***Official B/C/E/G6P OLED Calibration Thread - Page 39 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1141 of 2010 Old 03-23-2017, 02:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post
If you buy a specrto I1Pro(x) there is no need to buy a profiled I1D3 since the spectro is used to create corrections.


I know that Chromapure corrections are meter specific. I am not sure if the Calman provides meter specific corrections. They may be generic corrections for the display type.


- Rich
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrref View Post
When you get your i1Pro, compare it to the profiles in the i1D3 and let us know what you see. I've calibrated and profiled a couple more OLEDs, and I have even more data that shows they vary panel to panel. So if you want the most accuracy, best to profile your meter.
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post #1142 of 2010 Old 03-23-2017, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by 256k View Post
So... you think Chromapure 3 is better than Calman then?, for the cost of Calman Enthusiast offer (300$), can i have then the same features on Chromapure 3?, the idea is to install it on my laptop and take the retail i1D3 (the one from amazon) to my family/friends house and calibrate their tv's

I need to know carefully what to do... all i've always seen is Calman, never seen chromapure 3 in action, only on screens and it looked a bit... weird in comparison

I know i'm not buying the best calibration tool, but at least i want to buy a decent software

You guys talk about chromapure with i1D3, but have in count that i cannot buy their i1D3, but the standard one

Still think that the enthusiast option of calman (value 400 but for 300 doing that trick) seems a better offer, hmm... gonna see videos to decide what to do...
Yes, here is the new UI for the ChromaPure3. It has been greatly improved.
I'd send an email to chromapure for more information.


- Rich
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post #1143 of 2010 Old 03-23-2017, 02:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post
Yes, here is the new UI for the ChromaPure3. It has been greatly improved.
I'd send an email to chromapure for more information.


- Rich
Jesus christ, it does look like a windows 95 app, also for what i've seen is not that intuitive as you guys says... i mean, or you see the tutorials and learn what to do each time, or you're sold, on Calman at least they tell you what to do on each place :S

Arghhh, dont know what to do X___x
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post #1144 of 2010 Old 03-23-2017, 02:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 256k View Post
Jesus christ, it does look like a windows 95 app, also for what i've seen is not that intuitive as you guys says... i mean, or you see the tutorials and learn what to do each time, or you're sold, on Calman at least they tell you what to do on each place :S

Arghhh, dont know what to do X___x
At some point, you have to learn how to do a basic calibration. After that, both programs are very good. Personal preference.


- Rich
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post #1145 of 2010 Old 03-23-2017, 04:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post
At some point, you have to learn how to do a basic calibration. After that, both programs are very good. Personal preference.


- Rich
So... What options do i need to check to have the best i1D3 with chromapure 3? no pattern generator, just that, as far as i read the meter type "PRO" http://www.chromapure.co.uk/details.asp?id=24&type=blog that cost 75GBP more is the one i should buy, no? it is really worth it?

http://www.chromapure.co.uk/details....&type=products
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post #1146 of 2010 Old 03-23-2017, 04:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 256k View Post
So... What options do i need to check to have the best i1D3 with chromapure 3? no pattern generator, just that, as far as i read the meter type "PRO" http://www.chromapure.co.uk/details.asp?id=24&type=blog that cost 75GBP more is the one i should buy, no? it is really worth it?

http://www.chromapure.co.uk/details....&type=products
We are getting seriously off-topic. If you ask these questions on the ChromaPure thread, you'll get more folks answering:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-di...-3-thread.html

You need a way to display patterns. I use my Lumagen Radiance 2020. There are others.
Here is a link to TED's Lightspace disk:

http://www.displaycalibrations.com/disk_features.html

- Rich


Here is a link to: CHROMAPURE GRAYSCALE & COLOR CALIBRATION FOR DUMMIES


http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=35322
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post #1147 of 2010 Old 03-23-2017, 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by RichB View Post
At some point, you have to learn how to do a basic calibration. After that, both programs are very good. Personal preference.


- Rich
HCFR is a great place to start.
I mean, you may have a display that needs a non-standard workflow to get good results, but if you're stuck "clicking next" just going through a single process you may end up with a "calibration" that is now worse than you began.

