CalMAN Home for LG - Page 12 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #331 of 535 Old 07-19-2019, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toto84 View Post
Thanks for your time and response.
When you say to put the i1display pro on screen mode you mean Raw XYZ?
Should the i1pro2 not be in contact with the screen?
Should the windows size be 10% or 100%
Should the 100% white be 100 nits when taking reading?
Should i use a gamma of 2.2 or 2.4 for creating the profile?
Should i create of profile for hdr and dolby vision as well?
Could you please confirm on the second picture taken that use native gamma for gamut target should be check or uncheck?

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I really think you should just follow the tutorial videos, Ive never used an Xrite i1 pro or calibrated a screen before yesterday and just followed the YouTube videos. Now I have both SDR and HDR calibrated and as I type this I’m in the middle of calibrated DV. All without major issue.

Looks like your using the advance features (which are not required) if you follow the tutorials
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Last edited by jdstephens; 07-20-2019 at 03:37 PM.
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post #332 of 535 Old 07-20-2019, 08:54 AM
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I have i1 Diplsay Pro and I noticed recommendation to use Raw ZYX mode. But no such mention for SDR workflow. Is it also recommended to use Raw XYZ for SDR?
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post #333 of 535 Old 07-20-2019, 10:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Antarius View Post
I have i1 Diplsay Pro and I noticed recommendation to use Raw ZYX mode. But no such mention for SDR workflow. Is it also recommended to use Raw XYZ for SDR?
Yes, for both SDR and HDR.

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post #334 of 535 Old 07-20-2019, 11:55 AM
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Hey Tyler (ping @WiFi-Spy ),
in the YouTube tutorial video "LG OLED 2019 Calibration SDR with CalMAN Home" you've mentioned that you're going to upload a 10h version of the SDR grey screen media file. I was however unable to find this video.
Is the video available yet and if so where?
If not: do you still plan to upload it?
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post #335 of 535 Old 07-20-2019, 01:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdstephens View Post
I really think you should just follow the tutorial videos, Ive never used an Xrite i1 pro or calibrated a screen before yesterday and just followed the YouTube videos. Now I have both SDR and HDR calibrated and as I type this I’m in the middle of calibrated DV. All without major issue.



Looks like your using the advance features (which are required) if you follow the tutorials
Profiling is not in the tutorial and is critical for my calibration as i have a colorimeter and a spectrometer.
A lot of different people even pro have different method.
I am a perfectionist and i want to make sure i have the best result as this process is not cheap.
I spend countless hours reading the forums and calibrating is now a hobby for me.

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post #336 of 535 Old 07-23-2019, 11:27 AM
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After calibrating for SDR, I then calibrated for HDR and Dolby Vision.

Afterwards, from the media player screen (with the grey pattern still playing) I assigned the calibrated modes to all inputs

I can easily see if the calibrated SDR mode is in effect because the panel brightness is well reduced from pre-calibration.

However it’s a bit tricky to see if the HDR modes have taken the calibration. None of the numbers are different, even going into the color management screen there doesn’t appear to be any adjustments. I am sure the HDR Home and Dolby Vision Home modes are now calibrated but my question is whether there is any way to easily confirm this?

Do the settings show up somewhere in the service menu?

BTW, I’m using a C9 model TV and the internal pattern generator.
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post #337 of 535 Old 07-23-2019, 01:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Iraschwips View Post
After calibrating for SDR, I then calibrated for HDR and Dolby Vision.



Afterwards, from the media player screen (with the grey pattern still playing) I assigned the calibrated modes to all inputs



I can easily see if the calibrated SDR mode is in effect because the panel brightness is well reduced from pre-calibration.



However it’s a bit tricky to see if the HDR modes have taken the calibration. None of the numbers are different, even going into the color management screen there doesn’t appear to be any adjustments. I am sure the HDR Home and Dolby Vision Home modes are now calibrated but my question is whether there is any way to easily confirm this?



Do the settings show up somewhere in the service menu?



BTW, I’m using a C9 model TV and the internal pattern generator.


The color gamut and white balance controls will be grayed out For those picture modes.

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post #338 of 535 Old 07-23-2019, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted by WiFi-Spy View Post
The color gamut and white balance controls will be grayed out For those picture modes.

Thank you for this Tyler, and for the three very helpful tutorial videos. I'll have to verify that the two controls you mention are greyed out.



Also, I may have missed it elsewhere but I'm assuming that after defining the Tone Map for the HDR modes dynamic tone mapping must be turned off, or will this option also be greyed out?



