike, and Thank you for doing so

Mike did spend lots of time writing this Guide, and keep adding new information, when it become available to him. And also answer so many questions, with very detail reply for the OP situation, on many different threads

This is the most detail guide, I ever seen for subwoofer set-up, and did learn a few things myself, after been in this Hobby for many years

The reason, some members around here, have this Guide link, on their Signature. And also became a Sticky, in the subwoofer Threads.


Ray

Thank you both very much for the kind words! I don't take posts like these for granted, and hearing them helps to make the work I have put into the Guide all the more worthwhile.

I have been out of town on business, and pretty well out-of-contact, since early Wednesday? morning (I'm almost too tired to even remember when I left ) or I would have responded sooner. Thanks again!

Regards,
Mike

Finally tested it.

Well I finally decided on a woofer plan to go with my 5.1 system of ML Motion 40’s and the Motion 30 Center. Going with the new NAD 758 surround receiver, seems like a great piece for the money and a single svs sb3000, flying blind as it is too new to have been opined on. Does look great on paper. Was going to go with a pair of sb2000’s but decided to go with a bit more quality potentially as opposed to quantity. Have to wait a few weeks to get the bdi media cabinet so won’t be able to report back for a while. Not a an over the top bass freak so think the one woofer should do if not can always add a second later regards. Ned.

Actually, since the Audioengine A5 are powered speakers, it should be pretty easy. Connect the inputs of the SB2000 to the Soundblaster instead of the A5. Connect the outputs of the SB2000 to the inputs of the A5. Adjust the volume of the subwoofer until it sounds right. The subwoofer will crossover at 80 Hz, playing everything below 80 Hz, while sending everything above to the A5.
A standard Stereo RCA cable, male both ends should be fine between the subwoofer and A5, not sure what the connection to the Soundblaster is, but one end of the cable will need to be male Stereo RCA, and the other end whatever the Soundblaster needs.

No separate amp or receiver needed.

Hey drh3b, was 80 Hz crossover an arbitrary number you chose (and from there, calibrate accordingly)? As the A5's are probably small (rather than mid-sized) bookshelf speakers, would a higher crossover be more appropriate with the SB2000s? i.e. 100Hz-120Hz? However, A5+ speakers are rated 1.5dB down at 50Hz, so going by what's mentioned by SVS, I'd set it around ~60Hz (which SVS classify is the crossover to set for 'Large' bookshelf speakers)? I'm not so sure how to judge.


Did a bit more searching and found frequency response of the A5's:
https://www.soundandvision.com/conte...-labs-measures
Appears they roll off from 100hz and down, and between 100-110 there's a slight decline, would I be right to suggest I should set the sb2000 x-over between approx 100 and 110hz?

Any way, just an observation since I've hooked up these is that right now the volume is set at or around the 9 o'clock mark - any more than that it overpowers the room - insane.

Actually, since the Audioengine A5 are powered speakers, it should be pretty easy. Connect the inputs of the SB2000 to the Soundblaster instead of the A5. Connect the outputs of the SB2000 to the inputs of the A5. Adjust the volume of the subwoofer until it sounds right. The subwoofer will crossover at 80 Hz, playing everything below 80 Hz, while sending everything above to the A5.
A standard Stereo RCA cable, male both ends should be fine between the subwoofer and A5, not sure what the connection to the Soundblaster is, but one end of the cable will need to be male Stereo RCA, and the other end whatever the Soundblaster needs.

No separate amp or receiver needed.

When you hook it up like the way I suggested, the crossover to the A5 is automatically set at 80 Hz, and isn't adjustable. I just looked at the graph, and the -3db point is 57 Hz, so you should be fine. It looks like there is a small hump at 100 Hz and 1kHz, don't know how audible they'll be to you. It's possible that you can adjust the crossover control on the SVS, but that will only affect the subwoofer(low pass), not the A5, so you want that set at the 80 Hz, to match what is being sent to the A5*.

The 80 Hz crossover isn't arbitrary, it's where most people can't localize sound coming from the subwoofer.
The important thing is it should sound good to you, and with the components you have, just adjusting the subwoofer volume to taste should get you pretty good sound.

*Left that out of the original suggestion.

Hi Ned

A very good way of thinking, to get a single better sub, instead of two lesser ones. While I am a fan of dual sub, and PB-2000 are also well regarded. I think you did the right decision to get a single SB-3000. It might be all you need, for your sound preference. If not, just adding another will be easy, when the budget recover.

Let us know how it sound with your Martin Logan, I bet it will sound very sweet.


Ray

Was going to go with a pair of sb2000’s but decided to go with a bit more quality potentially as opposed to quantity.

I think you did the right decision to get a single SB-3000. It might be all you need, for your sound preference. If not, just adding another will be easy, when the budget recover.

The PB-1000 is a gem but I feel like it is too much power for the room I have it in. I barely use the volume on it and wonder if I’d be better off with any old sub. I listen to music only.

Really looking forward to getting the system together. I’ve heard the Martin Login Motion 40’s a few times and really think they are a sleeper speaker system, quality way above their pay grade, really fast and detailed from 40hz all the way up. Amazing mid bass and midrange detail and of course the folded foil tweeter. If the svs blends well and gives me the bottom octave, the system should sound great. I don’t need volume much more than 90db anymore so the 40’s should be fine as far as volume output, much more interested in the quality and taking care of my ears, we only have two! Thanks. Regards. Ned.

For protecting our hears, I know what you mean. At work, I always wear double hearing protection. No matter if single or double is require. I want to enjoy my Audio hobby, as long as I can.

Wishing you the best, with the integration of your new sub, with your ML speakers.
For that type of volume requirement, your new SB-3000. Should play very nice, once the best place for-it, is found within your room. Not sure, if you are aware of this Guide for sub/s and speaker integration. So just in case here's a link;
Guide to Subwoofer Calibration and Bass Preferences
While it is a long read, and should be read at least twice. It is full of useful information.

All the best in your search, of a perfect sound.


Ray

This the first time, I heard this one

Anyhow, the Golden rule when it come to a single, or multiple subs.
It is always better have too much sub/s, than not enough. That same rule also apply to power from an AVR, or a combination of an AVP with power amp/s. My suggestion would be keeping your PB-1000. Or perhaps if still able to exchange-it, for a different model. To try a SB-1000.

Since you only listen to music. You want to stay with a sub that do have a flat, frequencies response. Many older subs, did tend to boost some frequencies, to make them sound more impressive.


Ray