2016/2017 Vizio P Series Calibration Thread - Page 119 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #3541 of 5363 Old 07-18-2017, 08:49 AM
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Originally Posted by skschatzman View Post
@DAB be careful not to fall into the placebo effect of using someone else's settings. Each display is different. The overall quality may or may not be better. You may make parts of it better and parts of it worse.

If you aren't sure, then default is best until you can get it professionally calibrated.

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Sk- Thank You, Yes I too agree with your thoughts.
I did this as a point of reference . I also want a few more hours on the display before spending ? how many hours? calibrating. I have S&M HD Benchmark BR Edition- Calibration disc.. But wanted to make sure it was adequate for this display and wanting
DV& HD-10 adjustments. { had a Plasmas for 14 and calibrated it over the years, as need}
Going to wait for the new S&M but that most likely will not be out until HD&DV get their final act together.
This display's PQ out of the Box is very good. Calibrated PQ is very good and I like the PQ.
However, spend ?~$$1,500+ to calibrate a $1,500 display that might be replaced with new tech- in two years. Really isn't worth it. Even coming from a calibrated high end Plasma. Tx dB
*if anyone want to see a very campy, but beautiful "over colored'' eye candy- on NF there is a Chinese made show called "Ice Fantasy". an interest view...
'
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post #3542 of 5363 Old 07-18-2017, 09:10 AM
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@DAB $1500 for a calibration is highway robbery. My local ISF level 2 certified tech charges $150 for each standard/peripheral. So for SDR/DV/HDR10 it would cost $450 +tax.

$500 for a full calibration is about what it should cost. I wouldn't pay anymore than that.

Or you could invest in a meter ($200ish) and learn a new skill.

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post #3543 of 5363 Old 07-18-2017, 09:11 AM
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Unless the prices have dramatically risen, usually pro cal will run you under 500. I would recommend holding off on that as they are still tweaking the picture and that could "destroy" the calibration you paid for. The best option IMO if you have the time and resources is to purchase the equipment and software yourself as that will last you much longer.
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post #3544 of 5363 Old 07-18-2017, 09:18 AM
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@phate I agree that paying for a calibration on these displays may be too early, but only for DV/HDR10 IMHO. The last 2-3 firmware updates there hasn't been much change in SDR.

At this point I feel there won't be much future change to SDR and paying for a basic SDR calibration is not a bad idea.

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post #3545 of 5363 Old 07-18-2017, 10:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skschatzman View Post
@DAB $1500 for a calibration is highway robbery. My local ISF level 2 certified tech charges $150 for each standard/peripheral. So for SDR/DV/HDR10 it would cost $450 +tax.

$500 for a full calibration is about what it should cost. I wouldn't pay anymore than that.

Or you could invest in a meter ($200ish) and learn a new skill.

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Sk- My Apology -big time!
I did get a "Q" in 11/16 when I was starting to lean towards the P65. I did not go back to
review the email "Q" before posting. The $1500 somehow got into my mind... The Calibration quote did come in at $550 + some other expense.. Thanks for your response.
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post #3546 of 5363 Old 07-18-2017, 06:35 PM
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I was wondering if anyone has experimented w/ turning Clear Action off but maxing out reduce judder and reduce motion blur? Just trying creative ways to reduce motion blur.

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post #3547 of 5363 Old 07-18-2017, 06:50 PM
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Just updated my SDR calibration settings. Blacks are deeper and my settings now save/recall properly!!! Thank you @Matt McRae
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/showthread.php?p=50605377

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post #3548 of 5363 Old 07-19-2017, 12:58 PM
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My latest SDR calibration with new calman update and newest Vizio P-Series Firmware. I just revised it found a couple of errors.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Vizio P55 C1 Calibration 20Jul17.pdf (33.4 KB, 90 views)
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post #3549 of 5363 Old 07-20-2017, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by LittleNickySantoro View Post
My latest SDR calibration with new calman update and newest Vizio P-Series Firmware.
Awesome, thank you! PDF is super easy to follow too. I'll try to set this up later today.