I suppose it may be early to ask but speaking of tone mapping has anyone experimented with different roll-off points for 1,000, 4,000 and 10,000 nit mastering levels?



Thanks again!
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post #339 of 535 Old 07-23-2019, 02:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iraschwips View Post
After calibrating for SDR, I then calibrated for HDR and Dolby Vision.



Afterwards, from the media player screen (with the grey pattern still playing) I assigned the calibrated modes to all inputs



I can easily see if the calibrated SDR mode is in effect because the panel brightness is well reduced from pre-calibration.



However it’s a bit tricky to see if the HDR modes have taken the calibration. None of the numbers are different, even going into the color management screen there doesn’t appear to be any adjustments. I am sure the HDR Home and Dolby Vision Home modes are now calibrated but my question is whether there is any way to easily confirm this?



Do the settings show up somewhere in the service menu?



BTW, I’m using a C9 model TV and the internal pattern generator.


The color gamut and white balance controls will be grayed out For those picture modes.

Tyler Pruitt - Technical Evangelist - for CalMAN

10 Bit Gradient Test Patterns (HEVC) - Free Download
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post #340 of 535 Old 07-23-2019, 02:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iraschwips View Post
Thank you for this Tyler, and for the three very helpful tutorial videos. I'll have to verify that the two controls you mention are greyed out.



Also, I may have missed it elsewhere but I'm assuming that after defining the Tone Map for the HDR modes dynamic tone mapping must be turned off, or will this option also be greyed out?



I suppose it may be early to ask but speaking of tone mapping has anyone experimented with different roll-off points for 1,000, 4,000 and 10,000 nit mastering levels?



Thanks again!
Good luck with that, can't find any recommendation either about that.
A very well kept secret, best to experiment yourself as there is no standard for hdr.

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post #341 of 535 Old 07-24-2019, 04:59 PM
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Hi tyler, this is the dark mode using deitp.
Its still very dark, any suggestion?

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post #342 of 535 Old 07-25-2019, 12:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolls-Royce View Post
Yes.
From looking at the calman workflows i'd say the only method to calibrate DV at the present moment is autocal. HDR is included in the manual calibration workflow but I don't see DV anywhere.
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post #343 of 535 Old 07-25-2019, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Guz911 View Post
From looking at the calman workflows i'd say the only method to calibrate DV at the present moment is autocal. HDR is included in the manual calibration workflow but I don't see DV anywhere.
That's because the previous method used to do manual cals on DV has proven over time not to be consistently reliable. Tyler has mentioned this in an earlier post.

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post #344 of 535 Old 07-25-2019, 04:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Rolls-Royce View Post

That's because the previous method used to do manual cals on DV has proven over time not to be consistently reliable. Tyler has mentioned this in an earlier post.
And incredibly time consuming.
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post #345 of 535 Old 07-28-2019, 10:11 AM
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Re Calman Home (for LG), could somebody confirm, or otherwise, that the Murideo Six-G meter is supported?

It doesn't appear in the drop down menu on source in the evaluation version. Thank you.
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post #346 of 535 Old 07-28-2019, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Tom Edge View Post
Re Calman Home (for LG), could somebody confirm, or otherwise, that the Murideo Six-G meter is supported?

It doesn't appear in the drop down menu on source in the evaluation version. Thank you.
Some real world stuff may not show up in the evaluation version, which can't use real meters, displays, or pattern sources in any case.
Have you tried looking here: https://store.portrait.com/consumer-...me-for-lg.html

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post #347 of 535 Old 07-28-2019, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Rolls-Royce View Post
Real world stuff will not show up in the evaluation version, which can't use real meters, displays, or pattern sources.
Have you tried looking here: https://store.portrait.com/consumer-...me-for-lg.html
It's listed as supported, but I was just running through the evaluation version and wanted to double check. Thank you.
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post #348 of 535 Old 07-28-2019, 12:20 PM
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Hi tyler, this is the dark mode using deitp.
Its still very dark, any suggestion?

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Any comment on this?

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post #349 of 535 Old 07-28-2019, 12:42 PM
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Any comment on this?

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I am also wondering why everyone is dodging our questions about this.

I asked the same thing with no response in the LG oled near black thread too. Like it's some mystery or taboo to talk about it.

Which do we trust.. the black test patterns or the calibration results? And, why are they different?

Is it too much to ask?



