Official calibration of the Vizio P series - Page 23 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #661 of 1977 Old 01-09-2015, 03:46 PM
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Originally Posted by superkyle View Post
Wow you guys got way out of my league fast haha. Thanks to all for the reading material. Fafrd let me know how the profiling goes in very interested. If you can post a walk thought that would be great. I'm considering following your footsteps. I'm not a "perfectionist" so the cheaper option appeals to me the most. More or less I would rent it to learn. Googer after you get the update would you mind doing a run through on your p70 and confirming some of the issues listed in the past couple pages such as the red push in the grey scale? Also the person that stated issues using RGB and something else I forget can you elaborate a little more on what you mean/did? I'm not exactly in a place to spend a ton of money but I would like to get the set as close as I can with the i1d3 as possible.
I've changed my plan a bit. I am happy enough with the separation between CMS and 11-pt greyscale settings that I'm going to focus on greyscale for now with my i1DisplayPro and accept that my colors will depend on my meter and may be slightly off reference due to its accuracy.

Once I get everything dialed-in for white point and gamma, I'll rend a ColorMunkiPhoto to profile my meter and get colors closer to reference (and I'm pretty sure the work on 11-pt greyscale won't be wasted).

Honestly, the colors I am getting off of my un-profiled i1DisplayPro are pretty fantastic and dialing-in black levels and shadow detail seems like the much more important domain to improve picture quality with this TV.

I picket up Teds Lifhtspace Calibration Disk and plan to dive into the near-black test patterns next...
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Last edited by fafrd; 01-09-2015 at 03:49 PM.
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post #662 of 1977 Old 01-09-2015, 05:20 PM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
I've changed my plan a bit. I am happy enough with the separation between CMS and 11-pt greyscale settings that I'm going to focus on greyscale for now with my i1DisplayPro and accept that my colors will depend on my meter and may be slightly off reference due to its accuracy.

Once I get everything dialed-in for white point and gamma, I'll rend a ColorMunkiPhoto to profile my meter and get colors closer to reference (and I'm pretty sure the work on 11-pt greyscale won't be wasted).

Honestly, the colors I am getting off of my un-profiled i1DisplayPro are pretty fantastic and dialing-in black levels and shadow detail seems like the much more important domain to improve picture quality with this TV.

I picket up Teds Lifhtspace Calibration Disk and plan to dive into the near-black test patterns next...


My near black has a blue push... I haven't seen if I can correct with offset (was going to revisit when I get new firmware).
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post #663 of 1977 Old 01-09-2015, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
As I just posted in the owner's thread, I refreshed my calibration and repeated some of my black letterbox bar black level measurements at various scenes in Star Trek Into Darkness.

I wasn't scientific about it and didn't note specific scenes so I could return to them (and so it is not an apples-apples comparison), but where the darkest letterbox bars I read with 1.0.4.1 was 0.002 cd/m2 (calibrated to 100 cd/m2 peak white), measuring last night, my i1SisplayPro gave me a reading of 0.000 cd/m2 twice.

I assume that means some level below 0.001cd/m2, but it could be anecdotal evidence that Vizio made some incremental improvement in the dimming of letterbox bars.

I am very happy with the widescreen BlueRay performance of my P70 -those letterbox bars are black (as in invisible). I returned a 65VT60 plasma in part because I could still see the letterbox bars -the P70 is delivering superior black levels in that specific criterion.

I also made some inter-scene measurements of highlights versus dark regions from some of the same STID scenes, and it is easy to find examples where the intraday-Sven contrast ratio exceeds the ~6000:1 native contrast ratio of the Sharp LCD panel, indicating that the local dimming is doing its thing. From my casual check, the best measurement I made had a highlight measuring 80 cd/m2 and a dark area of the same scene measuring 0.011 cd/m2, indicating an effective contrast ratio of ~7300:1.

Aside from the picture sequence in GCD, is there any set of high-contrast content images that can be used to check 'real-world' effective contrast ratios in a repeatable manner?

Not interested in checkerboard test patterns because actual local dimming performance is so scene-dependent.

If the blackness of the letterbox bars when displaying dark scenes is of any relevance, it seems that the P70 is capable of delivering an effective contrast ratio in excess of 100,000:1.

My earlier calibration had to be tweaked to re-center grey levels, so my sense is there may have been some changes impacting the interpretation of CMS/11-pt settings (though will be interested in the impressions of other P70 owners once they recieve FW 1.1.14 and circle back to check the accuracy of their earlier calibrations...).

Have you seen, did new firmware have an effect on greyscale?


