2018 LG OLED Calibration and User Settings (No price talk) - Page 112 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #3331 of 3727 Old 09-05-2019, 04:09 PM
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Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Have you used 100% White HDR10 10% Window patch (with black background)?
Yes, with the Raspberry Pi. It doesn't allow me to control the size, but it looks like 10%.

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post #3332 of 3727 Old 09-05-2019, 04:18 PM
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Yes, with the Raspberry Pi. It doesn't allow me to control the size, but it looks like 10%.
What HDR10 metadata you used? Looks so low for HDR10 400 nits.

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post #3333 of 3727 Old 09-05-2019, 04:28 PM
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What HDR10 metadata you used? Looks so low for HDR10 400 nits.
Sorry but I can't remember I will have to try again (hopefully this weekend) and pay more attention to all the settings in the Calman metadata creation boxes, and what I set in the HDFury PC Utility for AVI Infoframe too. It does sound like I got one of the settings wrong. I wasn't too worried at the time because I remember I've measured 742 nits last year. But there are so many different things to remember to do, all in the perfect order, and one tiny mistake and it's all wasted.

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post #3334 of 3727 Old 09-05-2019, 06:36 PM
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But there are so many different things to remember to do, all in the perfect order, and one tiny mistake and it's all wasted.
You've got that right!
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post #3335 of 3727 Old 09-06-2019, 03:58 AM
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Originally Posted by janos666 View Post
Yes... The #1 "new smart app from the Store" (provided by some third party like Spectracal) is what I initially hoped for when the DV Home-AutoCal issue was publicly discussed. And I started hoping for #2 when LG started marketing the new features for 2019 (either a firmware update with the same integrated pattern generator or more likely an LG "smart app" downloadable from the store because LG clearly refrains from integrating new features to firmware updates but a new smart app is not a new basic feature...).
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Or, if Spectracal would kindly port MobileForge to the LG platform, such that it was an internal "app" downloaded from the LG "Content Store", and running in the TV, that would clearly also be able to show Dolby Vision patterns and could work just like the 2019 models' internal pattern generator as well. That would be nice and solve all of the problems; I wonder if it might happen.
Hi guys,

The problem is that WebOS apps are located to the end of the video processing pipeline of the LG, so even if application will be released it can't be used as pattern generator.

When a display developer want to include to his TV model an internal pattern generator, then it should be placed before any other video processing.

Even to LG 2019 model, its not placed to to exact 'front' position, as its after the Contrast/Brightness controls and after the PQ tone mapping, for that reason it will work only if you have Contrast @ 85 and Brightness @ 50 (which are the bypass settings) and can't be used to evaluate HDR10/DV calibration.

If it was positioned in front of all processing then if should work properly for everything.

I have posted about that detail before even TV's release to public (January 2019): ''For the generator to be effective, for all kind of calibrations (using normal OSD calibration controls or internal LUT capabilities), TPG it has to be located before 'Contrast/Brightness'. If its located after 'Contrast/Brightness', then it will not see any user changes when the default contrast/brightness controls values (BR50/CR85) will not be used. It's very rare the Brightness control to work at default position (50), most of the times it will be require to be adjusted to prevent clipping or display properly the near black details.''

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post #3336 of 3727 Old 09-06-2019, 09:42 AM
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Hi guys,

The problem is that WebOS apps are located to the end of the video processing pipeline of the LG, so even if application will be released it can't be used as pattern generator.
Ah. Oh dear. We'll all screwed for Dolby Vision (full calibration) then, which is what I thought so it re-emphasises how pleased I am to be able to do even something.

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When a display developer want to include to his TV model an internal pattern generator, then it should be placed before any other video processing.

Even to LG 2019 model, its not placed to to exact 'front' position, as its after the Contrast/Brightness controls and after the PQ tone mapping, for that reason it will work only if you have Contrast @ 85 and Brightness @ 50 (which are the bypass settings) and can't be used to evaluate HDR10/DV calibration.

If it was positioned in front of all processing then if should work properly for everything.

