Originally Posted by OMARDRIS
I'm the one who came up with the idea of using LightSpace's Color Engine to generate gamma files for Sony and JVC projectors. From me also comes the method with the ARVE tool to create HDR-EOFT curves for Sony projectors. I have been doing this for a while and know that the method is not 100% accurate and can not compete with a 3-D LUT. This also applies to the export for the Sony ImageDirector. Therefore, I think it's great that Steve has incorporated the Export.
But I do not understand what the problem with the export for JVC AutoCal is. LightSpace outputs the 12 output values for the following input values (positions):
5%, 10%, 15%, 20%, 30%, 40%, 50%, 60%, 70%, 80%, 90%, 95%
These are the default positions of AutoCal.
JVC AutoCal correctly assigns the output values to the input positions. If you interpolate the values for Gamma 2.2 in 5% steps, you will also get a straight line in Excel.
It is basically correct that the gamma equalizers can neither correct the color space nor the white point and therefore these settings must be done manually as well as it is with the on-board means. A big advantage of the gamma equalizer, however, is that it protects the black level much better than the offset Controller. The result of LightSpace exported gamma curve is the better, the more accurately the color space and the white point were set before the measurement. An option is also to create your own ColorSpace for the projector, if the desired color space is technically impossible to achieve. But there still needs to be gained experience.
For the JVC projectors I offer yet another possibility to save an RGB-corrected gamma curve from LightSpace into the projector. This curve then has 256 positions and also 10-bit values. But again, the principle is that 0% and 100% can not be changed. At the moment I'm using LightSpace's export for "Video Card Gamma Table" and converting the data accordingly. Steve and his team would not need a day to build the export into LightSpace. The curves are saved in the JVC projector via the ARVE tool. At the moment the alpha tests are running.
So I already use existing interfaces to the projectors.
I applaud the work you did for the Sony and the JVC projectors. It's great to see more tools supporting these directly.
My issue is with the way Light Illusion deals with this, using an untested implementation to rubbish (again) the JVC projectors without any good reasons to do so.
Light Illusion are taking any opportunity to claim that the JVC projectors are unfit for purpose, or that the JVC Autocal is a piece of junk.
I was initially very positive about testing this new feature, then Steve dumped his statement that the fact their implementation wasn't working clearly proved that there was something wrong with the JVCs.
They are using a limited number of points, and they might not be spacing them correctly. Otherwise, as you know, Arve's tools and the JVC Autocal can create and upload custom curves that do not have any of these issues.
You are a JVC user yourself. You must know that this is complete nonsense, or you are not able to calibrate your projector properly if you have these issues using the JVC Autocal or Arve's tool.
There are some extreme cases (such as Bobof's unit or my old RS500) that can cause issues with 3D LUTs because of the way Lightspace handles undersaturated gamuts, but most units can be calibrated fine. It's not because Lightspace has these issues in some limited cases that it's fine to paint all the JVC models and units with the same brush. It's so unprofessional that I really don't understand the reasoning or the strategy behind it.
In fact, many Light Illusion clients such as Gordon at Convergent use Lightspace daily to calibrate JVC projectors, and they are not saying they are unfit for purpose or seizing any opportunity to rubbish them and the tools that come with them. They deliver great results to they clients, because if you know the projectors, the way they work and their limitations, you can get excellent results.
It is, sadly, a frequent attitude form Light Illusion: instead of making positive progress, fixing issues, they often rubbish the competition. That's very poor behaviour, and as long as they keep doing this and spread misinformation, they will find users like myself who don't care which tool they use as long as it works, but know their projector well enough to call bull***** when necessary.
It's always the same. Any offer to help is shot down, any potential issue is dismissed. Light Illusion need to be less defensive, and to realize that they have very little experience in the home cinema market, compared to enthusiasts who spend a lot more time than they'll ever will with these products and know them inside out. I guess this attitude might work with completely unexperienced users who think that Lightspace can't be wrong because it's used by studios, but for anyone else it's just poor customer relations. It's alienating and frankly sad, especially when there is good will that's systematically rejected.
My offer to help is still there. I'm not the only one. If Steve doesn't like me, he can ask
to help provide feedback. He is very experienced and knows the JVC Autocal inside out. Or any competent calibrator who could provide feedback on this and knows that the JVCs are not the pile of junk Light Illusion would like their users to believe they are.
Hopefully Light Illusion will stop rubbishing the JVCs at every opportunity. This is simply ridiculous. They should either get first hand experience on them, or be consistent and declare that they are not supported, nor any projector, nor any consumer display, because they are not "fit for purpose"