Oppo UDP203’s 21x9 CIH Mode - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 58Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 301 Old 12-23-2017, 05:31 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
coolrda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bakersfield, CA
Posts: 3,913
Mentioned: 243 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1387 Post(s)
Liked: 1503
Oppo UDP203’s 21x9 CIH Mode

Oppo’s 21x9 feature really wasn’t a big deal to me when it was released. It is now. My RS520 locks with 4K/60 and I’m dead in the water when it comes to streaming online content and having aspect control, whether from Netflix, Amazon, YouTube or others. The 21x9 fixed lens feature is huge. It’s so nice having the Oppo default to the 4K 16x9 screen for menus of all sources when shutoff. I’ve always preferred my Oppo remotes over my iRule or harmony hub control for control of the disc. And now it handles all my scaling too. Pretty sweet. I got permanent thumb drives for trailers and cal patterns. Really makes things simple. If you run a fixed lens setup give it a shot. It’s a killer feature that can save you some major cash.
Uppsalaing and Negatron like this.
coolrda is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 301 Old 12-24-2017, 02:54 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
CAVX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 8,942
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Liked: 179
Yeah, should have my OPPO 203 in Jan, 2018 and looking forward to the progressive upgrade to UHD. A-lens stays regardless of the projector upgrade.
blastermaster and john hunter like this.

Mark Techer

I love my Constant Image Height system!
CAVX is offline  
post #3 of 301 Old 12-24-2017, 03:33 PM
Member
 
john hunter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 183
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 69 Post(s)
Liked: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolrda View Post
Oppo’s 21x9 feature really wasn’t a big deal to me when it was released. It is now. My RS520 locks with 4K/60 and I’m dead in the water when it comes to streaming online content and having aspect control, whether from Netflix, Amazon, YouTube or others. The 21x9 fixed lens feature is huge. It’s so nice having the Oppo default to the 4K 16x9 screen for menus of all sources when shutoff. I’ve always preferred my Oppo remotes over my iRule or harmony hub control for control of the disc. And now it handles all my scaling too. Pretty sweet. I got permanent thumb drives for trailers and cal patterns. Really makes things simple. If you run a fixed lens setup give it a shot. It’s a killer feature that can save you some major cash.
Can only agree wholeheartedly. A really great feature that opens up every PJ to anamorphic support.
john hunter is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 301 Old 12-24-2017, 08:59 PM
Member
 
huse0054's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 23
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 1
i don't understand, what exactly does all this mean? Why would be of benefit?
huse0054 is offline  
post #5 of 301 Old 12-25-2017, 07:09 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
coolrda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bakersfield, CA
Posts: 3,913
Mentioned: 243 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1387 Post(s)
Liked: 1503
Quote:
Originally Posted by huse0054 View Post
i don't understand, what exactly does all this mean? Why would be of benefit?
For one thing, a lot of projectors give you aspect ratio or scaling control with 4K/24-30 but not 4K/60. This is beneficial for a lot of external 4K content when you have a roku or other streaming device plugged into the Oppo.

Another is that menus and overlays on the disc stay locked to the 21:9 window while you change the contents AR. Heres an example.

This is the Menu when stretched by the projector.



This is with the projector set to full and the Oppo doing the scaling. The menus are always on the screen regardless or AR. Now its like watching on a true native 21x9 panel.
coolrda is offline  
post #6 of 301 Old 12-25-2017, 12:16 PM
Member
 
huse0054's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 23
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 1
i see, that makes sense now thanks for the further detailed info. Am I safe to assume the sony- ubp-x800 would not have this ability?
huse0054 is offline  
post #7 of 301 Old 12-26-2017, 09:10 AM
AVS Forum Club Gold
 
Shawn Kelly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 968
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 171 Post(s)
Liked: 109
FWIW, we've been working closely with Oppo to get all these modes in and working properly but we're still fine tuning. The "Full" mode when video output is set to 21:9 fixed or movable is still off - it horizontally stretches and therefore crops the sides. This will be fixed in the next firmware update.
DenverMDM likes this.

Shawn Kelly
Panamorph, Inc.
www.panamorph.com
[email protected]
Shawn Kelly is offline  
post #8 of 301 Old 12-26-2017, 01:20 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
CAVX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 8,942
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Liked: 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn Kelly View Post
FWIW, we've been working closely with Oppo to get all these modes in and working properly but we're still fine tuning. The "Full" mode when video output is set to 21:9 fixed or movable is still off - it horizontally stretches and therefore crops the sides. This will be fixed in the next firmware update.
Good to hear.

What would be even better is if the studios turned on the 21:9 mode in their work flow for disc mastering.
DenverMDM likes this.

