2018 LG OLED Calibration and User Settings (No price talk) - Page 120 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #3571 of 3665 Old 10-24-2019, 10:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolls-Royce View Post
It's also entirely possible that you might have suffered a failed component on the board and would have seen the same issue on the next restart of the TV regardless. For example, a power supply capacitor failing can cause the kind of power cycling you described. Honestly, although the two incidents (your user error in uploading an improper file and the set's cycling on and off) followed each other, no cause-and-effect has been proven.
That is possible, though it would be an extraordinary coincidence of course. (Probably not a power supply capacitor in any case, since most/all of that circuitry is on a separate board.)

I dispute slightly the characterization of "user error" since I purposely uploaded a file without much caring about the parameters as said.

Of course there is an easy way to test if someone is willing risk a mainboard since the file I uploaded is posted earlier in this thread. I would hope/assume that Calman developers and/or LG would have done that in fact.

Either say I stand by my comments about firmware recovery, which are more general than my personal issue.
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post #3572 of 3665 Old 10-24-2019, 10:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theMule View Post
That is possible, though it would be an extraordinary coincidence of course.
Definitely.

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post #3573 of 3665 Old 10-24-2019, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theMule View Post
That is possible, though it would be an extraordinary coincidence of course. (Probably not a power supply capacitor in any case, since most/all of that circuitry is on a separate board.)

I dispute slightly the characterization of "user error" since I purposely uploaded a file without much caring about the parameters as said.

Of course there is an easy way to test if someone is willing risk a mainboard since the file I uploaded is posted earlier in this thread. I would hope/assume that Calman developers and/or LG would have done that in fact.

Either say I stand by my comments about firmware recovery, which are more general than my personal issue.
I had a user which used LG Templates of DeviceControl.

He had B8 (which support 17-Point 3D LUT upload) an C8 (which support 33-Point 3D LUT upload)

The user forgotten and used the LG C8 template to upload to B8 a 33-Point Cube. But TV was not bricked...as he uploaded a 33p file to a TV which support 17p file.... just the correction file was not loaded after he verified via meter measurements.

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post #3574 of 3665 Old 10-24-2019, 01:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theMule View Post
That is possible, though it would be an extraordinary coincidence of course. (Probably not a power supply capacitor in any case, since most/all of that circuitry is on a separate board.)
Actually it's a good point and no, not an extraordinary coincidence. If it was one, it was an ordinary coincidence!

Life is full of them happening at random. When they line up with something, we often leap to conclusions. Example, the telephone rings and you were thinking about someone different 7 minutes earlier. You don't remember these events.

But when the telephone rings and you were thinking about the same person 7 minutes earlier, it's "WOW! THAT'S AMAZING! I WAS JUST THINKING OF YOU!".

The chances of you thinking of the person who phoned up is simple probability based on the number of people you know, but our brains forget the "miss" events and focus disproportionately on the "hit" events.

There's a name for this phenomenon but I can't remember it. This "bias" effect is why you thought it would be "an extraordinary coincidence", and it's also why it's not, it's just a coincidence.

Quote:
Either say I stand by my comments about firmware recovery, which are more general than my personal issue.
Agreed of course yes.
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post #3575 of 3665 Old 10-27-2019, 01:20 PM
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Thanks you Tyler and Ted, that was a good idea!

Quote:
Originally Posted by chros73 View Post
So the question is ... that do the different 19. WB point values represent the 3 tone curves?
Short answer: no. They rely on the MDL metadata value (as we saw earlier):

Quote:
the "real peak nits" setting (that results in MDL and maxCLL values as well) in madvr pixelshader with "output HDR format" for the 3 different 9. WB point values:
- 1.: 669 (C8) , 669 (B8) : 100 - 760
- 2.: 696 (C8) , 692 (B8) : 761 - 2500
- 3.: 713 (C8) , 705 (B8) : 2501 - 10000
Quote:
Originally Posted by chros73 View Post
5. *and* this example shows that maxCLL is ignored completely!
That's wrong: display receives maxCLL fine.