I'm just saying you need to play with whatever software you choose, get familiar with what IT wants, and then how to tell it what it wants when it needs it for YOUR display.
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post #1148 of 2010 Old 03-23-2017, 09:49 PM
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I noticed when watching a 3D movie on my E6 that the picture settings are different than what I had set them to for non-3D. It goes to Standard picture mode instead of ISF Dark Room and OLED light goes to 100. I assume it does this to compensate for the dimmer 3D image. Would you recommend leaving it there or changing it and if so, what settings work best for 3D?


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post #1149 of 2010 Old 03-24-2017, 04:53 AM
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The hours have passed and i've only seen that the initial idea of the i1D3 PRO (calibrated) + Chromapure 3 will be for nothing, since i dont have a pattern generator and cant pay one... So just using the chromapure disc will not make a huge difference on B6, right? Unless i can pay one of those super expensive devices like eeColor i will not see great improvements on the image quality of the B6, right? or i'm wrong? Sorry for the "offtopic" but it's not that much, since i want it to calibrate my B6 and maybe someday someone else enters here with the same questions and doubts

Has anyone here been, or is in my same position? If it's the case, you saw a good gain on B6 image quality? or it was not worth the price? Should i better waste the money on hire a pro calibrator?

@vsorgi 3D Mode is treated like other mode, totally separated

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post #1150 of 2010 Old 03-24-2017, 05:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vsorgi View Post
I noticed when watching a 3D movie on my E6 that the picture settings are different than what I had set them to for non-3D. It goes to Standard picture mode instead of ISF Dark Room and OLED light goes to 100. I assume it does this to compensate for the dimmer 3D image. Would you recommend leaving it there or changing it and if so, what settings work best for 3D?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
I assumed that 3D glasses are neutral and apply only a light attenuation, so I put on 3D mode the same configuration of ISF mode, except the OLED light that I leaved at 100.
I don't know if it is the right procedure but I have a good image result.
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post #1151 of 2010 Old 03-24-2017, 06:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 256k View Post
The hours have passed and i've only seen that the initial idea of the i1D3 PRO (calibrated) + Chromapure 3 will be for nothing, since i dont have a pattern generator and cant pay one... So just using the chromapure disc will not make a huge difference on B6, right? Unless i can pay one of those super expensive devices like eeColor i will not see great improvements on the image quality of the B6, right? or i'm wrong? Sorry for the "offtopic" but it's not that much, since i want it to calibrate my B6 and maybe someday someone else enters here with the same questions and doubts

Has anyone here been, or is in my same position? If it's the case, you saw a good gain on B6 image quality? or it was not worth the price? Should i better waste the money on hire a pro calibrator?

@vsorgi 3D Mode is treated like other mode, totally separated

You don't need a dedicated pattern generator. Just need some way to display patterns. Ted's Lightspace disk via your main media player is totally acceptable. If want for cheaper there are free alternatives in these forums you can find, though my opinion is that Ted's disk is worth the asking price and pretty much everyone will say the same.


For will it make a big difference... it's subjective, everyone in here will say yes, though some people initially say they do not like a calibrated picture (just a preference).


Self or Pro calibration will be a big step up in overall accuracy. The eecolor box would then be the next significant step and seems is really the only way to get really accurate colors out of these sets as CMS is not good. Can always start with the self cal and get the eecolor later if decided, and you'd then have all the other necessary patterns/equipment to set it up at that point.
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post #1152 of 2010 Old 03-24-2017, 07:59 AM
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To hell with everything... Buyed the i1D3 PRO + Chromapure 3 Standard... In one week i'll be here posting my really stupid-bad results ... xD
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post #1153 of 2010 Old 03-24-2017, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by 256k View Post
To hell with everything... Buyed the i1D3 PRO + Chromapure 3 Standard... In one week i'll be here posting my really stupid-bad results ... xD
Good plan

- Rich

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post #1154 of 2010 Old 03-24-2017, 08:50 AM
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To hell with everything... Buyed the i1D3 PRO + Chromapure 3 Standard... In one week i'll be here posting my really stupid-bad results ... xD
As a ChromaPure customer for over a year now you won't be disappointed, especially when you see the awesome picture quality the i1D3 and ChromaPure combination can deliver for your displays. Truth be told though, in the case of LG's OLEDs, the improvements you see may not be as dramatic as you will likely see on other display types in your family since the LG OLEDs are so good out of the box.

While you are waiting for your order I would urge you to download the ChromaPure 3.1 owners manual and read it carefully from front to back (lots of great info in there) and also read the Curt Palme ChromaPure for beginners guide we referenced above. Good Luck!