I have posted about that detail before even TV's release to public (January 2019): link
Yes of course, but by that time it would have been far too late to change. I don't predict LG will redesign it for 2020 either. They might not even keep the feature for 2020 (we're all assuming that they will, but who knows!)

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post #3337 of 3727 Old 09-06-2019, 01:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Ah. Oh dear. We'll all screwed for Dolby Vision (full calibration) then, which is what I thought so it re-emphasises how pleased I am to be able to do even something.



Yes of course, but by that time it would have been far too late to change. I don't predict LG will redesign it for 2020 either. They might not even keep the feature for 2020 (we're all assuming that they will, but who knows!)
So the only thing you can't do with DV calibration on the 2019 LG using the internal TPG is to Validate it. But I've personally never seen a bad validation if you follow all the steps of the workflow correctly.
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post #3338 of 3727 Old 09-06-2019, 01:27 PM
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So the only thing you can't do with DV calibration on the 2019 LG using the internal TPG is to Validate it. But I've personally never seen a bad validation if you follow all the steps of the workflow correctly.
Agreed. If I had a 2019 model, I'd be absolutely thrilled with the internal PG, the ability to edit the PQ roll-off, and the ability to reset LUTs in Picture Modes without having to do a full bloody factory reset.

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post #3339 of 3727 Old 09-07-2019, 02:47 PM
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About everyone's HDR calibration approach to the C8:


Do you calibrate for peak output or 700 nits?
I.e., do you reduce RGB high in 2p white balance until you have 700 nits for 100% white on a 10% window, or calibrate for native peak output (i.e., keeping one value at 0)?


In the latter case, my panel will be at 780 nits post calibration.

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post #3340 of 3727 Old 09-07-2019, 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Hi guys,

The problem is that WebOS apps are located to the end of the video processing pipeline of the LG, so even if application will be released it can't be used as pattern generator.

When a display developer want to include to his TV model an internal pattern generator, then it should be placed before any other video processing.

Even to LG 2019 model, its not placed to to exact 'front' position, as its after the Contrast/Brightness controls and after the PQ tone mapping, for that reason it will work only if you have Contrast @ 85 and Brightness @ 50 (which are the bypass settings) and can't be used to evaluate HDR10/DV calibration.

If it was positioned in front of all processing then if should work properly for everything.

I have posted about that detail before even TV's release to public (January 2019): ''For the generator to be effective, for all kind of calibrations (using normal OSD calibration controls or internal LUT capabilities), TPG it has to be located before 'Contrast/Brightness'. If its located after 'Contrast/Brightness', then it will not see any user changes when the default contrast/brightness controls values (BR50/CR85) will not be used. It's very rare the Brightness control to work at default position (50), most of the times it will be require to be adjusted to prevent clipping or display properly the near black details.''

How about a Store App and some extra firmware functions to temporarily set all processing to neutral ("bypass")? Isn't that how it's basically done with patters coming in on the HDMI port?
I am much less concerned about validation than calibration in this case (where every single firmware release has different and blatantly obvious tone-curve issues in random picture formats since the first "macro block" fix).

And I think the fine-grained 1DLUT can and should be used for aligning the black and very first gray points instead of the rough Brightness control anyways.
I am not sure why CalMAN doesn't try (or why it fails) to align the near/black points with the 1DUT. But my panel works fine with Brightness=50 out-of-box, so I am not sure if it does or not.

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post #3341 of 3727 Old 09-07-2019, 03:35 PM
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And I think the fine-grained 1DLUT can and should be used for aligning the black and very first gray points instead of the rough Brightness control anyways.
I am not sure why CalMAN doesn't try (or why it fails) to align the near/black points with the 1DUT. But my panel works fine with Brightness=50 out-of-box, so I am not sure if it does or not.
It does try, and leaving C=85 B=50 you should be able to align the near black points. In my case any failure is my meter isn't perfectly accurate near black because it's not a professional expensive meter.

