Sony S1500/ S3500 / S4500 / S5500 / S6500 Blu-ray players - Page 66 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1951 of 2244 Old 09-12-2016, 09:55 AM
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Hey all,

Was wondering if I could get some feedback here. I've been experimenting with my setup to join legacy and current tech enology together for more compatibility.

My new approach is to take the optical out from the Panasonic TV and run it into my optical / coax to analog converter. The sound bar I use does have an optical in, but can only receive a PCM inputer, the TV can only output DD 5.1 over the optical out.

While running the TV optical out into the converter optical in and then red and white analog from converter out to sound bar in works, I've noticed a few device behavior differences.

When using the Roku, i get a slight pop before the video stream starts, but once started, audio is crips and clear.

On the sony blu-ray BDP-S6500, it only makes a couple pops while the unit powers up and negotiates it's connections, then once up and running no ops before each stream. The pops mentioned here are the kind you'd here when sound hardware is changing formats.

I was curious if there was a way i could eliminate all the pops in change, or if this is just a normal part in having to do a digital to analog conversion ? Thanks

P.S. This is my ideal plan for setup right now because I want to keep the sound bart I have as i'm really happy with it's sound, and this eliminates having to change inputs on the sound bart for each device and anything connected to the TV will automatically come out sound bar instead of the TV speakers. Just trying to clean it up as much as possible, and like i said, it's not bad, I just notice the little pops during transitions, not content playback itself.
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post #1952 of 2244 Old 09-12-2016, 10:49 AM
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You might find one of these useful. I was able to use my mitz dlp tv with the latest hdmi devices.

I use this one to connect all my hdmi devices to my tv and send the audio to a sound bar optically.

Provides the best audio and video quality for the connected devices.

https://www.jtechdigital.com/video-a...ntrol-5x1.html
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post #1953 of 2244 Old 09-12-2016, 11:32 AM
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You might find one of these useful. I was able to use my mitz dlp tv with the latest hdmi devices.

I use this one to connect all my hdmi devices to my tv and send the audio to a sound bar optically.

Provides the best audio and video quality for the connected devices.

https://www.jtechdigital.com/video-a...ntrol-5x1.html
Thanks wolf, I 'll take that into consideration. I was wondering if there was a simper device the only digital input into the sound bar is optical the other two are analog, but it can only accept PCM be it analog or digital. I was curious if there was a device that stayed optical all the way through for example that would take the DD output from the TV's optical out and output optical PCM for the sound bar. That's the only reason I can't use the tv directly connected to the sound bar. . So I don't even need a digital to analog converter here. just a DD to PCM converter. Since I only have two devices on the TV, this would be an easier solution. simply passing the DD output to PCM to make the tv compatible with the sound bar. The only other solution, is to get a new sound bar that can take DD in. which is a last resort.
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post #1954 of 2244 Old 09-12-2016, 11:59 AM
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Thanks wolf, I 'll take that into consideration. I was wondering if there was a simper device the only digital input into the sound bar is optical the other two are analog, but it can only accept PCM be it analog or digital. I was curious if there was a device that stayed optical all the way through for example that would take the DD output from the TV's optical out and output optical PCM for the sound bar. That's the only reason I can't use the tv directly connected to the sound bar. . So I don't even need a digital to analog converter here. just a DD to PCM converter. Since I only have two devices on the TV, this would be an easier solution. simply passing the DD output to PCM to make the tv compatible with the sound bar. The only other solution, is to get a new sound bar that can take DD in. which is a last resort.
What make and model is the sound bar?.
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post #1955 of 2244 Old 09-12-2016, 12:03 PM
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What make and model is the sound bar?.
I don't remember the exact model since it's a few years old now, but it's a VIZIO HD sound bar it has virtual surround 3 inputs, 2 analog and one optical. Was about 100 bucks when i bought it at walmart probably about 3 or 4 years ago. maybe 5 now. It also has an output for a powered subwoofer as well, but i've never used one. It's about 40 or 42 inches it's about the same length as my TV
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post #1956 of 2244 Old 09-12-2016, 12:31 PM
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Being a newer sound bar. It should be able to handle a dts or dolby audio signal.