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post #1155 of 2010 Old 03-24-2017, 09:04 AM
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Yeah... The problem is that my english is far of perfect, so i have problems sometimes trying to understand what the hell i have to do

BTW, i will try to calibrate my TV just as Vincent Teoh says, because each time i see one of his calibrations i'm like "JESUS CHRIST! LOOK AT THAT B6!"

He says that for lower IRE's he uses a 2.2gamma, but from 40 to 100 he uses a 2.4 gamma to give the image a real "pop" effect (Thats what i see always and thats what i want!), just look at how this B6 looks, jesus christ





Of course he uses Calman ultimate and a lot better equipment than i will, but i'll try to get as close as i can to that wonderfull calibrations

PS: Have anyone calibrated HDR using Masciola HDR patterns and the media player of the TV? did you see any improvements to the Standard HDR settings?

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post #1156 of 2010 Old 03-24-2017, 02:03 PM
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To hell with everything... Buyed the i1D3 PRO + Chromapure 3 Standard... In one week i'll be here posting my really stupid-bad results ... xD
Nice choice (to come down the rabbit hole!)

There are many people here in the forum, not just in this thread, who will gladly help you.


I highly recomend SAVING your current settings. Write them down if needed.
Once you're familiar with Chromapure and the whole process, then return to those settings, run measurements so you know what state your display is starting at so you can see not only the visual difference but the measured differences.

Note: I don't know if this is a simple task with chromapure. I'm all HCFR and know nothing about other software workflow(s).

Either way you will be much happier knowing you're getting the most out of your display, even if you don't have to change much. This kind of thinking is what keeps me from sleeping soundly (thinking I could "improve" my last calibration.... every time).
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post #1157 of 2010 Old 03-24-2017, 02:24 PM
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Nice choice (to come down the rabbit hole!)

There are many people here in the forum, not just in this thread, who will gladly help you.


I highly recomend SAVING your current settings. Write them down if needed.
Once you're familiar with Chromapure and the whole process, then return to those settings, run measurements so you know what state your display is starting at so you can see not only the visual difference but the measured differences.

Note: I don't know if this is a simple task with chromapure. I'm all HCFR and know nothing about other software workflow(s).

Either way you will be much happier knowing you're getting the most out of your display, even if you don't have to change much. This kind of thinking is what keeps me from sleeping soundly (thinking I could "improve" my last calibration.... every time).
Thanks, i'll take the offer :P

For all this time i've been taking a look to this TV problems (B6), and since i have the TV in a room where no light enters on night, i can see clearly if my TV is pure black or not, at first i didnt understood why a TV that was supposed to have Pure blacks didnt have them, so far what i've found touching all the settings of the TV almost every day since november 2016 is:

- Brightness higher than 50 means by force the lost of pure black, looks like some subpixels turn on and glow
- ASBL is less agressive on my PC if i set it to OLED 80/Contrast 85, contrast makes ABL appears really agressive if you have a higher contrast, but OLED Light does not seems to affect that much as contrast
- On games like FFXV on a PS4 PRO, if you set HDR to Limited/Black level LOW, it results on clipping of things like the Sun of the game, take a look at this photos i took yesterday:

RGB Limited (will always be YUV422 on PS4 PRO no matter if complete or limited) + Black level low:



RGB Complete + Black level high + (Here come my own settings i've been using to avoid the clipping and have pure black without glow, having all the shadow detail possible...) Brightness 48 + DYNAMIC CONTRAST MEDIUM (Yes, sounds crazy, but it's the only thing that made me have the entire shadow detail while having high nits at the same time i have a lower contrast)



Notice how now there's a perfect Sun Sphere, while on limited/low there wasnt

With the calibration tools now i want to see how incorrect image i get from this, but if anyone can test those settings 1 week before me (Have to wait 1 week to have my i1D3 calibrated) and if by 20 points it can be corrected, i'll be really grateful

It's a shame there's no way to touch the gamma on HDR... Amazon App allows it and hell, what a difference it makes

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post #1158 of 2010 Old 03-24-2017, 03:57 PM
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I have calibrated my 65B6 using Chromapure3 using the I1D3 with meter corrections using an I1Pro2.
After completing that calibration, I ran Calman 2016 also profiling the I1D3 using the I1Pro2.