You'll see in the SpectraCal tutorials that Tyler points out that you can manually tweak any near-black points after the main Autocal process, before the LUT is calculated and uploaded to the TV. This is what I do.
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post #3342 of 3727 Old 09-08-2019, 02:09 AM
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Originally Posted by janos666 View Post
How about a Store App and some extra firmware functions to temporarily set all processing to neutral ("bypass")? Isn't that how it's basically done with patters coming in on the HDMI port?
I am much less concerned about validation than calibration in this case (where every single firmware release has different and blatantly obvious tone-curve issues in random picture formats since the first "macro block" fix).
No, because you will still have the current iTPG limitation, you will not able to verify properly DV/HDR10.

Still the best solution is to use external generator.

Now, since LG has started to use that iTPG generation, we have to expect only improvements based to that method, I don't expect that LG will abandoned the iTPG and create a webOS app for that job.

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And I think the fine-grained 1DLUT can and should be used for aligning the black and very first gray points instead of the rough Brightness control anyways.

I am not sure why CalMAN doesn't try (or why it fails) to align the near/black points with the 1DUT. But my panel works fine with Brightness=50 out-of-box, so I am not sure if it does or not.
The problem is that the near black points you have with CalMAN are pre-defined, so you don't have complete control totally of near black (17,18,19,20 8-bit values), as the lowest DDC point is 2.3%, so even if you calibrate 2.3% well, this will not prove that your near black is not clipped, below the 2.3%, like 0.5% (17).

It will be better idea the control points to be user selectable, as the 1D LUT has 1024 adjustable values, so even with problematic panels, to be able to be fixed better the near black issues.

For example using LG Template with Device Control, you can measure 101-Point Grayscale with LightSpace (so you will take in total measurements, 100-Point Grayscale+Black, so 1,2,3,4% etc..) and from these measurements to generate a 1024-Point 1D LUT and upload it to the TV, so you have better control of low end.

Another way to improve even more is to create a 46-Point Grayscale, then upload it to the 1D LUT of the TV, then measure with a custom 101-Point Grayscale which will focus more to low end (tight spacing of 8-bit values....to measure 0.5%, 1%, 1.4%, 2%, 2.3%, 2.7% etc.) with a larger spacing to higher end, then joint the 2 measurements, using Augment process, and generate a new 1D LUT based to these 2x different grayscale data. Just giving you an idea of capabilities.

But later we have find out that the 1D LUT has some issues and we are not using it, see the reasons here, and a post-verifications by using only 3D LUT and skipping completely 1D LUT here.

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post #3343 of 3727 Old 09-08-2019, 02:18 AM
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Originally Posted by mrtickleuk View Post
It does try, and leaving C=85 B=50 you should be able to align the near black points. In my case any failure is my meter isn't perfectly accurate near black because it's not a professional expensive meter.

You'll see in the SpectraCal tutorials that Tyler points out that you can manually tweak any near-black points after the main Autocal process, before the LUT is calculated and uploaded to the TV. This is what I do.
A smarter approach from LG side, for next year..., as they know, according to their own instructions which say that CR/BR (but color also @ 50) you need to have specific (default values) for 1D LUT to work, then they should have 'grayed out' the CR, BR and Color sliders when you are using internal LUT, as you have seen, when you are using internal 1D LUT they are grayed out the WB controls, so this should prevent from any accidental errors from user side perspective.

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post #3344 of 3727 Old 09-08-2019, 05:16 AM
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No, because you will still have the current iTPG limitation, you will not able to verify properly DV/HDR10.
You can calibrate it though. Other people who have the equipment (eg Neil Robinson of LG) have already verified that the results are correct using the Internal Pattern Generator. So, the verification is just verifying that the IPG system is an accurate method to use for this operation, which doesn't have to be done every single time by every single user. Especially if they cannot afford it.

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Still the best solution is to use external generator.
Of course! No-one is arguing that the Internal Pattern Generator is "best", that was a different topic! But as you know, the problem is that external generator that can send bit-accurate Dolby Vision patterns is RIDICULOUSLY expensive, even compared to the VERY expensive bit-accurate (YCrCb) HDR10 ones, and I thought this discussion was focussing what is affordable for a normal enthusiast.

