CalMan 5 Release Notes and Discussion - Page 191 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #5701 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by CalWldLif View Post
yes enthusiast.
had calman since 3.5/4

so i have to call portrait/calman company?

geez.
what ver started the activate on line thing?
Just e-mail Support, hasn't been a problem so far.

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post #5702 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 11:03 AM
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Originally Posted by jrref View Post
Miki, agreed, I believe from their perspective the discount to upgrade to Video Pro/Studio was a loyalty offer but not many need that level of software. Let's see what they come up with.
The discount sounds good on the surface but in reality for home users that purchased Enthusiast version making that upgrade decision now will have to commit to all Access of $500 per year. and if you miss two years now you have to pay $1,000, three years $1500 ... etc ... to just get software bug fixes and updates.

This financial commitment is unreasonable for your average Enthusiast. SC/PD know this and do not care.
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post #5703 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 11:46 AM
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What % increase in sales did Spectracal get in the last 10 years?
10 Years ago, finding a DIYer was a rare occurrence. Now, how many have purchased and gone on to calibrate their own sets now days? I imagine, quite a few!
TVs have now become much more complicated, and will continue to do so, but at some point, I can see built in Patterns, and Meter so users TVs can self calibrate themselves.

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post #5704 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Lesmor View Post
what pisses me off since this issue raised it's head was I didnt even realise that there was an annual fee
I saw no mention of it when I bought Enthusiast or I probably wouldn't have bothered
Me too. I read it as a one time fee of $399 for a permanent license. I don’t recall reading that there was also an annual fee attached to it. Maybe I just overlooked something but I would not have upgraded to Enthusiast if that was (is) the case.
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post #5705 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 01:25 PM
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Originally Posted by p5browne View Post
TVs have now become much more complicated, and will continue to do so, but at some point, I can see built in Patterns, and Meter so users TVs can self calibrate themselves.
Will probably never happen. Here is the reason (think I've posted this before).

Calibration in the industry is thought of as a "value add" model for specialized retailers. Meaning. Thats something that they can make money on, or differentiate themselves from big box retailers on.

They need that to be able to sustain. TV manufacturers should know that.

If they make Autocal automatic (and sell you the meter to do it with, if they have the patents, because they would have no interest in shifting the entire business over to xrite... ), which would be trivial, they'll lose specialized retail after market income.

If they cant get patents to build a probe - they even would canibalize their own business. (People arent into color accuracy en masse (not a mass market thing.. ) )

I first encountered this notion of "providing specialized retail some "value add"" with the european car industry, where they literally had meetings over how to subsidize their retail partners, if electric vehicles are built to only need a service once or never in their lifetime. They had models where most of their service partners would have to close, and then they were missing showroom floor, and a big part of car 'culture' (people loving to interact with it, compaired to "mobility as a service").

So those inefficiencies are actually somewhat there to stay.... It also allows manufacturers to sell "better" tiers, where the better might only be a little better color accuracy across the line.

With todays 3D lut tech you can compensate everything "in the signal path". TVs would become even more exchangeable - thats not something the manufacturers want.

I have a 3D LUT box at home. To me every SDR TV is a perfect SDR TV (if it has 100% gamut coverage... ). The same way an LG OLED always is a perfect OLED after LUT calibration. But LG does it differently, they produce one OLED panel and sell their customers on "processing and accessories". They can, because people dont mind the higher price point with OLEDs.

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post #5706 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by keyoctave View Post
Me too. I read it as a one time fee of $399 for a permanent license. I don’t recall reading that there was also an annual fee attached to it. Maybe I just overlooked something but I would not have upgraded to Enthusiast if that was (is) the case.
This falls under the communication category I was talking about previously.
They don't list the All Access Maintenance on the main product page. All they say is:
"All CalMAN® software licenses are permanent and never ending."
You need to look at the Description page and then they assume you know what All Access means and to go to the All Access tab for the details.

Another problem is the Home vs Professional versions. They do list the Business vs Home (or they did) on the main product page but I don't think they explicitly say that you need a professional version of the software to calibrate for compensation. If they do, it's not easily seen and they seem to be implying it. When I was calibrating for myself at home, I learned you needed a professional version of the software to calibrate for compensation here on AVS when someone happened to be talking about it.

Just my opinion, simple changes to make communication clearer.

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post #5707 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 01:41 PM
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Originally Posted by CalWldLif View Post
design function grayed out in 2018 ver.
what am i missing?
did it get taken away?
Requires an additional license which they offer for free (part of the software fee). You have to ask for it.
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post #5708 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by p5browne View Post
What % increase in sales did Spectracal get in the last 10 years?