The Chromapure3 meter corrections and grayscale calibration results and Calman meter profile and measurements are attached. Calman and Chromapure do not agree.
Perhaps, this is an example of the Calman meter correction issue.

ChadB is coming tomorrow to calibrate my B6. That should be interesting

- Rich
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post #1159 of 2010 Old 03-24-2017, 04:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 256k View Post
Thanks, i'll take the offer :P

For all this time i've been taking a look to this TV problems (B6), and since i have the TV in a room where no light enters on night, i can see clearly if my TV is pure black or not, at first i didnt understood why a TV that was supposed to have Pure blacks didnt have them, so far what i've found touching all the settings of the TV almost every day since november 2016 is:

- Brightness higher than 50 means by force the lost of pure black, looks like some subpixels turn on and glow
- ASBL is less agressive on my PC if i set it to OLED 80/Contrast 85, contrast makes ABL appears really agressive if you have a higher contrast, but OLED Light does not seems to affect that much as contrast
- On games like FFXV on a PS4 PRO, if you set HDR to Limited/Black level LOW, it results on clipping of things like the Sun of the game, take a look at this photos i took yesterday:

RGB Limited (will always be YUV422 on PS4 PRO no matter if complete or limited) + Black level low:

***SNIPPED FOR QUOTE***

RGB Complete + Black level high + (Here come my own settings i've been using to avoid the clipping and have pure black without glow, having all the shadow detail possible...) Brightness 48 + DYNAMIC CONTRAST MEDIUM (Yes, sounds crazy, but it's the only thing that made me have the entire shadow detail while having high nits at the same time i have a lower contrast)

***SNIPPED FOR QUOTE***

Notice how now there's a perfect Sun Sphere, while on limited/low there wasnt

With the calibration tools now i want to see how incorrect image i get from this, but if anyone can test those settings 1 week before me (Have to wait 1 week to have my i1D3 calibrated) and if by 20 points it can be corrected, i'll be really grateful

It's a shame there's no way to touch the gamma on HDR... Amazon App allows it and hell, what a difference it makes
Gamma is not really a thing with HDR. Instead we have a pre-defined EOTF. Black is black is black. None of this Black = 0.15 nits or whatever non-oleds are at for black levels.
The Playstation is going to play games using HDR10, which is something we can calibrate for. Ryan Masciola has an HDR10 calibration disc that has patterns to match the controls of these OLED displays (Because LG just had to be different than everyone else...).
You can't play these files on the Playstation 4 as the encoding format is not supported. However from my basic testing (I'm sure Ted Aspiotis is going to or has done a FAR better job at evaluating the console), the console is basically clean so you can calibrate HDR with another clean device (blu-ray player supporting the files, or even USB drive connected to the display's USB ports) and have the same results.

You can't directly compare SDR and HDR in the games either. Different shaders and rendering pipelines are going to be used. Sometimes the choices used in one or the other may change for artistic reasons while sacrificing accuracy (bloom, "black levels", highlights are the typical areas first modified).
I've not played any Final Fantasy XV since getting my display (Read my posts here, I have ultra mega OCD and take things beyond the logical realm of perception lol).



---


I've been tinkering with a thought:
Judd-Voss, White point vs using it as the observer type in HCFR/other?
I've used the white point specified by Iron Mike (x=0.3067 y=0.3180) in the last few pages of the Lightspace CMS thread (Very nice reading material, IMO, regardless of right or wrong or sideways).
Using it with Judd-Voss, I get the very obvious blue tinting, which is probably what everyone else got when trying this as well.

Try it with the Normal Observer, and Non-refresh display with no matrix. Looks neutral to me (compared to Silly Sally's CCSS).

I'm still hammering out bumps in my grayscale but I'm planing on trying both out as I think one is slightly warmer or cooler than the other (perceptionally both closely match my parents LM7200 with eeColor, far more than Non-refresh with standard white point or using the matrix provided by dschlic1).
For all I know my parents LM7200 could have metamerism failure but I don't really have any spectro or "reference" displays way to confirm, so take what I say with a grain of salt.
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post #1160 of 2010 Old 03-25-2017, 12:31 PM
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Hi folks, I just registered this account after lurking for a bit.

I'm a new owner of a 55C6P and want to get my feet a little wet with calibrating the unit. I have a moderate level of experience calibrating PC monitors using my i1 display pro meter and the DisplayCal package.