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A smarter approach from LG side, for next year..., as they know, according to their own instructions which say that CR/BR (but color also @ 50) you need to have specific (default values) for 1D LUT to work, then they should have 'grayed out' the CR, BR and Color sliders when you are using internal LUT, as you have seen, when you are using internal 1D LUT they are grayed out the WB controls, so this should prevent from any accidental errors from user side perspective.
Excellent idea, and yes also Colour=50 I mentioned should have.

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post #3345 of 3727 Old 09-08-2019, 05:53 AM
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You can calibrate it though. Other people who have the equipment (eg Neil Robinson of LG) have already verified that the results are correct using the Internal Pattern Generator. So, the verification is just verifying that the IPG system is an accurate method to use for this operation, which doesn't have to be done every single time by every single user. Especially if they cannot afford it.
No-one has posted results which compares if HDMI input patch generation provide the same results as iTPG.

This reminds me the MobileForge announcements where all should be reference at paper but users found that its inaccurate, of the Murideo/VFP which selling generators from 2015/2017 as reference and the users still waiting the FW update to fix issues users have found, many months already.

I have learned from many ''wrong'' stuff I have experienced the last years to not talk for stuff 'that are accurate' unless its proven by someone 3rd party that are accurate, because we have seen announcements and many awards the last years but specific stuff are really working. (which don't get awards)

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Of course! No-one is arguing that the Internal Pattern Generator is "best", that was a different topic! But as you know, the problem is that external generator that can send bit-accurate Dolby Vision patterns is RIDICULOUSLY expensive, even compared to the VERY expensive bit-accurate (YCrCb) HDR10 ones, and I thought this discussion was focussing what is affordable for a normal enthusiast.
As I have posted again, its really silly to calibrate 2 times the TV with native gamma and full nits, to be able to generate 2 kind of calibration, for DV and HDR10.

Since you AutoCAL with same target (max nits and gamma 2.2 as target)...and DV or HDR10 use both PQ, and for gamut they are measuring the exact same patches (5 only.., B and 100% of WRGB), if LG with SpectraCAL wanted their users but the pro calibrators also to not spend twice time to perform the exact same stuff, then CalMAN/LG should share one gamma based calibration values with full nits (without tone mappping) results and use the 5 color measurements for matrix LUT and for DV config file, and generate from these data the calibration for DV and HD10 at once.....and all will be happy! both users will no need DV generator for the calibration (only for verification can be used disk or media file patterns) and calibrators will spend less time for their field calibration.

Now even if you have a Murideo, you spend twice time to do the exact same calibration, with TV's in 2019 where they activate via voice, have real time analysis of frame and apply real-time tone mapping, and have many other smart capabilities, its so difficult to be programmed like this for all to have less trouble during calibration.

Also to available backup export to USB, like TV is doing for years with TV stations, to store the backup of all picture settings per mode, including all internal LUT.

The ideal was the TV to have capability from normal TV menu to disable tone mapping, and the user to be able to use normal TV menu 20-p RGB balance controls to do manual cal for full nits, and then to have pop-up a window where the users should write the xyY for WRGBCMY patches, so the TV company, to not care what patch generator the user or the software he will use (if he will do manual cal or AutoCAL), and DV/HDR10 cal to work that way.

Also a switch to forge HDR mode (with popup menu of what metadata you want) to able convert an SDR patch generation input to HDR10, so any user to be able to use the low cost Rasberry Pi (without need to buy HD Fury) for HDR patch generation and for verification also.