0. Test setup:
- nvidia driver version: v385.28 (passing all the HDR metadata to the display)
- madvr version: madmeasure107
- HCFR version: 3.5.1.4 (1% window, black frame insertion in every 2nd frame)
- meter: i1DisplayPro
- LG 65B8:
-- firmware: 4.10.25 (doesn't have the black crush that later firmwares introduced)
-- using: PC mode, RGB Full range
-- HDR10 Cinema preset: everything is at default setting (oled light 100, contrast 100, brightness 50), couple of processing settings are turned off, Cinema preset is uncalibrated (means factory settings)
-- DTM is off
-- peak nits using 1% windows: ~700 nits (C8 supposed to be + ~200 nits brighter)

File name conventions for the graphs: pq|rolloff-mdl-maxcll-maxfall-19point[-movieinitials]

1. maxCLL works fine, the above mentioned 3 test cases:

ro-1000-1000-512 | ro-4000-4000-512 | ro-4000-577-512
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2. MDL:

I wanted to say the MDL is not relevant when maxCLL is present and maxCLL < MDL but take a look at this when maxCLL is close to 10000:

ro-4000-10000-512 | ro-6900-10000-512 | ro-10000-10000-512
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Otherwise it doesn't seem to change anything:

ro-4000-577-512 | ro-1000-577-512
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ro-4000-10000-512 | ro-4000-9977-240
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3. maxFALL:

It seems that the TV doesn't use it at all *or* it's used by ABL algo(s).

4. Weird cases:

a) Curve is totally broken when maxCLL *and* MDL is close to 10000, like with Spears & Munsil's 10000-10000-xxx demo video:

ro-10000-10000-512 | ro-4000-9977-240
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b) Something strange is happening with maxCLL between 500 and 501, note how bright the image gets between 501 and (let's say 670), like with Guardians of the Galaxy (2014):

ro-333-333-111 | ro-420-420-140 | ro-500-500-167 | ro-501-501-167
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Above maxCLL 501 it tries to correct itself:

ro-540-540-180 | ro-580-580-193 | ro-620-620-207 | ro-690-690-230
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5. Curve of some movie titles:

Guardians of the Galaxy 2014 | Godzilla King of Monsters 2019 | The Meg 2018 | Mad Max Fury Road 2015 | Arrival 2016
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6. madvr with "ouput HDR format"

When you enable "ouput HDR format" in madvr then the set "real display peak nits" (e.g. 700) becomes MDL and maxCLL as well and maxFALL will be MDL / 3. So, if "real display peak nits" is 700 then: 700-700-233

ro-683-683-231 | ro-700-700-233 | ro-760-760-253 | ro-840-840-280 | ro-960-960-233
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As we can see, e.g. 683-683-231 is slightly brighter than 700-700-233, so I used 700 for "real display peak nits", although only using 1% window achieved ~700 nits during continuous measurement.
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Last edited by chros73; 11-01-2019 at 10:08 AM.
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post #3576 of 3665 Old 10-30-2019, 05:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chros73 View Post
Thanks you Tyler and Ted, that was a good idea!
So, what do you think, guys?

Our conversation started from: LG's has 3 tone curves (that can be parameterized in 2019 models).
Now, I'd argue that it's true at all. Due to 2. (and 4.a.) and 4.b.

It would be nice if someone can test these with a C8/E8 and C9/E9.

Another thing popped into my mind: I'm not sure how valid those tests above that has smaller values than the actual peak brightness of the TV. E.g. 333-333-111
I'm not sure how I can limit HCFR to only measure up to only 333 (in this case) and not 700.

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post #3577 of 3665 Old 10-30-2019, 05:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chros73 View Post
So, what do you think, guys?

Our conversation started from: LG's has 3 tone curves (that can be parameterized in 2019 models).
Now, I'd argue that it's true at all. Due to 2. (and 4.a.) and 4.b.

It would be nice if someone can test these with a C8/E8 and C9/E9.

Another thing popped into my mind: I'm not sure how valid those tests above that has smaller values than the actual peak brightness of the TV. E.g. 333-333-111
I'm not sure how I can limit HCFR to only measure up to only 333 (in this case) and not 700.
I don't know if and how this will affect the patch generation, but madVR tone mapping should be disabled (select passthrou HDR to the display) and with HCFR the BT.2390 tone mapping should be disabled also.