I understand that calibrating TVs are quite a bit different than PC monitors. At this point I'm only fiddling around with the SDR Game Mode, which I know is pretty much locked out and one can only adjust the picture with the some very basic controls. Using the AVS HD 709 disc I've used the basic test patterns and set my contrast and brightness controls.

Contrast : 85
Brightness : 53

As I understand it, my meter would only benefit me to take color temperature readings while tweaking the SDR Game Mode. I'd like to get as close as D65 as possible, which I understand W50 is about as good as one can get. A couple of questions:

1) If I'd like to set sustained luminance via the OLED backlight is it as simple as using a 100% white test screen, set to a window (to minimize ABL) and adjust from there?
2) Can brightness and contrast be set or verified with my meter, or is that a strictly eyeballs + test pattern calibration only?

Thanks for the input. I'll eventually dabble with the ISF picture modes, but for now all I use the TV for is 4K console gaming.
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post #1161 of 2010 Old 03-25-2017, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by i_max2k2 View Post
Guys now that, 2017 models are shipping out or almost ready to ship out. Do we know if LG will give us a firmware with Dolby Vision calibration enabled and that Golden Reference file for our OLED's, or is that file out in the wild?

Anyway we can ask and perhaps get that file from LG.
Hi, I don't think LG will ever release the Dolby Reference Golden Number file for 2016 models, since they know that their CMS controls are not working as expected, it makes no sense to release a file for DV calibration which will make things worse after the user will start adjusting the CMS controls, we will see if they will have improve this area with their 2017 models, to be able to release the Golden Reference file for 2017 line.

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post #1162 of 2010 Old 03-25-2017, 05:19 PM
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Originally Posted by RIppolito View Post
I have a preamp that contains a video processor that can output rgb, 4:4:4, or 4:2:2. I also have an eecolor box that internally processes in rgb space, but will pass out whatever format is passed in.

It would seem to me that if I set up the end to end to be rgb into the OLED, I would get the best picture.

What is the prevalent thinking on which video format produces the best picture?

Thanks in advance...be well
Ron
Hi Ron,

If you send RGB-Video signal to LG, it will dim slightly the near black levels, while YCbCr Input will be better. I quickly checked if I can spot a difference sending from OPPO UDP-203 1080p 12-bit Output throu eeColor between RGB-Video vs. YCbCr 4:2:2 vs. YCbCr 4:4:4, I was not able to see a difference even looking Color Space evaluation patterns from S&M1 + S&M2 calibration disks.

eeColor will always output the same colorspace it's getting to it's input, it will only change the bit-depth to 12-bit for smoother shades, less banding/interpollation artifacts.
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post #1163 of 2010 Old 03-25-2017, 05:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Kamikaze_Ice View Post
I've heard (haven't verified) that internal processing is YCbCr.
My LED LG's are all RGB, and I assume they wouldn't bother restructuring for non-RGB processing when they've been doing it for years.

Then again, you were having issues with color differences in RGB with your Playstation.

I actually have another theory on that.
Try calibrating at a different peak brightness and see if your primary luminance axis has shifted?
The theory here being that voltage is very irregular due to ABL effecting voltage, causing inconsistent axis shifts at different luminance levels.
I noticed this with Cyan on my display when running Ted's luminance patterns (CALMAN 10-point axis patterns).
Hi, most of the displays are processing internally in YCbCr, (some models like better 4:2:2 input, others 4:4:4.) I guest because of the lower data rate (less resources) and probably, for LED TV's it will need less processing also (counting to Y numbers) to decide about the global/local dimming etc.

KURO is an exception, it likes better RGB-Video input, if you feed it with RGB-Video it provides better high-frequency resolution better from 4:4:4/4:2:2.

LG 2016 OLED's have an issue in it's Color Gamut mapping (I haven't measured 2017 models to see if they suffering with the same issue), the Normal Gamut it has provides a close gamut coverage to REC.709 (a bit oversaturated) but the tracking of low end colors is expanded to larger coverage, this is something I haven't seen before, seems that the LG engineers haven't programmed well that, see what is happening when you measure the lower luminance levels... From lower Luminance levels from the classic ones (100%/75%) users/magazines/calibrators are using they are staring the shiftings of all colors for random (not linear) directions, especially @ 25% Luminance and below the colorspace coverage is larger, this will provide non-linear gradients or other problems with strange shades to real picture (example here). Usually that kind of measurements are ignored from the users which measure only a few color points to validate the post calibration results.