Also now that the backlight is always on, do you notice any "flahslights" or "clouding." How does gamma look with ALZ? I have very slight flash lighting and clouding on the extreme right that is not visible with ALZ on or in the daytime with ALZ off but is noticeable with ALZ off in a dark room. Just curious.
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post #664 of 1977 Old 01-09-2015, 05:40 PM
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Originally Posted by nulsul View Post
Have you seen, did new firmware have an effect on greyscale?


Also now that the backlight is always on, do you notice any "flahslights" or "clouding." How does gamma look with ALZ? I have very slight flash lighting and clouding on the extreme right that is not visible with ALZ on or in the daytime with ALZ off but is noticeable with ALZ off in a dark room. Just curious.

Something must be off with your TV or settings. With 1.0.0 my P60 with ALZ on had excellent uniformity. I never turned off ALZ unless calibrating as there is no need to. Seeing normal anomalies such as closing or flash lighting with ALZ ON is normal. This is because there is nothing controlling the backlight and it is just a "normal" backlit LCD. ALZ should never be turned off really. Even with the new firmware I don't notice much difference except maybe mor controlled transitions.


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post #665 of 1977 Old 01-09-2015, 07:08 PM
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My near black has a blue push... I haven't seen if I can correct with offset (was going to revisit when I get new firmware).
Most likely yes - my friend's P70 drifted considerably towards blue at the very bottom end if I set the offsets based on 20 or 30% gray that the 11-point settings alone weren't able to fully correct. It meant a bit more work with the 11-point settings to get it in-line across the board but was worth the extra effort to reduce the initial error on the absolute bottom end using the offsets first.

Last edited by Googer; 01-09-2015 at 07:12 PM. Reason: Reworded a bit
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post #666 of 1977 Old 01-10-2015, 09:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
I've changed my plan a bit. I am happy enough with the separation between CMS and 11-pt greyscale settings that I'm going to focus on greyscale for now with my i1DisplayPro and accept that my colors will depend on my meter and may be slightly off reference due to its accuracy.

Once I get everything dialed-in for white point and gamma, I'll rend a ColorMunkiPhoto to profile my meter and get colors closer to reference (and I'm pretty sure the work on 11-pt greyscale won't be wasted).

Honestly, the colors I am getting off of my un-profiled i1DisplayPro are pretty fantastic and dialing-in black levels and shadow detail seems like the much more important domain to improve picture quality with this TV.

I picket up Teds Lifhtspace Calibration Disk and plan to dive into the near-black test patterns next...
How much was the disc and where did you buy it. I looked it up and am interested in one for myself but all i seem to find is the guide and the free version. Is the free version sufficient for what we need?
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post #667 of 1977 Old 01-10-2015, 10:11 AM
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How much was the disc and where did you buy it. I looked it up and am interested in one for myself but all i seem to find is the guide and the free version. Is the free version sufficient for what we need?

There is a link to Teds site in the main thread for it. You can purchase direct from there (you need to use the drop down to make the selection).


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post #668 of 1977 Old 01-10-2015, 10:48 AM
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How much was the disc and where did you buy it. I looked it up and am interested in one for myself but all i seem to find is the guide and the free version. Is the free version sufficient for what we need?
Hello, Free Version contains the basic patterns (contrast/brightness) to precalibrate and support for the Free CalMAN's ColorCheckerClassic patches where you can check your performance of your display using a meter and the free version of CalMAN from the software side.

For a complete calibration you will need the full version of the disk that contains over 150 color reproduction patterns to help identify visually problems.

Each available internal calibration control settings that a display has are not always working as expected...Some controls are introducing image anomalies, others have safe working range (for example they are not introducing problems if you use them only at +-2 value of adjustments only), other display controls must not using them, because they are breaking the display color management system or producing non-linearity to display performance, banding, strange artifacts etc.

That's why I added so many Color Reproduction Patterns to my calibration disk, for the users to verify their controls reactions after using some controls or to check if the combination of internal display calibration controls are not introducing problems to the display.

So I'm suggesting you to check also after modification of the internal sliders during calibration some Grayscale ramp or grayscale steps of my disk, to see if the controls have added problems to linearity of the steps, banding or other problems....with this way you will see start learning your display safe working range, because not all controls are working perfectly....

I have replied to other user about the available versions of the disk here: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-di...l#post28774410

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS / CalMAN ColorChecker / HCFR
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, ControlCAL
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box - P/G: DVDO AVLab TPG
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
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post #669 of 1977 Old 01-10-2015, 11:03 AM
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How much was the disc and where did you buy it. I looked it up and am interested in one for myself but all i seem to find is the guide and the free version. Is the free version sufficient for what we need?
The disk is not free, but you get a number of excellent patterns for $15.

