2016/2017 Vizio P Series Calibration Thread - Page 118 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #3511 of 5363 Old 07-12-2017, 04:16 PM
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Originally Posted by beardontwalk123 View Post
There is a new Dolby Vision Calibration workflow that takes measurements of the display and calibrates it off of that. It says it currently is only for the LG OLED though. I wonder why it couldn't be used for any DV display.

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Its coming to the P Series, someone posted a image of the listed displays.

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post #3512 of 5363 Old 07-12-2017, 04:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by DisplayCalNoob View Post
Its coming to the P Series, someone posted a image of the listed displays.

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That was Auto Cal......I was talking about the new DV Workflow.

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post #3513 of 5363 Old 07-12-2017, 04:25 PM
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Originally Posted by beardontwalk123 View Post
That was Auto Cal......I was talking about the new DV Workflow.

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Maybe LG, got first dibs. Is there a new GR file, on Vizio site?

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post #3514 of 5363 Old 07-12-2017, 04:26 PM
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According to shoman, autocal for newer Vizio models is in the works. Maybe DV will be part of it

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post #3515 of 5363 Old 07-12-2017, 04:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by DisplayCalNoob View Post
Maybe LG, got first dibs. Is there a new GR file, on Vizio site?

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No, the new DV Workflow gets rid of Golden Reference files completely.....

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post #3516 of 5363 Old 07-12-2017, 04:27 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by skschatzman View Post
According to shoman, autocal for newer Vizio models is in the works. Maybe that will be part of it

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Could be....I feel like the Auto-Cal will be for SDR only but that would be awesome if it did HDR also!

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post #3517 of 5363 Old 07-12-2017, 04:35 PM
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Originally Posted by beardontwalk123 View Post
No, the new DV Workflow gets rid of Golden Reference files completely.....

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Tyler Pruitt should be able to provide the answers you seek.....or should I say Wifi-Spy.

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post #3518 of 5363 Old 07-12-2017, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by DisplayCalNoob View Post
Tyler Pruitt should be able to provide the answers you seek.....or should I say Wifi-Spy.

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Auto Cal is only for SDR.

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post #3519 of 5363 Old 07-13-2017, 02:45 AM
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Originally Posted by skschatzman View Post
Would be nice if we could use a 3d lut within the display. Seeing as how most displays have built in media apps and physical media is becoming less and less popular, external 3d lut boxes don't seem all that appealing to me. I'm sure a lot of consumers would agree.

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Hi, in a ideally consumer world, TV's had to include 3D LUT uploading (for those who want the best possible picture), something the Panasonic OLED EZ1000 will feature via future firmware update, this is the only way to have reference picture since internal display controls are only a few to be able to have color fidelity to the whole range.

The only consumer reference source we have is the Blu-Ray, which movies mastered for BD-Release, all streaming services are using their own encoding/compression so this is altering the content, so even if you have a perfect calibrated display, a stream content will not look perfect.

For example take a look here:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/39-net...u-blu-ray.html

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/39-net...s-blu-ray.html

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/39-net...vs-amazon.html

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/39-net...s-blu-ray.html

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/39-net...vs-amazon.html

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/39-net...azon-vudu.html

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/39-net...-vudu-hdx.html

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/39-net...s-blu-ray.html
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post #3520 of 5363 Old 07-13-2017, 05:51 AM
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updated my settings again. This time I used no APL. The big change for me was changing sync mode to on(thanks @shoman94 ). I tried using many different APL patterns, but just could not see a significant change or difference in reference material. I couldn't find any definitive information on how to properly utilize APL either.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/showthread.php?p=50605377

I attached a copy of my grayscale/contrast ratio

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post #3521 of 5363 Old 07-13-2017, 09:52 AM
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Thanks. Yah I'm aware that not all content is created equal and the source/host of the content also has an impact. I can't justify spending hundreds of $ for a box right now. Especially when we are in the middle of a new format evolution. With HDMI 2.1 on the way, other hdr formats on the rise. It's great it's happening, but for the conciencious consumer, it's too early to dive in. I'm just getting my feet wet.