You would be better off sending the audio directly to the soundbar from the source. Usual when you use the tv optical out its not going to provide the best audio. Depends on tv, there maybe some.

To simple test this. Just hook the optical out of the sony 6500 directly to your sound bar.

Play a dts master hd bluray and a dolby true hd bluray.

With the above jtech audio extractor I play blurays every night. Dts master hd 5.1 dolby true hd 5.1, even 7.1.

My sound bar is a dts and dolby digital 5.1. I have never had it not playback an audio source. It sounds the best it can be.

I'm not saying i'm getting lossless audio cause i'm not. Optical cant pass the entire lossless audio bandwidth.

But i am getting the best possible sound you can from a bluray with hd audio passed to the soundbar.

Give it a try with the sony directly to the soundbar.

Goodluck
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post #1957 of 2244 Old 09-12-2016, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by LNEWoLF View Post
Being a newer sound bar. It should be able to handle a dts or dolby audio signal.

You would be better off sending the audio directly to the soundbar from the source. Usual when you use the tv optical out its not going to provide the best audio. Depends on tv, there maybe some.

To simple test this. Just hook the optical out of the sony 6500 directly to your sound bar.

Play a dts master hd bluray and a dolby true hd bluray.

With the above jtech audio extractor I play blurays every night. Dts master hd 5.1 dolby true hd 5.1, even 7.1.

My sound bar is a dts and dolby digital 5.1. I have never had it not playback an audio source. It sounds the best it can be.

I'm not saying i'm getting lossless audio cause i'm not. Optical cant pass the entire lossless audio bandwidth.

But i am getting the best possible sound you can from a bluray with hd audio passed to the soundbar.

Give it a try with the sony directly to the soundbar.

Goodluck
The sony doesn't have optical, it has digital coax out, which is why i needed to get the coax to analog adapter box to begin with so i could connect the sony to the sound bar. The only device I have that has optical out is the Roku 4, and connected directly to the sound bar works fine. The reason I was going to try and connect the TV out to the sound Bar was because3 i've been considering buying an AppleTV since i have mostly apple products, and the latest generation, only has HDMI out. I tried to find the soundBar on amazon and walmart, and it's no longer listed. If i had to guess I probably got it back between 2009 and 2011. This particular sound bar can ONLY take PCM input signals it was specifically mentioned in the manual. I had shoved the sound bar under my bed for a few years because I had decided just to use the TV speakers for a while because they aren't horrible, I just wanted more range, but not a full 5.1 setup.

I had considered using Airplay if i got an apple TV i have installed an airplay receiver on my Linux based media server, and it's connected to gigabit ethernet, and the AppleTV (if i got one ) would be connected to the same switch. I just wanted to try the direct connection option first. While it works fine while sound is playing, it's just the few seconds while a device is initialing I hear the little pops. I had pretty much given up on home theater while i have lived in apartments because i don't have the same control over the property as I would with a house, so I just felt it wasn't worth investing in at this point. That's why i've been trying to stay simple, but also nice at the same time.
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post #1958 of 2244 Old 09-12-2016, 01:10 PM
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I understand, all I can suggest is that jtech.

Would allow you to plug all/any of your hdmi devices into it. Then use the optical out to the optical input on the sound bar.

Good luck...

I do recall reading somewhere about the pop you are describing. Some manual that stated you may experience a loud pop.
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post #1959 of 2244 Old 09-12-2016, 01:27 PM
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I understand, all I can suggest is that jtech.

Would allow you to plug all/any of your hdmi devices into it. Then use the optical out to the optical input on the sound bar.

Good luck...

I do recall reading somewhere about the pop you are describing. Some manual that stated you may experience a loud pop.
Wolf,
Just an update, I returned the setup to how it was, the ROKU directly connected to the optical in on the sound bar, and the sony BDP-S6500 connected by coax to the coax to analog adapter, and then the analog outs to the sound bar. The pooping is gone. The pop only showed up when connected to the TV's optical out. Part of it may have to do with the TV being a Plasma TV and it having high voltage inside, and the optical out being sensitive to that high voltage when things change.