I used the near-black patters yesterday and the results were not bad. The patterns only last 10sec which was too fast for my i1DisplayPro so I had to screw around using the pause button to make it work.

During my calibration session yesterday, I tried calibrating HDMI 4 for the first time and was surprised to se a significant shift in red and green color primaries versus HDMI 5. I was able to calibrate it out but I had assumed that once you calibrate the CMS of a color temp, it will be be identical for all inputs including OTA TV and Via apps.

Could someone with a meter and a BlueRay with test patterns check if they get consistent CMS results from HDMI5 and HDMI4?

Among other things, this makes me want to get some patterns into the ViaApps to check there as well -maybe through USB?

Appreciate anyone's help to confirm or deny this strange discrepancy between HDMI5 and HDMI4 - run primaries & secondaries to confirm your calibration through HDMI5, then switch your pattern source to HDMI4 and rerun primaries and secondaries there (with all settings identical).

Last edited by fafrd; 01-10-2015 at 11:07 AM.
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post #670 of 1977 Old 01-10-2015, 11:11 AM
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I used the near-black patters yesterday and the results were not bad. The patterns only last 10sec which was too fast for my i1DisplayPro so I had to screw around using the pause button to make it work.
Hi, use a lower integration time without LLH (In case you are using CalMAN). The luminance reading of this patterns is more important from chromaticity readings repeatability.

Some displays has something like a small auto-dimming feature after displaying the same window pattern for about some specific time, it gives lower Luminance and different xy readings. This is the reason I have created my disk chapters to have max. time 10 sec. of displaying each patch, and there is a gap with black field between the patches also to prevent the LED-LCD displays from Auto-Dimming their backlights or for Plasmas to prevent the reduce of their light output when you will leave the same pattern displayed for a long time, to prevent a temporary image retention and to clear the panel of the last displayed color patch also.

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS / CalMAN ColorChecker / HCFR
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, ControlCAL
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box - P/G: DVDO AVLab TPG
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
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post #671 of 1977 Old 01-10-2015, 11:42 AM
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The disk is not free, but you get a number of excellent patterns for $15.

I used the near-black patters yesterday and the results were not bad. The patterns only last 10sec which was too fast for my i1DisplayPro so I had to screw around using the pause button to make it work.

During my calibration session yesterday, I tried calibrating HDMI 4 for the first time and was surprised to se a significant shift in red and green color primaries versus HDMI 5. I was able to calibrate it out but I had assumed that once you calibrate the CMS of a color temp, it will be be identical for all inputs including OTA TV and Via apps.

Could someone with a meter and a BlueRay with test patterns check if they get consistent CMS results from HDMI5 and HDMI4?

Among other things, this makes me want to get some patterns into the ViaApps to check there as well -maybe through USB?

Appreciate anyone's help to confirm or deny this strange discrepancy between HDMI5 and HDMI4 - run primaries & secondaries to confirm your calibration through HDMI5, then switch your pattern source to HDMI4 and rerun primaries and secondaries there (with all settings identical).
I've found on the two P70's I've calibrated for them to measure the same with the same CMS settings with different base settings for color - that's why in my calibration settings I actually list 2 different values for color depending on if it's HDMI 1-4 or HDMI 5 (and I'm not sure about other inputs such as its tuner, component, or the Vizio apps but it I was to hazard a guess I'd say they behave like HDMI 1-4 do in this regard). This is another bit of behavior I'd expect could change through firmware updates but it sounds as if it hasn't as of 1.1.14 (that you now have as I recall). I'm still on 1.0.0 myself with no luck in service checks getting it to update (though I can definitely see the LET time updates itself to whenever I do a service check - just remember it shows UTC time, not local ).
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post #672 of 1977 Old 01-10-2015, 12:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Hello, Free Version contains the basic patterns (contrast/brightness) to precalibrate and support for the Free CalMAN's ColorCheckerClassic patches where you can check your performance of your display using a meter and the free version of CalMAN from the software side.

For a complete calibration you will need the full version of the disk that contains over 150 color reproduction patterns to help identify visually problems.

Each available internal calibration control settings that a display has are not always working as expected...Some controls are introducing image anomalies, others have safe working range (for example they are not introducing problems if you use them only at +-2 value of adjustments only), other display controls must not using them, because they are breaking the display color management system or producing non-linearity to display performance, banding, strange artifacts etc.

That's why I added so many Color Reproduction Patterns to my calibration disk, for the users to verify their controls reactions after using some controls or to check if the combination of internal display calibration controls are not introducing problems to the display.

