R.Masciola's HDR-10 UHD Test Patterns - Page 39 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1141 of 1765 Old 01-02-2018, 04:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Rev_018 has been re-released to all existing customers with the applied fix. Thanks!

- Ryan M.
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post #1142 of 1765 Old 01-03-2018, 02:32 AM
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post #1143 of 1765 Old 01-03-2018, 04:57 AM
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Hi Ryan, I bought your test pattern suite and have found them very useful, however my only experience with this sort of thing has been with using home theater discs for SDR adjustments. I am quite new to doing this with HDR and I am confused by the white clipping pattern. The manual states that the white clipping test pattern is just for observing my TV's performance based on the metadata it's being feed. However without adjusting the contrast controls I can see up to 86% flashing on the 80-100 white clipping test pattern. I understand that my TV is not mapping the peak luminance information well, and the picture is very dim with only brightness and color adjusted from your patterns and the backlight set at the default maximum value. My TV is a Hisense 55n6 and according to its specs its brightness is listed at 390 nit and a contrast ratio of 4000:1. So my questions are how should I go about adjusting the contrast control in HDR? Should I leave it alone? Can I use the white clipping pattern to adjust the contrast control? For example moving contrast until everything above 1000 nit is clipped. Thank you for any help you can give this newbie.
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post #1144 of 1765 Old 01-03-2018, 06:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Korgano View Post
Hi Ryan, I bought your test pattern suite and have found them very useful, however my only experience with this sort of thing has been with using home theater discs for SDR adjustments. I am quite new to doing this with HDR and I am confused by the white clipping pattern. The manual states that the white clipping test pattern is just for observing my TV's performance based on the metadata it's being feed. However without adjusting the contrast controls I can see up to 86% flashing on the 80-100 white clipping test pattern. I understand that my TV is not mapping the peak luminance information well, and the picture is very dim with only brightness and color adjusted from your patterns and the backlight set at the default maximum value. My TV is a Hisense 55n6 and according to its specs its brightness is listed at 390 nit and a contrast ratio of 4000:1. So my questions are how should I go about adjusting the contrast control in HDR? Should I leave it alone? Can I use the white clipping pattern to adjust the contrast control? For example moving contrast until everything above 1000 nit is clipped. Thank you for any help you can give this newbie.
I'm not Ryan , but you should leave contrast alone. Sets that do HDR - regardless of their maximum brightness - generally use their defaults as the basis for their tone mapping. Changing contrast and/or brightness can adversely affect that tone mapping and hence the picture.
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post #1145 of 1765 Old 01-03-2018, 07:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Korgano View Post
Hi Ryan, I bought your test pattern suite and have found them very useful, however my only experience with this sort of thing has been with using home theater discs for SDR adjustments. I am quite new to doing this with HDR and I am confused by the white clipping pattern. The manual states that the white clipping test pattern is just for observing my TV's performance based on the metadata it's being feed. However without adjusting the contrast controls I can see up to 86% flashing on the 80-100 white clipping test pattern. I understand that my TV is not mapping the peak luminance information well, and the picture is very dim with only brightness and color adjusted from your patterns and the backlight set at the default maximum value. My TV is a Hisense 55n6 and according to its specs its brightness is listed at 390 nit and a contrast ratio of 4000:1. So my questions are how should I go about adjusting the contrast control in HDR? Should I leave it alone? Can I use the white clipping pattern to adjust the contrast control? For example moving contrast until everything above 1000 nit is clipped. Thank you for any help you can give this newbie.
Hi Korgano,


I'm happy to hear that my test patterns have been helpful. Regarding your question, historically, with SDR clipping test patterns, you would make the necessary adjustments within your display's menu +/- on the controls for brightness, contrast, color, tint and so on, until the level/clipping was adjusted properly based on the pattern that was being displayed. Unfortunately, this methodology does not directly correlate to HDR. This is due to your display's internal tone mapping. Every adjustment made within your display, will affect how your TV implements its tone mapping and it's typically recommended to keep adjustments mostly at factory default, especially contrast, unless utilizing a meter when within HDR. The 86% you see flashing is above the peak nit metadata of 1,000 nit implemented within the test pattern itself. Either the tone mapping is not being properly implemented or Hisense is taking the metadata and applying their own methodology. Thanks!


