2018 Vizio PQ65-F1 Calibration Thread - Page 18 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #511 of 532 Old 06-30-2020, 06:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Ario816 View Post
Quick question but can I save different gamma values for DV and HDR10?

In the SmartCast app I was trying to have the gamma for Netflix DV playback at 2.0 and the gamma for Prime Video at 2.1 (both using Calibrated Dark). But it won’t switch to my preferred gamma automaticity upon playback
If memory serves, the Gamma setting is per input. If you are switching all of your sources through a receiver and only use one input on you PQ65 (as I do), you are limited to a single Gamma value. Likewise if you use the same device to play back Netflix and Prime Video you are limited to one Gamma setting unless you somehow split the output from that device to two inputs on the PQ65.

If I am incorrect or missed something I hope someone else will chime in.

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post #512 of 532 Old 06-30-2020, 06:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Ario816 View Post
Quick question but can I save different gamma values for DV and HDR10?



In the SmartCast app I was trying to have the gamma for Netflix DV playback at 2.0 and the gamma for Prime Video at 2.1 (both using Calibrated Dark). But it won’t switch to my preferred gamma automaticity upon playback
To follow the EOTF correctly for DV and HDR10/+ then you must use 2.2 Gamma.

Gamma is set by the picture mode on each input and is shared by all dynamic range formats. I don't like how Vizio did this, but it is how it is. Just have to deal with it.
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post #513 of 532 Old 06-30-2020, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by skschatzman View Post
To follow the EOTF correctly for DV and HDR10/+ then you must use 2.2 Gamma.

Gamma is set by the picture mode on each input and is shared by all dynamic range formats. I don't like how Vizio did this, but it is how it is. Just have to deal with it.
Thanks guys. I was hoping this wasn’t the case so I could just use SmartCast for all my streaming viewing. Unfortunately DV on my set is extremely broken (sometimes scenes are extremely dark in Cal Dark and I get crushed blacks that appear as purple. Both things at least look better to the eye by making the Blue Offset to -10 and lowering gamma to 2.0.

HDR10 and SDR are otherwise perfect and was professionally calibrated to gamma 2.1. I’ve emailed Vizio back and forth but they don’t consider the DV issue warrants a replacement.
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post #514 of 532 Old 06-30-2020, 09:27 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Ario816 View Post
Thanks guys. I was hoping this wasn’t the case so I could just use SmartCast for all my streaming viewing. Unfortunately DV on my set is extremely broken (sometimes scenes are extremely dark in Cal Dark and I get crushed blacks that appear as purple. Both things at least look better to the eye by making the Blue Offset to -10 and lowering gamma to 2.0.



HDR10 and SDR are otherwise perfect and was professionally calibrated to gamma 2.1. I’ve emailed Vizio back and forth but they don’t consider the DV issue warrants a replacement.
Have you tried a factory reset of the TV? This can sometimes remedy those types of issues. I recommend you try this first if you haven't.
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post #515 of 532 Old 06-30-2020, 11:07 AM
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Have you tried a factory reset of the TV? This can sometimes remedy those types of issues. I recommend you try this first if you haven't.
Yeah I did factory reset last week and updated latest firmware. Not a hard reset but just used the setting to Reset to Factory settings. Still the same issue. The only “fix” for this seems to be lowering the blue offset or just getting an Apple TV to force convert all DV content to HDR.
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post #516 of 532 Old 06-30-2020, 03:49 PM
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Yeah I did factory reset last week and updated latest firmware. Not a hard reset but just used the setting to Reset to Factory settings. Still the same issue. The only “fix” for this seems to be lowering the blue offset or just getting an Apple TV to force convert all DV content to HDR.
That doesn't sound right. Were you able to change color temperature, if so make sure its set to normal.

Also, if you changed color space to RGB or YCbCr on any input outside of SmartCast it may affect DV.

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post #517 of 532 Old 06-30-2020, 05:06 PM
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That doesn't sound right. Were you able to change color temperature, if so make sure its set to normal.

Also, if you changed color space to RGB or YCbCr on any input outside of SmartCast it may affect DV.