I would rather have access to the baseline 3d lut built into the display and make adjustments based on the source through created picture modes. This would be good enough for me. At least until the new standards are settled in and we get some solid hardware to work with.
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post #3522 of 5363 Old 07-16-2017, 01:28 AM
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I don't have Calman, and was thinking of a cheap/free way of doing HDR10 calibration with HCFR's pattern generator.
Using manual patterns is a pain in the rear, so I thought about using Window's 10 Creator's Update HDR mode.
Would setting Windows to HDR mode and then using HCFR 'normally' work? I'd need an HDR capable video card, I know.
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post #3523 of 5363 Old 07-16-2017, 06:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Coolest View Post
I don't have Calman, and was thinking of a cheap/free way of doing HDR10 calibration with HCFR's pattern generator.
Using manual patterns is a pain in the rear, so I thought about using Window's 10 Creator's Update HDR mode.
Would setting Windows to HDR mode and then using HCFR 'normally' work? I'd need an HDR capable video card, I know.
No. You need a source to trigger HDR. Afaik hcfr can't trigger HDR

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post #3524 of 5363 Old 07-16-2017, 06:59 AM
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I guess I'll look into it some when I have the time, hopefully next week.
I've got a GTX 1050, and there's an nVidia API which would allow you to trigger HDR programmatically.

Let's say I manage to get the display into HDR mode, would the patterns be valid?

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post #3525 of 5363 Old 07-16-2017, 07:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Coolest View Post
I don't have Calman, and was thinking of a cheap/free way of doing HDR10 calibration with HCFR's pattern generator.
Using manual patterns is a pain in the rear, so I thought about using Window's 10 Creator's Update HDR mode.
Would setting Windows to HDR mode and then using HCFR 'normally' work? I'd need an HDR capable video card, I know.
Well, buying a Linker isn't that bad I suppose.

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post #3526 of 5363 Old 07-16-2017, 08:19 AM
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The Linker is $203 shipped, not horrible, but I don't think I'll be doing calibrations often enough to justify this expense right now.
I guess I posted in the wrong thread, though. I'll move this discussion to the HCFR thread. If this idea of mine works, perhaps HCFR will finally be able to output HDR10 patterns from the built in generator

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post #3527 of 5363 Old 07-16-2017, 09:21 AM
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Thanks. Yah I'm aware that not all content is created equal and the source/host of the content also has an impact. I can't justify spending hundreds of $ for a box right now. Especially when we are in the middle of a new format evolution. With HDMI 2.1 on the way, other hdr formats on the rise. It's great it's happening, but for the conciencious consumer, it's too early to dive in. I'm just getting my feet wet.

I would rather have access to the baseline 3d lut built into the display and make adjustments based on the source through created picture modes. This would be good enough for me. At least until the new standards are settled in and we get some solid hardware to work with.
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Hi, 3D LUT is something it can performed for SDR only, so any upcoming change in HDMI or HDR format's are not affecting this, since Blu-Ray which come to market hundred new tittles per week and there available some thousands all these years, it will have REC.709 and 100-120 nits target peak output and any TV can cover this 100%, so you can watch the content with the colors as is being mastered for SDR.

HDR movies will look very different from display-to-display due to different tone mapping each model features and because of differences in peak output each display has, so it's impossible to see exactly how content supposed to look 100%, something you can do with SDR.

With HDR you can't use 3D LUT because it's not possible to disable the display's internal gamut/tone mapping, so even if it's been released a low cost 3D LUT Box for HDR (because they cheaper one right now is starting from $5000, the Lumagen PRO) you can't do with consumer display 3D LUT for HDR.

If you are interested for 3D LUT display characterization for SDR you don't even need to spend a lot of money.... when you have a HTPC as a Media Player, then you can use a software player which supports MadVR as a renderer; like Media Player Classic or JRiver; get a calibration software that supports MadVR (like LightSpace HTL/CalMAN Enthousiast/DisplayCAL.....displayCAL is free open source) which is able to control the MadVR software pattern generator from inside your software player and be able to generate the 3D LUT correction table and do the display characterization.

MadVR supports the 3D LUT format file system of eeColor (65-Point Cube), so you will load the correction when you will playback movies from that software player you will use. So the cost if you go with DisplayCAL and MadVR is $0.