- Ryan M.
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@mascior Ryan, further to what you are saying, if I leave my pj at factory settings, according to your patterns, it clips everything above 400 nits. If I adjust the HDR Contrast slider to get to 1,000 the APL of course drops considerably. Is your recommendation still to clip. I don't know enough about where content is to know what I am clipping in real content when I leave it at the factory preset. That is, is there a pattern that I can use for setting HDR Contrast somewhere in between? Can you advise? Also, is each rev completely cumulative such that if I implement v18 I can archive previous versions? Thanks for your help.
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post #1147 of 1765 Old 01-03-2018, 11:03 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jqmn View Post
@mascior Ryan, further to what you are saying, if I leave my pj at factory settings, according to your patterns, it clips everything above 400 nits. If I adjust the HDR Contrast slider to get to 1,000 the APL of course drops considerably. Is your recommendation still to clip. I don't know enough about where content is to know what I am clipping in real content when I leave it at the factory preset. That is, is there a pattern that I can use for setting HDR Contrast somewhere in between? Can you advise? Also, is each rev completely cumulative such that if I implement v18 I can archive previous versions? Thanks for your help.

Hi jqmn,


I would recommend keeping your contrast at its default setting, especially with a projector. Regarding the pattern suite revisions, each new release encompasses the previous as well. So yes, you can archive all the previous revisions. Thanks!


- Ryan M.
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Hi Korgano,


I'm happy to hear that my test patterns have been helpful. Regarding your question, historically, with SDR clipping test patterns, you would make the necessary adjustments within your display's menu +/- on the controls for brightness, contrast, color, tint and so on, until the level/clipping was adjusted properly based on the pattern that was being displayed. Unfortunately, this methodology does not directly correlate to HDR. This is due to your display's internal tone mapping. Every adjustment made within your display, will affect how your TV implements its tone mapping and it's typically recommended to keep adjustments mostly at factory default, especially contrast, unless utilizing a meter when within HDR. The 86% you see flashing is above the peak nit metadata of 1,000 nit implemented within the test pattern itself. Either the tone mapping is not being properly implemented or Hisense is taking the metadata and applying their own methodology. Thanks!


- Ryan M.
Thank you Ryan and Rolls, very helpful responses! Quick follow-up question, if I wanted to get a meter and try calibrating the contrast that way what would be some of the best entry level options? Also if I should leave everything at default does that mean setting brightness by your test pattern is also unnecessary?
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post #1149 of 1765 Old 01-04-2018, 04:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Korgano View Post
Thank you Ryan and Rolls, very helpful responses! Quick follow-up question, if I wanted to get a meter and try calibrating the contrast that way what would be some of the best entry level options? Also if I should leave everything at default does that mean setting brightness by your test pattern is also unnecessary?
Your best low-cost bet is HCFR or the free version of LightSpace (DPS) and the X-Rite I1 Display Pro, AKA here as the I1D3. Setting brightness is probably unnecessary, but you should still check it.
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post #1150 of 1765 Old 01-06-2018, 02:45 AM
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Is there some guide or manual on how to use these patterns? I am not a pro calibrator, but i would like to make sure some settings are ok, HDR specific settings that do not need a measurement device, settings that can be done by looking at the screen using some guidelines and patterns. Like for brightness, contrast etc. but also if possible, for setting the gamma correctly, is that possible? Like in the Spears & Munsil disk, there is a short description for each pattern that tells you how to use it.
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post #1151 of 1765 Old 01-06-2018, 06:47 AM
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Is there some guide or manual on how to use these patterns? I am not a pro calibrator, but i would like to make sure some settings are ok, HDR specific settings that do not need a measurement device, settings that can be done by looking at the screen using some guidelines and patterns. Like for brightness, contrast etc. but also if possible, for setting the gamma correctly, is that possible? Like in the Spears & Munsil disk, there is a short description for each pattern that tells you how to use it.
You will need a meter bud.

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post #1152 of 1765 Old 01-06-2018, 06:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jowicrt View Post
Is there some guide or manual on how to use these patterns? I am not a pro calibrator, but i would like to make sure some settings are ok, HDR specific settings that do not need a measurement device, settings that can be done by looking at the screen using some guidelines and patterns. Like for brightness, contrast etc. but also if possible, for setting the gamma correctly, is that possible? Like in the Spears & Munsil disk, there is a short description for each pattern that tells you how to use it.
Hi jowicrt,

The test pattern suite manual can be located on the products page of my website. However, here is a direct link "DVS UHD|HDR-10 Test Pattern Suite Instructions Download (PDF)". The products manual will provide short descriptions that explain pattern utilization, including brightness, contrast, along with a multitude of other available UHD/HDR-10 test patterns.

