Official OPPO UDP-203 Owner's Thread - Page 51 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1501 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted by panasonicst60 View Post
It's softer than the internal TV upscaler on my TV....Has anyone else notice this when switching upscalers between the Oppo and the TV?
Is that a good thing?

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post #1502 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted by tjcinnamon View Post
So are you saying is provides more detail with more noise or are you saying the more detail there is the more noise?
Oppo upscaler has less noise and details.
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post #1503 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by tjcinnamon View Post
Is that a good thing?
Not for me. I guess it's personal preference. I personally prefer some grain with no detail loss. With the Oppo hype I was hoping it would have a better internal upscaler.
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post #1504 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by panasonicst60 View Post
Oppo upscaler has less noise and details.
You mean less noise and less details, correct? In general, digital imaging, the more you apply noise reduction, you loose details. Some people like a silky smooth picture without noise as much possible, while some prefer details not minding the noise. It is true for almost all digital imaging technologies. You have to compare what you like before permanently deciding what device you want to make the up-scaling.

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post #1505 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted by JaytheDreamer View Post
You mean less noise and less details, correct? In general, digital imaging, the more you apply noise reduction, you loose details. Some people like a silky smooth picture without noise as much possible, while some prefer details not minding the noise. It is true for almost all digital imaging technology. You have to compare what you like before permanently deciding what device you want to make the up-scaling.
I agree with you. I just hope oppo has a way for us to adjust the amount of DNR being applied. When set to source direct and letting my TV upscaler I feel I'm getting the purest picture. With some noise, but no loss of details. I guess its good oppo has the source direct, as some players don't and upscales everything internally.
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post #1506 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted by wxman View Post
I think I may have figured out why my screen on the E6 goes grey when a UHD disc first starts up, and then once the movie starts, everything is fine. The way i solved it was to set Output Resolution to auto, and Custom resolution to 60hz. The player is still sending the movie to the tv at 24 fps. I no longer have the gray screen at startup. Also, just for fun, I set Output resolution to Custom, and Custom resolution to 60hz, and it will send the movie to tv at 60 fps. I thought it would look horrible, but it actually looks really good. No SOE.

So for those who just want to fix the startup issue, Output Resolution to auto, Custom resolution to 60hz. However, If you stop movie, the screen will remain black until you eject.

Edit, never mind. It worked for a short amount time and did it again.
The value of Custom Resolution should matter only when Output Resolution = Custom. Should not matter when Output Resolution = Auto.

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post #1507 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Bigmoviefan View Post
THat Is a good question! Tech at Oppo suggested the length of 5 meters was the issue and so we need to find a more robust hdmi cable! Suggestions for a 5meter run ?
There are a couple of threads on AVS forum that deal strictly with what cable works, and what doesn't. I couldn't get the link to work but they are easily found with a search.
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post #1508 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post
I'm currently using the 10 foot cables Monoprice sells as HDMI Ultra HD Premium Certified.

Keep in mind that the longer the cables, the harder it is going to be to find something that works at the highest bandwidths. Also anything in the cable path: Daisy chained cables, adapters, switches, wall plates (used to tidy up the ends of in-wall cables), gizmos of any sort -- any of that stuff, can degrade the signal

Finally, HDMI plugs are just friction fit. It only takes a small shift of plug in socket to screw things up. So now that you know your problem is getting higher bandwidths to pass, the FIRST thing you should try is to unplug and re-plug every HDMI connection in the signal path -- from OPPO to Display -- making sure each plug is fully inserted STRAIGHT into the socket with nothing (e.g., cable weight or kinks in the cable) tugging on it in any direction.

This can be a particular problem with new cables that still have kinks in them from how they were folded for packaging.
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I really shouldn't have set my system up this way: I have my cables running behind the wall by way of wall plates with keystones. Two wall plates, two keystones, three total HDMI cables to complete the run from the Oppo to the LG. Fortunately, my wall plate is one of those multi-function ones that also features a brush plate, so I can just fish cable straight through if I need to. I'll certainly double check to make sure all my connections are solid, but to hedge my bets, I've also already ordered the Monoprice.

This is actually pretty fun. I feel like I'm getting to know my system, and the tech behind it, better.