10 Years ago, finding a DIYer was a rare occurrence. Now, how many have purchased and gone on to calibrate their own sets now days? I imagine, quite a few!

TVs have now become much more complicated, and will continue to do so, but at some point, I can see built in Patterns, and Meter so users TVs can self calibrate themselves.
Built in patterns yes. Built in meters??? I don't see how that is even possible. Meters need to take readings of the output levels, which means it will block a portion of the viewable screen.
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post #5709 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by skschatzman View Post
Built in patterns yes. Built in meters??? I don't see how that is even possible. Meters need to take readings of the output levels, which means it will block a portion of the viewable screen.
Pulls out like a kitchen hose.
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post #5710 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by p5browne View Post
Pulls out like a kitchen hose.
Go Go Gadget meter!

In all honesty as cool as that sounds, manufacturers look for ways to decrease costs. Some manufacturers like Vizio usually have a pretty close to calibrated output OOB. I don't see any manufacturers implementing a feature that the vast majority of consumers don't care about or want to pay extra for.
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post #5711 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 02:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skschatzman View Post
Built in patterns yes. Built in meters??? I don't see how that is even possible. Meters need to take readings of the output levels, which means it will block a portion of the viewable screen.
There are high end monitors that have motorized calibration sensors built in that pop out of the bezel along the bottom of the screen. Not cheap, mind.
Like this one:
https://www.eizoglobal.com/products/...277/index.html
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post #5712 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 02:56 PM
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Originally Posted by jrref View Post
This falls under the communication category I was talking about previously.
They don't list the All Access Maintenance on the main product page. All they say is:
"All CalMAN® software licenses are permanent and never ending."
You need to look at the Description page and then they assume you know what All Access means and to go to the All Access tab for the details.

Another problem is the Home vs Professional versions. They do list the Business vs Home (or they did) on the main product page but I don't think they explicitly say that you need a professional version of the software to calibrate for compensation. If they do, it's not easily seen and they seem to be implying it. When I was calibrating for myself at home, I learned you needed a professional version of the software to calibrate for compensation here on AVS when someone happened to be talking about it.

Just my opinion, simple changes to make communication clearer.
Well put.

On a more positive note, upgrading to Enthusiac allowed me to use a TPG and 3D Lut in my calibrations which expanded my knowledge and increased the overall viewing experience. Like you and others have expressed, I’ll wait and see before making any other judgments.

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post #5713 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 03:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobof View Post
There are high end monitors that have motorized calibration sensors built in that pop out of the bezel along the bottom of the screen. Not cheap, mind.

Like this one:

https://www.eizoglobal.com/products/...277/index.html
Interesting implementing, but I still don't see this coming to consumer grade TVs.
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post #5714 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 03:12 PM
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Interesting implementing, but I still don't see this coming to consumer grade TVs.
Neither do I, was just answering your post.
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post #5715 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 03:46 PM
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Originally Posted by jrref View Post
Another problem is the Home vs Professional versions. They do list the Business vs Home (or they did) on the main product page but I don't think they explicitly say that you need a professional version of the software to calibrate for compensation. If they do, it's not easily seen and they seem to be implying it. When I was calibrating for myself at home, I learned you needed a professional version of the software to calibrate for compensation here on AVS when someone happened to be talking about it.

Just my opinion, simple changes to make communication clearer.
Although they have pulled the home enthusiast details, it was clear (to me at least) that the home versions of CalMAN were not to be used for professional (paid) calibration.

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post #5716 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 03:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobof View Post
There are high end monitors that have motorized calibration sensors built in that pop out of the bezel along the bottom of the screen. Not cheap, mind.
Like this one:
https://www.eizoglobal.com/products/...277/index.html
I'm very surprised that no-one has yet mentioned the consumer (and I use the word loosely, because of its cost - but it was NOT a professional display) Bang & Olufsen (B&O) BeoVision 4. They did it over a decade ago!
https://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/0...n_beovision_4/

Quote:
after every 100 hours of viewing – or whenever you feel like it – a short robotic arm with a camera at the end swings down from behind the set’s aluminium frame and snaps a test picture.

The picture’s colour temperature is automatically analysed on screen and if it fails to provide you with the best reds for Baywatch swimsuits or the deepest blacks in films, then the TV adjusts its settings accordingly. B&O said that specialist sensors also constantly measure and adjust the TV’s brightness and contrast.