However, please keep in mind, unlike current SDR test patterns allowing for adjustment based on pattern reference. HDR test patterns are merely utilized as a point of reference, displaying your TV's current state within HDR modes. You would need a meter, as mentioned above by skschatzman, to take full advantage of the pattern suite and to get the best out of your display. Thanks!

- Ryan M.
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post #1153 of 1765 Old 01-08-2018, 08:33 AM
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Hi BCJ,

I have yet to experience this anomaly. The area's that you have circled are high frequency, single pixel H/V rows, extremely high detail. You may want to try lowering your sharpness, typically sharpness at this level will add extra processing, even at a default value of 50. Also, you may want to check if any other unnecessary processing/edge enhancement features are enabled, as this will skew your image as well. Thanks!

- Ryan M.
Just wanted to chip and say I see the exact same anomaly on my Sony ZD9, have done for as long as I've been using these patterns of yours and the result is the same across three different players (Panny, Sony, OPPO) so the TV must be doing something to the horizontal resolution. Perversely, it's only when the sharpness is raised to 59 (as BCJ pointed out) that the green tint subsides a little, and turning down the sharpness does nothing to affect the tint at all. Whatever the Sony processing is doing it's baking it in good and proper, and this is with every enhancer and reality creation and noise reduction and motionflow turned OFF. With the sharpness at 59 I notice a thin little 'edge' around the flashing bars in the white clipping patterns, should that be there or should the boxes have no discernable hard edges? If the latter then I might as well leave sharpness on 50 and be done with it.
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post #1154 of 1765 Old 01-08-2018, 12:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Just wanted to chip and say I see the exact same anomaly on my Sony ZD9, have done for as long as I've been using these patterns of yours and the result is the same across three different players (Panny, Sony, OPPO) so the TV must be doing something to the horizontal resolution. Perversely, it's only when the sharpness is raised to 59 (as BCJ pointed out) that the green tint subsides a little, and turning down the sharpness does nothing to affect the tint at all. Whatever the Sony processing is doing it's baking it in good and proper, and this is with every enhancer and reality creation and noise reduction and motionflow turned OFF. With the sharpness at 59 I notice a thin little 'edge' around the flashing bars in the white clipping patterns, should that be there or should the boxes have no discernable hard edges? If the latter then I might as well leave sharpness on 50 and be done with it.

Hi Geoff,


This anomaly seems to be directly correlated to Sony's processing in some way, as I can not reproduce this effect on any of my other test displays. I have seen this issue manifest on a few 4K Sony projectors and LCD displays so far, along with a few of my customer display devices. However, it never seems to appear in actual content. Also, there should be no discernible hard edges around the flashing bars. However, this may or may not be directly related to sharpness. Thanks!


- Ryan M.

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Hi jqmn,
I would recommend keeping your contrast at its default setting, especially with a projector
Just to clarify - if I am doing my own tone mapping through the gamma settings using a meter, I should not be concerned about adjusting contrast, correct?
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Do I need any tools for RM UHD|HDR-10 Test Pattern Suite digital download? How big is the file? Is it 4k? I was planning on using my xbox one x but I doubt it can handle the file format. I think I might use my receiver. It has a USB port I will be trying right now to see if it can play video files.
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post #1157 of 1765 Old 01-08-2018, 07:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Just to clarify - if I am doing my own tone mapping through the gamma settings using a meter, I should not be concerned about adjusting contrast, correct?
Hi Jwhn,

Not necessarily (even though default is typically the correct setting). I simply recommend leaving the contrast at its default setting if you are not going to utilize a meter, as the white clipping test patterns are for reference, not adjustment. Thanks!

- Ryan M.

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Do I need any tools for RM UHD|HDR-10 Test Pattern Suite digital download? How big is the file? Is it 4k? I was planning on using my xbox one x but I doubt it can handle the file format. I think I might use my receiver. It has a USB port I will be trying right now to see if it can play video files.
Hi artistdraw,

You would need a meter to take full advantage of the pattern suite. There are 1,400+ UHD/HDR-10 HEVC/H.265 encoded files wrapped in mp4 and ts containers. The digital download file size is 3.48 GB zipped and 8.57 GB uncompressed. I have yet to test my patterns on an XBOX One X. However, based on the specs, there should be no playback issues regarding HEVC encoded files, but that remains to be tested. Thanks!