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post #1509 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:23 PM
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I received my unit yesterday and set it up with no problems. Since initial setup, each time I turn the 203 on, I see an error message that ARC is not working. I am not using ARC, and I cannot find any settings in the OPPO related to ARC. After I dismiss the message, everything works fine. I have been following this thread since day one and have not seen anyone else mention this (it's possible that I missed it). Any idea why I am seeing this error message?

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post #1510 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:23 PM
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Has anyone tried if the 103 region free mod works with the 203?

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post #1511 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:27 PM
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Guys, we need to remember one thing with the "Strip Metadata" output. It's an experimental feature that Oppo has been upfront about from the beginning, so there are going to be changes along the way to this. The company's track record on flawless performance is indisputable, but we need to give them some time to get this right. I'm sure if we help them with pictures and such it will speed things up, but I don't think we'll see it fully baked for a while. (This is my own personal thought and it isn't from anything that Oppo has told me directly...let's give them time to fix it).

One last thing, the HDR output from the Oppo is much better than the Samsung because I haven't had to mess with the internal output of the Oppo in one way versus all the hoops I had to jump through on the "USER" setting in the Samsung.

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post #1512 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by lujan View Post
I'm taking delivery of the 203 today and this will be the first movie I check out on the 203 because I thought Batman vs. Superman was dark. Also, I have a Vizio "P" series TV and I read that another Vizio owner had to turn off "HDMI subsampling" for that HDMI port on the display for the Oppo to work? I have other devices attached to the Denon X6200W which is connected to HDMI 1 of the Vizio. In this case it seems that I may have to run two cables, one to Denon under "Audio only" HDMI port of Oppo and another to Vizio from "Main"? Does this sound correct and also do I need to make changes on Oppo settings for this? I only ran one HDMI cable on my 103 so I've never done it this way before.
I can't help you with your question about the Vizio. I've never seen a Vizio here in Australia and I have no idea what their "HDMI subsampling" does. My LG E6 doesn't have a menu item like that as far as I am aware.

Your Denon is HDCP 2.2 capable so you should be right just running a single cable to it and going from it to the TV. Note that I said "should"—I've got a Marantz which is HDCP 2.2 capable and I only use the 1 cable from the 203 to it, but I have no experience with our Denon.
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post #1513 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by leemathre View Post
I received my unit yesterday and set it up with no problems. Since initial setup, each time I turn the 203 on, I see an error message that ARC is not working. I am not using ARC, and I cannot find any settings in the OPPO related to ARC. After I dismiss the message, everything works fine. I have been following this thread since day one and have not seen anyone else mention this (it's possible that I missed it). Any idea why I am seeing this error message?
What receiver and what dispay and do you have CEC enabled on any devices? Do you have anything plugged in to the INPUT on the back of the Oppo?
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post #1514 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by leemathre View Post
I received my unit yesterday and set it up with no problems. Since initial setup, each time I turn the 203 on, I see an error message that ARC is not working. I am not using ARC, and I cannot find any settings in the OPPO related to ARC. After I dismiss the message, everything works fine. I have been following this thread since day one and have not seen anyone else mention this (it's possible that I missed it). Any idea why I am seeing this error message?
You dismiss it with the OPPO remote? So it is definitely an OPPO message, not something from your receiver?

I haven't seen that, or heard it reported.

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post #1515 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:31 PM
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You expect a disc player show 'Atmos' itself on it's own display??!!
My mistake was explained to me by another poster in an earlier post that was not only more informative than yours but a hell of a lot more courteous too.
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post #1516 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by wxman View Post
I think I may have figured out why my screen on the E6 goes grey when a UHD disc first starts up, and then once the movie starts, everything is fine. The way i solved it was to set Output Resolution to auto, and Custom resolution to 60hz. The player is still sending the movie to the tv at 24 fps. I no longer have the gray screen at startup. Also, just for fun, I set Output resolution to Custom, and Custom resolution to 60hz, and it will send the movie to tv at 60 fps. I thought it would look horrible, but it actually looks really good. No SOE.

So for those who just want to fix the startup issue, Output Resolution to auto, Custom resolution to 60hz. However, If you stop movie, the screen will remain black until you eject.