I have posted about that problem here: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/149-bl...l#post50740889 but another forum user which measured 65E6 and 65G6 with 10-Point Saturation of various Luminance levels found the same results (and worse) using reference gear also (Klein K-10A + JETI 1211) and posted pictures and animated pictures there: ***Official B/C/E/G6P OLED Calibration Thread
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post #1164 of 2010 Old 03-25-2017, 06:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Kamikaze_Ice View Post
Mr. Aspiotis, I'm curious. How are you taking measurements? Your process, I mean. Like sweeps? Anything shown between measurements? What do you leave on the screen before or after measuring? Single readings or multiple? If multiple, averaging them? Do you re-measure previous patterns (none, randomly, switching back and forth, specific points only, etc)?
Hi, these displays need about 60 minutes (meters need warmup also) before taking any measurement, the gamma is changing over the time until about 50min, where it's more stable after that period. It's starting with very dark average about 2.6 until to reach 2.4 one hour later.

With LightSpace I use for 3D LUT, I don't use any averaging since the meter is stable and ultra fast, since Klein has a fixed integration time, it takes the same time to read a 0.0006 nit patch or a 5.000 nits patch, i1d3 will take more time to read dark patches while it will measure faster brighter ones. This is a good advantage of Klein meter where all patches will stay displayed to the screen exact the same time, Klein takes any read for about 125ms. I use 0.5sec pattern delay, without low light averaging (it's not required...since Klein is taking internally 256 meter reads per second, and it's doing averaging internally and report 8 times per seconds to the software the results).

For manual cal's using internal controls I do only multi-passes (full measurement runs...grayscale..sweeps etc..) and when I need to change something to the internal settings, I'm displaying a full field black pattern. Displaying a full field 20% Gray or other xx% Gray pattern will affect the whole calibration and I believe it's the worst idea.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamikaze_Ice View Post
I know my lowly ColorMunki Display has nothing on your meters, but I've seen a few posts from people with high quality meters that seem to have much more stable measurements (or perhaps never checked stability-time-repeatability of their panel/measurements). So automated pattern measurement sequences, like grayscale/saturation sweeps, the previous pattern would always "taint" or "skew" the current one. Buzzard, on an older LG OLED, claims to be unable to reproduce what another user reported with a lower quality meter (as good or better than mine, and basically had the same behavior I'm seeing).
Since you don't have one of these panels yourself, did you by chance happen to check for something like this?
Perhaps this might be related to tecnezio's results?
ColorMunki Display / i1Display PRO are based under the same hardware; but i1Display PRO has a refreshing rate scan capability, the latest generation of i1Display PRO (Rev.B) it features a new refresh rate detection and synchronization AIO (All in One) measurement mode which can improve the measurement stability for certain displays and provide faster reading times, while this new measurement mode is not supported by HCFR or CalMAN, it's supported by ChromaPure/LightSpace.

I have sold my all i1D3 meters (OEM/Retail/C6) and I don't own an LG OLED to be able to test if there is an improvement with AIO mode with numbers.

I haven't measured a LG OLED 2015 model like the one Buzz is using.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamikaze_Ice View Post
Watching content between patches would also do the same thing (taint/skew). I assume that when profiling a display it would take stability into account but not so much this particular kind of stability or lack thereof. Basically content shown from the last few minutes are tainting/skewing my measurements.
Example: Put a 20% grey full screen field up, put the LG magic wand pointer on screen for ~5 seconds then move it. You can see the retention after image and it stays for about 1 minute.

This is not my meter as far as I can tell as it behaves fine on various LG's LCD displays my friends and family have. I don't get repeatable measurements that are rock solid stable, but it's definitely not the case when measuring my E6. This is something I highly doubt a correction matrix or spectral sample of my panel would help (my assumption, could be wrong).

Contact and non-contact modes have similar results, so OLED heat is not an issue for the meter itself (i.e. OLED heat in contact mode is not an issue.)
I have measured the temperature using a Non-contact Digital Infrared Thermometer with laser aiming, there is not problem with heat to the center of the screen, the panel has higher temperature (the 65E6 I used) to the bottom area where the electronics are located.