In the daytime when cutting out external lights aren't an option, I assume you just keep these same settings but reduce Gamma to 2.1 and up the backlight a bit? Even in a super dark room, I feel like a backlight at 16 is going to make it very hard to see any details in the blacks, but I could be wrong as I only recently just started playing with this stuff. I only started messing with calibrations in this thread a few weeks ago. It took my eyes a week to get used to non-Standard default calibration settings, and now every time I switch back I feel like I'm being assaulted by blue light.
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post #3550 of 5363 Old 07-20-2017, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleNickySantoro View Post
My latest SDR calibration with new calman update and newest Vizio P-Series Firmware.
Nice, can I steal your file to format one so I don't have to build one? Not sure why I never did this...

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post #3551 of 5363 Old 07-20-2017, 02:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleNickySantoro View Post
My latest SDR calibration with new calman update and newest Vizio P-Series Firmware.
My findings follow yours with the CMS. If I move from default it actually makes the Color Checker worse. My deltaE with SDR is super low as is......

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post #3552 of 5363 Old 07-20-2017, 02:12 PM - Thread Starter
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@skschatzman You are able to adjust CMS without posterization happening? When I adjust CMS it causes all sorts of problems for some reason. I ask you because we have the same size.....just curious.

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post #3553 of 5363 Old 07-20-2017, 02:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beardontwalk123 View Post
@skschatzman You are able to adjust CMS without posterization happening? When I adjust CMS it causes all sorts of problems for some reason. I ask you because we have the same size.....just curious.

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You are getting posterization just changing hue and Sat? Doesn't make sense.
Edit, my average Delta is 0.8 in color checker after CMS adjustments.

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post #3554 of 5363 Old 07-20-2017, 02:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shoman94 View Post
You are getting posterization just changing hue and Sat? Doesn't make sense.

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No, I haven't tried just Hue, and Sat. It's only luminance that causes it then?

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post #3555 of 5363 Old 07-20-2017, 02:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beardontwalk123 View Post
No, I haven't tried just Hue, and Sat. It's only luminance that causes it then?

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From my experience, yellow and green brightness changes can cause it.

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post #3556 of 5363 Old 07-20-2017, 02:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beardontwalk123 View Post
@skschatzman You are able to adjust CMS without posterization happening? When I adjust CMS it causes all sorts of problems for some reason. I ask you because we have the same size.....just curious.

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No. My content looks crisp. No obvious gradation or artifacts. Is there a reference video/image you have that I can compare with?

I always do Hue/Saturation until it's milked, then slowly adjust/test brightness.

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post #3557 of 5363 Old 07-20-2017, 03:29 PM
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I been thinking about selling my DVDO TPG to upgrade to the VideoForge Pro its the only pattern generator I've seen that can calibrate all three and be automated using Calman. Although the price of $1,495 is expensive I spent x10 plus on my audiophile hobby still not cheap considering. I hate calibrating HDR with USB drive takes for ever and I have never been able to calibrate DV so it looks like VideoForge Pro is a viable option.

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post #3558 of 5363 Old 07-20-2017, 05:00 PM
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This is a good guide on what where to start and what you need to adjust to get results. Like I said I did this with CMS on and on the color checker all the colors inside the primaries are all off. I got max errors of 5 and avg. deltaE of 2. The default CMS is max error of 4.1 and avg. deltaE of 1.4 so I attribute this to the primaries being over saturated for HDR.

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post #3559 of 5363 Old 07-20-2017, 06:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleNickySantoro View Post
I been thinking about selling my DVDO TPG to upgrade to the VideoForge Pro its the only pattern generator I've seen that can calibrate all three and be automated using Calman. Although the price of $1,495 is expensive I spent x10 plus on my audiophile hobby still not cheap considering. I hate calibrating HDR with USB drive takes for ever and I have never been able to calibrate DV so it looks like VideoForge Pro is a viable option.
Why not look at the hd fury linker? 200 bucks.

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post #3560 of 5363 Old 07-20-2017, 06:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleNickySantoro View Post
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6pvkYafrEY

This is a good guide on what where to start and what you need to adjust to get results. Like I said I did this with CMS on and on the color checker all the colors inside the primaries are all off. I got max errors of 5 and avg. deltaE of 2. The default CMS is max error of 4.1 and avg. deltaE of 1.4 so I attribute this to the primaries being over saturated for HDR.
With HDR, both DV and HDR 10, I concentrate on 50% of rec 2020. Dialing that in best you can results in a good color checker.