Edit, never mind. It worked for a short amount time and did it again.
Bob and I have a nice chain on my issue, which is similar to yours (thanks for your earlier response by the way). In my case, it appears that my cables aren't robust enough to handle 4k/60Hz output of Oppo's home menu. Have you tried swapping out cables? Here are the links to some posts between Bob and I.

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post #1517 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave Vaughn View Post
Guys, we need to remember one thing with the "Strip Metadata" output. It's an experimental feature that Oppo has been upfront about from the beginning, so there are going to be changes along the way to this. The company's track record on flawless performance is indisputable, but we need to give them some time to get this right. I'm sure if we help them with pictures and such it will speed things up, but I don't think we'll see it fully baked for a while. (This is my own personal thought and it isn't from anything that Oppo has told me directly...let's give them time to fix it).

One last thing, the HDR output from the Oppo is much better than the Samsung because I haven't had to mess with the internal output of the Oppo in one way versus all the hoops I had to jump through on the "USER" setting in the Samsung.
I agree. I would encourage people to share photos and describe their setups, and do so not just here but directly with Oppo via their web site. More data is likely useful.

And I suspect they will solve it. But not overnight!

And yes, luckily, HDR works better than the Samsung when coupled with a JVC projector, so it is watchable (just not all our dreams realized in one box) while Oppo tweaks this experimental feature.
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post #1518 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:34 PM
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Originally Posted by panasonicst60 View Post
Not for me. I guess it's personal preference. I personally prefer some grain with no detail loss. With the Oppo hype I was hoping it would have a better internal upscaler.
The Oppo may be adding less sharpening than the TV's upscaler. It is a matter of preference rather than reference, either way, so I'm not saying your preference is wrong. But this also means neither is objectively better. They are different -- and both are making judgment calls about how much detail to ADD to the original signal.
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post #1519 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by ccool96 View Post
That and why does the HD-Fury work great with not only the Panasonic, but also the Philips to get SDR2020 forced output. Yet the Oppo using the same settings is forced all the way down to SDR 709.
Very good point!!
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post #1520 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan_h View Post
I agree. I would encourage people to share photos and describe their setups, and do so not just here but directly with Oppo via their web site. More data is likely useful.

And I suspect they will solve it. But not overnight!

And yes, luckily, HDR works better than the Samsung when coupled with a JVC projector, so it is watchable (just not all our dreams realized in one box) while Oppo tweaks this experimental feature.
So are there suggestions on OPPO settings in conjunction with JVC projectots?
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post #1521 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:46 PM
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About the HDR metadata stripping.

You have to consider what HDR10 is: Bt.2020 colorimetry and a PQ curve, representing peak luminocities of 1000 or 4000 nits.

Now, if you simply strip the HDR metadata (basically a flag stating the signal is Bt.2020, PQ, and the peak nit value), and replace it with a simple signaling of just Bt.2020, then the display will interpret the pixels as Gamma encoded with a peak of 100 nit.

The problem is that the pixels themself are still encoded with a PQ curve, and much higher intended luminocities. To do this right, the Oppo would have to a complex color volume modeling, in order to map the higher luminocity and PQ curve to a 100 nit Gamma curve. This will involve a lot of color volume clipping.

So, simply removing the HDR signaling, and repacing it with Bt.2020 signaling will not provide the intended results. It is possible that somehow the pixel value range of the PQ encoded pixel looks somewhat acceptable when interpreted as a Gamma encoded pixel, but that would be pure luck

I do not know what the Panasonic does differently, but I'm pretty sure that the HDRFury does not touch the pixel values to do any real color conversion.

Overall, if you have issues with feeding a valid HDR signal to your projectors, then you should bring that to the attention of the projector manufacturer, so that they can implement the correct handling of HDR10.
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post #1522 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:46 PM
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So which cable is Premium High Speed > 5 meters? Im having the same issue.
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I just placed an order for the Monoprice 10 foot certified cable as well. The HDMI cable that came with the Oppo is to short to reach my TV through the wall.

Hopefully the length will not cause any issue.


