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-   -   CalMAN Home for LG (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-display-calibration/3067446-calman-home-lg.html)

LeRoyK 05-13-2019 07:13 PM

CalMAN Home for LG
 
This is a place to discuss using CalMAN Home for LG

LeRoyK 05-13-2019 07:13 PM

Reserved for future update

LeRoyK 05-13-2019 07:17 PM

When using CalMAN Home for LG can you modify the target White point?

D-Nice does not use standard D65 for our LG OLEDs and Technicolor Warm1 also uses a non standard White point. Can we set the Autocal target White point ourselves?

LeRoyK 05-13-2019 07:24 PM

In this document CalMAN Home for LG Walkthrough.

Step 8, is the only choice 'Matrix LUT' for the 3D LUT? Are other choices available?

Wjboshart 05-13-2019 08:17 PM

CalMAN Home for LG
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by LeRoyK (Post 58043762)
In this document CalMAN Home for LG Walkthrough.



Step 8, is the only choice 'Matrix LUT' for the 3D LUT? Are other choices available?



Other choices are available. Matrix is the primary way to calibrate hdr. There are other means for sdr. The 3dlut has a drop down tab for other options that the walkthrough states are prebuilt.
And yes you can also set your own white point


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TubeFromHolland 05-14-2019 03:22 AM

I am sorry but I don't know anything about LUTs, or any of the terms used in these posts. But I do have a question if I may.

First, is there a FAQ where I can lookup my following questions?

1. I studied the CalMAN Home for LG Walkthrough. Is it correct that my xrite i1 display colorimeter (that I use for my computer display) will work?

2. The specifications tab states that calman will work in "in VMWare Fusion® and Bootcamp® for Mac OS X® users"
But will that work satisfactorily with the USB connection? I know it's a specific matter that not many will encounter but I need to know before hand because I will need to order a VMware + windows license that I cannot return.

3. Regarding the pattern generator: I noticed that 2019 models have a pattern generator built into the TV unit. The separately sold pattern generator is $1500, which is about the cost of the 55 C8. Would you say it's wise to pick the 2019 C9 model over the C8 for this reason alone?

4. Can the calibration process for the C8 be completed without the pattern generator? I may not use HDR anyway. Or am I mixing things up?

Thanks a bunch.

Wjboshart 05-14-2019 07:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TubeFromHolland (Post 58044622)
I am sorry but I don't know anything about LUTs, or any of the terms used in these posts. But I do have a question if I may.



First, is there a FAQ where I can lookup my following questions?



1. I studied the CalMAN Home for LG Walkthrough. Is it correct that my xrite i1 display colorimeter (that I use for my computer display) will work?



2. The specifications tab states that calman will work in "in VMWare Fusion[emoji2400] and Bootcamp[emoji2400] for Mac OS X[emoji2400] users"

But will that work satisfactorily with the USB connection? I know it's a specific matter that not many will encounter but I need to know before hand because I will need to order a VMware + windows license that I cannot return.



3. Regarding the pattern generator: I noticed that 2019 models have a pattern generator built into the TV unit. The separately sold pattern generator is $1500, which is about the cost of the 55 C8. Would you say it's wise to pick the 2019 C9 model over the C8 for this reason alone?



4. Can the calibration process for the C8 be completed without the pattern generator? I may not use HDR anyway. Or am I mixing things up?



Thanks a bunch.



1) Yes you can use an x-rite meter.
2) I would imagine the usb wouldn't be an issue
3) That will depend on your preference. If you've got the money to spend might as well get the c9 for the newer features. There are alternative pattern generators that are cheaper, but will only work for sdr material. I use raspberry pi that I flashed with a generator program. You can also use an amazon fire stick.
4) there is an internal pattern generator in calman, but your computer has to be able to output signal bit perfect, and again can only do sdr.


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WiFi-Spy 05-14-2019 07:46 AM

I am recording tutorial videos for CalMAN Home for LG this week. It will probably take a week after that to do all the post production.

I will be covering calibrating SDR/HDR/Dolby Vision on a 2019 LG C9.

cupsaa 05-14-2019 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WiFi-Spy (Post 58045508)
I am recording tutorial videos for CalMAN Home for LG this week. It will probably take a week after that to do all the post production.

I will be covering calibrating SDR/HDR/Dolby Vision on a 2019 LG C9.

Will the 2018 LG be covered in that video as well?

WiFi-Spy 05-14-2019 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cupsaa (Post 58047880)
Will the 2018 LG be covered in that video as well?



The only thing that will be different is that I will be using the internal pattern generator on the 2019 TV models.

rswood 05-14-2019 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WiFi-Spy (Post 58045508)
I am recording tutorial videos for CalMAN Home for LG this week. It will probably take a week after that to do all the post production.