It's also possible because the TV doesn't natively support PCM out it's optical out, being forced could cause feedback. If connections get too hard to manage Then i'll have to look for a new sound bar maybe so more current devices can be connected directly, but for now it seems like i've found stable middle ground. Thanks for the help I'll continue to do search and keep the thread updated.
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post #1960 of 2244 Old 09-12-2016, 01:47 PM
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Glad you got rid of the pop....

I recently p/u a new yamaha ats1060 soundbar with hdmi input from costco for 150.

I enjoy allot of the older movies from the 30, 40, 50, 60 and 70. just wanted to have better clarity and bass than tv speakers can provide. Without using the AVR. Haven't opened the box yet.

Currently working on atmos speaker logistics in my head

Take care..........
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post #1961 of 2244 Old 09-12-2016, 03:58 PM
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Glad you got rid of the pop....

I recently p/u a new yamaha ats1060 soundbar with hdmi input from costco for 150.

I enjoy allot of the older movies from the 30, 40, 50, 60 and 70. just wanted to have better clarity and bass than tv speakers can provide. Without using the AVR. Haven't opened the box yet.

Currently working on atmos speaker logistics in my head

Take care..........

Thanks, you too. I took apart the wired network and cleaned up the home theater area and cabling, now it looks so much nicer and clean! It's been a productive evening / afternoon.
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post #1962 of 2244 Old 09-14-2016, 07:55 AM
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@LNEWoLF I replaced the sounder today because I was tired of dealing with adapters. The new One is a Vizio as well, and it can accept current signals . I was able to connect the new one directly to the TV optical out and it's working beautifully. It also has a Coax in so if i wanted to listen to a CD from the BDP directly i can. It has a red and white port, a 35" and a powered subwoofer out.

It cost me 100 bucks, but to use something that will play nicer with my setup without adapters makes it much more worth it, it also contains bluetooth as an added bonus .

Anyway Just wanted to let you know i upgraded my audio, so now I'll be good for several more years. Even if the future blu-ray players ditch coax out, I can still get sound because it supports the optical out from the TV so anything connected to the TV will come out.
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post #1963 of 2244 Old 09-14-2016, 08:09 AM
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@LNEWoLF I replaced the sounder today because I was tired of dealing with adapters. The new One is a Vizio as well, and it can accept current signals . I was able to connect the new one directly to the TV optical out and it's working beautifully. It also has a Coax in so if i wanted to listen to a CD from the BDP directly i can. It has a red and white port, a 35" and a powered subwoofer out.

It cost me 100 bucks, but to use something that will play nicer with my setup without adapters makes it much more worth it, it also contains bluetooth as an added bonus .

Anyway Just wanted to let you know i upgraded my audio, so now I'll be good for several more years. Even if the future blu-ray players ditch coax out, I can still get sound because it supports the optical out from the TV so anything connected to the TV will come out.
There ya go, upgrading is always a good thing. Brings many smiles. Good to hear your enjoying your new setup.

Careful though upgrading can be addictive. Before you know what happend you'll have a new 4k tv and a full blown Dolby Atmos and DTS X 7.2.4 system.
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post #1964 of 2244 Old 09-14-2016, 08:24 AM
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There ya go, upgrading is always a good thing. Brings many smiles. Good to hear your enjoying your new setup.

Careful though upgrading can be addictive. Before you know what happend you'll have a new 4k tv and a full blown Dolby Atmos and DTS X 7.2.4 system.
Yep, that's true, though I have set limits on how much i'll invest in while in the apartment, and the 4k TVB will ONLY come when the Plasma TV dies. Plasma is something zI want to hang onto as long as I can.

This was a reasonable upgrade though. It avoids adapters, and keeps cable count low. The only thing I might add to it is an external Sub to make it a 2.1 setup instead of 2.0, but the 2.0 sounds great. It actually sounds better then the old sound

Hopefully for now this was the better choice, to avoid adapters.
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post #1965 of 2244 Old 09-15-2016, 11:55 AM
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Hey all, Now that things are stable, and the new hardware is functioning as expected, there is one thing I wanted to double check on. Since the TV outputs Dolby from it's optical out, and the new sound bar is able to receive the signal directly without a convert anymore. I was wondering for devices like the sony blu-ray player or any other device with a supported connection such as coaxial, is there any advantage at this point to connect it directly to the supported connection on the sound bar, or would the same signal the sound bar would receive directly still get transmitted from the HDMI connection to the TV and then out the digital out. I know the HD codecs won't be natively played, but as far as Dolby 5.1 being played as Dolby 2.0 be good to go?