If you will use a stand-alone player (blu-ray/media player) and you want to do display characterization for your display, then you need to add a 3D LUT Box between your TV-player, to store there the 3D LUT correction table.

The lower cost solution coming from eeColor for this job and it's the only one 3D LUT Box which works with free software....DisplayCAL (for those who want to keep the cost low) or using CalMAN Enthousiast or LightSpace HTL from paid software solutions.

For the 3D LUT Box which don't feature an internal pattern generator, you can use some low-priced hardware like (Amazon FireStick / Google ChromeCast etc.) to the software that supports these devices as patch generators.

The solutions from Lumagen also but it will require paid software to work and all Lumagen are including an internal pattern generator also.

BTW Panasonic OLED features 3D LUT upload capability with 64-Point Cube size bujt is doing to be released to public some time later via firmware update, they haven't announced if it will be support HDR mode, but sure it will be for SDR mode at least.

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post #3528 of 5363 Old 07-16-2017, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Coolest View Post
I guess I'll look into it some when I have the time, hopefully next week.
I've got a GTX 1050, and there's an nVidia API which would allow you to trigger HDR programmatically.

Let's say I manage to get the display into HDR mode, would the patterns be valid?
Hi, I don't have NVidia to use it's control panel and see how it works but to trigger the HDR mode it has to send Metadata Infoframe with a lot of details inside, so only a tick from a menu to enable/disable HDR really don't help if you need to generate patterns for HDR calibration.

You need to have a panel to enter the a lot of details, about Mastering Display Color Volume (Primaries/White Point, Max-Min Display Luminance) and Content Metadata (MaxCLL, MaxFALL), AVI format....and according to all these details to generate a metadata infoframe (for example: 87:01:1a:74:02:00:c2:33:c4:86:4c:1d:b8:0b:d0:84:80 :3e:13:3d:42:40:e8:03:32:00:e8:03:90:01) and AVI infoframe (for example: 00:E8:64:5D:00), or have an area which you can enter these 2 infoframe codes directly.

This is what you can do with HD Fury Products, you have the control of the inserted metadata.

If your notebook has accurate RGB-Output then you can use it. Usually Intel or NVidia with proper configuration may have accurate output while AMD's have less possibilities.
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post #3529 of 5363 Old 07-16-2017, 10:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Hi, I don't have NVidia to use it's control panel and see how it works but to trigger the HDR mode it has to send Metadata Infoframe with a lot of details inside, so only a tick from a menu to enable/disable HDR really don't help if you need to generate patterns for HDR calibration.

You need to have a panel to enter the a lot of details, about Mastering Display Color Volume (Primaries/White Point, Max-Min Display Luminance) and Content Metadata (MaxCLL, MaxFALL), AVI format....and according to all these details to generate a metadata infoframe (for example: 87:01:1a:74:02:00:c2:33:c4:86:4c:1d:b8:0b:d0:84:80 :3e:13:3d:42:40:e8:03:32:00:e8:03:90:01) and AVI infoframe (for example: 00:E8:64:5D:00), or have an area which you can enter these 2 infoframe codes directly.

This is what you can do with HD Fury Products, you have the control of the inserted metadata.

If your notebook has accurate RGB-Output then you can use it. Usually Intel or NVidia with proper configuration may have accurate output while AMD's have less possibilities.
I am very interested in doing 3d lut.....I have CalMAN enthusiast and Calibrate with my laptop. How do I begin this process?

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post #3530 of 5363 Old 07-16-2017, 10:09 AM
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I am very interested in doing 3d lut.....I have CalMAN enthusiast and Calibrate with my laptop. How do I begin this process?

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3D LUT is for SDR, see one post above where I explain what you will need to do 3D LUT.

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post #3531 of 5363 Old 07-16-2017, 10:14 AM - Thread Starter
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3D LUT is for SDR, see one post above where I explain what you will need to do 3D LUT.
I understand that it is for SDR only, I am just not understanding the process. Do I use CalMAN to take measurements and then input this findings elsewhere? Can I just do everything within CalMAN itself? I will try researching a little today specifically in regards to using it with CalMAN as that's what I am most familiar with.