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I've tested the Monoprice premium/certified cables in the available lengths (i.e., up to 20 ft.) and found that even the max. 20 ft. length worked OK. I used a Samsung K8500 connected to a JVC RS600 projector for the testing. They should also work with the Oppo as the UHD source.
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post #1523 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by JaytheDreamer View Post
You mean less noise and less details, correct? In general, digital imaging, the more you apply noise reduction, you loose details. Some people like a silky smooth picture without noise as much possible, while some prefer details not minding the noise. It is true for almost all digital imaging technologies. You have to compare what you like before permanently deciding what device you want to make the up-scaling.
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Originally Posted by panasonicst60 View Post
I agree with you. I just hope oppo has a way for us to adjust the amount of DNR being applied. When set to source direct and letting my TV upscaler I feel I'm getting the purest picture. With some noise, but no loss of details. I guess its good oppo has the source direct, as some players don't and upscales everything internally.
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Originally Posted by nathan_h View Post
The Oppo may be adding less sharpening than the TV's upscaler. It is a matter of preference rather than reference, either way, so I'm not saying your preference is wrong. But this also means neither is objectively better. They are different -- and both are making judgment calls about how much detail to ADD to the original signal.
Overall I'm really disatisfied how my B6 handles non-uhd content. Low grade 1080 such as cable and tv apps (UFC fight pass, fox sports go, etc)... it really doesn't to a great job. About 80% of my reasoning for really going after this (other than my other great oppo experience) is for the upscaler (I was hoping there were other functions such as an anti-aliasing method/jaggie smoothing). The other 20% was to get a super high quality blu ray player

Thats why I keep asking you owners about the scaling feature. I'm still getting this and returning the Xbox One S this but maybe I should get a lumagen as well?
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post #1524 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by leemathre View Post
I received my unit yesterday and set it up with no problems. Since initial setup, each time I turn the 203 on, I see an error message that ARC is not working. I am not using ARC, and I cannot find any settings in the OPPO related to ARC. After I dismiss the message, everything works fine. I have been following this thread since day one and have not seen anyone else mention this (it's possible that I missed it). Any idea why I am seeing this error message?
Are you using a programmable remote instead of the OPPO's own remote?

ARC (Audio Return Channel) is one of the Input choices for the 203. The other two being normal player operation and playback of stuff coming in on the HDMI Input. You would use ARC if you want the TVs own audio (from its internal channel tuner) to come BACK into the OPPO on the HDMI cable normally used by the OPPO to send video to the TV.

If you are using a programmable remote, particularly one set up for the prior OPPO players, it may be sending out the command to change Inputs during power up, and ending up on the ARC Input by mistake, perhaps temporarily.
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post #1525 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by jhualum1 View Post
Bob and I have a nice chain on my issue, which is similar to yours (thanks for your earlier response by the way). In my case, it appears that my cables aren't robust enough to handle 4k/60Hz output of Oppo's home menu. Have you tried swapping out cables? Here are the links to some posts between Bob and I.

-Rob

First Comment

Second Comment

Third Comment
Thanks for the links. I have tried both the OPPO certified cable, and a BJC certified cable, and it occurs with both cables. Both have the HDMI certification for for high speed (18 gbps).

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post #1526 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 12:58 PM
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So which cable is Premium High Speed > 5 meters? Im having the same issue.
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THat Is a good question! Tech at Oppo suggested the length of 5 meters was the issue and so we need to find a more robust hdmi cable! Suggestions for a 5meter run ?
Check out this AVS thread: UHD Blu-ray and Long HDMI cables - what works !

- and -

This article from our own Dave Vaughn in Sound & Vision:

UHD Blu-ray vs. HDMI – Pt. 2: Which Cables Can Actually Pass HDMI 2.0?