It should be good if you can use an HDFury device to grab the metadata your VideoCard is sending to our display, to be sure that all are fine.

I will not be surprised if you will find something that is not working, (like the 1D LUT in calibration we found), but someone who talk with LG (so only Tyler) can report any feedback to LG.

I don't think also anyone in LG will pay attention to any 2018 problem.

But congrats for the info and time you have spend for such test, its always good users to perform such testing to find out if features are working in real-world.

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post #3578 of 3665 Old 10-30-2019, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
I don't know if and how this will affect the patch generation, but madVR tone mapping should be disabled (select passthrou HDR to the display) and with HCFR the BT.2390 tone mapping should be disabled also.
Yes, this should be clarified because some of the screenshots might make all these various test cases somewhat confusing.
But I think it's clear he used pass-though. The metadata would of been constant the whole time otherwise and each measurement would look exactly the same. (I hope.)
And isn't that HCFR setting used for the reference curve only? It looks like a target setting, not signal processing. So, the background reference plot might be incorrect but the measurements should be valid (I think).

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post #3579 of 3665 Old 10-31-2019, 07:39 AM
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Interesting video about Firmware 05.10.20:

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Warm regards,
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post #3580 of 3665 Old 10-31-2019, 08:25 AM
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Originally Posted by bejoro View Post
Interesting video about Firmware 05.10.20:

https://youtu.be/FNeMd28XEng

As the team of experts in 3D LUT profiling after many many different kind of testing has found and all agree (explained here) that using 1D LUT (via AutoCAL using CalMAN, or profiling using LightSpace) is producing worse picture with poorer gradation, so as I have posted many times, we don't recommend from any user to use the internal 1D LUT (due to problematic implementation somewhere to to video processing when 1D LUT is active) but to use only the 33-Point LUT table of LG (as its not affected from such issues), so if you don't perform 1D LUT upload (and just use 3D LUT upload) you will still have enabled any firmware improvements, unlike when you use internal 1D LUT, you will loose these improvements as Vincent is talking (1:34) :

Vincent has many times mentioned the problems of CalMAN and AutoCAL, for that reason he is not performing AutoCAL to his customers, as the 3D LUT capabilties or CalMAN are not working well with OLED's, as the Support and QA manager of CalMAN has confirmed:



Because Vincent is using CalMAN only and doesn't own any LightSpace license, he is still performing manual cal to his customers as its the only way for not having any issues.

But a manual cal can't reach the level of performance of a proper 3D LUT profiling.

CalMAN users are waiting the CalMAN engine will be improved and it will not introduce such issues users are reporting, with CalMAN 2019 R3.
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post #3581 of 3665 Old 10-31-2019, 09:00 AM
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Those who take payment from customers aka professionals, do you ever used autocal in your work when calibrating LG OLEDs?
Seems that Vincent didn´t.
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post #3582 of 3665 Old 10-31-2019, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
But congrats for the info and time you have spend for such test, its always good users to perform such testing to find out if features are working in real-world.
Thanks Ted, I've learned from the best

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I don't know if and how this will affect the patch generation, but madVR tone mapping should be disabled (select passthrou HDR to the display) and with HCFR the BT.2390 tone mapping should be disabled also.
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Originally Posted by janos666 View Post
Yes, this should be clarified because some of the screenshots might make all these various test cases somewhat confusing.
There's no tonemapping in madTPG, neither in HCFR during measurements. You can try it out easily.
Although I don't have any external device to check the validity of metadata values but multiple users confirmed that it works well with the mentioned nvidia drivers, let alone MDL values that can be easily checked by taking a look at the 19. point values of WB.
So I'm sure that the metadata values are correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by janos666 View Post
And isn't that HCFR setting used for the reference curve only? It looks like a target setting, not signal processing.
That's correct: it only modifies the "white" reference curve, nothing else. The yellow curve is the response of the display (based on the used metadata).

Quote:
Originally Posted by janos666 View Post
So, the background reference plot might be incorrect ...
It depends on what you are after, which tone curve you want to compare to. That's why I also attached couple of PQ reference curves as well (with the same metadata), so you can easily check how it should look like in theory compared to roll-off (according to HCFR), and see that it has nothing to do with the actual display response.