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post #3532 of 5363 Old 07-16-2017, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by beardontwalk123 View Post
I understand that it is for SDR only, I am just not understanding the process. Do I use CalMAN to take measurements and then input this findings elsewhere? Can I just do everything within CalMAN itself? I will try researching a little today specifically in regards to using it with CalMAN as that's what I am most familiar with.
Open the Color Cube (3D LUT) workflow and there some guides you can read there: http://calman.spectracal.com/support.html

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post #3533 of 5363 Old 07-16-2017, 10:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Open the Color Cube (3D LUT) workflow and there some guides you can read there: http://calman.spectracal.com/support.html
Man, this stuff is way beyond me...haha. What do I need to get started? I have CalMAN Enthusiast and an i1 Display Pro. You are talking about madVR. Do I also need more hardware to do an Auto Cal? I don't seem to be getting too far into this before getting stuck.

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post #3534 of 5363 Old 07-16-2017, 02:32 PM
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Man, this stuff is way beyond me...haha. What do I need to get started? I have CalMAN Enthusiast and an i1 Display Pro. You are talking about madVR. Do I also need more hardware to do an Auto Cal? I don't seem to be getting too far into this before getting stuck.

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Have you opened CalMAN's Color Cube Workflow? Procedure is by far easier than learning how to calibrate manually.

Open that workflow and follow every step...connect @ source the MadVR as patch generator...connect at display the MadVR 3D LUT Generator, set the target gamut....find you display native mode (largest gamut) and pre-calibrate only 100% White using RGB Gain/High....then skip the 1D Ramp LUT and go and start the AutoCal of 3D LUT Cube.

There is a guide for MadVR and CalMAN here: http://www.spectracal.com/Documents/...QuickStart.pdf

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Any Suggestions for calibration settings for using PS4 Pro with HDR?

I know you have to use HDMI 1-4 ports to achieve this.
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post #3536 of 5363 Old 07-17-2017, 10:19 AM
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My Vizio p65-e1 arrived on Friday and I've been having setting it up over the weekend. The one issue I'm having is that I occasionally see shots in the various movies I've watched that seem to suffer from the Soap Opera Effect. I've noticed it in the 1080p version of Trolls that I streamed through Netflix, and I have also seen it regularly on the UHD version of Stranger Things streaming through Netflix. I don't see it in every shot during either of these shows, but it is instead very shot dependent.

I've set reduce judder and reduce motion blur to 0. I also have clear action and game low latency off. My set is FW# 3.2.13.3.

Are there any settings I should adjust to completely get rid of the SOE?

Thanks for your help everyone.


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post #3537 of 5363 Old 07-17-2017, 10:44 AM
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@matthorn the only thing you can do to completely get rid of soe effect is reduce judder=0 and turn on Pure Cinema(AKA Film Mode).

If that doesn't work please try a factory reset of your display to rule out any bugs left from a firmware update.

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post #3538 of 5363 Old 07-17-2017, 10:49 AM
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I received my P65-E1 2 weeks ago[replacing my p65-c1- which i had for less than 2 months].
So got around to Cal with Shoman's Cal-outline. PQ is quite good, will have to tune it in, a little more for my very bright afternoon living room.
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post #3539 of 5363 Old 07-17-2017, 11:03 AM
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@DAB be careful not to fall into the placebo effect of using someone else's settings. Each display is different. The overall quality may or may not be better. You may make parts of it better and parts of it worse.

If you aren't sure, then default is best until you can get it professionally calibrated.

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post #3540 of 5363 Old 07-17-2017, 11:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matthorn View Post
My Vizio p65-e1 arrived on Friday and I've been having setting it up over the weekend. The one issue I'm having is that I occasionally see shots in the various movies I've watched that seem to suffer from the Soap Opera Effect. I've noticed it in the 1080p version of Trolls that I streamed through Netflix, and I have also seen it regularly on the UHD version of Stranger Things streaming through Netflix. I don't see it in every shot during either of these shows, but it is instead very shot dependent.

I've set reduce judder and reduce motion blur to 0. I also have clear action and game low latency off. My set is FW# 3.2.13.3.

Are there any settings I should adjust to completely get rid of the SOE?

Thanks for your help everyone.


Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
I had that problem also. If Pure Cinema is disabled the SOE will be present. I am on a beta firmware that was released after the one you are on and it does get fixed.

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