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post #350 of 535 Old 07-28-2019, 01:43 PM
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You guys probably WON'T see 17 or 18. Their luminance is just too close to Black. You can do the math and figure out what they should be based on the gamma target and what Black and White read.
Note that you can see 19...
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post #351 of 535 Old 07-28-2019, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Rolls-Royce View Post
You guys probably WON'T see 17 or 18. Their luminance is just too close to Black. You can do the math and figure out what they should be based on the gamma target and what Black and White read.

Note that you can see 19...
So this is normal?
I always heard so you should see until 17 flashing.

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post #352 of 535 Old 07-28-2019, 03:05 PM
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Some TVs never show 17 flashing. If your OLED is one of those with a firmware version that is crushing black, it won't, either.
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post #353 of 535 Old 07-29-2019, 04:29 AM
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For calibration for the dark mode would you stick to 100 nits as reference or higher?

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post #354 of 535 Old 07-29-2019, 06:16 AM
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For calibration for the dark mode would you stick to 100 nits as reference or higher?

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~100 nits would be my personal choice for a dark room environment, unless you cannot get the display to behave and calibrate properly at that level. No need for higher luminance in the dark.
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post #355 of 535 Old 07-29-2019, 03:14 PM
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For calibration for the dark mode would you stick to 100 nits as reference or higher?
These info below will be available to the upcoming LG guide for OLED I will upload to my site soon:

Grade-1 SDR Reference Monitor/TV Calibration Targets

The viewing of accurate images depends on an accurate calibration of the display, control over the viewing environment (lightning and room decor), as well as the appropriate placement of the observer relative to the screen.

The Reference Viewing Environment can be considered one where color critical decisions are made, while the Home Viewing Environment is where finalized deliverables are viewed, with the intent to best match the original artistic intent, as defined by the director and colorist within the Reference Viewing Environment.



The goad of home TV calibration is the Home Viewing Environment to match the Reference Viewing Environment image.

Within the professional industries reference monitors (Grade-1) are the standard for color critical work.



BU TECH 3320 (Version 4.1 - September 2019) - User Requirements for Video Monitors in Television Production, defines the technical characteristics for video broadcast monitors used in a professional TV production environment for evaluation and control of the images being produced.

Its describing the definition of Grade-1 SDR Reference Monitor with Standard Dynamic Range capabilities.

Grade-1 Monitors are devices for high-grade technical quality evaluation of images at key points in a color grading production workflow.

They are used for critical evaluation during post-production.

As a minimum requirement, these monitors shall have the quality properties of the image system they are used to evaluate.

It is expected that all applied technologies are state-of-the-art at this level as the Grade 1 monitor is a 'measuring instrument' for visual evaluation of image quality.

Grade-1 SDR Reference Monitor should be been calibrated and capable to produce a reference luminance level of 100 cd/m2 (nits) for 100% White (235 level @ 8-bit) patch on the screen.
Automatic Brightness Limiter (ABL) functions shall not be used for Grade-1 SDR Reference Monitors, this means that the monitor need to be capable to display 100 cd/m2 with a full field 100% Reference White pattern also.

100% luminance on the screen corresponds to a 10-bit luma signal of digital level 940, and the black level corresponds to a 10-bit luma signal of digital level 64.


100% luminance on the screen is defined as the luminance of a luma signal of digital level 940, but levels 941 through 1019 should also be correctly displayed.

The highest value of 10-bit luma signal is digital level 1019. The luma level 1019 is called 'Super-White' or '109% White'.

For the luminance gamma characteristic (Electro-Optical Transfer Function) of the screen, its recommended that a nominal value of 2.4 gamma to be used.



LG OLED Panel Auto Brightness Limiting (ABL)

But there is an ABL (Auto Brightness Limiter) present at all LG OLED TV's for the purpose of preventing them to consume too much power when displaying content with preponderance of bright elements, and protecting internal components from overheating.

The impact of the ABL, however, is limited to high-APL content such as hockey and winter sports during which can be observed a brightness reduction as the APL increases.

APL is the average level brightness (Luma) of the total numbers of pixel of an video image frame; defined as a percentage of the range between blanking and reference white level.



The LG 2018/2019 OLED TV's are able to reach about 150 cd/m2 on 100% APL using when you will take measurement using an 100% White full field pattern, so there is still some brightness headroom even for high-APL scenes because SDR content is mastered to a 100 cd/m2.