The BeoVision 4 50in display costs $7500 (£3500/€4000) and the 65in model costs $13,500 (£7500/€8000).
Here's a picture from the manual
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post #5717 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 03:57 PM
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Noice - thats a reference that wouldnt be greenlit in 2019. (Baywatch swimsuits)
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post #5718 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 08:20 PM
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Originally Posted by randal_r View Post
Requires an additional license which they offer for free (part of the software fee). You have to ask for it.
thank you.

i just don't understand spect/portrait
i use to be able to install versions and uninstall for different features no problem/
now when i install new vers, i loose the ability to go back to a prior version.
and why do i have to ask for something that has been there as long as i remember?

shakes head.

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post #5719 of 7128 Old 03-05-2019, 11:57 PM
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Originally Posted by p5browne View Post
I was trying to post the offer here, but, like I said, it disappeared from my e-mail account.
Anyone else who also got it, can you post it to this Forum for all to see?
I got this also, but not from Light Illusion , Ted his company send it out to it's disk users:
http://archive.sendpulse.com/u/Njk4NjUzMg==/5ge17/

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I got this also, but not from Light Illusion , Ted his company send it out to it's disk users:
http://archive.sendpulse.com/u/Njk4NjUzMg==/5ge17/
I don't use his disc, he sent it to known users of Enthusiast AFAICT.

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post #5721 of 7128 Old 03-08-2019, 01:58 AM
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Some home edition information has been released, $145, no mention of an annual renewal, Auto cal for a specific manufacturer but I think it does contain manual calibration which can be used for any TV i guess??

I do not have enough posts to embed the link to spectracal:-

email below in full

CalMAN Home - Lowering the Price of Home Calibration Software
Portrait Displays, the global leader in color calibration solutions and advanced display control, is excited to announce the much-anticipated upcoming release of CalMAN Home. CalMAN Home will be released alongside the broad release of CalMAN 2019 professional calibration solutions in April. With CalMAN Home, consumers will have a simpler, lower-cost option to calibrate the TV in their household.

Color calibration delivers an exceptional home cinema experience with optimized color, allowing consumers to view films, TV shows, and other media just as the creator intended, and to choose color settings designed for different viewing activities and environments.

Initially, 4 versions of CalMAN Home will be released, each priced at $145.00 USD, with more versions to follow. The first versions of CalMAN Home include:
CalMAN Home for LG
CalMAN Home for Panasonic
CalMAN Home for Samsung
CalMAN Home for Sony

Each version of CalMAN Home supports AutoCal for a specific TV manufacturer listed above. Consumers will have the ability to purchase a color calibration solution that is specific to the TV in their household. AutoCal is Portrait Displays’ award-winning calibration feature providing consumers the ability to easily calibrate their TVs for their specific environment and viewing preferences. Additionally, every CalMAN Home version provides the ability to conduct manual calibrations for TVs that may not support AutoCal.

CalMAN Home comes with 1 full year of updates, ensuring that each user gets the best results for their selected TV platform.

CalMAN Home offers a simplified user experience that will produce excellent calibration results. Close attention was paid to ensure that the most utilized features were included in each CalMAN Home version and many advanced level features were streamlined, further simplifying the calibration process. To learn more about the features, measurement devices, pattern sources, and AutoCal support within each version of CalMAN Home, please click here to view the features for each version of CalMAN Home.

CalMAN 2019 professional calibration solutions and CalMAN Home are scheduled to release in April 2019. More information on the newest features and hardware support will be announced in the coming month.

About Portrait Displays

Portrait Displays provides color display solutions that combine the latest in color science with advanced display control. Portrait Displays ensures that color presents beautifully on screens of all sizes – for global device manufacturers like Dell, HP, LG, Panasonic, Samsung, and Sony, as well as leading content creators and distributors like Netflix and Amazon. Only Portrait Displays upholds color quality every step of the way, from the creation of the first frame to its appearance on the screen of any device.

Portrait Displays’ CalMAN color calibration software is the most popular calibration solution utilized by Hollywood’s most demanding color professionals. CalMAN color calibration solutions meet the requirements to deliver a superior viewing experience that is just right.

Portrait Displays is headquartered in Pleasanton, CA with offices in Seattle, and a presence across Europe, Taiwan, China, Japan, and Korea. Portrait Displays is an Intel Capital Portfolio company. With decades of experience in color science and display technology, Portrait Displays is taking the lead in inventing a more colorful digital future.