Mark Techer

I love my Constant Image Height system!
CAVX is offline  
post #9 of 301 Old 12-26-2017, 03:34 PM
AVS Forum Club Gold
 
Shawn Kelly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 968
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 171 Post(s)
Liked: 109
Working on it. Just one of our missions in the realm of wagging the dog. I assume you're just talking about the AR flag.

Shawn Kelly
Panamorph, Inc.
www.panamorph.com
[email protected]
Shawn Kelly is offline  
post #10 of 301 Old 12-26-2017, 04:31 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
coolrda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bakersfield, CA
Posts: 3,913
Mentioned: 243 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1387 Post(s)
Liked: 1503
Quote:
Originally Posted by CAVX View Post
Good to hear.

What would be even better is if the studios turned on the 21:9 mode in their work flow for disc mastering.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn Kelly View Post
Working on it. Just one of our missions in the realm of wagging the dog. I assume you're just talking about the AR flag.
Yep. Even if they don't give us enhanced for 21x9, I'd be happy with the flag that triggers auto stretch with 2.40 content when set for fixed or moveable 21x9. Thanks and keep at it.
coolrda is offline  
post #11 of 301 Old 12-28-2017, 02:48 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
CAVX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 8,942
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Liked: 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn Kelly View Post
Working on it. Just one of our missions in the realm of wagging the dog. I assume you're just talking about the AR flag.
Yes. Not that different to how DVD had flags for 16:9 enhanced which we used to our advantage, BD and UHD should have their flags for 21:9 turned on. It would provide us with a full panel worth of image without the need to scale.

I get that most of the world is 16:9, but this allows the highest possible res for every system and for those with 16:9, the answer is simple, don't turn on the 21:9 mode, rather, leave it at 16:9.

LG(?) has already made a curved 100" 5120 x 2160 display. More will follow if there is software. In fact, all the good things about TVs these days started out in PC monitors. Those included progressive scan and high frame rates. Notice the shape of PC monitors of late? Many are moving to the "ultra wide" aspect of 2.37:1.
BattleAxeVR likes this.

Mark Techer

I love my Constant Image Height system!
CAVX is offline  
post #12 of 301 Old 12-28-2017, 06:36 AM
AVS Forum Club Gold
 
Shawn Kelly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 968
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 171 Post(s)
Liked: 109
Hi Mark,

Ah the glorious days when DVDs were anamorphic and the players just down converted to letterbox!

Unfortunately at this point the UHD BD flag is only considered to identify the format of the content without intention to actually provide anamorphic data.

Yep - chicken and egg. The studios aren't motivated to add UltraWide "stuff" because the market isn't big enough but in part the market isn't big enough because the studios don't put out that added UltraWide stuff. Our hoped-for ace in the hole some years ago was that Vizio put out a 21:9 panel through a major channels but they really dropped the ball on marketing so nobody bought it.

Constant encouragement seems to be the recipe of the day.
BattleAxeVR likes this.

Shawn Kelly
Panamorph, Inc.
www.panamorph.com
[email protected]
Shawn Kelly is offline  
post #13 of 301 Old 12-28-2017, 02:09 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
CAVX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 8,942
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Liked: 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn Kelly View Post
Hi Mark,

Ah the glorious days when DVDs were anamorphic and the players just down converted to letterbox!

Unfortunately at this point the UHD BD flag is only considered to identify the format of the content without intention to actually provide anamorphic data.
One thing I've noticed since owning an OPPO (still using the 103D) is that the display actually shows the format as 16:9 regardless of the image being letterboxed or full screen.

Did some research and apparently 21:9 is part of the BD spec, they just choose not to use it.

Mark Techer

I love my Constant Image Height system!
CAVX is offline  
post #14 of 301 Old 12-28-2017, 03:59 PM
AVS Forum Club Gold
 
Shawn Kelly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 968
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 171 Post(s)
Liked: 109
We were active both in the CEA working group for standards and as part of the BDA since these discussions began (under the Folded Space moniker). Again, constant "encouragement" but so far that's all we and other champions of the cause have been able to accomplish.

Shawn Kelly
Panamorph, Inc.
www.panamorph.com
[email protected]
Shawn Kelly is offline  
post #15 of 301 Old 12-30-2017, 03:06 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
CAVX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 8,942
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Liked: 179
We have had 16:9 for close to 30 years now. Yawn, it time for something new.

