The Official ChromaPure thread - Page 222 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #6631 of 7446 Old 07-12-2015, 11:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markymiles View Post
Unfortunately I get this message after a while

"Index was out of range . Must be non-negative and less than the size of the collection.
Parameter name : index"
I hit the same problem, repeatedly. Unfortunately Tom was never able to reproduce the problem, so he couldn't fix it.

He will tell you to repair .Net, uninstall CP and then reinstall it. Sometimes that helps, sometimes not.

I gave up and bought the competitor's product instead.
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post #6632 of 7446 Old 07-12-2015, 12:01 PM
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Yep Chromapure latest version. I finally got it to work, but the report and readings were nothing like reality. The end result ridiculously dark and miles out. I was watching the log and it didn't appear to tally with what was on screen. Something is not at all right. They still aren't communicating nicely. I don't recall seeing a 0-100% greyscale display at all.

On the signal generator screen what setting do I put on for the lumagen. It has window size, presumably small, and output format YCbCr 422? Anything else

I thought the auto calibrate was the answer to everything but I am tempted to use manual controls at this rate.
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post #6633 of 7446 Old 07-12-2015, 01:56 PM
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The Official ChromaPure thread

Try setting the output for the Lumagen to RGB......see if that's any different


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post #6634 of 7446 Old 07-12-2015, 06:07 PM
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Originally Posted by markymiles View Post
Yep Chromapure latest version. I finally got it to work, but the report and readings were nothing like reality. The end result ridiculously dark and miles out. I was watching the log and it didn't appear to tally with what was on screen. Something is not at all right. They still aren't communicating nicely. I don't recall seeing a 0-100% greyscale display at all.

On the signal generator screen what setting do I put on for the lumagen. It has window size, presumably small, and output format YCbCr 422? Anything else

I thought the auto calibrate was the answer to everything but I am tempted to use manual controls at this rate.
Let's start from the beginning.

  1. This is a plasma and you are using window test patterns, yes?
  2. What do the pre-calibration results look like? Please post a report. I am particularly interested in your observation that you were unable to get a 2.22 gamma at 10 and 20 percent even when adjusting manually.
  3. Have you installed the latest Lumagen firmware?
  4. I am also particularly interested in your claim that it took you a weekend to get proper communication between the Lumagen and the program. This shouldn't take more than 5 minutes, so I suspect something in the configuration.
  5. When does the error occur, during grayscale or the LUT correction?
  6. What size LUT are you correcting?
  7. What model of Lumagen are you using?
  8. You write that "the report and readings were nothing like reality. The end result ridiculously dark and miles out." It is absolutely critical that I see that report.

At this stage I just need a lot more information. I think this is probably easily fixable.
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post #6635 of 7446 Old 07-12-2015, 11:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottJ View Post
I gave up and bought the competitor's product instead.
Funny, that's exactly why I gave up on CalMAN and bought Chromapure.... The only calibration software I haven't experienced annoying glitches with is HCFR (the original version from homecinema-fr) but I don't consider it anymore since it doesn't support LUTs. I do wish that MadVR supported the Lumagen....
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post #6636 of 7446 Old 07-13-2015, 01:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post
Let's start from the beginning.

  1. This is a plasma and you are using window test patterns, yes? Yes
  2. What do the pre-calibration results look like? Please post a report. I am particularly interested in your observation that you were unable to get a 2.22 gamma at 10 and 20 percent even when adjusting manually. See uploaded manual and autocal versions
  3. Have you installed the latest Lumagen firmware?Yes
  4. I am also particularly interested in your claim that it took you a weekend to get proper communication between the Lumagen and the program. This shouldn't take more than 5 minutes, so I suspect something in the configuration.
  5. When does the error occur, during grayscale or the LUT correction? Not sure, finally managed a full calibration which is attached
  6. What size LUT are you correcting? 125
  7. What model of Lumagen are you using? XS-3D
  8. You write that "the report and readings were nothing like reality. The end result ridiculously dark and miles out." It is absolutely critical that I see that report. Attached

At this stage I just need a lot more information. I think this is probably easily fixable.
Answered all I can. Have a day off work tomorrow so can play again. Could you just confirm what settings I should have in the signal generator options.

Hopefully can get this sorted. Wouldn't let me upload the PDF's as they are over 1mb so uploaded to dropbox instead:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/e77g5ewejw...20715.pdf?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7ydzbewsy5...magen.pdf?dl=0

Last edited by markymiles; 07-13-2015 at 01:44 AM.
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post #6637 of 7446 Old 07-13-2015, 03:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markymiles View Post
Answered all I can. Have a day off work tomorrow so can play again. Could you just confirm what settings I should have in the signal generator options.
Which windows test pattern? On plasmas, if you use too large a windows pattern, you'll engage the brightness limiter which will give you a display response that'll lead to an erroneous calibration.