I will be covering calibrating SDR/HDR/Dolby Vision on a 2019 LG C9.

Tyler, I recently purchased the LG workflow and I have a couple questions.

1. Why after a 3D LUT do you guys now recommend the option of changing the contrast and the black level after the 3D LUT. I was always under the impression not to touch those controls after the LUT?

2. when doing the 3D lut point, do we still reduce the intervals of the patches to 10 or leave at the default of 45 which is higher than the enthusiast version of 30?

WiFi-Spy 05-14-2019 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rswood (Post 58048186)
Tyler, I recently purchased the LG workflow and I have a couple questions.



1. Why after a 3D LUT do you guys now recommend the option of changing the contrast and the black level after the 3D LUT. I was always under the impression not to touch those controls after the LUT?



2. when doing the 3D lut point, do we still reduce the intervals of the patches to 10 or leave at the default of 45 which is higher than the enthusiast version of 30?



1. That step in the workflow is really more for validation of your luminance And for you to be able to check brightness and contrast after.


2. Smaller interval pattern insertion should provide slightly better results.

Wjboshart 05-14-2019 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WiFi-Spy (Post 58048474)
1. That step in the workflow is really more for validation of your luminance And for you to be able to check brightness and contrast after.


2. Smaller interval pattern insertion should provide slightly better results.



I'm not understanding the validation aspect especially towards brightness/contrast? If something didn't look right you can't rightfully change either setting without ruining the bypass setting correct?


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LeRoyK 05-14-2019 07:46 PM

Did my first Autocal today. Went pretty well.

I was not sure why the program picked some of the values at the very bottom, but it was easy to correct.

@WiFi-Spy , what does the Unity LUT checkbox actually do in Step 8? There seems to be unresolved debate in other threads.

LeRoy

liberator72 05-14-2019 10:39 PM

Reposting here by request of @WiFi-Spy after initially posting in the main CalMAN thread. Sorry, I hadn't noticed a Home for LG thread had been opened.

I am running CalMAN Home for LG. This is my first foray into calibration myself, I have previously paid professionals to do it for me but the process fascinates me so I am eager to learn. I purchased the Home for LG version as it is reasonably priced and thought it may be a good place to start with its simplified workflows, and as I learn more then probably step up to the more advanced, professional version.

I currently own a 2017 series OLED (I will be purchasing a 2019 model in the next month or two), and have just a couple queries.



I have manually calibrated SDR and am very happy with the results (initial pro calibration drifted substantially after over 4000 hrs usage), and have also done HDR Cinema, just the 2 point grayscale based on jrref's advise/recommendation. So my first query was also, is there a way to manually calibrate Dolby Vision in just the Home version? I have a HDFury so if there is, then I am able to inject the DV metadata into the built in pattern window as per the 2017 LG/DV calibration thread on these forums. If not, are there any plans to add manual DV calibration in a future release?



Secondly, my meter is iDisplayPro (Retail). I am looking to purchase a Spectro to profile it, unfortunately here in the UK, they run a bit more expensive than on your side of the pond. I will purchase an i1Pro2 if I have to, but I note that Home is compatible with the X-Rite ColorMunki Spectro (Design and Photo). I haven't been able to find either of those for sale in the UK, and a Google search takes me to X-Rite's site which states there is now an upgraded version, the i1Studio. These are readily available here and is a lot cheaper than the i1Pro2. So my question is, would that device be compatible even though it is not on the supported list, and if so would it be accurate enough to profile my iDisplayPro as beginner in calibration, or do I just bite the bullet and buy an i1Pro2 now?



Thank you in advance for any information you can give.

Kind regards, Leon

rswood 05-16-2019 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeRoyK (Post 58049424)
Did my first Autocal today. Went pretty well.

I was not sure why the program picked some of the values at the very bottom, but it was easy to correct.

@WiFi-Spy , what does the Unity LUT checkbox actually do in Step 8? There seems to be unresolved debate in other threads.

LeRoy

I would like to know this too! Maybe Tyler will respond.

4klover 05-16-2019 09:43 AM

Hi everyone
I just bought this for c9
I was able to add my TV once
Now Everytime I click on find TV
Put ip and the code.
The application just crashes
Support is useless since their mailbox is full
I'm very mad about this.
Hope someone can help

Thanks

WiFi-Spy 05-16-2019 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4klover (Post 58056356)
Hi everyone

I just bought this for c9

I was able to add my TV once

Now Everytime I click on find TV

Put ip and the code.

The application just crashes

Support is useless since their mailbox is full

I'm very mad about this.

Hope someone can help



Thanks



Which build number are you running? We fixed a bug that was causing that crash.