So I'm suggesting you to check also after modification of the internal sliders during calibration some Grayscale ramp or grayscale steps of my disk, to see if the controls have added problems to linearity of the steps, banding or other problems....with this way you will see start learning your display safe working range, because not all controls are working perfectly....

I have replied to other user about the available versions of the disk here: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-di...l#post28774410
This sounds very interesting. I'm definitely in for one. Being on a budget though dampens my ability to calibrate to the fullest potential. I am currently using hcfr and the i1d3. The i1d3 is not profiled for my display (I know shame on me) but truthfully I just cannot afford it. I plan to check out googers profiling on my meter and see what changes it makes from the basic matrix. My question comes in here. The color checker pattern in HCFR is limited. Can I even make use to all ( or even enough to make the purchase worth it rather than the free discs). I've done some reading and I see using HCFR you can use some of the calman folders etc. but outside of the near black and most likely near white what other adjustments does this allow me to make or is it basically a visual verification through different sets of patterns post calibration?
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post #673 of 1977 Old 01-10-2015, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Googer View Post
I've found on the two P70's I've calibrated for them to measure the same with the same CMS settings with different base settings for color - that's why in my calibration settings I actually list 2 different values for color depending on if it's HDMI 1-4 or HDMI 5 (and I'm not sure about other inputs such as its tuner, component, or the Vizio apps but it I was to hazard a guess I'd say they behave like HDMI 1-4 do in this regard). This is another bit of behavior I'd expect could change through firmware updates but it sounds as if it hasn't as of 1.1.14 (that you now have as I recall). I'm still on 1.0.0 myself with no luck in service checks getting it to update (though I can definitely see the LET time updates itself to whenever I do a service check - just remember it shows UTC time, not local ).
Yeah, I remember you stating that about HDMI1-4 versus HDMI5. So what I've seen on my P70 is probably not an issue of my specific panel.

It's strange, though -I wonder if Vizio knows about it?

I'll try to take images of the uncalibrated primaries for both groups as well as how off the HDMI5 calibration looks on HDMI1-4 and vi a-versa.

HDMI5 seems to be intended primarily for low latency and gaming -have you found anything through your two calibrations to convince you that HDMI5 offers some advantage for displaying Bluerays, or do you think HDMI is equivalent (or even better)?

And knowing which of these two streaming uses seems like it is critical. It seems like you would want to use whichever HDMI matches streaming primaries/secondaries so that a single calibration can be used for movies both through BlueRay or Via apps (both USB and Streaming).
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post #674 of 1977 Old 01-10-2015, 01:40 PM
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I've done some reading and I see using HCFR you can use some of the calman folders etc. but outside of the near black and most likely near white what other adjustments does this allow me to make or is it basically a visual verification through different sets of patterns post calibration?
Hi, I have replied to other user about the measurement capabilities from HCFR users here: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-di...l#post30407730

The visual verification can be performed before/during/after calibration.....to verify the control value adjustment are not introducing problems to your image.

For example view some color/grayscale ramps with all the values at zero, disable enhancements etc. vs. your settings after Grayscale calibration, and later after Grayscale+CMS calibration...to be able to verify that all are good during all these steps.

These problems in image is something that the 21-Point Grayscale or 5-Point Saturation or Color Checker reports can't display to the user, that's why its important to use some Color Reproduction Patterns after the end of the Calibration or during the calibration, and try to find by viewing them with our eyes for problems: Look for smooth color graduations, distortions, discoloration, clipping, banding, posterization, crushed shadow details, raised black levels.... something that the measurements/pretty calibration dE reports can't show.

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS / CalMAN ColorChecker / HCFR
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, ControlCAL
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box - P/G: DVDO AVLab TPG
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
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post #675 of 1977 Old 01-10-2015, 07:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Hi, I have replied to other user about the measurement capabilities from HCFR users here: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-di...l#post30407730

The visual verification can be performed before/during/after calibration.....to verify the control value adjustment are not introducing problems to your image.

For example view some color/grayscale ramps with all the values at zero, disable enhancements etc. vs. your settings after Grayscale calibration, and later after Grayscale+CMS calibration...to be able to verify that all are good during all these steps.

