LG 86UK7570PUB Calibration HCFR i1Display - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 8 Old 01-31-2019, 12:23 PM - Thread Starter
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LG 86UK7570PUB Calibration HCFR i1Display

Hello guys hoping for some help.

I've been using HCFR and and i1Display Pro to try and calibrate my tv but after a few attempts I think I'm getting something wrong. After calibration there is pretty significant banding in the image and it looks unnatural. Regardless of what I change the color errors don't change.


I'm using the AVSHD709 played using the TV's built in video player and the HCFR Window files and 75% Color.
I've attached some screenshots of the results after calibration.

Dynamic Contrast Off, Color Gamut Auto

My steps were:

- Set Contrast (97)
- Set Brightness (44)
- Set Backlight for 35-40 fTL (44)
- Gamma on TV set at 2.4
- Check for WB 6500k using 100% White Pattern (Warm 2)
- 2 Pt Calibration
- 10 pt Calibration
- CMS Calibration

During my 10 pt calibration I saw this TV has a Luminance Setting on each point that I used to adjust to get it closer to the Y value before making G=R=B settings. Am I not suppose to mess with the Luminance setting under each 10 pt calibration?

Also I'm not sure if I'm using the correct settings because I set the TV at 2.4 but on HCFR I set it at 2.3 Power Law which I thought is what people were saying to do. First image shows banding from ISF Night calibrated and second image is no banding from ISF Day uncalibrated.

Any help is appreciated!









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post #2 of 8 Old 02-03-2019, 03:59 PM
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If you remove the CMS calibration, do you still see the issue?
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post #3 of 8 Old 02-05-2019, 02:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkfan9 View Post
If you remove the CMS calibration, do you still see the issue?
Re-doing the CMS did fix the issue so it was probably something I changed in the CMS that caused this banding. Thanks!
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post #4 of 8 Old 02-06-2019, 02:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jubei951 View Post
I'm using the AVSHD709 played using the TV's built in video player and the HCFR Window files and 75% Color.
Hi, about the patterns you are using for your CMS calibration, when you have patterns with 75% Saturation and 75% Luminance then use 75% REC.709 colorspace target @ HCFR preferences.

Note that AVSHD disk patterns named as 75% Color have 100% Saturation with 75% Luminance (not with 75% Saturation) while the100% color patterns you see labeled have 100% Saturation and 100% Luminance level.

BTW, there a mis-match in HCFR Grayscale patterns when you are using HCFR, see there what you can do to resolve this, HCFR will add an offset to fix that issue: LG 2017 OLED Calibration Thread and Settings

Quote:
Originally Posted by jubei951 View Post
- Set Contrast (97)
- Set Brightness (44)
These settings don't look so normal for an LG, see about not to have clipped your levels above 100% reference white.

You can see why you need to leave 'headroom' there, some picture examples of 'out of video legal range values' using a latest popular movie, see there.

If you are watching your movies from your TV USB then playback your patterns and calibrate from the TV USB input, but if you are using a different playback device, stream the patterns from that device, to be sure that your calibration controls adjustments will be accurate during movie playback also.

See some other calibration procedure details there: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-d...l#post57492174

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS / CalMAN ColorChecker / HCFR
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, ControlCAL
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box - P/G: DVDO AVLab TPG
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
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post #5 of 8 Old 02-06-2019, 11:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Hi, about the patterns you are using for your CMS calibration, when you have patterns with 75% Saturation and 75% Luminance then use 75% REC.709 colorspace target @ HCFR preferences.

Note that AVSHD disk patterns named as 75% Color have 100% Saturation with 75% Luminance (not with 75% Saturation) while the100% color patterns you see labeled have 100% Saturation and 100% Luminance level.

BTW, there a mis-match in HCFR Grayscale patterns when you are using HCFR, see there what you can do to resolve this, HCFR will add an offset to fix that issue: LG 2017 OLED Calibration Thread and Settings



These settings don't look so normal for an LG, see about not to have clipped your levels above 100% reference white.

You can see why you need to leave 'headroom' there, some picture examples of 'out of video legal range values' using a latest popular movie, see there.

If you are watching your movies from your TV USB then playback your patterns and calibrate from the TV USB input, but if you are using a different playback device, stream the patterns from that device, to be sure that your calibration controls adjustments will be accurate during movie playback also.

See some other calibration procedure details there: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-d...l#post57492174
Thanks! I was using the folder under AVSHD > HCFR > 75% Color, so am i suppose to use 75% REC709 or just REC709?

I also reset the brightness and contrast settings and contrast too.

I did choose the "round down" option.