(FWIW, I have a 50' (~15m) run from the media closet to my TV and the Celerity Optical Fibre works great while a Monoprice "18Gbps" cable did not.)
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__________
Visio P65-C1 / Oppo UDP-203 / Apple TV 4K / TiVo Bolt
Yamaha RX-A2060 5.1.4 / KEF iQ / Speakercraft (Ceiling) / Hsu sub / Ruipro 15 Meter Fiber HDMI
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post #1527 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 01:02 PM
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The Oppo may be adding less sharpening than the TV's upscaler. It is a matter of preference rather than reference, either way, so I'm not saying your preference is wrong. But this also means neither is objectively better. They are different -- and both are making judgment calls about how much detail to ADD to the original signal.
You are absolutely correct! I learn something new every day. The lg is adding more sharpening. I readjust the sharpest setting with test patterns and switching back and forth look very similar. I will do further testing to figure out which is doing a better job. Thanks!
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Last edited by panasonicst60; 12-16-2016 at 01:12 PM.
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post #1528 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 01:04 PM
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I'm taking delivery of the 203 today and this will be the first movie I check out on the 203 because I thought Batman vs. Superman was dark. Also, I have a Vizio "P" series TV and I read that another Vizio owner had to turn off "HDMI subsampling" for that HDMI port on the display for the Oppo to work? I have other devices attached to the Denon X6200W which is connected to HDMI 1 of the Vizio. In this case it seems that I may have to run two cables, one to Denon under "Audio only" HDMI port of Oppo and another to Vizio from "Main"? Does this sound correct and also do I need to make changes on Oppo settings for this? I only ran one HDMI cable on my 103 so I've never done it this way before.
Apart from the Oppo not working when connected to the Denon, I am really enjoying it so far. I connected the Main HDMI output to the Vizio "P" series TV and the Audio line to the Denon. The setup afterwards was very simple and quick. I updated the Harmony remote to learn the "HDR" and "Resolution" buttons using the old Oppo 103 settings and started to watch Batman vs. Superman. WOW, the picture really looks much better with more depth and not nearly as dark as when watching on the Samsung UHD player. I haven't tried the "Strip metadata" action yet but don't see the need quite yet.

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post #1529 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 01:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave Vaughn View Post
Press and hold the info button ...it will then pop up.
Thank you for the information.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soulnight View Post
Very interesting. Thanks!

can you comment on the difference in the picture between Panasonic and Samsung + hdfury to get SDR REC2020?
Did you see any difference? I am currently running with the samsung + hdfury to do SDR REC2020 for my projector Epson EH-LS10000. Wondering if it would look any different with the panasonic. Obiously, it does with the oppo...
I thought the difference between the Samsung and Panasonic while using the HDFury was very noticeable. No red push and much better coloring... The Oppo is also much better than the Samsung, but the difference isn't as big between the Oppo and the Panasonic. The Panasonic/Fury is the winner when it comes to SDR 2020.
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post #1530 of 37220 Old 12-16-2016, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by nathan_h View Post
If you already have a UHD streaming device, running it through the Oppo doesn't provide many advantages (unless you don't use a receiver or TV with multiple inputs) until they fix the SDR 2020 output bug. Otherwise, your results running through the Oppo (if it were to accept HDR on the input) versus bypassing the Oppo should be pretty much the same.

The input's advantage will be with non UHD sources, for scaling. Otherwise, if it does anything to a HDR UHD signal, that would be considered a bug by most users.

(Again, with the caveat that some people might really value being able to convert HDR 2020 2160p to a "lower" format like SDR 2020 2160p -- which, while not a possible output option given the current bug, could be a big selling point for some users with some displays. For example: Me. I would use that feature for sure.)
That would be great if the streaming device audio & video would match up. I talked to an Oppo tech today & they were aware people were having this problem but didn't seem concerned about it.

Without having the streaming apps part of my decision to buy the 203 was that the description stated you can run a streaming device in on the back HDMI port. I ran the latest Apple TV thru at 1080p & also tried upscale to 4k. Either way the audio & video sync are really off. Impossible to watch.

Hopefully they will get this fixed but again he didn't seem really concerned about it. It was really sad.

If you're going to have an HDMI in and specify the reason for this is to run a streaming device at least make sure the streaming device will work. I understand hopefully the HDR function will work in the future on the back HDMI but at least get the picture & audio synced together.

I stream a lot of TV shows as well as watching 4k UHD movies & upscaled Blu-rays.

I still prefer the 103D for upscaled Blu-rays. Unfortunately I don't think the upscaling chip in this one is nearly as good as the 103D so I'll be keeping the 103D.

If you're getting it just to watch 4k UHD movies or you don't want your Blu-rays upscaled to 4k and you don't want any streaming apps then this player will work for you. I'm not sure it's worth the price they're charging for it the way it is now.
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203 , 203 uhd , blu-ray , denon x4300h , dsd streaming , failure , Oppo , oppo 203 , sacd dsd hdmi , troubleshooting , UDP-203 , uhd , usb

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