AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/)
-   HDTV Software Media Discussion (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/114-hdtv-software-media-discussion/)
-   -   Sony confirms BD will allow movie copying to laptops/other devices! (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/114-hdtv-software-media-discussion/785331-sony-confirms-bd-will-allow-movie-copying-laptops-other-devices.html)

xboxboi 01-11-2007 05:52 AM

huh !!!

Sony's home entertainment unit, David Bishop has confirmed during CES that Blu-ray movies will include a feature that will allow copies of the movies to be transferred to laptops or other devices.

It seems like in an attempt to prevent BD from being illegally copied to computer devices, BD is going to include this feature in its movies. A legal BackupBlu-ray anyone? if the movies can be copied into a transferable file, cannot it be transfered via p2p as well?

http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=71699

Quote:


Blu-ray DVDs are to include a feature that will allow copies of films to be transferred to laptops or other devices.

It's an effort by Sony to gain wider acceptance of its new format and, more importantly, rival Microsoft's HD-DVD technology.

Speaking at the Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas this week, head of Sony's home entertainment unit, David Bishop, indicated that we'll see this feature soon.

"It's not currently part of anything on our current release schedule, but we'll probably roll it out sometime this year."


khwiggins2 01-11-2007 08:29 AM

Really? I though if you copied your home movies to blu-ray disks, Sony owned your movies.

deria 01-11-2007 08:37 AM

I'm not sure how this would work, but it sounds pretty similar to the Managed Copy function of HD-DVD. Either way, though, you can be sure that the resulting copy will ber personally identifiable to you (which is reasonable; managed copy is about allowing the consumer to exercise his fair use rights, not about piracy).

dialog_gvf 01-11-2007 08:38 AM

Quote:


Blu-ray DVDs are to include a feature that will allow copies of films to be transferred to laptops or other devices.

It's an effort by Sony to gain wider acceptance of its new format and, more importantly, rival Microsoft's HD-DVD technology.

Isn't that Managed Copy? Or is BD going to introduce it's own variant?

Gary

WickyWoo 01-11-2007 09:01 AM

Managed copy has always been an optional feature of BR. It's required for HD-DVD.

More than likely the files are encrypted, and are tagged with your player key when you copy them out. Then if they find you uploading them, your butt gets blacklisted

I wouldn't be shocked if they charged you a few bucks either.

stanger89 01-11-2007 09:25 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by WickyWoo View Post

Managed copy has always been an optional feature of BR. It's required for HD-DVD.

See, I've never liked this answer, MC is supposed to be a mandatory part of AACS, and since BD uses AACS, should be mandatory on BD as well as HD DVD.

I also don't like the idea that it appears to be on a disc-by-disc basis (ie "we'll add it to movies later") and that ""It's not currently part of anything on our current release schedule,"

That just doesn't give me a warm-fuzzy.

WickyWoo 01-11-2007 09:29 AM

Quote:


I also don't like the idea that it appears to be on a disc-by-disc basis (ie "we'll add it to movies later") and that ""It's not currently part of anything on our current release schedule,"

It's optional because the studios don't like their stuff being in a copyable digital form period. Managed copy is required for HD DECKS, not for each and every disc. What you're going to see is an iPod/PSP version on the disc that will be unlocked somehow, probably through a decryption program and online activation.

Once one company does it with success, more will do it. I thinkSony would really like to save money on bandwidth, and getting people to buy both versions. After all, wouldn't you pay $1.99 to unlock it rather than $10 from iTunes? (let's pretend ripping will never be an option)

stanger89 01-11-2007 09:37 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by WickyWoo View Post

It's optional because the studios don't like their stuff being in a copyable digital form period.

I'm well aware of that, but that's not the issue.

Quote:


Managed copy is required for HD DECKS, not for each and every disc.

No, MC was supposed to be Mandatory per AACS, ie we were supposed to be able to make an MC of any disc. This is the whole issue of MC vs MMC.

I also believe it was the other way around, that players were not required to provide a means to MC, but that if you had a player that could, you could make an MC of any disc.

Quote:


After all, wouldn't you pay $1.99 to unlock it rather than $10 from iTunes? (let's pretend ripping will never be an option)

I don't have any interest in a crapified PSP version. I'm only interested in 1:1 perfect copy for my Media Server.

If they won't provide me a way to do that, they can shove it. I will not purchase a movie I can't make a copy of. If I can't make a copy, I don't own it, and I'm not going to "purchase" something I don't own.

WickyWoo 01-11-2007 09:42 AM

Quote:


I don't have any interest in a crapified PSP version. I'm only interested in 1:1 perfect copy for my Media Server.

That's not goign to happen. Ever.