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post #3561 of 5363 Old 07-20-2017, 08:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleNickySantoro View Post
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6pvkYafrEY

This is a good guide on what where to start and what you need to adjust to get results. Like I said I did this with CMS on and on the color checker all the colors inside the primaries are all off. I got max errors of 5 and avg. deltaE of 2. The default CMS is max error of 4.1 and avg. deltaE of 1.4 so I attribute this to the primaries being over saturated for HDR.
You had those errors in SDR?

Here is my SDR color checker. No issues adjusting CMS.
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post #3562 of 5363 Old 07-21-2017, 03:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAB View Post
I have S&M HD Benchmark BR Edition- Calibration disc.. But wanted to make sure it was adequate for this display and wanting
DV& HD-10 adjustments.

Going to wait for the new S&M but that most likely will not be out until HD&DV get their final act together.
Hi, we are all expecting the release of the S&M3 UHD which is coming mid 2018 (or later).

But the problem is that stuff has changed a lot with HDR calibration and you can calibrated only with Meter/Software for HDR, it's not working like SDR where you can get a calibration disk without even a meter and do some adjustments without meter/software also.

This is happening because Contrast/Brightness settings in HDR are not working like we know in SDR, Brightness/Contrast/Backlight or OLED Light should left untouched in HDR Mode; because the display gamut/tone mapping is based to these default settings. Gamma is greyed out since there no gamma used in HDR, we have ST.2084.

In SDR we use Gamma curve as transfer function where you can set it to 2.2/2.4/BT1886 or whatever value you like....having in calculation the display Black/Peak White level to generate each digital level luminance levels, but in HDR the PQ Curve transfer function (ST.2084) which is an absolute curve it has specific luminance levels for each digital level (0-10000nits).

But S&M3 will have a lot of interesting stuff to check out different tone mapping/metadata and other test which will make it again a tool for verification for any calibration enthusiast user.

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration S/W: LightSpace ZRO / HCFR
S/W: ColourSpace INF, LightSpace XTP, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, ChromaPure
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box P/G: Murideo Six-G, DVDO AVLab TPG
Meter: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A
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post #3563 of 5363 Old 07-21-2017, 03:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleNickySantoro View Post
I been thinking about selling my DVDO TPG to upgrade to the VideoForge Pro its the only pattern generator I've seen that can calibrate all three and be automated using Calman. Although the price of $1,495 is expensive I spent x10 plus on my audiophile hobby still not cheap considering. I hate calibrating HDR with USB drive takes for ever and I have never been able to calibrate DV so it looks like VideoForge Pro is a viable option.
Hi, DVDO AVLab TPG, if you exclude the patch generation feature, it has the ColorChecker function where using a pixel cursor it can display to you the digital level of the selected pixel (this function is available to Dolby Monitor also) so it's a very helpful tool to check output levels or a incoming signal, to test output of a player to see if it's bit perfect etc.

DVDO work with LightSpace/CalMAN/ChromaPure while VideoForge Pro it will lock to work only for CalMAN 2017 (or later).

About HDR10 patch generation VideoForge Pro can do only RGB HDR10 and not YCbCr HDR10, so you will have exact the same results when you will use a combo of DVDO AVLab with HD Linker... with VideoForge Pro (or Murideo Six-G...since Murideo can't do YCbCr REC.2020 also......Murideo's device is the VideoForge PRO but with custom firmware) so you will output 1080p24 RGB-Video 10bit from DVDO and let the HD Linker to add to your the static metadata to trigger the HDR10 mode...and do the upscale from 1080p24->2160p24.

About Dolby Vision Patch generation, if you have a notebook with accurate RGB output, you can use it as pattern generator for DV.

Intel or NVidia with proper configuration may have accurate output while AMD's have less possibilities.

CalMAN has a specific image which will show if it can trigger DV mode, RGB 1080p 8bit signal is required (not 2160p) only. If you see that you can't get an accurate output from your notebook, you can use the DVDO ColorChecker function to find out which setting is outputting the correct output (if it's possible).