It's true that these displays are not rock solid.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamikaze_Ice View Post
No random jumps/dips of 10 or more nits. This is very obvious on my E6, where I just measure twice from HCFR and see a large enough difference to throw off white balance and gamma to a small perceptional degree (ala warm 1 vs warm 2 kind of white)
Constant measurements over 1 minute match results of back to back measurements or slightly delayed measurements for the same length of time. This is not the case on my E6, where the constant measurements will be LOWER, which makes no sense unless this means the display is unstable and needs time to stabilize which will greatly impact profiling results (!) for creating a 3D LUT.
About 3D LUT, since I don't own an LG OLED, I had a change to make 3D LUT using eeColor 3D LUT Box and LightSpace 2 times, so the first time I did 17-Point Cube (4913 Colors...took 1H20M) and the second time 21-Point Cube (9261 Colors...took 2H30M), I have posted the post-calibration results here: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-di...l#post51515377

To fight drifting, the LightSpace (I used) has 2 features which seems that are working very good; Drift Compensation and Anisometric patch sequence which both of them helps to final 3D LUT correction generation.

With Drift Compensation feature enabled and with 30 value for example, it takes a one White measurement per 30 patches and at the end it's including to the correction 3D LUT any display 'drifting over the time' issues, LG's are not stable displays over the time and this helps a lot to the final 3D LUT generation.

Anisometric sequences are better suited to displays that have any form of ABL, such as Plasmas and many OLEDs, where Sequential patch ordering can cause display overheating (overheating can actually be an issue on any display that has high peak luminance outputs, as it can cause the display to drift. Anisometric patch sequence is using an algorithm to display the patches with one dark/one bright patch order in simple words.
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post #1165 of 2010 Old 03-26-2017, 03:17 AM
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Originally Posted by 256k View Post
Hi, i'm more lost than a SOB on the day of the father, so... to begin...

I dont know anything about calibration, but i want to calibrate my B6 for SDR and HDR, i have buyed the HDR patters from masciola, and i'm looking to buy an i1D3, i have 1h50min to decide if buy it or not (To have it tomorrow), cost me 220€

What i need to know is... i1D3 will work for me? i just want to use it on my B6 and my older tv's, because i'm tired of trying all kind of settings and no one looks like the other one, so i'm tired of not know how my tv is supposed to look, if i buy the i1D3 i'll be able to properly calibrate my TV if i buy something like CALMAN software? or it wont be enough to do it?

i dont have any tripod so it will be on contact with the TV

Thanks
Hi,

You will have no problem with i1Display PRO, since it's Luminance range limit is up to 1.000nits and the LG OLED's can reach up to 750nits max.

About patterns you will need to get SDR patterns also.

About calibration software there free solutions, you can download:

1) HCFR from here with support forum topic: HCFR - Open source projector and display calibration software

2) The Free DPS version of LightSpace CMS can be used also with an i1Display PRO meter, there available to read various guides on the Light Illusion website.

The specific guide for use with LightSpace DPS is here.

But there is a lot of potentially useful/interesting info in the various guides on the website also.

Support forum topic: Free LightSpace DPS - Manual Display Calibration

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post #1166 of 2010 Old 03-26-2017, 03:20 AM
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Originally Posted by JNayAV View Post
Not sure what the DIY guy is going to do in a couple years. What's the next cheapest sensor that can handle 1000+ cd/m^2 accurately? Maybe X-Rite will come out with an updated sensor? What are current LCD owners doing?
Hi, the BasICColor DISCUS which is better meter (but more 5x times more expensive) from i1DisplayPRO, has laser aiming, better thermal stability, it's coming certified from BasICColor and can measure up to 2.500cdm/2 while i1Display PRO is not coming with any certification of performance.

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post #1167 of 2010 Old 03-26-2017, 04:26 AM
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Originally Posted by 256k View Post
Y
Probably not the best idea to take non contact readings with that much lighting in the room. Its bound to pickup some of the ambient light at low levels.
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post #1168 of 2010 Old 03-26-2017, 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by RichB View Post
^
It seems like Calman and Chromapure have some "customization" of meters.

Calman has a version of the I1Dispaly OEM that is rebranded and may include other changes. It is not clear, to what extent this provides better performance.
Calman has display type selection that applies offsets.


Chromapure sells the I1Display with individual calibration for many display types using reference meters. For the I1Display EOM, I do not see "standard" corrections.


I chose to buy standard meters: I1Display and I1Pro2 to perform corrections from all my displays. Once that decision was made, the software is choice comes down to preference.
IMO Chromapure is easier to use than Calman.