The current build is 5.10.0.50

4klover 05-16-2019 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WiFi-Spy (Post 58056676)
Which build number are you running? We fixed a bug that was causing that crash.

The current build is 5.10.0.50

I'm using that one.
I was able to get it to connect again by factory reset everything.
Is that a requirement Everytime?

4klover 05-18-2019 06:07 AM

Hi everyone,
I'm looking to get help calibrate my c9 with calman home 2019
I calibrated hdr but I can't do dolby vision.
It turned out green after it was done.
It forced me to reset the TV.
Please guide me through It

Thanks

Wjboshart 05-18-2019 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4klover (Post 58064268)
Hi everyone,

I'm looking to get help calibrate my c9 with calman home 2019

I calibrated hdr but I can't do dolby vision.

It turned out green after it was done.

It forced me to reset the TV.

Please guide me through It



Thanks



First foremost I would retry. If the meter had a delay wrong or read a wrong pattern that could be the case. There was a glitch in early autocal with the 2018 where everything would turn blue with hdr calibration


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egandt 05-18-2019 12:11 PM

Very Impressed
 
I'm using Calman Home Enthusiast, but same sets as LG Home. I have the C6 1000 meter and am using madvr's pattern generator since I use the HTPC for most viewing anyways and that way I can do HDR easily.

Since I'm Calman Home Enthusiast owner (bummer they did away with it) and use madvr I've been calibrating and then generating a 3D Lut for madvr for many years, however it has always been 3+ hours work twice a year to get it done and normally it got my Deltas to under 2, however using Autocal it took 20 minutes and then 3 hours to wait for the 3D luts (same as if I was doing that part by hand), the end result is with in .25 for Grey and .48 for the 3D Luts, so better quality and easier/faster to run. Simply put I can afford to do it four times a year as I should rather than twice given the time savings.
Since the LG C8 is new I assume I will be doing every other weeks for the next 2 or 3 month until it settles in but given the minimal effort required I see no reason not to do so regularly. I'll be doing HDR10 and SDR for now since Dolby Vision is not possible using my pattern generator and I have nothing that needs it anyways. I have a Vertex, but given that Madvr can switch to HDR for patterns there is no need to use it to force HDR. A standalone pattern generator would be nice, but given the costs 500+, I'll stick with good old madvr which I use anyways for display.

ERIC

Wjboshart 05-18-2019 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by egandt (Post 58065762)
I'm using Calman Home Enthusiast, but same sets as LG Home. I have the C6 1000 meter and am using madvr's pattern generator since I use the HTPC for most viewing anyways and that way I can do HDR easily.



Since I'm Calman Home Enthusiast owner (bummer they did away with it) and use madvr I've been calibrating and then generating a 3D Lut for madvr for many years, however it has always been 3+ hours work twice a year to get it done and normally it got my Deltas to under 2, however using Autocal it took 20 minutes and then 3 hours to wait for the 3D luts (same as if I was doing that part by hand), the end result is with in .25 for Grey and .48 for the 3D Luts, so better quality and easier/faster to run. Simply put I can afford to do it four times a year as I should rather than twice given the time savings.

Since the LG C8 is new I assume I will be doing every other weeks for the next 2 or 3 month until it settles in but given the minimal effort required I see no reason not to do so regularly. I'll be doing HDR10 and SDR for now since Dolby Vision is not possible using my pattern generator and I have nothing that needs it anyways. I have a Vertex, but given that Madvr can switch to HDR for patterns there is no need to use it to force HDR. A standalone pattern generator would be nice, but given the costs 500+, I'll stick with good old madvr which I use anyways for display.



ERIC



You shouldn't have to recalibrate that frequently...these tvs don't drift to that extent. I calibrated mine after around 200 hours and didn't touch it again until I checked out lightspace a little before the .31 firmware update. At that time it was still tracking very close to my original calibration


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4klover 05-18-2019 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wjboshart (Post 58065652)
First foremost I would retry. If the meter had a delay wrong or read a wrong pattern that could be the case. There was a glitch in early autocal with the 2018 where everything would turn blue with hdr calibration


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

yeah tried again
still same issue
hope we can get a video tutorial soon

Wjboshart 05-18-2019 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4klover (Post 58066516)
yeah tried again

still same issue

hope we can get a video tutorial soon



So I can't really speculate for the 2019 model. But assuming it's similar to 2018 just without the need for an external generator, when you select Dolby vision in the hdr drop down and select dv, are you also changing the dv setting to relative before starting calibration? After the grayscale completes the 20pt you then do the config file (should be primaries and then a black and white) then make sure to load that file, don't know if it does that automatically for your set or if you still have to do it manually. as I said, not sure where that is in the workflow now for 2019 models, but that's how it worked with 2018. And then switch dv to absolute to measure post calibration


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WiFi-Spy 05-18-2019 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4klover (Post 58064268)
Hi everyone,

I'm looking to get help calibrate my c9 with calman home 2019

I calibrated hdr but I can't do dolby vision.