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post #3583 of 3665 Old 10-31-2019, 10:26 AM
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And isn't that HCFR setting used for the reference curve only? It looks like a target setting, not signal processing. So, the background reference plot might be incorrect but the measurements should be valid (I think).
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Originally Posted by chros73 View Post
Thanks Ted, I've learned from the best

It depends on what you are after, which tone curve you want to compare to. That's why I also attached couple of PQ reference curves as well (with the same metadata), so you can easily check how it should look like in theory compared to roll-off (according to HCFR), and see that it has nothing to do with the actual display response.
We want the chart to have fixed marking of target shape of PQ, to all charts, for that reason I mentioned to be disabled the software tone mapping.

It will be helpful if you can add a text to each picture (inside the picture) to be easier the comparison of what someone see when he will look these results.

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post #3584 of 3665 Old 10-31-2019, 11:22 AM
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I used to calibrate my own VT60 using an EODIS3 meter and Calman but with the added complexities and hardware requirements I no longer feel comfortable doing so.


So, I know, chances are low but does anyone here know of a good calibrator in Hamburg, Germany (for a 77" C8)?
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post #3585 of 3665 Old 10-31-2019, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
so if you don't perform 1D LUT upload (and just use 3D LUT upload) you will still have enabled any firmware improvements, unlike when you use internal 1D LUT, you will loose these improvements as Vincent is talking (1:34)
LG made so many poorly documented changes that it's hard to track all quirks.

The first macro-block fix firmware (in the late 04.xx.xx series) surely didn't use any AutoCAL-flag blacklisting. I had some picture modes calibrated and those were clearly effected by the fix, a re-calibration was obviously necessary after that update.

After I installed 05.10.20 I yet again felt the need to re-calibrate even though I didn't see any big changes (I wasn't sure if the small inaccuracy was due to random panel drift [aging, temperature, IR, etc] or the firmware update). I never checked the macroblock-flash test video with this firmware but I never noticed any issues during normal use (I remember still picking up some small anomalies with the first fix).
I installed 05.10.35 (beta) yesterday and didn't validate or re-calibrate any picture modes yet because SDR and HDR10 modes feel unchanged (but I plan to re-calibrate as soon as my HDFury Integral arrives, so I can do DV as well on the same day). I checked the macroblock test video today and I think I see the least amount of flashing artifacts ever on this C8 (virtually zero) but I don't see any clear difference between Cinema with factory LUTs and ISF-Night with (stale) CalMAN LUTs (both 1D and 3D). The only notable difference is the slightly different tone-response (the default Cinema is still darker on the low-end compared to the CalMAN calibrated modes).

I also don't perceive any decrease in precision after a 1DLUT reset.
On the other hand, I almost always had issues with the manual CMS controls on all LG TVs (strange posterization artifacts even after slight adjustments but very unpredictably) and the 20-point controls were simply tiresome (these usually take a lot more time than similar controls on most other TVs).

And how do you calibrate HDR10 and/or DolbyVision without a 1DLUT (in the absence of a big 3DLUT in those modes)? Especially now that DolbyVision still has the tone-response issue (clearly too dark shadows) with it's factory LUTs (although, I didn't check that just yet with this latest beta firmware but it's clearly wrong with the latest official release and that's more important).

Could any of this be a difference between US and EU models? (Mine is EU but Vincent is EU based as well. But the 1DLUT...)


Is that test image showed by Vincent publicly available? I wish to try checking the amount of dithering applied by my C8 between Cinema-factory and ISF-CalMan modes. Although the different tone-response (or even just different white balance) could also affect this (the dithering will probably look different on slightly different shades and different calibration means different shades might appear for the same input...).
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post #3586 of 3665 Old 10-31-2019, 02:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
we don't recommend from any user to use the internal 1D LUT (due to problematic implementation somewhere to to video processing when 1D LUT is active) but to use only the 33-Point LUT table of LG (as its not affected from such issues), so if you don't perform 1D LUT upload (and just use 3D LUT upload) you will still have enabled any firmware improvements, unlike when you use internal 1D LUT, you will loose these improvements as Vincent is talking (1:34) : https://youtu.be/FNeMd28XEng?t=215
Good, I was hoping to clarify this @ConnecTEDDD , because Vincent used the term "autocal" which is too vague (But understandable for the audience of the video).