Is it that hard to change discs? Maybe you should buy one of those 200 disc changers.....

JeffY 01-11-2007 09:47 AM

I wonder if they got Blu-Ray association permission before saying that, I doubt Fox is happy about this.

PeterS 01-11-2007 09:48 AM

THIS IS NOT MANAGED COPY

IT IS MUCH MUCH WORSE!!!!

Sony is talking about also placing on the disc a digital version of the film. This would be precompressed to a smaller size for playing on something like a video iPod. Issues are:

1) It will be HEAVILY DRMed by Sony!!! Remember Sony's capabilities in DRM - I thought you might.
2) It will be at whatever size/compression ratio that they determine.
3) It will only be possible to read this file with an appropriate Sony BD-ROM drive (which supports this new DRM).

This is not in reponse to MANAGED COPY but to the fact that HD-DVDs are now shipping new titles with standard DVDs on the other side (something BD can't do) as they SD discs are quite useful to those looking to move the movie on to their portable video player.

ottscay 01-11-2007 10:14 AM

Sooner or later someone will make a software program to rip them, and you should feel free to use said program, because you hav a legal right to. Just don't go around uploading them to the internet.

It's a good business idea to put PSP/video ipod version on, although I'll just continue to use software that rips my DVDs and turns them into the appropriate format for my ipod (I will never, EVER, pay for a movie twice unless I am getting few features/content, not to use it on a different machine).

dialog_gvf 01-11-2007 10:41 AM

This is the end of movies on UMD. BD discs will be the new way of distributing movies for PSP.

They just added a market for BD discs. And they are a lot cheaper anyway. And the PSP user is encouraged to get a PS/3.

Gary

nataraj 01-11-2007 11:27 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by WickyWoo View Post

That's not goign to happen. Ever.

Who really are you ? Tell us what your background is ... what industry you work in (not the company, mind you).

It seems you are not aware of all the (M)MC issues that have been discussed over several months. Search ....

darinp2 01-11-2007 11:36 AM

77 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by WickyWoo View Post

Managed copy has always been an optional feature of BR. It's required for HD-DVD.

This was the thinking for a while, but based on more recent comments I have gotten the impression that MC will be basically the same on both formats, if we ever get it. Is your statement above just your impression, or do you know it to be the case for a fact?

--Darin

lymzy 01-11-2007 11:39 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by darinp2 View Post

or do you know it to be the case for a fact?

--Darin


He even think HDCP should be implemented in the add-on drive...

hdkhang 01-11-2007 09:41 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by nataraj View Post

Who really are you ? Tell us what your background is ... what industry you work in (not the company, mind you).

It seems you are not aware of all the (M)MC issues that have been discussed over several months. Search ....

WickyWoo is on a crusade to save all from the evil FUD being spread by HD-DVD supporters, he just doesn't like lies and all... so everything he says is the truth

Cheers...
Duy-Khang Hoang

stanger89 01-12-2007 04:50 AM

Amir has confirmed that MC is to be mandatory per AACS, and that it should be the same (licensing wise) on both HD DVD and BD.

WickyWoo 01-12-2007 12:23 PM

Quote:


Who really are you ? Tell us what your background is ... what industry you work in (not the company, mind you).

It seems you are not aware of all the (M)MC issues that have been discussed over several months. Search ....

I'm not typing it out again. Do a search. Besides, I doubt if after you've asked this twice and gotten the same response. Notthat you would believe anything I told you anyway. Because the secrets of Hollywood are really decided here in Philly, where they import all the film crews from NYC and it's virtually impossible to get on any production that comes here outside of extras construction and food service work because of it

Quote:


This was the thinking for a while, but based on more recent comments I have gotten the impression that MC will be basically the same on both formats, if we ever get it. Is your statement above just your impression, or do you know it to be the case for a fact?

It's optional on the hardware. In other words, you can't plug your iPod into the USB port on your BR player (assuming there will be one with one), and necessarily be guaranteed the ability to download said copy from disc to iPod.

nataraj 01-12-2007 12:31 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by WickyWoo View Post

I'm not typing it out again. Do a search.

I searched and didn't find. Afterall for a newbie you are a prolific poster

Besides, if you write statements of opinions as if they are fact, then I'm going to ask such questions.

So, your reply is, that you don't actually know any insider info, but just try to pretend you know. Otherwise you wouldn't be writing things like "That's not goign to happen. Ever."

mikemorel 01-12-2007 03:47 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by nataraj View Post

I searched and didn't find. Afterall for a newbie you are a prolific poster

Besides, if you write statements of opinions as if they are fact, then I'm going to ask such questions.

