Official Panasonic DP-UB820/824 Owner's Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 150 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #4471 of 5162 Old 05-16-2019, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by docrog View Post
A problem, however, is that my HDMI cable and JVC PJ are capable of carrying 18Gbps. Netflix performs flawlessly, but Amazon Video is subject to intermittent "stuttering" while the ATV4K & Roku Ultra play that same source material without hiccups. While this could be a function of the Panasonic's inability to match frame rates (locked at 60), I'm not sure how the 18Gbps question is relevant here.
There are two separate issues at play here:

1. Frame rate lock forces 24p -> 60p conversion. It's not clear if this is happening in the UB820 or at Panasonic's servers or all the way back at the source (assuming it gets info that the device is 60p only). This is definitely a source of judder issues, though the Amazon Prime app has seemingly multiple framerate issues that could have various root causes

2. Frame rate lock necessitates 18gbps HDMI connection. 4k60 HDR requires 18gbps. 4k24 HDR works fine at 10gbps. So UHD Blu-rays (4k24 4:2:0 encoded, converted to 4:2:2 before transmission) will work fine on 10gbps devices as designed. UHD streaming content, though, will not work on 10gbps devices even if the source is 24p. For example, The Man in the High Castle on Amazon streams at 4K with HDR10 at 24 Hz. This works fine on 10gbps devices. The UB820, though, forces it to 60Hz. This requires an 18gbps connection. The end result is that 10gbps displays will get a 1080p60 signal in an Rec2020 container (unless you have forced all output to SDR709). Not only are you not getting UHD but the 1080p signal has desaturated colors.

These are parallel issues with the same root cause. You having a full 18gbps connection negates 2 but not 1.

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Last edited by jt7272; 05-16-2019 at 01:29 PM.
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post #4472 of 5162 Old 05-16-2019, 01:46 PM
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Originally Posted by mattztt View Post
I've noticed this too and have started switching to other sources for SDR Netflix content so there's no unnecessary extra processing in the pipeline. You're never going to improve an SDR image by wrapping it in an HDR container but you can degrade it if it's not done right.
But it looks really good, like a perfect 1080p picture. It's not harming it, which actually makes no sense.

Amazon Prime is a disaster though with HDR material being forced to 60 Hz. You'd think that could be addressed with an update. If the disc can be played in 24p, why not Prime?

That just pushes Prime material over to my PS4, which isn't applying the tone mapping of the 820.

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post #4473 of 5162 Old 05-16-2019, 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Erod View Post
But it looks really good, like a perfect 1080p picture. It's not harming it, which actually makes no sense.
When you output SDR content to an SDR display you get output that is 100% accurate to the source. If you wrap SDR in an HDR container then you introduce the possibility of altering the output through poor mapping between the containers (see the Red Dead Redemption 2 fiasco) or unnecessary tone mapping which could darken the overall image or at least the brighter elements of the image to accommodate HDR highlights which would never appear in SDR content. This could be especially problematic for projectors.

Now the Panasonic UHD players being the top notch players they are may not actually suffer from these potential issues and likely do a great job of it. But if I instead stream SDR content from a device that will output it as SDR then there is no question. Additionally my projector won't unnecessarily flip to HDR mode, open the iris up, and turn on high lamp.
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post #4474 of 5162 Old 05-16-2019, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by docrog View Post
I was hoping that the "stuttering" issues in Amazon Video would have been addressed in the recent internet service maintenance. Despite owning both the ATV4K & Roku Ultra, my preference would be to use the UB820/9000 app for UHD/HDR Netflix & Amazon (and YouTube HDR) because the HDR Optimizer works much better with my JVC NX7 projector than HDR from either of the other 2 UHD streaming devices.
Seriously if you are interested in streaming, buy an Apple TV. Something that will allow frame rate matching. Stuttering can also be from the abomination that is 60 hz conversion of 24hz material. And nearly every Netflix app on everything other than an Apple TV and maybe one or two other devices will force 60hz.
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post #4475 of 5162 Old 05-16-2019, 02:22 PM
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I'm confused by recent posts. My comment regarding my preference for the UB820 over the Roku Ultra was specifically for streaming HDR content. Are you implying that content which is in SDR is being forced to HDR on UB820 output and therefore being "wrapped" in an incorrect envelope? AFAIK, with regards to my UB820 settings (I do NOT force SDR-BT2020 output), SDR remains SDR and only "native" HDR content will trip the JVC flag. No?