Do you have dynamic contrast turned off?

By the way, which plasma do you have?
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post #6638 of 7446 Old 07-13-2015, 03:45 AM
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Originally Posted by JimP View Post
Which windows test pattern? On plasmas, if you use too large a windows pattern, you'll engage the brightness limiter which will give you a display response that'll lead to an erroneous calibration.

Do you have dynamic contrast turned off?

By the way, which plasma do you have?
Yeah on the signal generator options you have window size and output format. I picked small window size and 4:2:2 output.

It's a couple of generation ago PS51D6900 Samsung. Not sure model number here. Dynamic contrast nope.

I'm hoping it's just a configuration/setting issue otherwise I've wasted the money on Autocal Advanced and the Lumagen. The software itself works fine and I got pretty good results just using the inbuilt CMS on my TV and PJ. Wanted to see how much better it could be with the advance LUT calibration.........
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post #6639 of 7446 Old 07-13-2015, 03:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markymiles View Post
Answered all I can. Have a day off work tomorrow so can play again. Could you just confirm what settings I should have in the signal generator options.

Hopefully can get this sorted. Wouldn't let me upload the PDF's as they are over 1mb so uploaded to dropbox instead:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/e77g5ewejw...20715.pdf?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7ydzbewsy5...magen.pdf?dl=0
Resolution: It sets automatically to the display's resolution.
Color Format: YCbCr 422
Pattern Size: Medium Window
Signal Intensity: 75%
Baud: 9600
Port: 4 or above

I have attached a Lumagen setup document.

With the manual calibration, the obvious problem is that black level has not been set properly. It is much, much too high. This is what prevented you from getting a good gamma at low light levels and left you with the ridiculously low contrast ratio of 191. BTW, you should be doing all calibrating in a dark or near dark room.
The second problem I see is that the light output is too low. You are getting about 90 cd/m2. You should be able to get 120 cd/m2 without crushing white. Try raising the Contrast control a few ticks.

Otherwise, the manual calibration looks nearly perfect

The auto-cal report you provided doesn't tell me much because it is absolutely insane. The Lumagen is clearly not communicating with the software correctly. This is the report from the auto-cal session that you say worked? It didn't work. It is showing readings all over the map.

BTW, this was a 125 point LUT calibration? I ask because the report you provided is not the report that CP generates after doing a 125/729/4913 LUT calibration.

Please run a 125-point calibration again, post the calibration report. Also, when it is finished right-click in the activity window, Select All, Copy, and then paste all of the calibration activity into an e-mail and send to [email protected]. Send support the calibration report as well.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf auto-cal-Lumagen.pdf (63.7 KB, 48 views)

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post #6640 of 7446 Old 07-13-2015, 03:50 AM
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BTW, posting a calibration report is essential for me when trying to diagnose problems. If the report is too big to post here, you can send it to ChromaPure support via e-mail or you can use this free online tool for compressing pdfs without losing quality.

http://smallpdf.com/compress-pdf

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post #6641 of 7446 Old 07-13-2015, 03:55 AM
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Thanks Tom. Yeah the room wasn't completely dark as I was measuring for during the day type calibration.

I'll have another go tomorrow and send you the results.
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post #6642 of 7446 Old 07-13-2015, 03:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markymiles View Post
I'm hoping it's just a configuration/setting issue otherwise I've wasted the money on Autocal Advanced and the Lumagen.
It is a configuration problem. If ChromaPure users were getting the results you are getting I would have been run out of business a long time ago. There's a strange, but nearly universal, reaction many people have when using software. It makes you feel like you are the only person in the world doing what you are doing and that everyone else experiences what you are experience.

In your case the problem is so extreme, we should be able to figure it out fairly quickly.

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post #6643 of 7446 Old 07-13-2015, 09:41 AM
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Ahhhhhhh, and relax

Thanks for your help, not quite sure exactly which change made it work correctly but followed your guide to the letter, including changing the com port from 3 to 4. The result, brilliant picture. Only thing I forgot to do in my rush to do it quickly before the kids got home is to calibrate 100% white with my display settings somehow

Will now play around tomorrow with targets, BT1886 gamma etc and do my PJ.