Mark Techer

I love my Constant Image Height system!
CAVX is offline  
post #16 of 301 Old 01-02-2018, 06:31 PM
Senior Member
 
sbquart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 289
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 162 Post(s)
Liked: 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn Kelly View Post
Working on it. Just one of our missions in the realm of wagging the dog. I assume you're just talking about the AR flag.
Shawn, can you confirm they will be fixing the HDR misconvergence issue when stretching. Myself and others have noted this on the 203 thread when using our lenses. Reds and blues tend to bleed when stretching. Thanks.
sbquart is online now  
post #17 of 301 Old 01-02-2018, 06:58 PM
AVS Forum Club Gold
 
Shawn Kelly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 968
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 171 Post(s)
Liked: 109
Just to confirm - are you sure it's the Oppo stretch mode or is it the lens? The Phoenix and older CineVista lenses were designed to do this and then rely on the panel alignment feature in JVC, Sony and Epson projectors to converge.

Shawn Kelly
Panamorph, Inc.
www.panamorph.com
[email protected]
Shawn Kelly is offline  
post #18 of 301 Old 01-02-2018, 11:02 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
coolrda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bakersfield, CA
Posts: 3,913
Mentioned: 243 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1387 Post(s)
Liked: 1503
Quote:
Originally Posted by sbquart View Post
Shawn, can you confirm they will be fixing the HDR misconvergence issue when stretching. Myself and others have noted this on the 203 thread when using our lenses. Reds and blues tend to bleed when stretching. Thanks.
I have that issue as well. Only with the Oppo scaling. No issue with the proj scaling.
coolrda is offline  
post #19 of 301 Old 01-02-2018, 11:09 PM
Senior Member
 
sbquart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 289
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 162 Post(s)
Liked: 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn Kelly View Post
Just to confirm - are you sure it's the Oppo stretch mode or is it the lens? The Phoenix and older CineVista lenses were designed to do this and then rely on the panel alignment feature in JVC, Sony and Epson projectors to converge.
Definitely the Oppo. I can make it happen on my TV as well.
sbquart is online now  
post #20 of 301 Old 01-03-2018, 03:42 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
CAVX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 8,942
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Liked: 179
Has this been reported to OPPO?

I have found their customer service in regards to faults to be one of the best I have dealt with.

Mark Techer

I love my Constant Image Height system!
CAVX is offline  
post #21 of 301 Old 01-03-2018, 06:24 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
coolrda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bakersfield, CA
Posts: 3,913
Mentioned: 243 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1387 Post(s)
Liked: 1503
I haven't yet but I will. Now that I think about it I have seen it in a movie, a horizontal blue line. Must be a timing issue.
coolrda is offline  
post #22 of 301 Old 01-06-2018, 12:53 PM
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 868
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 519 Post(s)
Liked: 292
Quote:
Originally Posted by CAVX View Post
LG(?) has already made a curved 100" 5120 x 2160 display. More will follow if there is software. In fact, all the good things about TVs these days started out in PC monitors. Those included progressive scan and high frame rates. Notice the shape of PC monitors of late? Many are moving to the "ultra wide" aspect of 2.37:1.
I like 21:9 monitors but the extra resolution provided by 5K ultrawide is useless for movies, only for games.

For movies the ideal 21:9 monitor resolution is 3840 x 1600 so there is never any horizontal scaling, only vertical cropping or scaling depending on what you prefer. Upscaling for nothing, by a non-integer ratio (1.33x horizontally and variable vertically, depending on the exact vertical resolution of the movie in question which as you know can vary quite a bit from 1600 lines to 1640 or more), results in lowered image quality and sharpness.
BattleAxeVR is offline  
post #23 of 301 Old 01-06-2018, 02:40 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
CAVX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 8,942
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Liked: 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by BattleAxeVR View Post
I like 21:9 monitors but the extra resolution provided by 5K ultrawide is useless for movies, only for games.

For movies the ideal 21:9 monitor resolution is 3840 x 1600 so there is never any horizontal scaling, only vertical cropping or scaling depending on what you prefer. Upscaling for nothing, by a non-integer ratio (1.33x horizontally and variable vertically, depending on the exact vertical resolution of the movie in question which as you know can vary quite a bit from 1600 lines to 1640 or more), results in lowered image quality and sharpness.
Based on what I am seeing from Epson and Optoma UHD projectors, Scaling or more to point, 1:1 pixel mapping is irrelevant with UHD content.

However, the true 21:9 mode for UHD has 2160 vertical pixels and would support 5120 pixels if the studios would encode properly. At this time, they are just catering for a 16:9 market, so everything is maxed out to 3840 wide. Which kind of reminds me of early DVD days when studios were not using the anamorphic enhancement function, so would do 4 x 3 letter boxed transfers instead of 16:9 anamorphic. Why did they do this? Because MOST people owned 4 x 3 TVs.