For additional information contact:
Portrait Displays, Inc.



cheers
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post #5722 of 7128 Old 03-08-2019, 03:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chopples123 View Post
Some home edition information has been released, $145, no mention of an annual renewal, Auto cal for a specific manufacturer but I think it does contain manual calibration which can be used for any TV i guess??

I do not have enough posts to embed the link to spectracal:-

email below in full

CalMAN Home - Lowering the Price of Home Calibration Software
Portrait Displays, the global leader in color calibration solutions and advanced display control, is excited to announce the much-anticipated upcoming release of CalMAN Home. CalMAN Home will be released alongside the broad release of CalMAN 2019 professional calibration solutions in April. With CalMAN Home, consumers will have a simpler, lower-cost option to calibrate the TV in their household.

Color calibration delivers an exceptional home cinema experience with optimized color, allowing consumers to view films, TV shows, and other media just as the creator intended, and to choose color settings designed for different viewing activities and environments.

Initially, 4 versions of CalMAN Home will be released, each priced at $145.00 USD, with more versions to follow. The first versions of CalMAN Home include:
CalMAN Home for LG
CalMAN Home for Panasonic
CalMAN Home for Samsung
CalMAN Home for Sony

Each version of CalMAN Home supports AutoCal for a specific TV manufacturer listed above. Consumers will have the ability to purchase a color calibration solution that is specific to the TV in their household. AutoCal is Portrait Displays’ award-winning calibration feature providing consumers the ability to easily calibrate their TVs for their specific environment and viewing preferences. Additionally, every CalMAN Home version provides the ability to conduct manual calibrations for TVs that may not support AutoCal.

CalMAN Home comes with 1 full year of updates, ensuring that each user gets the best results for their selected TV platform.

CalMAN Home offers a simplified user experience that will produce excellent calibration results. Close attention was paid to ensure that the most utilized features were included in each CalMAN Home version and many advanced level features were streamlined, further simplifying the calibration process. To learn more about the features, measurement devices, pattern sources, and AutoCal support within each version of CalMAN Home, please click here to view the features for each version of CalMAN Home.

CalMAN 2019 professional calibration solutions and CalMAN Home are scheduled to release in April 2019. More information on the newest features and hardware support will be announced in the coming month.

About Portrait Displays

Portrait Displays provides color display solutions that combine the latest in color science with advanced display control. Portrait Displays ensures that color presents beautifully on screens of all sizes – for global device manufacturers like Dell, HP, LG, Panasonic, Samsung, and Sony, as well as leading content creators and distributors like Netflix and Amazon. Only Portrait Displays upholds color quality every step of the way, from the creation of the first frame to its appearance on the screen of any device.

Portrait Displays’ CalMAN color calibration software is the most popular calibration solution utilized by Hollywood’s most demanding color professionals. CalMAN color calibration solutions meet the requirements to deliver a superior viewing experience that is just right.

Portrait Displays is headquartered in Pleasanton, CA with offices in Seattle, and a presence across Europe, Taiwan, China, Japan, and Korea. Portrait Displays is an Intel Capital Portfolio company. With decades of experience in color science and display technology, Portrait Displays is taking the lead in inventing a more colorful digital future.

For additional information contact:
Portrait Displays, Inc.



cheers
One year of full updates, that is the annual fee model it seems.
In the compare table the 3D LUTs are gone and the Lumagen support as well.
DV only supported on LG, but I own a LG so not sure if others brands had DV flows.
At least the Pro2 is still supported and I guess the meter profiling with it.
Not sure about the US, but in Europe the LUTs are valued as important.
The gap with Pro versions is becoming too big now.
Will never spend about 1900 Euro just to get these features back.
So I will neither down or upgrade or make use of fee model.
Will keep an eye on the market how things evolve.
Or Tyler can I also be put on the Ultimate version sponsored list 😉
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post #5723 of 7128 Old 03-08-2019, 03:34 AM
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Here is the PDF. http://portrait.acemlnb.com/lt.php?i=95A158A17A685


