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post #1 of 66 Old 07-15-2019, 09:48 AM - Thread Starter
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why do you all love accurate colors

this is something that has puzzled me for quite some time, peoples obsession with having accurate color calibrations, to me accurate colors are so dull that i can't stand them, i tried setting my sony af9 oled tv to cinema mode and everything ended up looking black and white, a clip of family guy wen't from vibrant popping to near monotone beige and you say this is what the creators intended especially for a show like family guy? accurate colors are only good for dark movies or shows that are meant to be dull there i can understand if someone wants it but for anything less i don't get it, i got the xperia 1 which is professionally calibrated and the screen was so dull compared to my xperia xz1, so why are people so obsessed about accurate calibration? when it comes to calibration i prefer everything as far away from accurate calibration as possible i mean my af9 oled has the color slider set to i think 80 or 90 with the color temp to cold, black adjust to high, why are people so against vibrant and popping colors? the display on the surface pro which is known for it's calibration was terrible to me, it also feels like people are shamed for liking vibrant colors and i don't understand why people like accurate colors so much for pure enoyment unless again you're watching a movie like the dark knight rises or anything dark like that with no colors
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post #2 of 66 Old 07-15-2019, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by zzcool View Post
this is something that has puzzled me for quite some time, peoples obsession with having accurate color calibrations, to me accurate colors are so dull that i can't stand them, i tried setting my sony af9 oled tv to cinema mode and everything ended up looking black and white, a clip of family guy wen't from vibrant popping to near monotone beige and you say this is what the creators intended especially for a show like family guy? accurate colors are only good for dark movies or shows that are meant to be dull there i can understand if someone wants it but for anything less i don't get it, i got the xperia 1 which is professionally calibrated and the screen was so dull compared to my xperia xz1, so why are people so obsessed about accurate calibration? when it comes to calibration i prefer everything as far away from accurate calibration as possible i mean my af9 oled has the color slider set to i think 80 or 90 with the color temp to cold, black adjust to high, why are people so against vibrant and popping colors? the display on the surface pro which is known for it's calibration was terrible to me, it also feels like people are shamed for liking vibrant colors and i don't understand why people like accurate colors so much for pure enoyment unless again you're watching a movie like the dark knight rises or anything dark like that with no colors
HI zzcool,

Many A/V enthusiasts strive to reproduce content as close to what the Director/Creator intended. That's all there is to the Calibration movement you mention. Here is the thing. We are not all the same. Set your gear the way that makes you happy and get the most enjoyment from. In the end its about Entertainment. If you like Bold Color and Pop that is great. I do enjoy extra color in some cases as well. Do what makes you happy and don't look back.

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post #3 of 66 Old 07-15-2019, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by zzcool View Post
this is something that has puzzled me for quite some time, peoples obsession with having accurate color calibrations, to me accurate colors are so dull that i can't stand them, i tried setting my sony af9 oled tv to cinema mode and everything ended up looking black and white, a clip of family guy wen't from vibrant popping to near monotone beige and you say this is what the creators intended especially for a show like family guy? accurate colors are only good for dark movies or shows that are meant to be dull there i can understand if someone wants it but for anything less i don't get it, i got the xperia 1 which is professionally calibrated and the screen was so dull compared to my xperia xz1, so why are people so obsessed about accurate calibration? when it comes to calibration i prefer everything as far away from accurate calibration as possible i mean my af9 oled has the color slider set to i think 80 or 90 with the color temp to cold, black adjust to high, why are people so against vibrant and popping colors? the display on the surface pro which is known for it's calibration was terrible to me, it also feels like people are shamed for liking vibrant colors and i don't understand why people like accurate colors so much for pure enoyment unless again you're watching a movie like the dark knight rises or anything dark like that with no colors
The pursuit of accuracy is to match the output of a specific display to that of a reference mastering display. Content creators and mastering colorists work in tandem to create a work of art in order for viewers to consume the content the way it was intended.

If the image looks dull or not pleasing to your eyes, then there may be reasons for that.

1. The most common reason is years of watching overly bright and/or saturated content on improperly configured displays. This has caused a skewed perception on what content should look like. Retraining your perception takes practice and time.

2. The display you are referring to is improperly configured. Sometimes even professional calibrations can be messed up. Also there should be different picture modes based on lighting.