The sound bar is 2.0 with the option for an external sub which would make it 2.1.

So far everything is working great and I haven't had any issues so far with leaving the sound bar on the optical input and letting the devices change the TV input for their connection and getting audio. This has really saved me a lot of unnecessary extra cables / connections. I have even been able to remove the digital to analog audio converter since the direct connection works now.

Thanks for the help and feedback, it's helped bring my setup up to date for what I want at the time being. One other thing this should help with is not limiting what devices I can get as long as it can connect to the TV.
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post #1966 of 2244 Old 09-15-2016, 12:56 PM
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So far everything is working great and I haven't had any issues so far with leaving the sound bar on the optical input and letting the devices change the TV input for their connection and getting audio. This has really saved me a lot of unnecessary extra cables / connections. I have even been able to remove the digital to analog audio converter since the direct connection works now.

Thanks for the help and feedback, it's helped bring my setup up to date for what I want at the time being. One other thing this should help with is not limiting what devices I can get as long as it can connect to the TV.
If there are no audio sync problems, and the TV output passes everything you need, I don't see that it matters.

I have an AVR with a few inputs. So I can use the TV's optical or the HDMI from any device. Since I have an S6500, TiVo, Roku 3 I just use the TV's output to test stuff. My TV doesn't pass DD+ or DD EX, and I seldom use it. But it's nice to have a second opinion sometimes.
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post #1967 of 2244 Old 09-15-2016, 01:05 PM
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If there are no audio sync problems, and the TV output passes everything you need, I don't see that it matters.

I have an AVR with a few inputs. So I can use the TV's optical or the HDMI from any device. Since I have an S6500, TiVo, Roku 3 I just use the TV's output to test stuff. My TV doesn't pass DD+ or DD EX, and I seldom use it. But it's nice to have a second opinion sometimes.
Hey Joe,
There is only one very minor audio problem I've experienced, but it's with just plain audio, not any kind of video content.

It happens on both ROKU 4 and Sony what happens is when i start say, an mp3 file there is a 1 second delay before I hear the audio. the only happens on the initial start, and with the sony i can hit back and the first second plays. Anything else, Netflix DVD blu-ray etc all play fine with no delay. Dos you think this might be a TV issue since TVs are not used to dealing with just audio, or is this a device issue i might be able to tweak with delay settings?

Everything on a whole is great i just need to seem to turn up tiny glitches like this if possible.
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post #1968 of 2244 Old 09-15-2016, 02:17 PM
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Hey Joe,
There is only one very minor audio problem I've experienced, but it's with just plain audio, not any kind of video content.

It happens on both ROKU 4 and Sony what happens is when i start say, an mp3 file there is a 1 second delay before I hear the audio. the only happens on the initial start, and with the sony i can hit back and the first second plays. Anything else, Netflix DVD blu-ray etc all play fine with no delay. Dos you think this might be a TV issue since TVs are not used to dealing with just audio, or is this a device issue i might be able to tweak with delay settings?

Everything on a whole is great i just need to seem to turn up tiny glitches like this if possible.
I'm far from an expert with this stuff. If you were using an AVR I would say to watch the LED display. I have audio delays all the time, even some audio dropouts when things change from DD 2.0 to DD 5.1, but I can live with them. A chronic problem is worth looking for a reason. Something that doesn't bother you is just a discussion item. Be happy. It's easier.
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post #1969 of 2244 Old 09-15-2016, 02:19 PM
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I'm far from an expert with this stuff. If you were using an AVR I would say to watch the LED display. I have audio delays all the time, even some audio dropouts when things change from DD 2.0 to DD 5.1, but I can live with them. A chronic problem is worth looking for a reason. Something that doesn't bother you is just a discussion item. Be happy. It's easier.
You're right, it's nothing to complain about. The delay is only as long as it takes to say the word "it's"

thanks for the help
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post #1970 of 2244 Old 09-15-2016, 04:50 PM
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I did some more digging into my situation and wanted to post some information I discovered that others might find useful to consider.