See my 2016 post, at the end: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-d...l#post44876905
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post #3346 of 3727 Old 09-08-2019, 02:14 PM
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Since you AutoCAL with same target (max nits and gamma 2.2 as target)...and DV or HDR10 use both PQ, and for gamut they are measuring the exact same patches (5 only.., B and 100% of WRGB), if LG with SpectraCAL wanted their users but the pro calibrators also to not spend twice time to perform the exact same stuff, then CalMAN/LG should share one gamma based calibration values with full nits (without tone mappping) results and use the 5 color measurements for matrix LUT and for DV config file, and generate from these data the calibration for DV and HD10 at once.....and all will be happy! both users will no need DV generator for the calibration (only for verification can be used disk or media file patterns) and calibrators will spend less time for their field calibration.
I raised this question myself here once but can't remember getting a straight answer (besides "not gonna happen for reasons" and "this was discussed somewhere already"):
-> Why can't CalMAN use the data captured during the HDR10 AutoCAL to configure the DV mode? (Or vice versa but the external patter generator costs make this way much more practical.)
As you say, this would make life easier for everyone, both home enthusiasts and professionals, poor and rich, skilled and stupid... The 1DLUT targets are the same (so, just upload the same LUT to both slots - processed and formatted accordingly if they use different internal formats but created from the same data) and both modes use a matrix based 3DLUT (in their own respective formats but both are based on the same basic "matrix profile" method, so the required data is already captured for both).
This looks like nothing else but a loosely disguised way of forcing people to buy DV compatible pattern generators or a new TV every year with less and less arbitrary limitations at software level. Or it's simply laziness and lack of any imaginations.
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post #3347 of 3727 Old 09-08-2019, 03:25 PM
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No-one has posted results which compares if HDMI input patch generation provide the same results as iTPG.
That is true. In the absence of that - and I can't do it - I have to believe Neil Robinson of LG. It would be great for someone else to do the tests and post the results here to prove he isn't wrong, of course.

As far as I can tell, lots of people in this community have the hardware which would be sufficient to do these tests.

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As I have posted again, its really silly to calibrate 2 times the TV with native gamma and full nits, to be able to generate 2 kind of calibration, for DV and HDR10.
And I have never disagreed with that! [snip other things I also agree with but we can't change]

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I raised this question myself here once but can't remember getting a straight answer (besides "not gonna happen for reasons" and "this was discussed somewhere already"):
-> Why can't CalMAN use the data captured during the HDR10 AutoCAL to configure the DV mode? (Or vice versa but the external patter generator costs make this way much more practical.)
That's an excellent question

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post #3348 of 3727 Old 09-08-2019, 04:06 PM
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That's an excellent question
Dolby's lock on all things DV means you should be asking them...

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post #3349 of 3727 Old 09-08-2019, 04:08 PM
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Dolby's lock on all things DV means you should be asking them...
I didn't ask, I merely complemented the question...
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post #3350 of 3727 Old 09-09-2019, 01:49 AM
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Dolby's lock on all things DV means you should be asking them...
As much as I hate Dolby for the situation, I think this one is on LG and Spectracal. I don't think Dolby forbade LG to backport the iTPG (from 9 to 8 series), or Spectracal to upload any arbitrary data into the memory slots of the configurable DV modes.
I realize the TV might needs to be switched into a DV picture mode before it can be reprogrammed (1DLUT + gamut coverage config/profile ; but I am not sure if this is really necessary or just an assumption among users) but that's easily attainable by feeding it with any arbitrary DV material for the time (not calibration patches but, say, a freely downloadable Dolby demo video opened by the integrated WebOS media player app). So I think that's just another a weak excuse.

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I raised this question myself here once but can't remember getting a straight answer (besides "not gonna happen for reasons" and "this was discussed somewhere already"):
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-d...l#post56533600

The pipiline is not related, since you disable any mapping and display works in gamma based with full nits. The pipeline is different when you enable mapping, but this is not affecting calibration since we calibrate with all these stuff disabled.

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This looks like nothing else but a loosely disguised way of forcing people to buy DV compatible pattern generators or a new TV every year with less and less arbitrary limitations at software level. Or it's simply laziness and lack of any imaginations.
As you know, it will not happen something which can reduce the sales of expensive DV pattern generators.
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Dolby's lock on all things DV means you should be asking them...
There no problem with that, since its been allowed to perform even manual cal with 2018 models using normal RGB balance controls for DV, these controls were disabled with older LG models.

About content mapping DV CMU takes completely control and bypass LG mapping.