3. If you suffer from any kind of visual impairment then it can prevent you from seeing the content as it was intended.

4. The display may be defective. Not very common, but a possibility.
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post #4 of 66 Old 07-15-2019, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by zzcool View Post
this is something that has puzzled me for quite some time, peoples obsession with having accurate color calibrations...........
This "sticky" thread from the opening page of this section of the forum should help clarify this discussion:


'Display Calibration: Root Fundamentals'

https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/show....php?t=1021933


If you don't complain about commercial cinema images, you shouldn't have problems with a correctly calibrated video display system.
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post #5 of 66 Old 07-15-2019, 11:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by GeorgeAB View Post
This "sticky" thread from the opening page of this section of the forum should help clarify this discussion:


'Display Calibration: Root Fundamentals'

https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/show....php?t=1021933


If you don't complain about commercial cinema images, you shouldn't have problems with a correctly calibrated video display system.
i have not been to the cinema since i think 2007
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post #6 of 66 Old 07-15-2019, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zzcool View Post
this is something that has puzzled me for quite some time, peoples obsession with having accurate color calibrations, to me accurate colors are so dull that i can't stand them, i tried setting my sony af9 oled tv to cinema mode and everything ended up looking black and white, a clip of family guy wen't from vibrant popping to near monotone beige and you say this is what the creators intended especially for a show like family guy? accurate colors are only good for dark movies or shows that are meant to be dull there i can understand if someone wants it but for anything less i don't get it, i got the xperia 1 which is professionally calibrated and the screen was so dull compared to my xperia xz1, so why are people so obsessed about accurate calibration? when it comes to calibration i prefer everything as far away from accurate calibration as possible i mean my af9 oled has the color slider set to i think 80 or 90 with the color temp to cold, black adjust to high, why are people so against vibrant and popping colors? the display on the surface pro which is known for it's calibration was terrible to me, it also feels like people are shamed for liking vibrant colors and i don't understand why people like accurate colors so much for pure enoyment unless again you're watching a movie like the dark knight rises or anything dark like that with no colors
I like movies and watch a lot of them. Much time, money and artistic talent goes into creating the visuals of a movie (usually). Why would I want to watch a distorted version of those visuals?
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post #7 of 66 Old 07-15-2019, 08:01 PM
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I can't imagine dropping the kind of cash for the most accurate display in the country (counting A9F/A9G as one here) and hating color accuracy so much. Should have bought a Vizio Quantum X in that case, so you can have light cannon of color.
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post #8 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 05:34 AM
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Plenty of people want image and even motion on TV to look different from what they see in the real world. Nothing wrong with that. Makes you a odd person though..,
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post #9 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 06:22 AM
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post #10 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 06:43 AM
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24fps is not real world motion.
I am not shure how you can say that. How do you know if minimize real world motion to TV size it will not look lots like real word for the most part? Shurely there is higher frame rate which is close to reality but aside from fast motion content does it even matter? It is definitely closer to reality than SOE motion which what the weird color folks also seem to like.

Important to me is that when i step out of the TV screen so to speak after watching a 24fps motion movie on my Plasma, back into the real world, it does not feel like stepping back in a different sort of reality which was the case with my 2008 LCD TV at times.
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post #11 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 06:51 AM
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Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post
I am not shure how you can say that. How do you know if minimize real world motion to TV size it will not look lots like real word for the most part? Shurely there is higher frame rate which is close to reality but aside from fast motion content does it even matter? It is definitely closer to reality than SOE motion which what the weird color folks also seem to like.

Important to me is that when i step out of the TV screen so to speak after watching a 24fps motion movie on my Plasma, back into the real world, it does not feel like stepping back in a different sort of reality which was the case with my 2008 LCD TV at times.
SOE does look closer to reality. 24fps is so choppy and makes it hard to focus on the actual content. Heck I can see the difference between 60fps and 120fps.
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post #12 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 06:53 AM
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I can understand people choosing accuracy (reference over preference).

I can understand people choosing some degree of inaccuracy in order to address subjective dis/likes (preference over reference).

I cannot understand people deliberately choosing maximum inaccuracy.

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post #13 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 07:59 AM - Thread Starter
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I can understand people choosing accuracy (reference over preference).

I can understand people choosing some degree of inaccuracy in order to address subjective dis/likes (preference over reference).