I was trying to figure out why the sony and ROKU 4 were having a couple second delay when playing any kind of music or audio only stream. It wasn't that big a deal, and it was not a problem to live with. However I do like to solve problems and am not willing to settle of a half answer if there is a better full answer to be found.

Here is what I discovered in my testing. When I plugged my 2016 ROKU streaming stick into the TV with the sound bar connected and ran through my audio testing, the delay was gone completely. Then I moved onto the sony BDP-S6500, and connected the coaxial out from the player to the sound bar's coaxial in. Then switched to the appropriate input. Tried some music files and streaming such as my amazon music library and pandora, and the delay was also gone there as well.

Here is the facts I used to come to my conclusion, Both the ROKU 4, and Sony have alternative audio outputs, where the ROKU streaming stick only has HDMI out. It would appear , that running the optical from the TV's output to the sound Bar's input and receiving audio from any device with an alternative audio out besides HDMI was causing either a hardware or software, or even both conflict.

Changing the connection to the device's dedicated audio out resolved this conflict..

Conclusion, I would conclude that the device with HDMI only didn't have the issue was because there was no other source to handle audio decoding, and switching to the dedicated audio connection solved the problem because it eliminated the audio trying to be decoded by multiple sources and pushed it through the device's dedicated audio out.

Hope someone finds this helpful in troubleshooting their own issues. Have a great day!
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post #1971 of 2244 Old 09-22-2016, 06:15 AM
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Do S6500 and S7200 have the Motionflow function, like S790?
I never had a S790, and don't have the S7200, but there is nothing I can find in the S6500. That function is in my Sony televisions. You can check the book:
https://docs.sony.com/release//Manual_4571032111.pdf
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post #1972 of 2244 Old 09-22-2016, 06:32 AM
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I never had a S790, and don't have the S7200, but there is nothing I can find in the S6500. That function is in my Sony televisions. You can check the book:
https://docs.sony.com/release//Manual_4571032111.pdf
Thanks JoeKustra. Sorry, my wrong, it's in my TV, not in my S790. I am looking for a new player after my S790 has broken down, and had the functions mixed up with the TV.
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post #1973 of 2244 Old 09-22-2016, 06:49 AM
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Thanks JoeKustra. Sorry, my wrong, it's in my TV, not in my S790. I am looking for a new player after my S790 has broken down, and had the functions mixed up with the TV.
No problem. My W600B has a function called CineMotion that I have off. I think MotionFlow is on my EX700.
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post #1974 of 2244 Old 09-22-2016, 02:52 PM
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Triluminos

Are the extra Triluminos colors in S6500 very exact data, that will only respond in Sony's Triluminos TVs? Or will it add difference even to the colors displayed on Sony's non-Triluminos TVs?
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Are the extra Triluminos colors in S6500 very exact data, that will only respond in Sony's Triluminos TVs? Or will it add difference even to the colors displayed on Sony's non-Triluminos TVs?
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/149-bl...l#post34834057
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post #1976 of 2244 Old 09-24-2016, 08:49 AM
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Hey guys, wanted to find out if any of the newer models of blu-ray player beyond the 6500 offer an airplay type of feature? for example the Home theater setup is in the living room with the new sound bar. I moved the old sound bar into the bedroom with an Airport express as an airPlay device. It would be nice to have the option to send the audio from the living room into the bedroom. Does anyone have suggestions on this?

FYI,for content online such as netflix, that's already doable via the iPad. I was more asking for stuff I have on disc.

Thanks.
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post #1977 of 2244 Old 09-24-2016, 02:47 PM
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I have a second question in addition to the one I asked earlier today. When I use the blu-ray player directly connected to the sound bar via the digital coaxial cable the dolby digital light comes on when the sound signal is detected, and fades out as expected. When I play the same sources through the HDMI connections to the TV and the audio comes out the TV's optical out to the sound bar, the dolby light doesn't come on, but I still get audio.