So, your reply is, that you don't actually know any insider info, but just try to pretend you know. Otherwise you wouldn't be writing things like "That's not goign to happen. Ever."

I believe WickyWoo has stated without hesitation (as if he knew) that BD-25 costs $1.50 to produce, and BD-50 costs additional $0.50 ea. At that point, well, frankly I stopped listening...it's so ridiculous that I did not know what to say. Sounds like I'm catching a January viral infection....

mikemorel 01-12-2007 03:58 PM

Ah yes...here it is...

https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...&&#post9131225

Quote:


Try closer to $1.50. Maybe if you include all of the packing, shipping, handling, advertising and storage of the beast it might hit $5. BD-50 is at most 50 cents more.

Which is why adult video companies interviewed say that BD is way too expensive and way more than HD DVD.

Way to back up the facts there Wicky.

nataraj 01-12-2007 04:35 PM

Quote:


Try closer to $1.50. Maybe if you include all of the packing, shipping, handling, advertising and storage of the beast it might hit $5. BD-50 is at most 50 cents more.

Yep. Stop the BS or give a link to the source ...

WickyWoo 01-12-2007 04:44 PM

Quote:


believe WickyWoo has stated without hesitation (as if he knew) that BD-25 costs $1.50 to produce, and BD-50 costs additional $0.50 ea. At that point, well, frankly I stopped listening...it's so ridiculous that I did not know what to say. Sounds like I'm catching a January viral infection....

Or I just did a quick google:

http://www.proactionmedia.com/blu-ray_replication.htm

$1.99 for lots of 5000 for BD-25. We can assume the studios get closer to the $1.49 price listed for 100,000. This after all is not a contract based facility but designed for one-offs(another $0.62 for a case).

No, I didn't state that as a fact. I said it was CLOSER to $1.50. You can get standard DVD for about $1.20 in lots of 5000, so it's going to add a premium. A BD-ROM is not materially different from a DVD in terms of how it's constructed. A DVD-9 is $0.21 more, so let's just say $0.50.

Quote:


So, your reply is, that you don't actually know any insider info, but just try to pretend you know. Otherwise you wouldn't be writing things like "That's not goign to happen. Ever."

Or I could just go by the umpteen statements in the media, the columns, the article etc published over the past few years about how they don't want people ripping their discs. Why else would they be moving to provide you with a portable version? To rip their discs, or even to recompress them involves copying, and they don't want you doing that in any way shape or form. I don't know how they could be any clearer on that topic.

Quote:


searched and didn't find. Afterall for a newbie you are a prolific poster

If you want to find it, then search and read all my posts until you find it. I'm not typing out the exhaustive details of my background again simply because you're positive I'm some plant from the enemy. check your private messages.

nataraj 01-12-2007 05:02 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by WickyWoo View Post

No, I didn't state that as a fact.

Let us se ...

Quote:


Try closer to $1.50. Maybe if you include all of the packing, shipping, handling, advertising and storage of the beast it might hit $5. BD-50 is at most 50 cents more.

What part of the above says, it was your estimation or guess ? How do you "know" bd-50 is atmost 50cents more ... ?


Quote:


Or I could just go by the umpteen statements in the media, the columns, the article etc published over the past few years about how they don't want people ripping their discs.

Why don't you try reading about MMC.

Quote:


check your private messages.

Thanks.

WickyWoo 01-12-2007 05:26 PM

Quote:


What part of the above says, it was your estimation or guess ? How do you "know" bd-50 is atmost 50cents more ... ?

Had you actually read my post......

CLOSER indicates an approximate range, not an exact figure. Since no one actually has public rates for BD-50 yet, we can only use DVD-9 as a guideline. So since BD-25 is only about $0.30 more than DVD-5, once can logically deduce that since it is a mere $0.21 increase for DVD-9, and since gluing together 2 layers is pretty much the same thing no matter what you're doing, that it would be no more than $0.50

Simple deduction

opathoris 01-13-2007 12:32 AM

I highly doubt this will actually ever happen. Sony can say all sorts of cool stuff will happen with blu-ray in the future, but when push comes to shove, the blu-ray consortium will kill it. Sony loves to sell potential, and not actual functions you can use today, or ever. If there is a digital copy it will be some horribly crippled DRM version for the psp that can only use Sony brand memory sticks or some nonsense.

Jeff Lampert 01-13-2007 06:32 AM

Quote:
once can logically deduce that since it is a mere $0.21 increase for DVD-9, and since gluing together 2 layers is pretty much the same thing no matter what you're doing, that it would be no more than $0.50

Considering that the yields on the BD50s were very poor early on, then wouldn't that mean there is more to the process then what you just described? Just curious.


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:35 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.