- Ryan M.
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Ryan-- For the test image that is the barn and a properly set brightness level, do you know whether we should be able to see anything inside the barn and if so, from left to right, how much? Cranking up brightness exposes that the entire inside of the barn is in the footage; this seems to be a good scene to test proper settings. Thanks.
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post #1160 of 1765 Old 01-09-2018, 02:35 PM
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Hi artistdraw,

You would need a meter to take full advantage of the pattern suite. There are 1,400+ UHD/HDR-10 HEVC/H.265 encoded files wrapped in mp4 and ts containers. The digital download file size is 3.48 GB zipped and 8.57 GB uncompressed. I have yet to test my patterns on an XBOX One X. However, based on the specs, there should be no playback issues regarding HEVC encoded files, but that remains to be tested. Thanks!

- Ryan M.
Can someone link meter I would need. I am googling meter calibration hdtv not sure if its correct. I am new to this not sure what it is. Thanks
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Ryan,

When my 4k direct tv box updated to HLG my SDR channels are now reporting 1080i/720p bt.2020 color gamut. Are there slides that you offer to calibrate to this color gamut? The tv does not switch over to HDR HLG on the non 4k channels.


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Ryan,

When my 4k direct tv box updated to HLG my SDR channels are now reporting 1080i/720p bt.2020 color gamut. Are there slides that you offer to calibrate to this color gamut? The tv does not switch over to HDR HLG on the non 4k channels.


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post #1163 of 1765 Old 01-10-2018, 02:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Ryan-- For the test image that is the barn and a properly set brightness level, do you know whether we should be able to see anything inside the barn and if so, from left to right, how much? Cranking up brightness exposes that the entire inside of the barn is in the footage; this seems to be a good scene to test proper settings. Thanks.
Hi jqmn,

You are correct, there is content within the barn and raising the brightness does in fact expose hidden content. However, I would not base your brightness adjustments solely on this test footage alone. I would recommend utilizing the black clipping test patterns as your reference. Also, please keep in mind, these test clips are merely SDR/sRGB to HDR/BT2020 converted image files vs true HDR clips (which I am currently working on acquiring). Thanks!

- Ryan M.
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Can someone link meter I would need. I am googling meter calibration hdtv not sure if its correct. I am new to this not sure what it is. Thanks
Hi artistdraw,

I would recommend an i1 Display PRO colorimeter at a minimum. Here is a great article on ConnecTEDDD's website regarding the different variations of the meter. Also, here is another great article on the ChromaPure website regarding the accuracy of the i1 Display PRO. Thanks!

- Ryan M.
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post #1165 of 1765 Old 01-10-2018, 03:11 PM - Thread Starter
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Ryan,

When my 4k direct tv box updated to HLG my SDR channels are now reporting 1080i/720p bt.2020 color gamut. Are there slides that you offer to calibrate to this color gamut? The tv does not switch over to HDR HLG on the non 4k channels.


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Hi jayraysaiz,

I have been working on a HDR/HLG pattern suite over the past couple of months. I will be looking to release these patterns soon. Please see the link below for a demo HLG test clip. Thanks!

10_Window_100_C940_HLG.zip

- Ryan M.
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Hi jayraysaiz,



I have been working on a HDR/HLG pattern suite over the past couple of months. I will be looking to release these patterns soon. Please see the link below for a demo HLG test clip. Thanks!



10_Window_100_C940_HLG.zip



- Ryan M.


Ryan is there a pattern for the SDR 10bit to enable the ability to calibrate SDR at bt.2020? When I’m on regular HD channel my tv is reporting BT.2020


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post #1167 of 1765 Old 01-10-2018, 03:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Ryan is there a pattern for the SDR 10bit to enable the ability to calibrate SDR at bt.2020? When I’m on regular HD channel my tv is reporting BT.2020


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Unfortunately, no and I wasn't even aware that DirecTV was implementing SDR/BT2020?!?

- Ryan M.
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Originally Posted by mascior View Post

I think this could be accommodated. I will reach out to Ricky over at Kalibrate Limited and see what we can do. Thanks!
I see that he's now dropped his price for the disc-only version: https://www.chromapure.co.uk/details...&type=products

Is there any news on the bundle yet please?

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post #1169 of 1765 Old 01-10-2018, 03:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mrtickleuk View Post
I see that he's now dropped his price for the disc-only version: https://www.chromapure.co.uk/details...&type=products

Is there any news on the bundle yet please?
Working on it!

- Ryan M.
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post #1170 of 1765 Old 01-11-2018, 06:51 AM
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Unfortunately, no and I wasn't even aware that DirecTV was implementing SDR/BT2020?!?



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Interesting is this something new? The colors seem off a bit since the new update. Of course could all be in my head.


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