For reference level SDR movie playback for home; for being considered as 'Grade-1'; the TV should display calibrated colors with the color primaries (REC.709 color gamut) and reference white (D65), as specified in the relevant SDR video standard ITU-R BT.709-6 (Parameter values for the HDTV standards for production and international programme exchange - June 2015).
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post #356 of 535 Old 07-29-2019, 06:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
These info below will be available to the upcoming LG guide for OLED I will upload to my site soon:

Grade-1 SDR Reference Monitor/TV Calibration Targets

The viewing of accurate images depends on an accurate calibration of the display, control over the viewing environment (lightning and room decor), as well as the appropriate placement of the observer relative to the screen.

The Reference Viewing Environment can be considered one where color critical decisions are made, while the Home Viewing Environment is where finalized deliverables are viewed, with the intent to best match the original artistic intent, as defined by the director and colorist within the Reference Viewing Environment.



The goad of home TV calibration is the Home Viewing Environment to match the Reference Viewing Environment image.

Within the professional industries reference monitors (Grade-1) are the standard for color critical work.



BU TECH 3320 (Version 4.1 - September 2019) - User Requirements for Video Monitors in Television Production, defines the technical characteristics for video broadcast monitors used in a professional TV production environment for evaluation and control of the images being produced.

Its describing the definition of Grade-1 SDR Reference Monitor with Standard Dynamic Range capabilities.

Grade-1 Monitors are devices for high-grade technical quality evaluation of images at key points in a color grading production workflow.

They are used for critical evaluation during post-production.

As a minimum requirement, these monitors shall have the quality properties of the image system they are used to evaluate.

It is expected that all applied technologies are state-of-the-art at this level as the Grade 1 monitor is a 'measuring instrument' for visual evaluation of image quality.

Grade-1 SDR Reference Monitor should be been calibrated and capable to produce a reference luminance level of 100 cd/m2 (nits) for 100% White (235 level @ 8-bit) patch on the screen.
Automatic Brightness Limiter (ABL) functions shall not be used for Grade-1 SDR Reference Monitors, this means that the monitor need to be capable to display 100 cd/m2 with a full field 100% Reference White pattern also.

100% luminance on the screen corresponds to a 10-bit luma signal of digital level 940, and the black level corresponds to a 10-bit luma signal of digital level 64.


100% luminance on the screen is defined as the luminance of a luma signal of digital level 940, but levels 941 through 1019 should also be correctly displayed.

The highest value of 10-bit luma signal is digital level 1019. The luma level 1019 is called 'Super-White' or '109% White'.

For the luminance gamma characteristic (Electro-Optical Transfer Function) of the screen, its recommended that a nominal value of 2.4 gamma to be used.



LG OLED Panel Auto Brightness Limiting (ABL)

But there is an ABL (Auto Brightness Limiter) present at all LG OLED TV's for the purpose of preventing them to consume too much power when displaying content with preponderance of bright elements, and protecting internal components from overheating.

The impact of the ABL, however, is limited to high-APL content such as hockey and winter sports during which can be observed a brightness reduction as the APL increases.

APL is the average level brightness (Luma) of the total numbers of pixel of an video image frame; defined as a percentage of the range between blanking and reference white level.



The LG 2018/2019 OLED TV's are able to reach about 150 cd/m2 on 100% APL using when you will take measurement using an 100% White full field pattern, so there is still some brightness headroom even for high-APL scenes because SDR content is mastered to a 100 cd/m2.

For reference level SDR movie playback for home; for being considered as 'Grade-1'; the TV should display calibrated colors with the color primaries (REC.709 color gamut) and reference white (D65), as specified in the relevant SDR video standard ITU-R BT.709-6 (Parameter values for the HDTV standards for production and international programme exchange - June 2015).
Thank you for sharing your knowledge.
Your help tedd has been tremendous.

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post #357 of 535 Old 07-30-2019, 12:26 AM
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Thank you for sharing your knowledge.
Your help tedd has been tremendous.

LG OLED Panel Automatic Static Brightness Limiter (ASBL)

LG OLED TV's have a function which we call it in calibration world as ASBL (Automatic Static Brightness Limiter). This function is enabled by default to all OLED's and it will automatically dim the picture when OLED TV will detect that you are displaying static images (like patterns windows during measurements/profiling) after some period of time. ASBL works by detecting APL changes. This function needs to be disabled before taking any measurement because it will affect calibration and panel response. If you like; you can enable it after the end of the calibration, or leave it disabled forever.



To disable that ASBL function ('TCP' is called in Service Menu), you will need to enter to IN-START LG OLED TV Service Menu.