So it really is a chicken / egg thing. Make the displays to move the population to UW but also give us program to support that. If they were smart, they would be encoding for 21:9 now and the current 16:9 players would not see this, hence reformat for 16:9. Update the player and you already have software. DTS did this on BD where they were already encoding at HDMA, but no one would hear this until HDMI 1.3 came out.
john hunter likes this.

Mark Techer

I love my Constant Image Height system!
CAVX is offline  
post #24 of 301 Old 01-14-2018, 04:49 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
CAVX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 8,942
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Liked: 179
I got to play with that 21:9 mode today. SONY projector won't scale for CIH with 4K HDR10, but the OPPO 203 allows easy AR changes at the push of a button (zoom on the remote). Very neat.

Mark Techer

I love my Constant Image Height system!
CAVX is offline  
post #25 of 301 Old 01-21-2018, 06:14 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
John Ballentine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Los Angeles, Ca.
Posts: 5,169
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 96 Post(s)
Liked: 97
I have a movable A-lens on a sled so I put the OPPO 203 to 21:9 Movable. But I also tried it at 21:9 Fixed. Seems to work the same. Anybody know the difference between these two options?
John Ballentine is offline  
post #26 of 301 Old 01-22-2018, 07:53 AM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
Josh Z's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Planet Boston, source of the spice, Melange.
Posts: 24,492
Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3782 Post(s)
Liked: 2819
Does the OPPO's 21:9 mode only work with a lens in place? Does it have an option for scaling the image down to occupy the center of the 21:9 image when doing the Zoom Method?

Josh Z
Home Theater Writer/Editor, High-Def Digest

My opinions are my own, and do not necessarily reflect those of my employers.
Josh Z is offline  
post #27 of 301 Old 01-22-2018, 04:02 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
CAVX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 8,942
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Liked: 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post
Does the OPPO's 21:9 mode only work with a lens in place? Does it have an option for scaling the image down to occupy the center of the 21:9 image when doing the Zoom Method?
I don't have my 203 yet, but my 103D seems to have a "half zoom" mode that looks to be about right for shrinking down the 16:9 image to be the same height as the active image of a letter box film. I would need to do some testing, but I think this is the mode. The question then is, does it still work now OPPO have introduced the new 21:9 mode to the 203?

I think to get the zoom/shrink to work, you would have to not use the 21:9 mode as that seems to introduce the scaling.

Mark Techer

I love my Constant Image Height system!
CAVX is offline  
post #28 of 301 Old 01-23-2018, 02:33 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
coolrda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bakersfield, CA
Posts: 3,913
Mentioned: 243 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1387 Post(s)
Liked: 1503
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post
Does the OPPO's 21:9 mode only work with a lens in place? Does it have an option for scaling the image down to occupy the center of the 21:9 image when doing the Zoom Method?
Initially I only remember the 21:9 Moveable and 21:9 Fixed modes but I checked last night and they added the 21:9 Cropped mode which allows you to stay zoomed on a 2.35 screen. I verified all scaling is correct. Nice addition for zooming.
Josh Z likes this.
coolrda is offline  
post #29 of 301 Old 01-24-2018, 09:45 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
coolrda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bakersfield, CA
Posts: 3,913
Mentioned: 243 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1387 Post(s)
Liked: 1503
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Ballentine View Post
I have a movable A-lens on a sled so I put the OPPO 203 to 21:9 Movable. But I also tried it at 21:9 Fixed. Seems to work the same. Anybody know the difference between these two options?
The 16x9 mode on 21:9 Fixed is accomplished by squeezing the 16x9 info into a 12x9(4x3) while the 21:9 Moveable is 16x9 mode is non-scaled due to the lens being moved out of the light path. The 21:9 and Full modes scaling will be the same on both Fixed and Moveable as the lens is engaged.
coolrda is offline  
post #30 of 301 Old 01-24-2018, 11:48 AM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
Josh Z's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Planet Boston, source of the spice, Melange.
Posts: 24,492
Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3782 Post(s)
Liked: 2819
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolrda View Post
Initially I only remember the 21:9 Moveable and 21:9 Fixed modes but I checked last night and they added the 21:9 Cropped mode which allows you to stay zoomed on a 2.35 screen. I verified all scaling is correct. Nice addition for zooming.
Just to confirm, these all work on 4k Ultra HD sources?

Josh Z
Home Theater Writer/Editor, High-Def Digest

My opinions are my own, and do not necessarily reflect those of my employers.
Josh Z is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply 2.35:1 Constant Image Height Chat

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off