Worth the low weekend to get the high now.
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post #6644 of 7446 Old 07-20-2015, 06:34 AM
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I have from time to time, had my problems with CP. IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN A FAULT OF MINE. I struggle with Windows. The reason is cause I just don't like Windows.
Tom or Somebody on this forum has always come through.
I have seen many people have problems just like me, and everyone that I have seen it is has always been something they are not doing right.
There is always the user who wants the Software to do more than was promised and that will always be.
Thanks Tom and everybody for the support.
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Nothing's Impossible if you don't have to do it yourself ! Glenee
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post #6645 of 7446 Old 07-20-2015, 07:39 AM
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I have a Chroma 5 and would like to try bt.1886 on my JVC rs57. When taking readings from the lens do I simply turn the device around so the diffuser is facing the lens?

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post #6646 of 7446 Old 07-20-2015, 10:39 AM
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I have a Chroma 5 and would like to try bt.1886 on my JVC rs57. When taking readings from the lens do I simply turn the device around so the diffuser is facing the lens?
Yes, but you'll still have to use black level and white level readings off the screen in cd/m2.

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Yes, but you'll still have to use black level and white level readings off the screen in cd/m2.

I'm unable to get black level off of the screen. Should I use 0.003 then?

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post #6648 of 7446 Old 07-20-2015, 12:23 PM
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I'm unable to get black level off of the screen. Should I use 0.003 then?
You can derive black level from a white level reading and contrast ratio.

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post #6649 of 7446 Old 07-20-2015, 01:58 PM
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The Official ChromaPure thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post
You can derive black level from a white level reading and contrast ratio.

Ok. I assume I can obtain a contrast ratio using the contrast module. Correct?

I don't understand, though. According to the manual, page 64, I'm supposed to compute a contrast ratio by pointing the sensor at the lens. How can I compute the ratio if I can't measure black?

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post #6650 of 7446 Old 07-20-2015, 02:09 PM
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Ok. I assume I can obtain a contrast ratio using the contrast module. Correct?

I don't understand, though. According to the manual, page 64, I'm supposed to compute a contrast ratio by pointing the sensor at the lens. How can I compute the ratio if I can't measure black?
Point at the lens, measure 100% and 0%. You will get numbers. Those numbers give a contrast ratio. Now point at the screen and measure 100% again. Divide that number by the contrast ratio. That's the black level.

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post #6651 of 7446 Old 07-20-2015, 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post
Point at the lens, measure 100% and 0%. You will get numbers. Those numbers give a contrast ratio. Now point at the screen and measure 100% again. Divide that number by the contrast ratio. That's the black level.

Sounds simple , thanks for the help. One additional question: how far should the sensor be from the lens when obtaining the contrast ratio?

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post #6652 of 7446 Old 07-20-2015, 10:25 PM
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Sounds simple , thanks for the help. One additional question: how far should the sensor be from the lens when obtaining the contrast ratio?
close enough to the lens to get a good black level reading but not so close that you overload the sensor.

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What sort of value is likely to overload the sensor Tom? I have an i1D3 Pro and I'm never sure what the limit is for this, but I'd like to try a BT1886 gamma, so it would be good to know how bright (close) I can go to my projector for this measurement.

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post #6654 of 7446 Old 07-21-2015, 01:22 AM
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What sort of value is likely to overload the sensor Tom? I have an i1D3 Pro and I'm never sure what the limit is for this, but I'd like to try a BT1886 gamma, so it would be good to know how bright (close) I can go to my projector for this measurement.
It is rated up to 1000 cd/m2.
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Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post
close enough to the lens to get a good black level reading but not so close that you overload the sensor.

With the sensor about a foot away from the lens the contrast ratio was reported to be 1088708. Based on white of 36 from the screen, I computed black level to be 0.000033. I entered these values on the options page and ran a 125 pt calibration. The results look good but these numbers look unbelievable based on reports from other users.

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post #6656 of 7446 Old 07-21-2015, 09:51 AM
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With the sensor about a foot away from the lens the contrast ratio was reported to be 1088708.
Did you turn off the dynamic iris (or whatever name JVC uses for that), while measuring the contrast ratio?
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post #6657 of 7446 Old 07-21-2015, 11:56 AM
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Did you turn off the dynamic iris (or whatever name JVC uses for that), while measuring the contrast ratio?
Yes, a contrast value of 1,088,708 is not correct.

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post #6658 of 7446 Old 07-21-2015, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Dominic Chan View Post
Did you turn off the dynamic iris (or whatever name JVC uses for that), while measuring the contrast ratio?

Yes. I always disable the DI before calibration.

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post #6659 of 7446 Old 07-21-2015, 03:37 PM
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Yes. I always disable the DI before calibration.
What are the 100% and 0% readings?

I normally place my i1Display Pro at least 2 feet from the lens.
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post #6660 of 7446 Old 07-21-2015, 04:00 PM
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Quote:
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What are the 100% and 0% readings?



I normally place my i1Display Pro at least 2 feet from the lens.

100% is 19 cd/m2 and I'm unable to read 0.

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