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Yes, that's what I did except that I did a full "read series" each time. I could have saved a lot of time by only tweaking the values that were there, on the "trust" that the LG factory process was roughly right when it chose which of R, G, B should get the "192" value. Ie, I did this.
  • Change RGB Gain all to 192
  • Read series.
  • Observe that "red" is the lowest of the 3 lines on the graph, so this means I need to reduce Green and Blue to meet it.
  • Tweak G and B a bit.
  • Read series.
  • Tweak G and B a bit more.
  • Read series.
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Look what do to improve more....

For the TV internal tone mapping to work as expected, the math of tone mapping expect that your display has a specific peak light output.

But every panel has different output, natively, as panels have variations, but at factory they load to the tone mapping engine a peak luminance default value.

For 2019 models is 700 nits the default value, so I believe its 700 nits for 2018 models also.

Since you don't do DV cal, where it will be uploaded internally to the TV your actual panel calibrated peak white value in nits, then the best you can do with the 'trick of SM adjustments' I posted, is to try using the RGB-Gain controls to fix RGB balance while the same time to aim to have 700 nits peak output also.

So the tone tone mapping will work better.

If you see that to get 700 nits calibrated it will require to reduce more from 192 then do it. But don't reduce peak output from OLED Light.
Another idea to see if it will work better is to pre-cal 100% White HDR10 WB with SM WB, starting with 192.192.192 and reducing only the 2 channels to fix RGB balance and then use OLED light to get 700 nits.

See which method is working better.

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As much as I hate Dolby for the situation, I think this one is on LG and Spectracal. I don't think Dolby forbade LG to backport the iTPG (from 9 to 8 series), or Spectracal to upload any arbitrary data into the memory slots of the configurable DV modes.
I realize the TV might needs to be switched into a DV picture mode before it can be reprogrammed (1DLUT + gamut coverage config/profile ; but I am not sure if this is really necessary or just an assumption among users) but that's easily attainable by feeding it with any arbitrary DV material for the time (not calibration patches but, say, a freely downloadable Dolby demo video opened by the integrated WebOS media player app). So I think that's just another a weak excuse.
It's necessary on the 2019 models with the internal pattern generator, not only do we know this for a fact but it's well documented in the Workflows and SpectraCal provides very long empty videos to play in the background for precisely this purpose!

It does seem a bit of a kludge to me. If the 2020 models don't have a command where Calman can send a "now go into Dolby Vision mode" or "now go into HLG mode" via DDC, it will look very silly.

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Another idea to see if it will work better is to pre-cal 100% White HDR10 WB with SM WB, starting with 192.192.192 and reducing only the 2 channels to fix RGB balance and then use OLED light to get 700 nits.

See which method is working better.
Thanks, Ted that's a great idea. I would much prefer to use OLED light to get to 700 nits (if I cared about the PQ tracking in HDR10 mode being accurate, I might not mind having it brighter to be honest). This is because as it's shared with Dolby Vision, I can get my ~780 nits (or whatever) accurate peak with accurate PQ tracking in Dolby Vision mode if I use the "lower OLED light in HDR10 mode" method. This is according to Stacey Spears, here:
Quote:
With the C8 (8 series) you measure the peak brightness of the panel and that is used for Dolby Vision. For HDR10, the panel brightness is a fixed value regardless of panel capability.
But if I used the "use values <192" method, it would affect both.

Next time I try I will concentrate on getting the range 30% - 60% as tight as possible, because the range above that is only use for brief specular highlights.
Is this a good idea or a bad idea? Which range should I concentrate on - is it 30-60, or some other range?

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It's necessary on the 2019 models with the internal pattern generator, not only do we know this for a fact but it's well documented in the Workflows and SpectraCal provides very long empty videos to play in the background for precisely this purpose!

It does seem a bit of a kludge to me. If the 2020 models don't have a command where Calman can send a "now go into Dolby Vision mode" or "now go into HLG mode" via DDC, it will look very silly.



