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post #1711 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 03:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by giomania View Post
No go for me; the same results as before with both 12 and 21 points. Then I started examining the completed measurements, and I went through and corrected (re-measured) any color over dE 1, and got most of them under 1, with the exception of the first colors (red, green, blue).

So the only difference for the measurements that I was able to fix was that I manually re-touched (by pressing M) to get them under 1. These measurements finish the process slower (more accurately?) than Auto cal. Would inserting a wait time between measurements fix this?

The first colors (red, green, blue) are in the hundreds delta, and I cannot get them lower. This has to be the issue I am having; see below image.

No, those three colors don't matter. In fact you can skip them entirely. I am happy to continue troubleshooting this, but I must insist that you send ChromaPure support a calibration report and the log file from the auto-cal session. Otherwise, we could go back-and-forth forever on this. I must have the data that allows me to see exactly what's going on.



Inserting additional wait time couldn't hurt, but it will slow down the process.

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post #1712 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 03:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by CadH View Post
Any Chance for RPI support or definitely Not, Tom?
I would need the device and developer documentation describing how to build application support.

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post #1713 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 06:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post
No, those three colors don't matter. In fact you can skip them entirely. I am happy to continue troubleshooting this, but I must insist that you send ChromaPure support a calibration report and the log file from the auto-cal session. Otherwise, we could go back-and-forth forever on this. I must have the data that allows me to see exactly what's going on.



Inserting additional wait time couldn't hurt, but it will slow down the process.
I agree we have done all that we can. I submitted the support request just now, and indicated that I have the files to submit. It did not allow for submission of files, so I presume that request is via email follow-up.

Mark
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post #1714 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 10:22 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by giomania View Post
I agree we have done all that we can. I submitted the support request just now, and indicated that I have the files to submit. It did not allow for submission of files, so I presume that request is via email follow-up.

Mark
I don't know what "It did not allow for submission of files" means. Just send an email; to [email protected] and attach the requested files.

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post #1715 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 12:19 PM
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Tom,
Are the Display 3 Pros known to have bad 0% stimulus errors? Mine for example now has a Blue error of 249.5%, Red 30.1% & Green 105.7% with the sensor on a black surface like one does with the i1pro. I'm beginning to think that this is effecting my 5% stimulus when calibrating tv. It also seems to be getting worse over time. Is it fixable?
David

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post #1716 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by DavidES View Post
Tom,
Are the Display 3 Pros known to have bad 0% stimulus errors? Mine for example now has a Blue error of 249.5%, Red 30.1% & Green 105.7% with the sensor on a black surface like one does with the i1pro. I'm beginning to think that this is effecting my 5% stimulus when calibrating tv. It also seems to be getting worse over time. Is it fixable?
David
I'm not Tom, but if you mean the I1D3, it isn't meant to work that way. No black calibration is needed as it is for the I1 Pro. The I1 Pro's dark cal is done so the software can detect and adjust for noise in its readings over time. Different tech, different requirements. If your 5% is very dark, that can be a problem, as most low-cost tristim probes including the I1D3 struggle with color readings at lower light levels. Luminance can be read successfully lower than color can - down to .02 nits on the I1D3, IIRC.

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post #1717 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 12:59 PM
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I've been trying to recalibrate my grayscale. My sensor is telling me that I have too much blue at 5% stimulus. I've run out of blue control trusting the sensor. I look at the screen there is no blue cast. Could the sensor circuitry be failing?

-Dave
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post #1718 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by DavidES View Post
I've been trying to recalibrate my grayscale. My sensor is telling me that I have too much blue at 5% stimulus. I've run out of blue control trusting the sensor. I look at the screen there is no blue cast. Could the sensor circuitry be failing?
What is your luminance reading at 5%? Again, the meter will have problems accurately reporting color as luminance gets close to its lower sensitivity limit. It's a known issue with lower-cost colorimeters.

What display do you have?

How old is your meter?

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post #1719 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 01:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolls-Royce View Post
What is your luminance reading at 5%? Again, the meter will have problems accurately reporting color as luminance gets close to its lower sensitivity limit. It's a known issue with lower-cost colorimeters.

What display do you have?

How old is your meter?

I don't remember. I do remember around 99.3% of 2.3 gamma if that helps. I didn't save the session.


TCL 49S405


October 2018

-Dave
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post #1720 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 01:40 PM
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I also remember it saying 124% Blue at the 5% stimulus.

-Dave
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post #1721 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 02:04 PM
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Originally Posted by DavidES View Post
I don't remember. I do remember around 99.3% of 2.3 gamma if that helps. I didn't save the session.


TCL 49S405


October 2018
The meter is less than a year old. It's possible but not likely that it has drifted.

What I'm looking for is the actual nits or foot-lambert reading you got at that 5% stimulus. A percentage of gamma tells me nothing, since the calculated gamma target is based on measurement of full white and full black.