It turned out green after it was done.

It forced me to reset the TV.

Please guide me through It



Thanks



That was an LG firmware bug in the day 1 shipping FW, that has now been fixed in the latest fw release.

WiFi-Spy 05-18-2019 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wjboshart (Post 58066900)
So I can't really speculate for the 2019 model. But assuming it's similar to 2018 just without the need for an external generator, when you select Dolby vision in the hdr drop down and select dv, are you also changing the dv setting to relative before starting calibration? After the grayscale completes the 20pt you then do the config file (should be primaries and then a black and white) then make sure to load that file, don't know if it does that automatically for your set or if you still have to do it manually. as I said, not sure where that is in the workflow now for 2019 models, but that's how it worked with 2018. And then switch dv to absolute to measure post calibration


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Using the 2019 internal generator there is no need to change DV metadata. Because the generator is after the Dolby Vision block in the TV. So it’s always behaving like it is in “relative mode”.

egandt 05-19-2019 10:05 AM

What is Autocal doing?
 
7 Attachment(s)
What is Autocal doing?

This is calibrating a OLED C8, notice what happens around 15%:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...568722&thumb=1
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...568724&thumb=1
Up until 15% all is ok, from there on, it is seriously broken!, making Autocal less than useless.

Here is what the pattern looks like at 10% (sorry cell phone), but you can get the idea:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...568726&thumb=1
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...568738&thumb=1
basically anything under 15% is garbage.

Moving to the next step, is thus impossible as the mode (Expert Bright in this case is now trashed unless I reset the DCC.

Now I ran similar ones yesterday without much trouble, but currently Autocal is basically worthless (less so as the result is worse than not using it). I am on 04.10.55 which has a black crush, but that still can not explain Autocal setting 0% or near 0% Blue for one low measurement and red for the next. I tired a manual one at 10%, just to show that it is not the meter.


Now using the same everything but a manual run this is what it looks like. Again sorry for the cell phone pic, but you can get the idea:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...568744&thumb=1
10%, 5% and 0%:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...568758&thumb=1
So decent. not great, but decent and does not explain why Autocal goes blue/red crazy, it does show the the meter is working however.

I've tried settings from: LG 2018 OLED and SUHD Reference Guide and from the UI same results with both.

So unimpressed right now,
ERIC

chunon 05-19-2019 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by egandt (Post 58069122)
What is Autocal doing?



This is calibrating a OLED C8, notice what happens around 15%:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...568722&thumb=1

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...568724&thumb=1

Up until 15% all is ok, from there on, it is seriously broken!, making Autocal less than useless.



Here is what the pattern looks like at 10% (sorry cell phone), but you can get the idea:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...568726&thumb=1

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...568738&thumb=1

basically anything under 15% is garbage.



Moving to the next step, is thus impossible as the mode (Expert Bright in this case is now trashed unless I reset the DCC.



Now I ran similar ones yesterday without much trouble, but currently Autocal is basically worthless (less so as the result is worse than not using it). I am on 04.10.55 which has a black crush, but that still can not explain Autocal setting 0% or near 0% Blue for one low measurement and red for the next. I tired a manual one at 10%, just to show that it is not the meter.





Now using the same everything but a manual run this is what it looks like. Again sorry for the cell phone pic, but you can get the idea:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...568744&thumb=1

10%, 5% and 0%:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/attac...568758&thumb=1

So decent. not great, but decent and does not explain why Autocal goes blue/red crazy, it does show the the meter is working however.



So unimpressed right now,

ERIC



What setting are you using for the low light handler ? What is your pattern source and delay set at it ?


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egandt 05-19-2019 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chunon (Post 58069146)
What setting are you using for the low light handler ? What is your pattern source and delay set at it ?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Pattern is either madvr (preferred as it does HDR, and most content plays through madvr) or Calman client III (I like being able to select the pattern here for verification), I've tried using both. As for a delay it auto selects 0.25 when I choose optimize, however I normally use 1, as I never remember to do that, these were with 1 as a result.

I tried using no low light handler (normally this is fine except for HDR), I also tried 3 samples for under 1,3, and 5 cd/m all without any difference. I normally use 3 samples under 1 cd/m for HDR work, as I've found this works best, never needed it previously for SDR.


Edit: I noticed something looking and black once it finishes anything from 24 and down is solid black (not 16 and below as expected), leaving be only 28 and 32 so the Brightness is way off, in fact 28 is where I'd normally expect 16 (so by at least 8 to 12), which could possible explain the issue, but does not explain why Autocal set these so very-very low.

Thanks,
ERIC


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