I have checked with DVDO Color Checker function the digital levels of the HD Linker in the video chain and it's not altering the video signal, so it's transparent.

You can use the X-Rite's utility to ensure (and reset if needed) that you Video Card output is not affected by any loaded VCGT (Video Card Gamma Table): http://www.xrite.com/service-support...ion-lut-tester

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration S/W: LightSpace ZRO / HCFR
S/W: ColourSpace INF, LightSpace XTP, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, ChromaPure
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post #3564 of 5363 Old 07-21-2017, 06:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
About HDR10 patch generation VideoForge Pro can do only RGB HDR10 and not YCbCr HDR10, so you will have exact the same results when you will use a combo of DVDO AVLab with HD Linker... with VideoForge Pro (or Murideo Six-G...since Murideo can't do YCbCr REC.2020 also......Murideo's device is the VideoForge PRO but with custom firmware) so you will output 1080p24 RGB-Video 10bit from DVDO and let the HD Linker to add to your the static metadata to trigger the HDR10 mode...and do the upscale from 1080p24->2160p24.[/url]
The Murideo Six-G only outputs RGB HDR10? That would then make it inaccurate for calibrating video HDR10 then?

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post #3565 of 5363 Old 07-21-2017, 06:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shoman94 View Post
The Murideo Six-G only outputs RGB HDR10? That would then make it inaccurate for calibrating video HDR10 then?
See page 4, note 1, about Murideo: http://www.spectracal.com/Documents/...QuickStart.pdf

There is no problem with that, when you measure only Grayscale (which is what currently do with HDR with the most of the displays), there no difference if you use RGB (HD Linker had option to send REC.2020 flag...which needed for some displays) or YCbCr REC.2020

The only HDR generator which can do YCbCr REC.2020 is the Accupel 6000.
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Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration S/W: LightSpace ZRO / HCFR
S/W: ColourSpace INF, LightSpace XTP, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, ChromaPure
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box P/G: Murideo Six-G, DVDO AVLab TPG
Meter: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A
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post #3566 of 5363 Old 07-21-2017, 07:45 PM
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Updated my settings for 3.3.18.1 and I included some screenshots.

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Sony XBR-75Z9F, Vizio M50-E1, Pioneer Kuro 5020, Marantz SR6013, AppleTV-4K, XBox One & (X), NVIDIA SHIELD.v1, FireTV 4K-HDR, HDHR Connects, QNAP 431+
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post #3567 of 5363 Old 07-21-2017, 08:22 PM
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Originally Posted by shoman94 View Post
Updated my settings for 3.3.18.1 and I included some screenshots.
Yes, screenshots.....I'm riding to Valhalla!

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post #3568 of 5363 Old 07-23-2017, 01:48 PM
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I have a calibration question for my Vizio p65-e1
FW 3.2.13.3

When I go to calibrate for HDR10 or DV it changes my color tuner settings for SDR as well. Am I doing something wrong? How do I adjust the HDR settings separately from the SDR ones? I'm making sure to have HDR content loaded like Glow, while I'm calibrating for HDR.


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post #3569 of 5363 Old 07-23-2017, 07:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matthorn View Post
I have a calibration question for my Vizio p65-e1
FW 3.2.13.3

When I go to calibrate for HDR10 or DV it changes my color tuner settings for SDR as well. Am I doing something wrong? How do I adjust the HDR settings separately from the SDR ones? I'm making sure to have HDR content loaded like Glow, while I'm calibrating for HDR.


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Enter them while watching that type of content.

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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
2018 Sony LCD Master Series Calibration Thread
Sony XBR-75Z9F, Vizio M50-E1, Pioneer Kuro 5020, Marantz SR6013, AppleTV-4K, XBox One & (X), NVIDIA SHIELD.v1, FireTV 4K-HDR, HDHR Connects, QNAP 431+
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post #3570 of 5363 Old 07-24-2017, 07:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleNickySantoro View Post
My latest SDR calibration with new calman update and newest Vizio P-Series Firmware. I just revised it found a couple of errors.
Thank you so much for making this! I will try this later tonight.
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