Which option of "autocal" did Vincent really mean, when he talked about the firmware "detecting if autocal had been used"?

Was it:
a) full 1DLUT and full 3DLUT?
b) unity 1DLUT and full 3DLUT?
c) (skip 1DLUT and keep LG's factory 1DLUT) but carry out 3DLUT?

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post #3587 of 3665 Old 10-31-2019, 02:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by janos666 View Post
LG made so many poorly documented changes that it's hard to track all quirks.

The first macro-block fix firmware (in the late 04.xx.xx series) surely didn't use any AutoCAL-flag blacklisting. I had some picture modes calibrated and those were clearly effected by the fix, a re-calibration was obviously necessary after that update.
[snip details - many thanks for those!]
[...]

Quote:
And how do you calibrate HDR10 and/or DolbyVision without a 1DLUT (in the absence of a big 3DLUT in those modes)? Especially now that DolbyVision still has the tone-response issue (clearly too dark shadows) with it's factory LUTs (although, I didn't check that just yet with this latest beta firmware but it's clearly wrong with the latest official release and that's more important).
I gave in, and I used 1DLUT autocal when I calibrated my Dolby Vision mode. I know there are slight problems with 1DLUT as Teddd has explained before once or twice, but the choices were:
a) use 1DLUT autocal for greyscale, with the slight issues of 1DLUT.
b) factory 1DLUT, with visibly worse problems than the results of doing (a).

(a) is better than (b), so that was the easy choice between the two options for me.

(The other method, skipping 1DLUT and using the 33-point greyscale calibration which comes as part of the Lightning LUT's 3DLUT cube is not possible with Dolby Vision calibration or feasible with HDR10/HLG calibration). So it really is just (a) or (b).

Quote:
Is that test image showed by Vincent publicly available? I wish to try checking the amount of dithering applied by my C8 between Cinema-factory and ISF-CalMan modes. Although the different tone-response (or even just different white balance) could also affect this (the dithering will probably look different on slightly different shades and different calibration means different shades might appear for the same input...).
Yes! They are all at http://test.full.band/vtest_Quants2D.html and they are great.

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post #3588 of 3665 Old 10-31-2019, 03:20 PM
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Originally Posted by mrtickleuk View Post
Many thanks @janos666 for explaining it very clearly Last weekend I did a 1D and 3D on SDR Cinema, in fact it's the only Mode I currently have with my own LUTs in since my last factory reset. So I could easily replace that with different top layer 3DLUTs and experiment as you say.

I've filled in your layers analogy into this summary table, hopefully it is correct and useful.
I've refined and updated my graphic over the intervening weeks; as it is now I have:



Hope it is useful to some.
Attached Thumbnails
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post #3589 of 3665 Old 10-31-2019, 03:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrtickleuk View Post
I've refined and updated my graphic over the intervening weeks; as it is now I have:
At first I thought the User Menu Color Gamut refers to the Color Management System menu (the one with the sliders, not the drop-down list). I can't recall if that was ever grayed out (even though I strongly believe it should be, since it's not just redundant but prone to cause artifacts).

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post #3590 of 3665 Old 10-31-2019, 04:24 PM
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At first I thought the User Menu Color Gamut refers to the Color Management System menu (the one with the sliders, not the drop-down list).
Right. Yes for the avoidance of doubt I mean Expert Controls/Colour Gamut which normally has the options Auto, Extended, Wide. On my Hybrid calibrated mode it is showing "Auto" and locked out.

Quote:
I can't recall if that was ever grayed out (even though I strongly believe it should be, since it's not just redundant but prone to cause artifacts).
It isn't ever greyed out, no.

AFAIK:
if you upload a 1DLUT:
  • Expert Controls/White Balance menu is locked
  • Expert Controls/Gamma item is locked.
  • Contrast, Brightness and Colour really ought to be locked, but they aren't.

if you upload a 3DLUT:
  • Expert Controls/Colour Gamut is locked.
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post #3591 of 3665 Old 11-01-2019, 06:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by janos666 View Post
LG made so many poorly documented changes that it's hard to track all quirks.

