Official Panasonic DP-UB820/824 Owner's Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 149 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #4441 of 5152 Old 05-15-2019, 10:34 AM
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Anyone using the "system gamma" option in the new update? This was already on the 9000.

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post #4442 of 5152 Old 05-15-2019, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by curlyjive View Post

I would be happy to just bitstream but when you do get the loud popping/cracking it's like fireworks and I don't want to buy new speakers now!

Do you only get HDMI "synch pops" when there is Atmos or DTS:X included? So, in other words, you bitstream Dolby TrueHD 7.1 when there is also Atmos for those who use it. You get the "synch pops". If you spin a movie, whether UHD or Blu, that has Dolby TrueHD 7.1 but with no Atmos included, then you do or don't have a problem?


I tested this in my set-up. None of my movies with Dolby TrueHD 7.1 (no Atmos) caused a concern. All of them when they come with Atmos do cause it. Oddly, if I put "No Speaker" for either right or left rear surround, then no problem (missing a channel though). I figured it was my Prepro and since PCM out of my 900, or now 820, is no concern, then I gave up at that point.

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post #4443 of 5152 Old 05-15-2019, 10:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erod View Post
Anyone using the "system gamma" option in the new update? This was already on the 9000.

Was this update recent?


Was there going to be an enhancement for Prime and Netflix streaming?

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post #4444 of 5152 Old 05-15-2019, 10:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by curlyjive View Post

I would be happy to just bitstream but when you do get the loud popping/cracking it's like fireworks and I don't want to buy new speakers now!

Do you only get HDMI "synch pops" when there is Atmos or DTS:X included? So, in other words, you bitstream Dolby TrueHD 7.1 when there is also Atmos for those who use it. You get the "synch pops". If you spin a movie, whether UHD or Blu, that has Dolby TrueHD 7.1 but with no Atmos included, then you do or don't have a problem?


I tested this in my set-up. None of my movies with Dolby TrueHD 7.1 (no Atmos) caused a concern. All of them when they come with Atmos do cause it. Oddly, if I put "No Speaker" for either right or left rear surround, then no problem (missing a channel though). I figured it was my Prepro and since PCM out of my 900, or now 820, is no concern, then I gave up at that point.
It's hard to tell because it's happens very infrequently. I can play the same atmos disc many times and only once in a blue moon it happens. Makes it hard to say for sure. Usually happens right when the sound starts or after the credits end and the menu audio comes back. It's never happened in the middle of playback
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post #4445 of 5152 Old 05-15-2019, 11:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post
Was this update recent?


Was there going to be an enhancement for Prime and Netflix streaming?
I still don't know what the streaming "maintenance" was about.

But there was an update that added the on-screen HDR metadata button to the playback info button (second press), and also a system gamma slider to the Optimizer.

These were both on the ub9000 already.

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post #4446 of 5152 Old 05-15-2019, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Erod View Post
I still don't know what the streaming "maintenance" was about.

But there was an update that added the on-screen HDR metadata button to the playback info button (second press), and also a system gamma slider to the Optimizer.

These were both on the ub9000 already.

I've had the metadata on 2nd press since I got mine a few weeks ago.


I'll check when I get home, but I suppose it isn't clear to me if there was a new firmware released in the last couple days.


I did notice a message about May 14 when I accessed Network Services. Figured they were doing something that didn't require a new f/w. Never did know what that was about, but streaming had better improve by several leaps over the next couple years!
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post #4447 of 5152 Old 05-15-2019, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by jh901 View Post
Never did know what that was about, but streaming had better improve by several leaps over the next couple years!
This^^^^^^

This device really is dog sh*t for streaming. No native framerate support + laggy menu navigation = useless. I have a Sony X800 and it is leaps and bounds better for streaming. It's really not even close. Furthermore, the Panasonic frequently has lower quality (more compression artifacts) when streaming side-by-side vs my Roku and X800. Maybe it's from framerate conversion? Maybe it's because Panasonic routs everything through their own servers (yes, they actually do this...to improve our experience...)?