These problems in image is something that the 21-Point Grayscale or 5-Point Saturation or Color Checker reports can't display to the user, that's why its important to use some Color Reproduction Patterns after the end of the Calibration or during the calibration, and try to find by viewing them with our eyes for problems: Look for smooth color graduations, distortions, discoloration, clipping, banding, posterization, crushed shadow details, raised black levels.... something that the measurements/pretty calibration dE reports can't show.
Ted I am trying to place my order for your disc. Fafrd said in an post above that it was $15, But on the display calibrations.com website it said it was $30? Am I ordering the right disc? I will attach the link I am using to place the order.
http://www.displaycalibrations.com/disk_copy_order.html

Again I would like to thank you for your time helping guys like me better understand what we are doing. Without pretty much everyone that is active on this thread I would be totally lost but thanks to you guys I have learned a ton.
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post #676 of 1977 Old 01-10-2015, 08:25 PM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
Yeah, I remember you stating that about HDMI1-4 versus HDMI5. So what I've seen on my P70 is probably not an issue of my specific panel.

It's strange, though -I wonder if Vizio knows about it?

I'll try to take images of the uncalibrated primaries for both groups as well as how off the HDMI5 calibration looks on HDMI1-4 and vi a-versa.

HDMI5 seems to be intended primarily for low latency and gaming -have you found anything through your two calibrations to convince you that HDMI5 offers some advantage for displaying Bluerays, or do you think HDMI is equivalent (or even better)?

And knowing which of these two streaming uses seems like it is critical. It seems like you would want to use whichever HDMI matches streaming primaries/secondaries so that a single calibration can be used for movies both through BlueRay or Via apps (both USB and Streaming).
My hdmi 5 is set to 50 color the rest at 43. Primaries don't move just saturation. I haven't seen much of a difference other then saturation
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post #677 of 1977 Old 01-11-2015, 01:06 AM
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Ted I am trying to place my order for your disc. Fafrd said in an post above that it was $15, But on the display calibrations.com website it said it was $30? Am I ordering the right disc? I will attach the link I am using to place the order.
http://www.displaycalibrations.com/disk_copy_order.html

Again I would like to thank you for your time helping guys like me better understand what we are doing. Without pretty much everyone that is active on this thread I would be totally lost but thanks to you guys I have learned a ton.
Hello and thank you for your good words, this is the exciting thing about calibration, you are getting more and more experience from trying new things day-by-day.

There currently 3 available version formats of Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk:

Blu-Ray Disk Copy (30$): Worldwide delivery of a Blu-Ray Disk Copy (BD-25GB Single Layer Disk) using First Class Priority International Mail to any destination.

Blu-Ray ISO Digital Download Link (15$): Personal Download Link for the Blu-Ray ISO File via e-mail. The user can burn the ISO File with a PC Blu-Ray Recorder using a Blank BD-25GB Single Layer Disk or playback the ISO File from a Stand-Alone Media Player / PC Software Player that supports Full Blu-Ray Menu.

Media Files Digital Download Link (15$): Personal Download Link for the Media Files via e-mail. All chapters of the Blu-Ray Release are included in MP4+MKV files for a wide device playback support from Stand-Alone Media Players, PC/MAC Software Players, Satellite Tuners, Digital TV Receivers, Video Game Consoles (for movie playback from USB), Tablets/SmartPhones, TV's USB Movie Mode or Stand-Alone Media Players / PC Software Players that don't support playback of Blu-Ray ISO Files with Full-Menus.

You can use the Blu-Ray Copy for your OPPO and the Media Files or Blu-Ray ISO (in case that you will use a software player that support Full Blu-Ray Menus).

There discount anytime you want to move from one version to another (-5$), these upgrade options can be found to the Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Upgrade Order For Disk Owners Only webpage.

For example if someone has the Blu-Ray Copy and want to move to Media Files, from the drop down menu "Please select the disk version upgrade you want to purchase and select which disk version you own:" you have to select ''Upgrade to Media Files Digital Download Link 1.1 (I own Blu-Ray Disk Copy 1.x)''.

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS / CalMAN ColorChecker / HCFR
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, ControlCAL
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box - P/G: DVDO AVLab TPG
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
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post #678 of 1977 Old 01-11-2015, 10:07 AM
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Hello and thank you for your good words, this is the exciting thing about calibration, you are getting more and more experience from trying new things day-by-day.

There currently 3 available version formats of Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk:

Blu-Ray Disk Copy (30$): Worldwide delivery of a Blu-Ray Disk Copy (BD-25GB Single Layer Disk) using First Class Priority International Mail to any destination.

Blu-Ray ISO Digital Download Link (15$): Personal Download Link for the Blu-Ray ISO File via e-mail. The user can burn the ISO File with a PC Blu-Ray Recorder using a Blank BD-25GB Single Layer Disk or playback the ISO File from a Stand-Alone Media Player / PC Software Player that supports Full Blu-Ray Menu.