The first macro-block fix firmware (in the late 04.xx.xx series) surely didn't use any AutoCAL-flag blacklisting. I had some picture modes calibrated and those were clearly effected by the fix, a re-calibration was obviously necessary after that update.
The AutoCAL-flag added from 4.10.31 FW.

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Originally Posted by janos666 View Post
On the other hand, I almost always had issues with the manual CMS controls on all LG TVs (strange posterization artifacts even after slight adjustments but very unpredictably) and the 20-point controls were simply tiresome (these usually take a lot more time than similar controls on most other TVs).
This is a major problem which affects more the HDR manual cal and less the SDR manual cal.

Generally any usage of normal UI WB/CMS controls will degrade the picture quality, for that reason it will work better if you use the WB of SM (2-Point or 1-Point if you will do profiling) that using normal UI adjustments.

Quote:
Originally Posted by janos666 View Post
And how do you calibrate HDR10 and/or DolbyVision without a 1DLUT (in the absence of a big 3DLUT in those modes)? Especially now that DolbyVision still has the tone-response issue (clearly too dark shadows) with it's factory LUTs (although, I didn't check that just yet with this latest beta firmware but it's clearly wrong with the latest official release and that's more important).
While you will display from HDMI input (or USB) a HDR10/DV pattern, you enter to SM and adjust WB there, to fix the most of RGB balance error, then you exit SM and continue to micro-adjust the normal menu controls (with smaller +- values ranges).

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Originally Posted by janos666 View Post
Could any of this be a difference between US and EU models? (Mine is EU but Vincent is EU based as well. But the 1DLUT...)
Sure, as to some regions (diff. batch/factorie) there no such problems by using manual CMS adjustments, or having active 1D LUT not introduce so major problem etc.

But generally the whole LG processing of calibration adjustments lucking the last 10 years for sure, and the WRGB comes into play as there many complex processing to make the panel to work like that.

Also there some processing internally the LG has which is based to NTSC calculations lol, I have searched a lot of korean patents of LG to find out how they work, for example to a 2015 patent of LG for about how to controller unit of luminance is working, it was using NTSC matrix to convert RGB to YCbCr (Y = 0.299R + 0.587G + 0.114B).

There a lot of processing steps generally to TV's where the are using some old (from CRT-era) calculations internally, for all TV companies, for that reason with LG and internal 3D LUT, its been bypassed a lot of processing calculation and the picture will look better visually (not counting dE differences..where any manual cal can't reduce so low as a good volumetric calibration)
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S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, ControlCAL
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box - P/G: DVDO AVLab TPG
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5

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post #3592 of 3665 Old 11-01-2019, 10:15 AM
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It will be helpful if you can add a text to each picture (inside the picture) to be easier the comparison of what someone see when he will look these results.
If you click on an image (not opening it on a new tab) it will be displayed in a popup and there you can see the filename of the image:
Quote:
File name conventions for the graphs: pq|rolloff-mdl-maxcll-maxfall-19point[-movieinitials]
Aanyway, I added the "ro-" prefix to the description above of all (!) images inside the post (meaning that all of them include reference curve that is roll-off), just to be clear.
There are more images attached to that post (that aren't used inside the post) and there are 6 PQ images amongst them.
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post #3593 of 3665 Old 11-01-2019, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrtickleuk View Post
Good, I was hoping to clarify this @ConnecTEDDD , because Vincent used the term "autocal" which is too vague (But understandable for the audience of the video).

Which option of "autocal" did Vincent really mean, when he talked about the firmware "detecting if autocal had been used"?

Was it:
a) full 1DLUT and full 3DLUT?
b) unity 1DLUT and full 3DLUT?
c) (skip 1DLUT and keep LG's factory 1DLUT) but carry out 3DLUT?
a+b, will detect.

But if you have your own meters, you can re-calibration so the new capabilities to be introduced.
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post #3594 of 3665 Old 11-01-2019, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
But if you have your own meters, you can re-calibration so the new capabilities to be introduced.
Ah! That explains it! (The grey text is now useless.)
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Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
The AutoCAL-flag added from 4.10.31 FW.