I cannot understand people deliberately choosing maximum inaccuracy.
well to me accurate colors simply look way too dull ifi change to the cinema mode in a nice and colorful game suddenly it goes gray how can anyone like that? one situation where i prefered the original color was when i hooked up a laptop to my w905a sony tv watching chernobyl the atmosphere got more green indoor with the laptop where it was more blue white on my tv but the difference was so small that it was hard to care but again that was a show meant to have depressing colors so some media i do understand the need for accurate colors and thats simply media that is meant to be dull or dark like horror movies maybe thrillers or anything like that, take something really bright and colorful and it will be awful to my eyes with an accurate calibration are you telling me the authors intended for it to be nearly gray?
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post #14 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 08:05 AM
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Well, I used to think Saving Pte Ryan and the HBO series Band of Brothers looked too drab and dull for a modern action movie. Then after a few more viewings, I began to appreciate what the shows were about... they weren't just summer blockbusters with the maximum bullet count and dead bodies. They told a story, of people from the greatest generation, who did hard things, brave things and sacrificed much, and the color scheme was part of the canvas on which the story was told. From then, I appreciated the extra effort to make the colors as they were.

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post #15 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 08:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zzcool
… i do understand the need for accurate colors and thats simply media that is meant to be dull or dark like horror movies maybe thrillers or anything like that …
I honestly don't understand why you think accuracy doesn't apply to bright scenes or vivid colours. If it's accurate, it's accurate regardless of how bright/colourful or dark/dull the content is.

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… take something really bright and colorful and it will be awful to my eyes with an accurate calibration are you telling me the authors intended for it to be nearly gray?
If the display is working properly and the calibration is accurate I would say, yes, the authors intended the content to be nearly gray. A good calibration is about objective accuracy, not subjective preference.

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post #16 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 08:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by eljaycanuck View Post
I honestly don't understand why you think accuracy doesn't apply to bright scenes or vivid colours. If it's accurate, it's accurate regardless of how bright/colourful or dark/dull the content is.


If the display is working properly and the calibration is accurate I would say, yes, the authors intended the content to be nearly gray. A good calibration is about objective accuracy, not subjective preference.
if the creators of family guy intended the show to be nearly gray compared to the vibrant colors that i am used to when seeing an episode then i would say i very much prefer my take on it than theirs or any other animated show for that matter, i don't watch family guy but it's a great example.
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post #17 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 08:44 AM
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Originally Posted by zzcool
if the creators of family guy intended the show to be nearly gray compared to the vibrant colors that i am used to when seeing an episode then i would say i very much prefer my take on it than theirs …
Fair enough. No-one will ever prevent you from choosing the settings you prefer.
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post #18 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 08:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by eljaycanuck View Post
Fair enough. No-one will ever prevent you from choosing the settings you prefer.
i just don't understand why people are shamed for it, i'd love to see a movie created to be vibrant on accurate displays but i feel most media isn't colorgraded past dull colors for some reason, i feel like i am truly in the minority when it comes to preferring vibrant popping colors, as for the person who said i shouldn't buy a sony af9 oled for it, oled doesn't have the issue where colors go nearly white at high brightness, the lg c8 was also pretty bad in picture quality compared to the af9 oled, just because i prefer a vibrant calibration doesn't mean i am not picky, back when i used crt trinitron monitors such as the sony fw900 i couldn't stand a color temp less than 11k
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post #19 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 08:59 AM
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When you watch alone in a room, nobody is coming to nag you what kind of settings you are running and what kind of videos you are watching. I like accuracy but i dont follow it to the letter, you are never fully recreating the creators intent no matter how accurately you're running your tv or projector in your room. I choose the most accurate picture preset, but enhance some settings instead of using the default ones. You dont want to enhance color too much to result in rgb clipping or enhance sharpness too much to introduce ringing noise all over the screen, a little boosted color and sharpness though is fine for some extra punch and not affecting accuracy in any significant way.