The only thing I cannot fix or get to work is the CMS, regardless of what I change the color dE is always really bad.
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post #6 of 8 Old 02-06-2019, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jubei951 View Post
Thanks! I was using the folder under AVSHD > HCFR > 75% Color, so am i suppose to use 75% REC709 or just REC709?

I also reset the brightness and contrast settings and contrast too.

I did choose the "round down" option.

The only thing I cannot fix or get to work is the CMS, regardless of what I change the color dE is always really bad.
When you set HCFR for 75% REC709, it expects 75% saturation, and 75% luminance patterns.
The AVSHD set doesn't have those patterns. Their pattern labeled as 75% is actually 100% saturation with 75% luminance as Ted stated.
If your patterns match, your primary readings should fall in the smaller CIE triangle, not the larger 100% one.
Try the 100% color patterns, and change back to just REC709 in HCFR to see if readings are more in line. Not sure whether they will be, but worth a shot trying.

If you have chromecast, you can also try to use it as a pattern generator for comparison; or plug your computer/laptop directly and use the built-in HCFR patterns.

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Last edited by CFC; 02-06-2019 at 12:27 PM.
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post #7 of 8 Old 02-06-2019, 03:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jubei951 View Post
Thanks! I was using the folder under AVSHD > HCFR > 75% Color, so am i suppose to use 75% REC709 or just REC709?

The only thing I cannot fix or get to work is the CMS, regardless of what I change the color dE is always really bad.
Change colorspace to REC.709 when you are using AVSHD CMS patterns as CFC recommends below:

Quote:
Originally Posted by CFC View Post
When you set HCFR for 75% REC709, it expects 75% saturation, and 75% luminance patterns.
The AVSHD set doesn't have those patterns. Their pattern labeled as 75% is actually 100% saturation with 75% luminance as Ted stated.
If your patterns match, your primary readings should fall in the smaller CIE triangle, not the larger 100% one.
Try the 100% color patterns, and change back to just REC709 in HCFR to see if readings are more in line. Not sure whether they will be, but worth a shot trying.
+1

Quote:
Originally Posted by CFC View Post
If you have chromecast, you can also try to use it as a pattern generator for comparison; or plug your computer/laptop directly and use the built-in HCFR patterns.
ChromeCast is not bit-perfect for patch generation.

Chromecast output YCbCr and HCFR sends to device RGB triplets, so during the internal colorspace conversion rounding errors are introduced.

Zoyd with Graeme has written before some years a custom special software offset code for HCFR/ArgyllCMS/DisplayCAL which will reduce the errors down to +-1 LBS (least significant bit).

But this offset was for earlier generations of ChromeCast, its unknown if that offset will be effective for newer models, someone with digital level analyzer has to check and report back (using DVDO AVLab TPG or Accupel DVG-6000 Ultra with Engineer Add-On).

A quicker test will be to compare measurements using patterns which have been designed to be accurate for HCFR from the source player of the user vs. the HCFR internal ones using ChromeCast, using GrayScale/Saturation or ColorChecker measurements runs etc.

Then compare the results and see what is happening to black/white level, grayscale RGB balance/gamma and color gamut tracking between these measurements, if there agreement then ChromeCast can be used.

Ted's LightSpace CMS Calibration Disk Free Version for Free Calibration Software: LightSpace DPS / CalMAN ColorChecker / HCFR
S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, ControlCAL
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box - P/G: DVDO AVLab TPG
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
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post #8 of 8 Old 02-06-2019, 03:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post

ChromeCast is not bit-perfect for patch generation.

Chromecast output YCbCr and HCFR sends to device RGB triplets, so during the internal colorspace conversion rounding errors are introduced.

Zoyd with Graeme has written before some years a custom special software offset code for HCFR/ArgyllCMS/DisplayCAL which will reduce the errors down to +-1 LBS (least significant bit).

But this offset was for earlier generations of ChromeCast, its unknown if that offset will be effective for newer models, someone with digital level analyzer has to check and report back (using DVDO AVLab TPG or Accupel DVG-6000 Ultra with Engineer Add-On).

A quicker test will be to compare measurements using patterns which have been designed to be accurate for HCFR from the source player of the user vs. the HCFR internal ones using ChromeCast, using GrayScale/Saturation or ColorChecker measurements runs etc.

Then compare the results and see what is happening to black/white level, grayscale RGB balance/gamma and color gamut tracking between these measurements, if there agreement then ChromeCast can be used.
Agreed.
Though Chromecast is not bit perfect, I was imagining him running the quick test with it because it should at least output the "correct" 75/75 pattern.
From there he could at least verify that dE and CIE diagram are more in line.
Ideally, you want to use output from the source which will be normally connected to that display's input.

CFC

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