Media Files Digital Download Link (15$): Personal Download Link for the Media Files via e-mail. All chapters of the Blu-Ray Release are included in MP4+MKV files for a wide device playback support from Stand-Alone Media Players, PC/MAC Software Players, Satellite Tuners, Digital TV Receivers, Video Game Consoles (for movie playback from USB), Tablets/SmartPhones, TV's USB Movie Mode or Stand-Alone Media Players / PC Software Players that don't support playback of Blu-Ray ISO Files with Full-Menus.

You can use the Blu-Ray Copy for your OPPO and the Media Files or Blu-Ray ISO (in case that you will use a software player that support Full Blu-Ray Menus).

There discount anytime you want to move from one version to another (-5$), these upgrade options can be found to the Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Upgrade Order For Disk Owners Only webpage.

For example if someone has the Blu-Ray Copy and want to move to Media Files, from the drop down menu "Please select the disk version upgrade you want to purchase and select which disk version you own:" you have to select ''Upgrade to Media Files Digital Download Link 1.1 (I own Blu-Ray Disk Copy 1.x)''.
Yeah, when I said $15, what I meant was that I bought the BlueRay ISO and burned my own Bluray - worked like a charm.

These patterns are organized for ChromaPure and Calman (separately) and there is no specific section for HCFR. But looking through what is there, you will find everything you need and more (especially in the Calman section).
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post #679 of 1977 Old 01-11-2015, 10:33 AM
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Yeah, when I said $15, what I meant was that I bought the BlueRay ISO and burned my own Bluray - worked like a charm.

These patterns are organized for ChromaPure and Calman (separately) and there is no specific section for HCFR. But looking through what is there, you will find everything you need and more (especially in the Calman section).
Yes, I own a copy. Ted's disc is indeed excellent.
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post #680 of 1977 Old 01-11-2015, 10:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Hello and thank you for your good words, this is the exciting thing about calibration, you are getting more and more experience from trying new things day-by-day.

There currently 3 available version formats of Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk:

Blu-Ray Disk Copy (30$): Worldwide delivery of a Blu-Ray Disk Copy (BD-25GB Single Layer Disk) using First Class Priority International Mail to any destination.

Blu-Ray ISO Digital Download Link (15$): Personal Download Link for the Blu-Ray ISO File via e-mail. The user can burn the ISO File with a PC Blu-Ray Recorder using a Blank BD-25GB Single Layer Disk or playback the ISO File from a Stand-Alone Media Player / PC Software Player that supports Full Blu-Ray Menu.

Media Files Digital Download Link (15$): Personal Download Link for the Media Files via e-mail. All chapters of the Blu-Ray Release are included in MP4+MKV files for a wide device playback support from Stand-Alone Media Players, PC/MAC Software Players, Satellite Tuners, Digital TV Receivers, Video Game Consoles (for movie playback from USB), Tablets/SmartPhones, TV's USB Movie Mode or Stand-Alone Media Players / PC Software Players that don't support playback of Blu-Ray ISO Files with Full-Menus.
Thank you for the information. Before I place my order I have just a couple more questions. I do most of my watching through direct tv and internal tv apps such as Netflix/Hulu plus. I unfortunately do not own an oppo blu Ray player but instead just a standard Panasonic. In doing some reading on the disc I came across an area where you explain to users how using s bluray player can alter the signal a little and say I calibrate through that then my colors may be still a bit off due to the quality of the bluray player. I don't really think this will matter much for me since my meter is not even profiled to my set so the amount of error introduced by that will far exceed the error of using the bluray player to calibrate (which is how it is calibrated now anyways). I also do not have a bluray burner but my question is will there be any difference in using the MP4 version burned to a dvd or the bluray copy?
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post #681 of 1977 Old 01-11-2015, 11:02 AM
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Thank you for the information. Before I place my order I have just a couple more questions. I do most of my watching through direct tv and internal tv apps such as Netflix/Hulu plus. I unfortunately do not own an oppo blu Ray player but instead just a standard Panasonic. In doing some reading on the disc I came across an area where you explain to users how using s bluray player can alter the signal a little and say I calibrate through that then my colors may be still a bit off due to the quality of the bluray player. I don't really think this will matter much for me since my meter is not even profiled to my set so the amount of error introduced by that will far exceed the error of using the bluray player to calibrate (which is how it is calibrated now anyways). I also do not have a bluray burner but my question is will there be any difference in using the MP4 version burned to a dvd or the bluray copy?

Are you playing the MP4 via your blu-Ray player? If not and instead use an HTPC you'll have to make sure that it's not affecting the picture being sent out. Many times settings can be turned off on a blu-Ray player so it's as "clean" as possible. Personally I'd spend the extra money on a physical disc unless you own a BR burner.