When i play music, it's a generally held belief if you engage tone controls -bass/treble on your sound processor driving your loudspeakers and change either of them from their default 0 values, you move away from the original recording as it was meant to be heard, but i still engage treble +1.
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Originally Posted by zzcool View Post
i just don't understand why people are shamed for it, i'd love to see a movie created to be vibrant on accurate displays but i feel most media isn't colorgraded past dull colors for some reason, i feel like i am truly in the minority when it comes to preferring vibrant popping colors, as for the person who said i shouldn't buy a sony af9 oled for it, oled doesn't have the issue where colors go nearly white at high brightness, the lg c8 was also pretty bad in picture quality compared to the af9 oled, just because i prefer a vibrant calibration doesn't mean i am not picky, back when i used crt trinitron monitors such as the sony fw900 i couldn't stand a color temp less than 11k
Nobody is shaming you, you spent money on your video display and you are the boss on how you prefer to run it. People can only suggest you or disagree about running a display inaccurately, but nothing more.
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post #22 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 09:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zzcool View Post
i just don't understand why people are shamed for it, i'd love to see a movie created to be vibrant on accurate displays but i feel most media isn't colorgraded past dull colors for some reason, i feel like i am truly in the minority when it comes to preferring vibrant popping colors, as for the person who said i shouldn't buy a sony af9 oled for it, oled doesn't have the issue where colors go nearly white at high brightness, the lg c8 was also pretty bad in picture quality compared to the af9 oled, just because i prefer a vibrant calibration doesn't mean i am not picky, back when i used crt trinitron monitors such as the sony fw900 i couldn't stand a color temp less than 11k
No one has shamed you. When you come into an area of the forum in which most of the members are seeking to make their displays more accurate and realistic for the content they watch (let's face it, pen-and-ink animation ISN'T realistic) and make the flat statements you did, you are going to get some backlash. You are adjusting to personal taste, which is all well and good. But you aren't going to convince anyone here of the "rightness" of your cause, nor does it sound as if you are going to be convinced otherwise. Time to move on...