A big consequence of the streaming locking to 60Hz is that you cannot stream in 4kHDR with a display that has a 10gbps HDMI port. 24Hz works fine in 4kHDR at 10gbps, but using 60 Hz requires an 18gbps connection. This eliminates the possibility of 4khdr streaming for multiple years of devices, especially projectors (isn't this device supposed to be great for projectors???).

Regardless, the end result is that the UB820 is so bad for streaming that it should not be allowed to advertise the capability.
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post #4448 of 5152 Old 05-15-2019, 11:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post
I've had the metadata on 2nd press since I got mine a few weeks ago.


I'll check when I get home, but I suppose it isn't clear to me if there was a new firmware released in the last couple days.


I did notice a message about May 14 when I accessed Network Services. Figured they were doing something that didn't require a new f/w. Never did know what that was about, but streaming had better improve by several leaps over the next couple years!
So far, the only thing I've noticed is that the trailer previews in the main Netflix no longer play. It's just a still shot.

Netflix streams nicely for me with my 820 and JVC projector. Everything is converted to SDR2020 and looks superb. However, Amazon Prime is a joke. I have to watch it through the PS4.

Panasonic definitely needs to fix this and get Amazon to play in 24p.

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post #4449 of 5152 Old 05-15-2019, 11:36 AM
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Does the 820 play SACD? Not clear from the pdf file showing the specs on the unit. Please advise.
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post #4450 of 5152 Old 05-15-2019, 11:45 AM
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Originally Posted by ptalar View Post
Does the 820 play SACD? Not clear from the pdf file showing the specs on the unit. Please advise.
No DVD Audio. No SACD.

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post #4451 of 5152 Old 05-15-2019, 12:45 PM
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Can't connect to internet via 5ghz band

Just picked up an 820 last night and I had an issue trying to connect to the internet via 5ghz wifi. I couldn't find any other posts with issues when I did a search, but I'm wondering if anyone else had has had problems, or if maybe it's a known issue? Only had a small amount of time to tinker with it before bed, but it's the only device I own that's had any problem connecting to the 5ghz band of my ASUS AC2900. Specifically, it does connect to the router, but then it fails to actually connect to the internet. When I connect to the 2.4ghz band it works not problem, but that one is a bit slower. I'll try and mess around with the router this weekend, but I thought I'd check and see if it was a know issue. Many thanks!
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post #4452 of 5152 Old 05-15-2019, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Hyp Toad View Post
Just picked up an 820 last night and I had an issue trying to connect to the internet via 5ghz wifi. I couldn't find any other posts with issues when I did a search, but I'm wondering if anyone else had has had problems, or if maybe it's a known issue? Only had a small amount of time to tinker with it before bed, but it's the only device I own that's had any problem connecting to the 5ghz band of my ASUS AC2900. Specifically, it does connect to the router, but then it fails to actually connect to the internet. When I connect to the 2.4ghz band it works not problem, but that one is a bit slower. I'll try and mess around with the router this weekend, but I thought I'd check and see if it was a know issue. Many thanks!
Not that this is helpful but I can confirm that mine works just fine on 5GHz. I am using Ubiquiti NanoHD AP's, and I do not have separate SSID's for 2.4 and 5GHz. Also, the 5GHz are using 80MHz channel width.

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post #4453 of 5152 Old 05-15-2019, 07:50 PM
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Originally Posted by jt7272 View Post
Regardless, the end result is that the UB820 is so bad for streaming that it should not be allowed to advertise the capability.
I must be doing something wrong. I haven't had any issues streaming with the 820 to my JVC native 4k projector. Maybe I've just been lucky and haven't watched any of the problematic content yet.
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post #4454 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 06:21 AM
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I must be doing something wrong. I haven't had any issues streaming with the 820 to my JVC native 4k projector. Maybe I've just been lucky and haven't watched any of the problematic content yet.
Not to dismiss your statement but I'm sure that lots of people have no problems with the performance of all different levels/tiers of equipment, regardless of their technical shortcomings. I'm sure that some people still say that their 720P DLP from 2006 "looks great, as good as anything". This is all very subjective.