That's the first officially released firmware with the "Macro Block Noise" fix (according to LG's change-log). I am pretty sure my calibrated picture modes got all messed up by the first fix. And I remember not being alone with that.
The picture modes calibrated with 05.10.20 show virtually zero "Macro Block Noise". The amount of dithering seem to be comparable between default-Cinema and AutoCAL-ISFDark. (Although the different tone responses make this comparison very hard. I am not looking at the exact same shades.)

Hmm... So...
May be this flag was only triggered when somebody calibrated a picture mode with >=04.10.31 but already calibrated picture modes were not flagged during the update to 04.10.31
And may be the firmware is smart enough to use the new dithering method if a picture mode gets calibrated with the current firmware. (By the way, I usually do a full factory reset between firmware updates and subsequent [re-]calibrations. May be that's another factor.)
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post #3595 of 3665 Old 11-04-2019, 02:43 PM
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LG Hidden Diagnostics Menu's

LG's 2018 have a secret menu with some valuable info which can help for trouble solving or for checking some additional stuff.

To access that secret menu, using the TV remove, you have to go to Channels Menu and highlight the 'Channel Tuning':



After that, press several times the '1' number from the LG's remote control... and the Host Diagnostics screen will appear:



Unfortunately there 2 more screens of info with LG 2019 models, these additional screens are not available to 2018 models.
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post #3596 of 3665 Old 11-04-2019, 03:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
LG Hidden Diagnostics Menu's

LG's 2018 have a secret menu with some valuable info which can help for trouble solving or for checking some additional stuff.

To access that secret menu, using the TV remove, you have to go to Channels Menu and highlight the 'Channel Tuning':



After that, press several times the '1' number from the LG's remote control... and the Host Diagnostics screen will appear:



Unfortunately there 2 more screens of info with LG 2019 models, these additional screens are not available to 2018 models.
2017 Models have the same hidden menu
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post #3597 of 3665 Old 11-05-2019, 03:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
LG's 2018 have a secret menu with some valuable info which can help for trouble solving or for checking some additional stuff.
To access that secret menu, using the TV remove, you have to go to Channels Menu and highlight the 'Channel Tuning':
After that, press several times the '1' number from the LG's remote control... and the Host Diagnostics screen will appear
Amazing find! HDMI info is really good, and now we can compare the RAM between models
Unfortunately they still hide the info about the SoC (CPU/GPU)

I'll upload an image of the B8 later.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRobotoPlus View Post
2017 Models have the same hidden menu
Can you upload an image of B7/C7? Thanks
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post #3598 of 3665 Old 11-05-2019, 04:45 AM
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Amount of DRAM in different LG models from the diag screen:
1.5 GB : 55B7, 55C7
2GB : 65C6, 65E6, 65B8
3GB : 55C8 , 77C9, 77Z9
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post #3599 of 3665 Old 11-05-2019, 06:13 AM
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After a few hours of fighting the quirks of the HDFury Integral I eventually managed to calibrate the DolbyVision Cinema mode on my C8. And I found an unexpected surprise: CalMAN left me a .CSV alongside the .TXT config file. This extra file looks suspiciously like a 1DLUT. So, it seems like it's possible to re-use a DolbyVision 1DLUT for HDR10 picture modes after all. Hurray! Well, at least on 2019 OLEDs and on a few random 2018 ones, because I opted to calibrate HDR10 with OLED Light set to 86 instead in order to hit the hard-coded constant 700 nit tone-mapping parameter of the 2018 models (and the 1DLUT shan't be re-used for picture modes with different OLED Light settings, similarly to SDR Day/Night or BFI/no-BFI picture modes). So, even though this is technically nice, it's practically still useless.
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post #3600 of 3665 Old 11-05-2019, 07:07 AM
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Quote:
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I opted to calibrate HDR10 with OLED Light set to 86 instead in order to hit the hard-coded constant 700 nit tone-mapping parameter of the 2018 models
Nice!
Do you remember what was the max nit in HDR Cinema mode @ 100 OLED Light (without brightness drifting)? Which size do you have?

And I added B8 to the above DRAM comparison.

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