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post #23 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 09:42 AM
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Every TV I have owned has been too bright, too contrasty and oversaturated at factory settings. I can not imagine cranking them up even more. When properly adjusted, I want my set to look natural, not like a cartoon.
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Originally Posted by skschatzman View Post
SOE does look closer to reality.
Fake frames in between real frames is motion smoothing. I am pretty shure that reality motion does not look like that, nothing smooth about it, on this planet..maybe on mars
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Originally Posted by skschatzman
24fps is so choppy and makes it hard to focus on the actual content.
You are exaggerating here..hardly see choppyness on my Plasma..watch at least 6 blu-rays a week. If you are that motion sensitiv you should buy screen tech with fast motion response or try the fake frames solution.
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post #25 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 12:07 PM
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Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post
Fake frames in between real frames is motion smoothing. I am pretty shure that reality motion does not look like that, nothing smooth about it, on this planet..maybe on mars
You are exaggerating here..hardly see choppyness on my Plasma..watch at least 6 blu-rays a week. If you are that motion sensitiv you should buy screen tech with fast motion response or try the fake frames solution.
Perception is relative. Just because you aren't sensative to 24fps motion choppiness, doesn't mean others aren't. The interpolation fake frames definitely improves realistic movements. The only bad side effect of this is occasional artifacts, but is much less distracting than choppy frames. No exaggeration. I play FPS shooters all the time and have grown accustomed to high FPS. Put me in front of a monitor with 60hz or 120hz and I will be able to tell you which one is active 100% of the time. 24fps is extremely easy for me to see without interpolation.
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post #26 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by zzcool View Post
this is something that has puzzled me for quite some time, peoples obsession with having accurate color calibrations, to me accurate colors are so dull that i can't stand them, i tried setting my sony af9 oled tv to cinema mode and everything ended up looking black and white, a clip of family guy wen't from vibrant popping to near monotone beige and you say this is what the creators intended especially for a show like family guy? accurate colors are only good for dark movies or shows that are meant to be dull there i can understand if someone wants it but for anything less i don't get it, i got the xperia 1 which is professionally calibrated and the screen was so dull compared to my xperia xz1, so why are people so obsessed about accurate calibration? when it comes to calibration i prefer everything as far away from accurate calibration as possible i mean my af9 oled has the color slider set to i think 80 or 90 with the color temp to cold, black adjust to high, why are people so against vibrant and popping colors? the display on the surface pro which is known for it's calibration was terrible to me, it also feels like people are shamed for liking vibrant colors and i don't understand why people like accurate colors so much for pure enoyment unless again you're watching a movie like the dark knight rises or anything dark like that with no colors
Ultimately it is about recreating the picture as the directors intended. Most people prefer it, some don't, to each their own. I fall between both camps personally. I have never had my TV's professionally calibrated but used the basic calibration from the Disney World of Wonder DVD to do a little simple calibration.
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post #27 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 12:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Ultimately it is about recreating the picture as the directors intended. Most people prefer it, some don't, to each their own. I fall between both camps personally. I have never had my TV's professionally calibrated but used the basic calibration from the Disney World of Wonder DVD to do a little simple calibration.
i understand that i guess i am trying to understand what makes accurate colors so much better and why most media looks dull to me like if something is meant to look super vibrant then putting a vibrant calibration ontop of that will make it look even better if it is meant to be vibrant i can only as i said understand proper calibration for real life movies but not anywhere else such as games,ui such as windows, or animation
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post #28 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by zzcool View Post
i understand that i guess i am trying to understand what makes accurate colors so much better and why most media looks dull to me like if something is meant to look super vibrant then putting a vibrant calibration ontop of that will make it look even better if it is meant to be vibrant i can only as i said understand proper calibration for real life movies but not anywhere else such as games,ui such as windows, or animation
Well it really boils down to the fact you prefer vibrant colors, even though they are not accurate. One of the simple things I always heard was take a color photograph of something doesn't matter what. Say from a magazine or something, display that on your screen, and then adjust the colors until they match the actual picture your holding. True to many people a properly calibrated display doesn't have that huge pop and vibrant colors. The problem is MOST people outside AVS and similar forums, have been watching tv's that were never adjusted out of the box, which is almost always with the brightness and color levels to high. IF that is your "reference" that your used to, then no a calibrated TV won't look as good to YOU, even IF that is a more "accurate" picture. People here are chasing after THEIR perfection, be it a perfect picture or perfect sound etc. Keep in mind, this is AVS, having a 12' square room with 8+ 15" subs is NORMAL around here.
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post #29 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 01:30 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by liffie420 View Post
Well it really boils down to the fact you prefer vibrant colors, even though they are not accurate. One of the simple things I always heard was take a color photograph of something doesn't matter what. Say from a magazine or something, display that on your screen, and then adjust the colors until they match the actual picture your holding. True to many people a properly calibrated display doesn't have that huge pop and vibrant colors. The problem is MOST people outside AVS and similar forums, have been watching tv's that were never adjusted out of the box, which is almost always with the brightness and color levels to high. IF that is your "reference" that your used to, then no a calibrated TV won't look as good to YOU, even IF that is a more "accurate" picture. People here are chasing after THEIR perfection, be it a perfect picture or perfect sound etc. Keep in mind, this is AVS, having a 12' square room with 8+ 15" subs is NORMAL around here.
i understand what you mean, i am though a display enthusiast like everyone else i am extremely picky when it comes to panel technology i skipped led entirely because it wasn't good enough for me i would never buy a gaming monitor as they are trash to me antiglare is one of the things i hate the most out of everything, led is overlal trash to me with an exception for my w905a which to this day still is remarkable for movies and shows, i fell in love with oled and i use that as a pc monitor, picture quality matters but i prefer cold and vibrant colors, i also can't stand warm colors thats even worse than dull colors as it gets a yellow hue that i just can't stand, i tried it i just couldn't handle using it for very long, the sony xperia 1 is calibrated it's what it's known for and i still prefered the ips of the xperia xz1 with supervivid mode enabled, i ended up sending the xperia 1 back one of the reasons being lack of super vividmode, so personally i see myself as a picture enthusiast like everyone else on this forum just in a different way, in real life when i pointed my camera towards a white car i actually prefered the white on the phone rather than what i was seeing as what i was seeing was just less white, but when it comes to grass when using my xperia 1 the grass actually looked duller than what i was seeing when taking a photo.
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post #30 of 66 Old 07-16-2019, 01:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zzcool View Post
i just don't understand why people are shamed for it, i'd love to see a movie created to be vibrant on accurate displays but i feel most media isn't colorgraded past dull colors for some reason, i feel like i am truly in the minority when it comes to preferring vibrant popping colors, as for the person who said i shouldn't buy a sony af9 oled for it, oled doesn't have the issue where colors go nearly white at high brightness, the lg c8 was also pretty bad in picture quality compared to the af9 oled, just because i prefer a vibrant calibration doesn't mean i am not picky, back when i used crt trinitron monitors such as the sony fw900 i couldn't stand a color temp less than 11k
No one is shaming you....but you have to expect members to (passionately) disagree with your position. You are posting on a HT hobbyist website. The goal for most enthusiasts is to recreate what the artist intended the viewer to see (and hear). Another way to state it is creating ("a quality") theater experience at home.
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