My primary complaints are about objective shortcomings: locked 60 Hz output with visible stuttering in native 24p Amazon content, all streaming content is run through Panasonic servers and their is clearly more compression at times (this is reflected in a lower bitrate). These shortcomings are either measurable or obviously observable relative to other contemporary equipment.

I'll put it another way: Would you buy this player if it didn't support 24p output for Bluray? If the answer is yes then we probably are not of the same mind about A/V equipment.

Anyways, I'm not here to bash Panasonic. It is important to know these things, though, as someone spending $500 on a Bluray player that lists UHD Streaming as a feature may indeed be disappointed when that streaming performance is poor or, even worse, their display with a 10 GBPS HDMI port will not receive a UHD signal while streaming. These are factors when considering which player (or possibly BR player + streaming box, probably the safest choice) to buy.

The UB820 is fantastic at playing Blu-rays (UHD or traditional). It's features are perfect for those using a projector for UHD BR's. Just be sure to budget extra money for a Shield TV or Roku Ultra or similar. Someone that is satisfied with the disc-playing performance of a Sony, for comparison, has no need for the separate streaming box (at least for Netflix, Amazon, and Youtube; streaming Plex or other home network stuff is dog sh*t on almost all modern BR players...).

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post #4455 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 06:34 AM
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Originally Posted by smitty View Post
I must be doing something wrong. I haven't had any issues streaming with the 820 to my JVC native 4k projector. Maybe I've just been lucky and haven't watched any of the problematic content yet.
Then you haven't tried to watch Amazon Prime with UHD content. It's a stuttering mess. I don't have issues with Netflix, but Amazon might as well not be there. I have to use the PS4 for Amazon.

Perhaps I need to get a Roku, but my PS4 probably has just as good of a picture.

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post #4456 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 07:28 AM
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I only watch standard HD for Amazon Prime. Didn't realize that the 4K stuttering was related to the Panny. Wow. They must be aware of this?! Is there a more active discussion forum that I shou



I don't currently pay extra for Netflix 4K.


Anyhow, is there a more active discussion forum that I should be aware of? How do we get Panny's attention?

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post #4457 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 07:49 AM
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Anyhow, is there a more active discussion forum that I should be aware of? How do we get Panny's attention?
blu-ray.com has a discussion forum for this player that is similarly active to here.

I have tried to contact Panasonic a few times and only once did I get someone that seemed to possibly understand the problem (not from a technical perspective, but they at least believed that there was a problem) . They promised to escalate the issue and get back to me in 48 hours. 72 hours later they did reply with "verify that your HDMI cable is 18gbps capable".... Clearly they didn't bother to read any of the conversation transcript. I replied back that their handling of the issue was either lazy or insulting. As you can expect that was the end of it.
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post #4458 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 08:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Erod View Post
Then you haven't tried to watch Amazon Prime with UHD content. It's a stuttering mess. I don't have issues with Netflix, but Amazon might as well not be there.
Yes, I don't have Amazon Prime. I've just been watching Netflix.

And in truth, I'm only using the player for a time as a streaming device. When I get serious about streaming content with my projector, I will use a Roku or ATV4k (as I do with my OLED), and use the player just for DVD's.

I wasn't trying to suggest that some folks were not having issues -- just that I hadn't experienced them yet. And perhaps I was also suggesting that the notion that Panasonic should not be allowed to advertise the player's streaming ability was a bit hyperbolic.

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post #4459 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 08:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post
Please do follow up here.


Did you play The Professional yet? It is a Sony release as well. Some of the best image quality to be released on UHD and perhaps the best 35mm anamorphic example. It's a stunner! Great film (from Luc Besson)!! That's the other title I've had the same exact problem with.
I don't have the Dual HDMI Out, so I'm not seeing the same problem. I do agree, The Professional has never looked this good. There was so much detail and colors that I hadn't noticed, the purples in Matilda's sweater in her first scene just popped out at me. I didn't have any issues with this disc.