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post #682 of 1977 Old 01-11-2015, 11:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Are you playing the MP4 via your blu-Ray player? If not and instead use an HTPC you'll have to make sure that it's not affecting the picture being sent out. Many times settings can be turned off on a blu-Ray player so it's as "clean" as possible. Personally I'd spend the extra money on a physical disc unless you own a BR burner.


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Yeah I agree with you. I just placed my order now I can play the waiting game for the update and the disc so I can really dive in and see what I can make this thing do.
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post #683 of 1977 Old 01-11-2015, 01:17 PM
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These patterns are organized for ChromaPure and Calman (separately) and there is no specific section for HCFR. But looking through what is there, you will find everything you need and more (especially in the Calman section).
That's true, there is not available a specific section for HCFR because the disk has been confirmed that is accurate and that can be used from HCFR users when the disk was already released.

So after that confirmation from Zoyd; the developer of current HCFR, the disk is officially compatible with HCFR Open Source Software. This has been discussed here & here.

For the HCFR users. they can use some CalMAN and ChromaPure Chapters from current version of the disk to perform measurements with HCFR.

The available Disk Chapters that are accurate and match the HCFR's Color Engine Calculations are the following:



Note: Uncheck ''use round down levels" that is located to HCFR Preferences -> General.

It's better to download the latest version of HCFR, If you download the HCFR 3.1.or later.... it's added CalMAN's ColorChecker SG measurements support; that made my disk the only available calibration disk with that feature, anyone can confirm that by checking the HCFR's Release Notes here.

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS / CalMAN ColorChecker / HCFR
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, ControlCAL
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box - P/G: DVDO AVLab TPG
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
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Ok im seriously considering purchasing calman 5. I'm a little unsure which version I should get. I also am unsure if it is worth the extra money for my level of expertise. Can someone please fill me in on the why and why nots that have and use both to help me understand if this is a purchase I should make or not...
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post #685 of 1977 Old 01-11-2015, 01:43 PM
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Ok im seriously considering purchasing calman 5. I'm a little unsure which version I should get. I also am unsure if it is worth the extra money for my level of expertise. Can someone please fill me in on the why and why nots that have and use both to help me understand if this is a purchase I should make or not...

For the "basics" I think "Basic" or HT is s good starting point. You'll miss some of the features, but if you find you need them the upgrade cost is the difference between the versions. I started with as low that seemed useful and may upgrade to ale advantage of some of the other features.


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post #686 of 1977 Old 01-11-2015, 01:46 PM
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Thank you for the information. Before I place my order I have just a couple more questions. I do most of my watching through direct tv and internal tv apps such as Netflix/Hulu plus. I unfortunately do not own an oppo blu Ray player but instead just a standard Panasonic. In doing some reading on the disc I came across an area where you explain to users how using s bluray player can alter the signal a little and say I calibrate through that then my colors may be still a bit off due to the quality of the bluray player. I don't really think this will matter much for me since my meter is not even profiled to my set so the amount of error introduced by that will far exceed the error of using the bluray player to calibrate (which is how it is calibrated now anyways). I also do not have a bluray burner but my question is will there be any difference in using the MP4 version burned to a dvd or the bluray copy?
The Blu-Ray version is easier to navigate, becasue you have onscreen menus and popup menu button can bring you quick navigation options to check change from one area of the disk to another.

It's always better idea to calibrate your whole video chain from your player you are using for content playback, so your corrections to the specific colorpoints you are fixing will include the fix of possible errors of you player internal processing/conversions/signal output.

Now for the devices that you can't use a calibration disk, copy the settings from the ones you used for your blu-ray calibration and check; if you can load from them a media file; the levels matching. You can use the Free Version of my disk that included the Contrast-Brightness Patterns inside in MP4+MKV formats, to check for black/while level matching, using the patterns with Flashing Bars.

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS / CalMAN ColorChecker / HCFR
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, ControlCAL
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box - P/G: DVDO AVLab TPG
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
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post #687 of 1977 Old 01-11-2015, 01:55 PM
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Are you playing the MP4 via your blu-Ray player? If not and instead use an HTPC you'll have to make sure that it's not affecting the picture being sent out. Many times settings can be turned off on a blu-Ray player so it's as "clean" as possible. Personally I'd spend the extra money on a physical disc unless you own a BR burner.
Hello, some TV's are handling differently the playback of content from USB with the playback that they accept from it's HDMI Inputs, a lot of times there mismatch.

Also some TV's are disabling a lot of advanced calibration controls in USB Mode.

The same is happening sometimes to Blu-Ray Players, but to be sure that it has no difference, you have to test it.