Sent from my LGMP450 using Tapatalk
Yep. All Inputs have color temp set to default normal and color space set to auto. I’ve had this problem with DV on this set forever regardless of input. I’ll include pics here showing what it looks like with picture mode in Cal Dark default on DV vs HDR. Vizio sent out a tech and said the issue is too objective and they won’t replace the set.
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post #518 of 532 Old 06-30-2020, 06:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Ario816 View Post
Yep. All Inputs have color temp set to default normal and color space set to auto. I’ve had this problem with DV on this set forever regardless of input. I’ll include pics here showing what it looks like with picture mode in Cal Dark default on DV vs HDR. Vizio sent out a tech and said the issue is too objective and they won’t replace the set.
I am curious. Did you bring this issue up to Vizio? This is not acceptable and warrants an exchange. Too bad it isn't possible now, but if you sat on this, then I would say you did yourself a disservice.
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post #519 of 532 Old 06-30-2020, 06:17 PM
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I am curious. Did you bring this issue up to Vizio? This is not acceptable and warrants an exchange. Too bad it isn't possible now, but if you sat on this, then I would say you did yourself a disservice.
Oh yeah I definitely brought it up to them back in early 2019 when it was still under warranty. They sent out a tech. The tech came and looked it over and he was like “I mean I guess I see the blue you’re talking about but it’s only in DV and it’s pretty subjective so they’re probably not gonna replace it” and He filed his report and They got back to me saying they Weren’t going to replace it.

At that point not much else I can do, so I either just lower the blue offset till the blue goes away or I avoid DV content entirely.
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That appears to be a memory issue, DV has a seperate memory for RGB levels, etc. It also has a different color model, than HDR10 especially streaming.

Whats your ATV settings?

You can visit the factory menu to see if there are any offset settings by going in to color temperature.

I'll PM you the remote code if you want, just understand that it may void your warranty.

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post #521 of 532 Old 06-30-2020, 06:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Ario816 View Post
Oh yeah I definitely brought it up to them back in early 2019 when it was still under warranty. They sent out a tech. The tech came and looked it over and he was like “I mean I guess I see the blue you’re talking about but it’s only in DV and it’s pretty subjective so they’re probably not gonna replace it” and He filed his report and They got back to me saying they Weren’t going to replace it.



At that point not much else I can do, so I either just lower the blue offset till the blue goes away or I avoid DV content entirely.
Ouch. Yah I don't like that answer. That is just horrible. Gives me more validation giving up on Vizio a month ago. They have a lot of work to do to regain my attention.
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post #522 of 532 Old 06-30-2020, 08:26 PM
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Originally Posted by DisplayCalNoob View Post
That appears to be a memory issue, DV has a seperate memory for RGB levels, etc. It also has a different color model, than HDR10 especially streaming.

Whats your ATV settings?

You can visit the factory menu to see if there are any offset settings by going in to color temperature.

I'll PM you the remote code if you want, just understand that it may void your warranty.

Sent from my LGMP450 using Tapatalk
I’ll take that remote code via PM. The tv is already out of warranty so nothing to worry about there. And I’ll post my Apple TV settings but the DV looking bad happens regardless of input or SmartCast.

Apple TV settings:
Format: 4KSDR
HDMI output: YCbCr
Chroma: 4:2:0
Match Range & Frame Rate ON
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post #523 of 532 Old 06-30-2020, 08:54 PM
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I’ll take that remote code via PM. The tv is already out of warranty so nothing to worry about there. And I’ll post my Apple TV settings but the DV looking bad happens regardless of input or SmartCast.



Apple TV settings:

Format: 4KSDR

HDMI output: YCbCr

Chroma: 4:2:0

Match Range & Frame Rate ON
Try changing chroma to 4:2:2, thats what DV use for chroma. DV is ICtCp 12 bit 4:2:2, DV will ignore YCbCr.

DV unlike HDR10 requires certain parameters, it expects 2.2 gamma, Contrast, and Brightness at default.

Format is 4KSDR thats odd.

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post #524 of 532 Old 06-30-2020, 09:04 PM
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Originally Posted by DisplayCalNoob View Post
That appears to be a memory issue, DV has a seperate memory for RGB levels, etc. It also has a different color model, than HDR10 especially streaming.

Whats your ATV settings?

You can visit the factory menu to see if there are any offset settings by going in to color temperature.

I'll PM you the remote code if you want, just understand that it may void your warranty.

Sent from my LGMP450 using Tapatalk
I'll take that remote code too if you don't mind.
Thanks!


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post #525 of 532 Old 06-30-2020, 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted by DisplayCalNoob View Post
Try changing chroma to 4:2:2, thats what DV use for chroma. DV is ICtCp 12 bit 4:2:2, DV will ignore YCbCr.

DV unlike HDR10 requires certain parameters, it expects 2.2 gamma, Contrast, and Brightness at default.

Format is 4KSDR thats odd.

Sent from my LGMP450 using Tapatalk
The 4KSDR setting on the Apple TV is just for the main screens.
Since he has the "Match Range & Frame Rate" setting ON, when DV content is played, the unit switches to the appropriate output.


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post #526 of 532 Old 07-01-2020, 05:42 AM
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Originally Posted by DisplayCalNoob View Post
Try changing chroma to 4:2:2, thats what DV use for chroma. DV is ICtCp 12 bit 4:2:2, DV will ignore YCbCr.

DV unlike HDR10 requires certain parameters, it expects 2.2 gamma, Contrast, and Brightness at default.