I wonder what the app access price will be?
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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Sony LCD Master Series Calibration Thread
My P75-C1 Calibration Settings (5.0.14.1).
Sony XBR-75Z9F, Vizio P75-C1, Pioneer Kuro 5020, Pioneer VSX-1131, XBox One(X), Wii, NVIDIA SHIELD.v1, FireTV 4K-HDR, HDHR Connects, QNAP 431+
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post #5724 of 7128 Old 03-08-2019, 04:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neverwish View Post
In the compare table the 3D LUTs are gone and the Lumagen support as well.
I assume you still get LG specific 3DLUT as part of the LG autocal, but nothing else?
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post #5725 of 7128 Old 03-08-2019, 04:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobof View Post
I assume you still get LG specific 3DLUT as part of the LG autocal, but nothing else?
Hi Tyler, can you clear things up here?
Do we retain a separate Lut flow or only 2018 models and up for LG or other brands.
I think for a lot of enthusiast customers this would be a decisive point to go with a Home license?
It is mentioned that manual flow works for situations where autocal is not available and
as older HDfury devices are also still supported this is a way to support a manual HDR flow as well then I think.
Will the Vertex also be added with the annual support for 2019?
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post #5726 of 7128 Old 03-08-2019, 06:08 AM
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The email I received from PD on the functionality of the "new" Home version is very clear, at least for me. There is no possibility of manually calibrating a display or creating 3D LUTs outside the Autocal function and you'll probably have to pay $ 145 a year to keep the software up-to-date.
The fact that the only version of CM dedicated to the enthusiast market does not provide support for 3D LUT boxes and accurate cheap TPG like the Raspberry PGenerator, it means that PD has actually come out of this market.
Personally, I will not buy the Home edition and I will not even pay $ 195 to keep my old Enthusiast up-to-date.
I can do more and better with other programs, some even free!
I'll see if in 2020 CM will bring something better than the competition, if in 2020 there will still be CM...

Miki
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TSCC Graduated | TVs: Pioneer PDP-LX5090H, LG OLED55C8PLA | SintoAmp: Pioneer VSX-921 | BD Player: Panasonic DMP-BDT260EG | External LUT box: Entertainment Experience eeColor | Softwares: Light Illusion Lightspace HTP, Portrait Displays CalMAN Home Enthusiast 2018 R3, HCFR, DisplayCAL | Probes: Klein K10-A - Jeti spectraval 1501 - x-rite i1 Pro 2 - i1 Display Pro OEM B-02, basICColor DISCUS | Test Pattern Generator: DVDO AVLab TPG
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post #5727 of 7128 Old 03-08-2019, 06:31 AM
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No version for Vizio’s?
I wonder what happens if we don’t own any of the TV’s above?


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post #5728 of 7128 Old 03-08-2019, 06:34 AM
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I wonder why they gave us all this information but left out how you get product updates after 1 “full” year? Maybe you buy it again only when you need new features? This may be a cheaper alternative vs yearly maintenance as long as you don’t buy a new TV every year. I wonder how many households or people who would calibrate with this product, have multiple manufacturers TVs? My guess would be an average of two. As far as the 3D LUT for the LG, the answer is going to be very interesting. No mention of Design Mode or basic home reporting so I’m guessing that’s out.

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post #5729 of 7128 Old 03-08-2019, 07:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anger.miki View Post
The email I received from PD on the functionality of the "new" Home version is very clear, at least for me. There is no possibility of manually calibrating a display or creating 3D LUTs outside the Autocal function and you'll probably have to pay $ 145 a year to keep the software up-to-date.
The fact that the only version of CM dedicated to the enthusiast market does not provide support for 3D LUT boxes and accurate cheap TPG like the Raspberry PGenerator, it means that PD has actually come out of this market.
Personally, I will not buy the Home edition and I will not even pay $ 195 to keep my old Enthusiast up-to-date.
I can do more and better with other programs, some even free!
I'll see if in 2020 CM will bring something better than the competition, if in 2020 there will still be CM...

Miki
You can manually calibrate any set.
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John
Sony 55A1E, A9F / LG 55OLEDC8
Marantz 7012, Ohm Walsh Speakers
Klein K10-A, Jeti 1501, Murideo Six-G Gen2
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post #5730 of 7128 Old 03-08-2019, 07:10 AM
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Thanks for the clarification, John. Where have you read that?

TSCC Graduated | TVs: Pioneer PDP-LX5090H, LG OLED55C8PLA | SintoAmp: Pioneer VSX-921 | BD Player: Panasonic DMP-BDT260EG | External LUT box: Entertainment Experience eeColor | Softwares: Light Illusion Lightspace HTP, Portrait Displays CalMAN Home Enthusiast 2018 R3, HCFR, DisplayCAL | Probes: Klein K10-A - Jeti spectraval 1501 - x-rite i1 Pro 2 - i1 Display Pro OEM B-02, basICColor DISCUS | Test Pattern Generator: DVDO AVLab TPG
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