There several methods to access the Service Menu here, or you can buy the LG Service Menu Remote Control from eBay; search for 'MKJ39170828' Remote.

It can be used also the AnyMote App from any SmartPhone equipped with build-in IR transmitter.



Use the IN-START button to access the LG OLED TV Service Menu, it will ask for a password, type '0413', navigate to '13. OLED', and set the TCP to Off.

Its recommended to check if the TCP setting will stay at 'off' after you will install a newer LG OLED TV Firmware Update or when you will perform reset to factory default settings (Reset to Initial Settings).
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S/W: LightSpace CMS, SpaceMan ICC, SpaceMatch DCM, CalMAN 5, CalMAN RGB, ChromaPure, ControlCAL
V/P: eeColor 3D LUT Box - P/G: DVDO AVLab TPG
Meters: JETI Specbos 1211, Klein K-10A, i1PRO2, i1PRO, SpectraCAL C6, i1D3, C5
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post #358 of 535 Old 07-30-2019, 03:24 AM
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And what about LG nanocell

Hi All,


I recently purchased an X-Rite i1Display Pro colorimeter plus an license for the CalMAN home LG software, to do some calibrating for my LG SM9000 (2019) nanocell television.
Finally there is an affordably solution for the end user, to play with color calibrating

So far most of the topics regarding calman home LG are about calibrating LG's OLED, i want to contribute my findings with the nanocell.
I made several sessions with good results, but also have some questions:


1. Calibrating SDR content


Session setup:

  • Playing the grey screen media file for SDR
  • Energy saving mode: OFF
  • Meter display LCD:LED
  • Windows size: Window 10%
  • Calibration Targets: Default (rec.709/sRGB, Gamma BT.1886 (night), Whitepoint: D65)
  • DeltaE Formula: de_ITP


After pre-cal measurement, i connect to display and select picture mode: Expert Dark, en hit the FULL DCC reset button. And from here i make the calibration steps; luminance, grayscale, colorspace, dynamic range.
At the end i found out that there is an dramatic difference between pre / post calibration. I am not sure there should be so much of an difference?

Screenshot: (look how the blue/red line is of the chart)


Thanks in advance
Herman
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post #359 of 535 Old 07-30-2019, 06:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Herman_lg_sm9000 View Post
After pre-cal measurement, i connect to display and select picture mode: Expert Dark, en hit the FULL DCC reset button. And from here i make the calibration steps; luminance, grayscale, colorspace, dynamic range.
At the end i found out that there is an dramatic difference between pre / post calibration. I am not sure there should be so much of an difference?

Screenshot: (look how the blue/red line is of the chart)


Thanks in advance
Herman
If your display is not strictly in line with the factory-loaded settings, yes, there could be such a difference. Or if the meter type you used in the CalMAN meter settings was not accurate for your TV...

...Royce...

"I never drink...wine."
Bela Lugosi, DRACULA, 1931

Last edited by Rolls-Royce; 07-30-2019 at 06:47 AM.
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post #360 of 535 Old 07-30-2019, 08:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
LG OLED Panel Automatic Static Brightness Limiter (ASBL)

LG OLED TV's have a function which we call it in calibration world as ASBL (Automatic Static Brightness Limiter). This function is enabled by default to all OLED's and it will automatically dim the picture when OLED TV will detect that you are displaying static images (like patterns windows during measurements/profiling) after some period of time. ASBL works by detecting APL changes. This function needs to be disabled before taking any measurement because it will affect calibration and panel response. If you like; you can enable it after the end of the calibration, or leave it disabled forever.



To disable that ASBL function ('TCP' is called in Service Menu), you will need to enter to IN-START LG OLED TV Service Menu.

There several methods to access the Service Menu here, or you can buy the LG Service Menu Remote Control from eBay; search for 'MKJ39170828' Remote.

It can be used also the AnyMote App from any SmartPhone equipped with build-in IR transmitter.



Use the IN-START button to access the LG OLED TV Service Menu, it will ask for a password, type '0413', navigate to '13. OLED', and set the TCP to Off.

Its recommended to check if the TCP setting will stay at 'off' after you will install a newer LG OLED TV Firmware Update or when you will perform reset to factory default settings (Reset to Initial Settings).
Hi Tedd, i calibrate my c9 for a bright room at 200 nits is it sufficient?
For the i1displaypro is the standart exposure mode should be set to 1 or 2 sec?
The low light trigger at 5 or 10 cd2 ?

Thank you


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