I know for a fact the TV can output DD 5.1 over the optical out according to the documentation.

I was also told that, the audio may be, being converted to LPCM from TV to sound bar to keep a compatible audio format.

The only other thing I can think of is the TV doesn't have a dolby or DTS decoder, and is being converted to LPCM by the TV.

I was just curious if someone had a better understanding of the audio process. It's been a while since i've kept up on the technology. Thanks

PS the audio sounds the same regardless of DD or not. I was just wondering why the DD signal wasn't going over optical, and only a direct coax connection.
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post #1978 of 2244 Old 09-26-2016, 08:12 AM
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Originally Posted by MacinMan View Post
I have a second question in addition to the one I asked earlier today. When I use the blu-ray player directly connected to the sound bar via the digital coaxial cable the dolby digital light comes on when the sound signal is detected, and fades out as expected. When I play the same sources through the HDMI connections to the TV and the audio comes out the TV's optical out to the sound bar, the dolby light doesn't come on, but I still get audio.

I know for a fact the TV can output DD 5.1 over the optical out according to the documentation.

I was also told that, the audio may be, being converted to LPCM from TV to sound bar to keep a compatible audio format.

The only other thing I can think of is the TV doesn't have a dolby or DTS decoder, and is being converted to LPCM by the TV.

I was just curious if someone had a better understanding of the audio process. It's been a while since i've kept up on the technology. Thanks

PS the audio sounds the same regardless of DD or not. I was just wondering why the DD signal wasn't going over optical, and only a direct coax connection.
The player device, not the TV, is downmixing the audio to stereo PCM. You might try disabling (not muting) the TV's internal speakers.

When a device sends audio over HDMI to the TV, it detects what type of speakers are connected to the TV and sends a compatible signal. Most TVs have only stereo speakers, so an attached player would automatically downmix the audio. When a TV is connected to an external sound system, like a soundbar, it should be able to tell the player it has more than two speakers. On the other hand, despite being able to forward multichannel Dolby Digital for their internal sound sources, some TV's can only forward stereo from devices connected via HDMI. If the TV's manual doesn't mention what it supports, then you'll just have to try various options.

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post #1979 of 2244 Old 09-26-2016, 08:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post
The player device, not the TV, is downmixing the audio to stereo PCM. You might try disabling (not muting) the TV's internal speakers.

When a device sends audio over HDMI to the TV, it detects what type of speakers are connected to the TV and sends a compatible signal. Most TVs have only stereo speakers, so an attached player would automatically downmix the audio. When a TV is connected to an external sound system, like a soundbar, it should be able to tell the player it has more than two speakers. On the other hand, despite being able to forward multichannel Dolby Digital for their internal sound sources, some TV's can only forward stereo from devices connected via HDMI. If the TV's manual doesn't mention what it supports, then you'll just have to try various options.
Thanks for the reply, While I was waiting for someone to respond, I did some research of my own since I was curious. It looks like in order to get multi channel passthrough from HDMI connected devices to say, an optically connected device such as sound bar, AVR, etc. It looks like the TV needs to support HDMI ARC. If the TV doesn't support ARC, then the audio is down mixed to PCM as part of the HDCP standards. While, I'm not going to rush out and get a new TV just to get ARC support, it looks like when I NEED a new TV most current ones at this point support the feature.
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post #1980 of 2244 Old 09-26-2016, 08:25 AM
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Thanks for the reply, While I was waiting for someone to respond, I did some research of my own since I was curious. It looks like in order to get multi channel passthrough from HDMI connected devices to say, an optically connected device such as sound bar, AVR, etc. It looks like the TV needs to support HDMI ARC. If the TV doesn't support ARC, then the audio is down mixed to PCM as part of the HDCP standards. While, I'm not going to rush out and get a new TV just to get ARC support, it looks like when I NEED a new TV most current ones at this point support the feature.
ARC = Audio Return Channel. It's how audio is sent back over the single HDMI connection between a TV and a receiver. It should have nothing to do with what is sent over an optical connection, but I've seen some rather strange design choices.

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