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post #4460 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by smitty View Post
Yes, I don't have Amazon Prime. I've just been watching Netflix.

And in truth, I'm only using the player for a time as a streaming device. When I get serious about streaming content with my projector, I will use a Roku or ATV4k (as I do with my OLED), and use the player just for DVD's.

I wasn't trying to suggest that some folks were not having issues -- just that I hadn't experienced them yet. And perhaps I was also suggesting that the notion that Panasonic should not be allowed to advertise the player's streaming ability was a bit hyperbolic.
This discussion finally prompted me to get a Roku for the theater room. It'll arrive today.

Don't know why I waited so long. I guess the thought of losing a week's worth of nights setting up my app page was too daunting. I know me.

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post #4461 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 08:59 AM
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I was hoping that the "stuttering" issues in Amazon Video would have been addressed in the recent internet service maintenance. Despite owning both the ATV4K & Roku Ultra, my preference would be to use the UB820/9000 app for UHD/HDR Netflix & Amazon (and YouTube HDR) because the HDR Optimizer works much better with my JVC NX7 projector than HDR from either of the other 2 UHD streaming devices.
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post #4462 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 09:25 AM
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Amazon Prime video performance is sketchy on almost all devices. I wouldn't be so quick to blame Panny.
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post #4463 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 10:16 AM
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Exclamation

Greetings guys,

I'm not one on AVS that gets into constant never-ending debating back and forth but I will make a comment on the UB820 Panasonic.

I have it and it works exactly right all the time if ???????????

If IMHO it's used for it's primary function and that guys is really what ???

Playing Hard-Disc !!!

I really don't think it was actually designed initially for Streaming although as we all know it can certainly do that.

I had recently Major changes to my H/T system.
And in doing those I made a decision and that decision was to use each Component for it's Major-Function.
I have stuck to that and I can 100% say every A/V Component is working exactly as they all should with ....... Zero Issues.

I use the ROKU Ultra for all streaming and it works exactly as it should in my H/T system.

Good-Luck guys,
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post #4464 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 10:53 AM
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Greetings guys,

I'm not one on AVS that gets into constant never-ending debating back and forth but I will make a comment on the UB820 Panasonic.

I have it and it works exactly right all the time if ???????????

If IMHO it's used for it's primary function and that guys is really what ???

Playing Hard-Disc !!!

I really don't think it was actually designed initially for Streaming although as we all know it can certainly do that.

I had recently Major changes to my H/T system.
And in doing those I made a decision and that decision was to use each Component for it's Major-Function.
I have stuck to that and I can 100% say every A/V Component is working exactly as they all should with ....... Zero Issues.

I use the ROKU Ultra for all streaming and it works exactly as it should in my H/T system.

Good-Luck guys,
Terry
I agree, the UB820 does its primary job well. As does the Roku Ultra. But you can't expect every person to buy a dedicated device for every function in their system. Shall I purchase a HTPC to stream spotify (even though my AVR can do it)? Shall I also buy an HDMI Matrix switcher to handle HDMI switching (even though my AVR can do it)? You could go on and on forever. You could argue that everyone should have both winter and summer tires, switching them by the seasons. In practicality it makes more sense for most to use all-season tires. They are a compromise but it's better than someone driving with their summers in Jan when the temperature is 10 degrees...

I'm not endorsing nor chastising any methodology or practice. I just want devices to perform as specified in their literature. I draw a line at false or misleading advertising or specifications, such as this:

One issue with the UB820 (locked 60 hz) makes streaming 4k HDR impossible with devices that have 10 GBPS HDMI, even if the source content would otherwise be compatible. Nowhere is this documented by Panasonic. Granted, HDMI specifications for HDR are just a disaster, and HDR in general has had such a sloppy rollout that confusion is not a surprise. Nonetheless, if someone at Panasonic had plugged the UB820 into any of a number of mainstream projectors and tried to stream something they would have found this immediately. That would allow them to update their device to support framerate switching or they could add a simple footnote in the specifications or feature descriptions. It is as simple as adding something like this "UHD/HDR via streaming services limited to 18 GBPS HDMI displays".