- Rich
SpectraCAL C6/C6 HDR is a OEM Branded i1Display PRO meter, all i1Display PRO meters (Retail/OEM/OEM Branded) feature the exact same hardware/firmware, just C6 has different internal meter unlocking code (to make it work with CalMAN only officially....but it can work with HCFR/LightSpace/DisplayCAL/ArgyllCMS also unofficially) and there added a lot of extra EDR tables for more different display types, but since technology is changing rapidly, each year model/brands under the same panel tech they have differences that can't be covered by one generic table for that display tech. SpectraCAL is using an average of SPD correction from panels with the same tech per each EDR table it's adding.

C6 vs. C6 HDR are exact the same meters from hardware side. SpectraCAL is testing the limits of the C6 meters according to their peak output capabilities. So the C6 meter which can read up to 1200-1300cd/2, they are an extra certification for this and named C6 HDR. The other meters that can read below that number or up to 1000cd/2 they named as C6.

SpectraCAL C6-HDR (Branded OEM i1d3) which can measure up to 1.300 cd/m2, which has exact the same hardware with classic i1Display PRO, just it hasn't verified up to what levels it can measure.

i1Display PRO's can read up to 1.300 cd/m2 also, but it's up to unit-to-unit variation (randomly) which one will measure up to 1.300 or 1.200 etc.

ChromaPure is selling their own customized 'PRO' meter which is an OEM meter with some extra 4-color matrix offset corrections tables which are loaded to the software with the license.

Tom is using OEM meters and he is comparing each meter individually using his JETI Reference Spectroradiometer and it's creating new meter correction tables unique, which work only for your specific meter.

This is the correction table list (not sure if it's the full list):

LG OLED
Samsung Standard LCD
Samsung LED
Sony Standard LCD
Sony LED
LG LED
LG Standard LCD
DLP Rear Projection
CRT
Plasma
LED Front Projection-Screen
LED Front Projection-Lens
Front Projection-Screen
Front Projection-Lens
Samsung Quantum Dot

These correction tables can be selected when you will initialise the meter from ChromaPure. but he is providing a list of (pre/post) xyY measurements that you can enter manually at any other software you may use.

It's a better idea to invest for a i1PRO spectrophotometer, to be able to create 4-color matrix tables for each display you want, this will provide you better performance than using any generic table.
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post #1169 of 2010 Old 03-26-2017, 08:15 AM
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Originally Posted by vsorgi View Post
I noticed when watching a 3D movie on my E6 that the picture settings are different than what I had set them to for non-3D. It goes to Standard picture mode instead of ISF Dark Room and OLED light goes to 100. I assume it does this to compensate for the dimmer 3D image. Would you recommend leaving it there or changing it and if so, what settings work best for 3D?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brama View Post
I assumed that 3D glasses are neutral and apply only a light attenuation, so I put on 3D mode the same configuration of ISF mode, except the OLED light that I leaved at 100.
I don't know if it is the right procedure but I have a good image result.
Hi guys, about 3D 1080p, 65E6 with OLED Light 100 / Contrast 84 you can get ~135 nits calibrated throu the LG glasses (circularly polarized).

Thou the glasses. the colors are shifting also, so you need perform a separate calibration for 3D and not use the 2D settings (boost OLED to 100) and wear the glasses.

To see how much the picture is dimmed and how much it's been shifting chromatically, you use a meter.

3D Glasses are cutting about 54% of the light output. I have measured with my JETI 1211 (Lab Grade Spectroradiometer); without glasses 290nits, with glasses 133nits, from seating position.

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post #1170 of 2010 Old 03-26-2017, 08:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Hi guys, about 3D 1080p, 65E6 with OLED Light 100 / Contrast 84 you can get ~135 nits calibrated throu the LG glasses (circularly polarized).

Thou the glasses. the colors are shifting also, so you need perform a separate calibration for 3D and not use the 2D settings (boost OLED to 100) and wear the glasses.

To see how much the picture is dimmed and how much it's been shifting chromatically, you use a meter.

3D Glasses are cutting about 54% of the light output. I have measured with my JETI 1211 (Lab Grade Spectroradiometer); without glasses 290nits, with glasses 133nits, from seating position.
And the big problem is that the glasses will vary from pair to pair since they are not optical quality so then it also begs the question why make any calibration changes, if the set is fairly close, when the glasses are the big variable that you can't control.

John
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