Format is 4KSDR thats odd.

Sent from my LGMP450 using Tapatalk
I don’t have an option for 4:2:2 just 4:4:4 or 4:2:0 but I’ll try switching it to 4:4:4 and see what it looks like tonight.
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post #527 of 532 Old 07-06-2020, 07:25 AM
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Hey so I ended up getting the DV patterns/slides from Diversified video solutions to see if any of the slides reproduced the bluish blacks issue I was having with certain DV streaming content.

I went through the majority of the slides and saw nothing wrong. I expected the one with the girl on the roof/sparklers to have the blueish blacks on the dark roof background but it looked good, no issue.

Any other slide in particular I should look at to see if the issue shows itself?

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post #528 of 532 Old 07-06-2020, 09:16 AM
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Hey so I ended up getting the DV patterns/slides from Diversified video solutions to see if any of the slides reproduced the bluish blacks issue I was having with certain DV streaming content.



I went through the majority of the slides and couldn’t reproduce the blueish black problem. I expected the one with the girl on the roof/sparklers to reproduce the blueish blacks on the dark roof background but it looked good, no issue.



Any other slide in particular I should look at to see if the issue shows itself?
Visit this thread, its the dedicated thread for the patterns for both HDR10 and DV.

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/top...ink_source=app

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post #529 of 532 Old 07-11-2020, 11:49 AM
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Quick update. Was on the phone yesterday back and Forth with Vizio and then bestbuy. Finally best buy agreed to replace the TV at a pro-rated price with the extended warranty. I decided to jump ship from having my last two Vizio crap out on me and bit the bullet and got a 65LGC9. They’re coming Sat to swap the TVs. Thanks to everyone here especially @DisplayCalNoob and @skschatzman for helping me out and letting me know the DolbyVision issue was not normal.
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post #530 of 532 Old 07-11-2020, 04:31 PM
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Quick update. Was on the phone yesterday back and Forth with Vizio and then bestbuy. Finally best buy agreed to replace the TV at a pro-rated price with the extended warranty. I decided to jump ship from having my last two Vizio crap out on me and bit the bullet and got a 65LGC9. They’re coming Sat to swap the TVs. Thanks to everyone here especially @DisplayCalNoob and @skschatzman for helping me out and letting me know the DolbyVision issue was not normal.
If Vizio had extended their services to color temperature calibrations by technicians, your problem could have been solved. The factory menu color temperature setting is global.

The green push could of only been fixed there with a meter. My Gain and Offset settings were the same as yours despite the panel differences, which I thought was weird. I calibrated my 2016 P55 today, using the internal patterns and the results were great. It even fixed a chroma subsampling issue that was discovered using S&M UHD HDR Benchmark disc for HDR10 content.

Enjoy your new display.

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post #531 of 532 Old 07-11-2020, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by DisplayCalNoob View Post
If Vizio had extended their services to color temperature calibrations by technicians, your problem could have been solved. The factory menu color temperature setting is global.

The green push could of only been fixed there with a meter. My Gain and Offset settings were the same as yours despite the panel differences, which I thought was weird. I calibrated my 2016 P55 today, using the internal patterns and the results were great. It even fixed a chroma subsampling issue that was discovered using S&M UHD HDR Benchmark disc for HDR10 content.

Enjoy your new display.

Sent from my LGMP450 using Tapatalk
Would you mind sharing your process for calibration using the internal patterns?
Why'd you choose that path as opposed to an external TPG?


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post #532 of 532 Old 07-11-2020, 06:00 PM
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Would you mind sharing your process for calibration using the internal patterns?
Why'd you choose that path as opposed to an external TPG?


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I use the free software HCFR and Spyder 4 Pro. Only using 20% and 80% stimulus. The internal patterns are limited to 80% for color temperature. HCFR has internal patterns, but I chose to use the display internal patterns because I don't trust the HDMI ports accuracy. Also, the factory menu, color temperature settings are Global. Positive for SmartCast to usb.

I also used BT.1886 gamma 2.2, since DV expects 2.2. Its kind of cumbersome, because the factory menu is up with the pattern and affecting the readings on the low end. So while doing the cal @ 20%, I would get the delta-e, as low as possible. Press the menu button, clearing the factory menu, so that the meter readings will be without light caused by the menu. Doing this until delta-e was well under one.

I plan on doing some white balance fine tuning after doing a SDR color checker sweep. I use different sources for different aspects. Like sharpness calibration for streaming DV/HDR, I used Netfilx DV pattern that has wheels at each corner, that are good for detecting moire effect.

I found sharpness at 4 was perfect for streaming. Next on the list, is to purchase R.Masciola's DV patterns Profile 5(streaming). When Stacey Spears DV Profile 7 patterns are shipped out, I can check them out on the Bluray player.

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