There so many different version for each are or world or devices / different firmware versions, no way to know for sure that all are working without problem without proper testing.

The best thing is to take some measurements (Grayscale/Saturation/Luminance or ColorChecker) from your Blu-Ray player and then use the same patterns to measure them from your USB..... Check the reports to see if the measurements from the both inputs are matching closely under meter repeatability tolerance.

But you have to check also Contrast/Brightness/Sharpness/Clipping patterns using your HDMI vs. USB to see if they are matching also.

If you see that the levels/measurements are matching (count the meter repeatability also), then you share your calibration settings to all your TV inputs.

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS / CalMAN ColorChecker / HCFR
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, ControlCAL
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box - P/G: DVDO AVLab TPG
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
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post #688 of 1977 Old 01-11-2015, 02:11 PM - Thread Starter
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One more question to you all. I have been playing around all day reading as much as I could and I have found that a very common method of profiling the i1d3 is using the i1 pro. I also found out recalibration of the meter will run about $100-$150. These meters are not cheap but actually might be affordable on my budget. Is there any reason I should not get the i1 pro? Also what makes the i1 pro2 so much more other than obviously it is new. I believe @Googer stated before he is using an i1 pro revision d to profile his c6. @fafrd if this setup is exactly what we need to profile and be selfsufficient then eBay has the meters used in good condition starting at $175-$300
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post #689 of 1977 Old 01-11-2015, 02:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
The Blu-Ray version is easier to navigate, becasue you have onscreen menus and popup menu button can bring you quick navigation options to check change from one area of the disk to another.

It's always better idea to calibrate your whole video chain from your player you are using for content playback, so your corrections to the specific colorpoints you are fixing will include the fix of possible errors of you player internal processing/conversions/signal output.

Now for the devices that you can't use a calibration disk, copy the settings from the ones you used for your blu-ray calibration and check; if you can load from them a media file; the levels matching. You can use the Free Version of my disk that included the Contrast-Brightness Patterns inside in MP4+MKV formats, to check for black/while level matching, using the patterns with Flashing Bars.
Thank you for your input. I have all of my components (direct tv genie, Xbox one, Panasonic BD player, Xbox 360, Roku) all connected through my avr.
With that said what would be the best method of calibration for watching tv. Obviously I can't load anything onto the genie. I can use the BD to calibrate through that which to me seems the best method but I would be "correcting" for internal processing that the player is doing which will not be in the loop when watching tv or playing xbox one. This would make bluray look the best obvioudky but would other sources take a hit from not having the same processing?
I realize this doesn't really apply to me since it is beyond the scope of the accuracy of my meter but I'm just curious on how you get around these issues.
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post #690 of 1977 Old 01-11-2015, 02:18 PM
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Ok im seriously considering purchasing calman 5. I'm a little unsure which version I should get. I also am unsure if it is worth the extra money for my level of expertise. Can someone please fill me in on the why and why nots that have and use both to help me understand if this is a purchase I should make or not...
For normal 1D LUT calibrations using dislay's internal controls, whatever software you will use, you will get the same final result. The difference is at layout/interface only.

CalMAN has the prettiest interface and you can customize it to meet your needs.

But if you move to a 3D LUT calibration, using any 3D LUT capable device (or via MadVR if an HTPC is your content source) here you will see greater difference in picture improvement.

There is helpful to check the 1D vs 3D Cube Comparison Guide where you can visualize the difference of calibrated color points precision over various cube resolution sizes between various hardware solutions.

An alternative way to check that difference is to use the Free CalMAN's ColorChecker new feature where you can visualize the difference before buying any hardware/software. I'm attaching the details below:
CalMAN ColorChecker Now Includes 3D LUT Visualization Features

See how accurate your monitor could be with new virtual 3D LUT capabilities and a free LUT visualization tool.

Now you can do more than test the accuracy of your display. Create a virtual 3D LUT in ColorChecker to see the difference a calibration could make! CalMAN can now create a virtual correction matrix unique to your monitor's color performance so you can see just how good your display could be. Once you've created the virtual 3D LUT in ColorChecker, upload your own photos and images to CalMAN Eyeglass and see the before-and-after effects of your corrective 3D LUT.

Download CalMAN 5.4 ColorChecker (Free Version) to get started.



(Above: photo viewed in CalMAN Eyeglass with corrective 3D LUT uploaded. Photo is rendered in split screen with the native display output on the left, and the corrected output on the right. This image is for demonstrative purposes only and will appear differently on different displays.)

Download CalMAN ColorChecker QuickStart Guide

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS / CalMAN ColorChecker / HCFR
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, ControlCAL
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box - P/G: DVDO AVLab TPG
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
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