Thanks, Ted that's a great idea. I would much prefer to use OLED light to get to 700 nits (if I cared about the PQ tracking in HDR10 mode being accurate, I might not mind having it brighter to be honest). This is because as it's shared with Dolby Vision, I can get my ~780 nits (or whatever) accurate peak with accurate PQ tracking in Dolby Vision mode if I use the "lower OLED light in HDR10 mode" method. This is according to Stacey Spears, here:


But if I used the "use values <192" method, it would affect both.

Next time I try I will concentrate on getting the range 30% - 60% as tight as possible, because the range above that is only use for brief specular highlights.
Is this a good idea or a bad idea? Which range should I concentrate on - is it 30-60, or some other range?
70% and below should be your focus.
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But if I used the "use values <192" method, it would affect both.
I would assume HDR10/HLG and DV modes all share the same factory default peak white value, so I guess you want the method which affects them both (assuming you can't upload a custom DV config).

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post #3357 of 3727 Old 09-09-2019, 03:08 PM
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I would assume HDR10/HLG and DV modes all share the same factory default peak white value, so I guess you want the method which affects them both (assuming you can't upload a custom DV config).
See above - unless I read @sspears ' post incorrectly, Dolby Vision uses the actual panel's peak white[1]. The adjustment to try to hit 700 nits (if I wanted PQ tracking to be accurate) would be for HDR10.

[1] Hmm, actually I fear this means "if you use Calman's DV workflow and have an expensive DV pattern generator and can upload the DV file to the TV"

@D-Nice - thanks!

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post #3358 of 3727 Old 09-10-2019, 02:38 AM
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Thanks, Ted that's a great idea. I would much prefer to use OLED light to get to 700 nits (if I cared about the PQ tracking in HDR10 mode being accurate, I might not mind having it brighter to be honest). This is because as it's shared with Dolby Vision, I can get my ~780 nits (or whatever) accurate peak with accurate PQ tracking in Dolby Vision mode if I use the "lower OLED light in HDR10 mode" method. This is according to Stacey Spears, here:

But if I used the "use values <192" method, it would affect both.
The problem with DV is that OLED Light is not used as panel gain, so it will not handle your nits output. See if reducing contrast to get 700 nits it will help (in DV mode only), but all these are just untested workarounds to see if you will have better results without buying expensive external generator. You have to use DV patterns to evaluate the 'tricks' you apply.

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See above - unless I read @sspears ' post incorrectly, Dolby Vision uses the actual panel's peak white[1]. The adjustment to try to hit 700 nits (if I wanted PQ tracking to be accurate) would be for HDR10.
This is happening already from LG DV 2017 cal TV's, the DV config file upload your black/white and primary colors xy + conversion matrix to LMS colorspace to the TV, but only when you will send custom DV config file, TV use the default DV config, which we guess that its using 700 nits as peak white info, as its 700 nits the default in 2019 HDR10 tone mapping setting also.
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post #3360 of 3727 Old 09-10-2019, 10:50 AM
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The problem with DV is that OLED Light is not used as panel gain, so it will not handle your nits output. See if reducing contrast to get 700 nits it will help (in DV mode only), but all these are just untested workarounds to see if you will have better results without buying expensive external generator. You have to use DV patterns to evaluate the 'tricks' you apply.
I see, thanks. It's looking more and more that I need to try to send real DV patterns.

I have thought of a possible option. I already use the Raspberry Pi and we know that it is bit-accurate in RGB mode. So, could I use this as a "baseline" to test my laptop's video output (it is DisplayPort, running through a DP-> HDMI adaptor) ? I could, in SDR mode, take readings with the Raspberry Pi, and then switch to using the laptop's video output on the TV, with the Calman internal pattern window showing on the TV, and repeat those readings. I would be able to compare the results and if they were very similar, then I could trust that the laptop's video output is bit-accurate maybe?

I know this does not take account of "panel drift" but it is the best I could do, and I would prefer this to faffing about with Changing contrast and tweaking OLED light.

Has anyone else done this? In case I get lucky, it's a Lenovo T520i with Intel HD Graphics 3000 chipset (https://laptopmedia.com/video-card/i...elena-pamet-2/).

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