This ignorance of the specifications and compatibility seems odd when one considers the bevy of related options that the UB820 provides.

I also would like a better description of the "tone curve" settings, though that is just a curiosity, not a complaint.
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post #4465 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 11:46 AM
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What would stream the best picture from Netfllix?

Roku Ultra
PS4 Pro
UB820

Video: JVC RS620/X9500 projector, Stewart ST130 screen, Panasonic ub820 UHD player
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post #4466 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by jt7272 View Post
One issue with the UB820 (locked 60 hz) makes streaming 4k HDR impossible with devices that have 10 GBPS HDMI, even if the source content would otherwise be compatible. Nowhere is this documented by Panasonic. Granted, HDMI specifications for HDR are just a disaster, and HDR in general has had such a sloppy rollout that confusion is not a surprise. Nonetheless, if someone at Panasonic had plugged the UB820 into any of a number of mainstream projectors and tried to stream something they would have found this immediately. That would allow them to update their device to support framerate switching or they could add a simple footnote in the specifications or feature descriptions. It is as simple as adding something like this "UHD/HDR via streaming services limited to 18 GBPS HDMI displays".
A problem, however, is that my HDMI cable and JVC PJ are capable of carrying 18Gbps. Netflix performs flawlessly, but Amazon Video is subject to intermittent "stuttering" while the ATV4K & Roku Ultra play that same source material without hiccups. While this could be a function of the Panasonic's inability to match frame rates (locked at 60), I'm not sure how the 18Gbps question is relevant here.
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post #4467 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 12:22 PM
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A problem, however, is that my HDMI cable and JVC PJ are capable of carrying 18Gbps. Netflix performs flawlessly, but Amazon Video is subject to intermittent "stuttering" while the ATV4K & Roku Ultra play that same source material without hiccups. While this could be a function of the Panasonic's inability to match frame rates (locked at 60), I'm not sure how the 18Gbps question is relevant here.
The frame rate lock is the sole reason. Do you prefer Netflix picture quality on the ub820 or the Roku?

Video: JVC RS620/X9500 projector, Stewart ST130 screen, Panasonic ub820 UHD player
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post #4468 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 12:29 PM
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The frame rate lock is the sole reason. Do you prefer Netflix picture quality on the ub820 or the Roku?
IMHO, there's no comparison with regards to HDR source material on Netflix. In my HT, the "dual tone mapping" combination of the UB820's Optimizer coupled with the JVC NX7's Auto Tone Mapping delivers an exceptional video presentation with absolutely minimal white clipping and solid blacks.
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post #4469 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 12:33 PM
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IMHO, there's no comparison with regards to HDR source material on Netflix. In my HT, the "dual tone mapping" combination of the UB820's Optimizer coupled with the JVC NX7's Auto Tone Mapping delivers an exceptional video presentation with absolutely minimal white clipping and solid blacks.
But how much of that tone mapping is really applied to a network stream?

I have a JVC projector, too, and I do notice that SDR2020 is applied to literally every movie on Netflix through the ub820, regardless if its HDR or not.

Video: JVC RS620/X9500 projector, Stewart ST130 screen, Panasonic ub820 UHD player
Audio: Anthem AVM60 preamp, Anthem MCA525 amp, B&K Reference 125.7 amp
Subs: dual SVS PC-12 cylinders
Speakers: Jamo 626k4 in-wall mains, Jamo 631k4 bi/dipole surrounds, DefTech DI6.5R heights

Last edited by Erod; 05-16-2019 at 12:40 PM.
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post #4470 of 5152 Old 05-16-2019, 12:49 PM
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But how much of that tone mapping is really applied to a network stream?

I have a JVC projector, too, and I do notice that SDR2020 is applied to literally every movie on Netflix through the ub820, regardless if its HDR or not.
I've noticed this too and have started switching to other sources for SDR Netflix content so there's no unnecessary extra processing in the pipeline. You're never going to improve an SDR image by wrapping it in an HDR container but you can degrade it if it's not done right.
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