I do suspect that your luminance at 5% stimulus may be too low for the meter to accurately report colors. Next time, try a continuous read at that 5% mark. If red, green, or blue are fluctuating a lot there, it's too little light for accuracy. Keep in mind that in Rec 709 (SDR HD), Blue makes up only 7.22% of the luminance of D65. It's the dimmest color, so is toughest for the meter to read, especially at low stimulus levels.

See post number 15 here:https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-d...e-balance.html

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Last edited by Rolls-Royce; 07-14-2019 at 02:09 PM.
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post #1722 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 05:15 PM
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If red, green, or blue are fluctuating a lot there, it's too little light for accuracy.

What amount of fluctuation would be considered a lot? I do get some; between 2-4%.



I remeasured in the White Balance and got at 5% Y 0.106 - 0.108. Red and Green are between 97 -99%. Blue at around 127%.

-Dave
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post #1723 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 06:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidES View Post
What amount of fluctuation would be considered a lot? I do get some; between 2-4%.



I remeasured in the White Balance and got at 5% Y 0.106 - 0.108. Red and Green are between 97 -99%. Blue at around 127%.
Based on those numbers, Blue is at ~ 0.009719564‬ to 0.009902952‬ nits. Probably way too low to be read accurately: it's less than half of the I1D3 minimum luminance.

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post #1724 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 06:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolls-Royce View Post
The meter is less than a year old. It's possible but not likely that it has drifted.



What I'm looking for is the actual nits or foot-lambert reading you got at that 5% stimulus. A percentage of gamma tells me nothing, since the calculated gamma target is based on measurement of full white and full black.



I do suspect that your luminance at 5% stimulus may be too low for the meter to accurately report colors. Next time, try a continuous read at that 5% mark. If red, green, or blue are fluctuating a lot there, it's too little light for accuracy. Keep in mind that in Rec 709 (SDR HD), Blue makes up only 7.22% of the luminance of D65. It's the dimmest color, so is toughest for the meter to read, especially at low stimulus levels.



See post number 15 here:https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-d...e-balance.html


In the post I made above, you can see that at 5%, the luminance was 4.02 with a delta of 18.62. I had to try manual measurements a few times to get it that low using an i1 Display Pro 3.

Mark


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post #1725 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 06:37 PM
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In the post I made above, you can see that at 5%, the luminance was 4.02 with a delta of 18.62. I had to try manual measurements a few times to get it that low using an i1 Display Pro 3.
4.02 is your gamma / EOTF, the r symbol. Your luminance Y is in the top line, third number 0.0595 nits. The top line is xyY readings.
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-Dave

Last edited by DavidES; 07-14-2019 at 06:39 PM. Reason: clarification
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post #1726 of 1732 Old 07-14-2019, 06:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Rolls-Royce View Post
Based on those numbers, Blue is at ~ 0.009719564‬ to 0.009902952‬ nits. Probably way too low to be read accurately: it's less than half of the I1D3 minimum luminance.


Thanks, Rolls-Royce.
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post #1727 of 1732 Old 07-18-2019, 08:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Clearing my recent browser data got rid of the problem for me with Opera, maybe Safari is the same.

Greetings,
Cornelius
FYI. On June 28 our web site was hacked. I didn't notice it because when you enter the URL directly it works fine. The problem only appears when you did a web search on ChromaPure. The search would appear to yield the correct site, but when you clicked on the link it would take you to an online pharmacy.


I have now fixed the problem. However, you may have to clear your browser's cache.
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post #1728 of 1732 Old 07-26-2019, 02:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Lumagen Auto-cal fix

I have now uploaded a version of the 3.1.19 Preview Release that includes two changes:
1. Adds support for auto-cal along with the SpyderX.
2. Adds a fix for the auto-cal module that resolves the problem that appears when selecting different grayscale modes. I simply removed the mode selector from the auto-cal module. Now, auto-cal uses whichever grayscale mode you have selected in the main Options module.


I tested this fix for both 12 point and 21 point modes and saw no problems. Here's the result for a 21 point HDR/2020 calibration.




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post #1729 of 1732 Old 08-11-2019, 10:46 PM
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Tom,

For HDR calibration, if i using auto cal why the grayscale is not good ?
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post #1730 of 1732 Old 08-11-2019, 10:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Lumagen has told me that the color matrix calibration can throw the grayscale off some, so it is a good idea to do a grayscale touch-up after color calibration has finished.


In your case it looks like to need to edit three or four points.

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post #1731 of 1732 Old 08-12-2019, 12:15 AM
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i am doing autocal without grayscale and then after that i do manual grayscale , it is ok ?
How do i verify the color , as the number of color show around 200-500 something ?
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post #1732 of 1732 Old 08-12-2019, 02:44 AM - Thread Starter
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i am doing autocal without grayscale and then after that i do manual grayscale , it is ok ?
How do i verify the color , as the number of color show around 200-500 something ?
No, do grayscale first and then after color, spot correct grayscale as needed.

You verify by the report that you are prompted to run at the end.

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