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post #4476 of 5162 Old 05-16-2019, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Erod View Post
But how much of that tone mapping is really applied to a network stream?

I have a JVC projector, too, and I do notice that SDR2020 is applied to literally every movie on Netflix through the ub820, regardless if its HDR or not.

You probably have SDR/HDR Network Conversion turned ON. This has the UB820 convert all SDR from Netflix and Amazon to HDR. Then if you are in SDR/BT2020 mode it might then tone map the converted HDR to SDR BT2020. In other words, SDR/REC709 -> HDR/BT2020 -> SDR/BT2020. This is one of several reasons I have SDR/HDR Network Conversion turned OFF.
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post #4477 of 5162 Old 05-16-2019, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by MOberhardt View Post
Seriously if you are interested in streaming, buy an Apple TV. Something that will allow frame rate matching. Stuttering can also be from the abomination that is 60 hz conversion of 24hz material. And nearly every Netflix app on everything other than an Apple TV and maybe one or two other devices will force 60hz.
As I'd previously written in the post which you quoted, I DO own the ATV4K. I have absolutely no Netflix issues when using the UB820 app, allowing me to make use of the Optimizer for HDR content.
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post #4478 of 5162 Old 05-16-2019, 10:15 PM
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Do any of the JVC projector users/experts know whether the 820 and it's UHD features are compatible with the slightly older 4K eshift projectors? I have a DLA-RS48 (X55) but cannot seem to find any feedback about compatibility this far back. JVC's website doesn't list these models in their support page when it comes to downloading the BT.2020 color gamut/file........the info screen while playing a 4K disc indicates that the player is displaying a 1080p signal rather than 4K. Was hoping to get by with the Panasonic UB820 and my 48 until it's time to upgrade to one of their new 4K models.
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post #4479 of 5162 Old 05-17-2019, 04:52 AM
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Originally Posted by audioguy3107 View Post
Do any of the JVC projector users/experts know whether the 820 and it's UHD features are compatible with the slightly older 4K eshift projectors? I have a DLA-RS48 (X55) but cannot seem to find any feedback about compatibility this far back. JVC's website doesn't list these models in their support page when it comes to downloading the BT.2020 color gamut/file........the info screen while playing a 4K disc indicates that the player is displaying a 1080p signal rather than 4K. Was hoping to get by with the Panasonic UB820 and my 48 until it's time to upgrade to one of their new 4K models.
This model is listed as having HDMI 1.4. It should be able to receive a 4k24 SDR signal. So you can try to set the output to SDR709 and it should work at 4k for Uhd blu-ray.

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post #4480 of 5162 Old 05-17-2019, 05:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audioguy3107 View Post
Do any of the JVC projector users/experts know whether the 820 and it's UHD features are compatible with the slightly older 4K eshift projectors? I have a DLA-RS48 (X55) but cannot seem to find any feedback about compatibility this far back. JVC's website doesn't list these models in their support page when it comes to downloading the BT.2020 color gamut/file........the info screen while playing a 4K disc indicates that the player is displaying a 1080p signal rather than 4K. Was hoping to get by with the Panasonic UB820 and my 48 until it's time to upgrade to one of their new 4K models.
To play 4K contents on the older eshift projectors you need an HDCP 2.2 to 1.4 converter such as this one
https://www.monoprice.com/product?c_...105&p_id=15242
EDIT: This works with the e-shift3 models such as the X500, but the e-shift2 models such as X55 do not accept 4K inputs.

The jvc calibration software required to load the BT.2020 software works with X95 and X75, but not X55:
https://www3.jvckenwood.com/english/...3_en_v1_03.pdf

Last edited by Dominic Chan; 05-17-2019 at 05:42 AM.
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post #4481 of 5162 Old 05-17-2019, 06:47 AM
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Originally Posted by jt7272 View Post
This model is listed as having HDMI 1.4. It should be able to receive a 4k24 SDR signal. So you can try to set the output to SDR709 and it should work at 4k for Uhd blu-ray.
Does not accept 4K input. From the user manual:

Digital Video Signal 480i, 480p, 576i, 576p, 720p/50 Hz, 720p/60 Hz, 1080i/50 Hz, 1080i/60 Hz,
1080p/24 Hz, 1080p/50 Hz, 1080p/60 Hz

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post #4482 of 5162 Old 05-17-2019, 06:49 AM
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Yikes. That is unfortunate. So that JVC has HDMI 1.4a (capable of 4k24 SDR) and 4k e-shift panels but it does not actually support 4k? Mind = blown

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post #4483 of 5162 Old 05-17-2019, 09:38 AM
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Originally Posted by jt7272 View Post
Yikes. That is unfortunate. So that JVC has HDMI 1.4a (capable of 4k24 SDR) and 4k e-shift panels but it does not actually support 4k? Mind = blown

Why is that mind-blowing? The new JVC RS3000 can't accept an 8K signal, but it has 8K e-shift. There's no standard to accept a signal for a format that doesn't exist is there?

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post #4484 of 5162 Old 05-17-2019, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by jh901 View Post
Why is that mind-blowing? The new JVC RS3000 can't accept an 8K signal, but it has 8K e-shift. There's no standard to accept a signal for a format that doesn't exist is there?
But there IS a standard to accept 4k24/4k30 with HDMI 1.4 and there were devices that used it. The same cannot be said for 8k at the moment.

EDIT:

Sorry for getting so far off-topic. Also sorry that the JVC won't do any 4k.

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post #4485 of 5162 Old 05-17-2019, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by claw View Post
Does not accept 4K input. From the user manual:

Digital Video Signal 480i, 480p, 576i, 576p, 720p/50 Hz, 720p/60 Hz, 1080i/50 Hz, 1080i/60 Hz,
1080p/24 Hz, 1080p/50 Hz, 1080p/60 Hz
Thanks guys, that’s kind of what I thought, I wasn’t sure if the eshift specs on mine were the same as on some of the later models.
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post #4486 of 5162 Old 05-17-2019, 02:23 PM
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Playing an mkv file through my UB820: I get an error message that the Audio Format is not supported.
This has a standard 5.1 track (not a hires one DTSHD-MA or DolbyTrueHD).

Do you know what the issue might be?

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post #4487 of 5162 Old 05-17-2019, 03:08 PM
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Can anyone confirm there's reasonable control4 drivers available for this? I'm planning on picking one up soonish.
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post #4488 of 5162 Old 05-19-2019, 07:48 AM
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I think that the biggest problem with Amazon prime is that they don't stream in 24p. IDK how a player at this price point, designed for this type of user, does not have 24p support for all streaming. It is beyond stupid.

Alas, I still have a Sony X800 which streams Netflix and Amazon Prime flawlessly. Unfortunately it is just about useless as a disc player (constant lockups). So, yes, I have the X800 solely for streaming as the UB820 is straight trash for it...
Our Sony X800 puts out an outstanding picture streaming, the up conversion looks great. Is the UB820 not up to the task?

Curious cause I'm looking to upgrade our player and we do a lot of Netflix streaming.

NEVERMIND. Read further and answered my own question.

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post #4489 of 5162 Old 05-19-2019, 08:00 AM
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deepsneaker appears to be located in Germany. The UB9000 remote is available from many online shops in Europe. I was never able to locate one from a US based shop. Maybe because there are only two US based retailers that sell the UB820 and UB9000 player.

The remote part number is N2QAYA000172.

I found a remote control retail shop in Spain that would ship to the US. It cost me $79 USD including shipping to US. It arrived 18 days after I placed my order.

https://mandisremotes.com/en/Panason...e-control.html

You can find the UB900 remote in the US on eBay and elsewhere. Its part number is N2QAYA000131. The main difference is that the UB900 remote does not have the HDR button that the UB9000 remote has.

Even the actual UB820 remote is difficult to find in the US. It is such a pain to use that I bought a UB9000 remote to use instead. The UB820 remote model number is N2QAYB001206. It appears you can get one from here for $16.95:

https://panasonic.encompass.com/item.../N2QAYB001206/


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I just purchased one from Spain for $2 more than you paid probably as the Euro fluctuates every day. Thanks for the info.
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post #4490 of 5162 Old 05-19-2019, 10:35 AM
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I ordered and received a UB9000 remote (not UB900) from a shop in Spain. With shipping charges to US and no VAT charged (VAT charges removed when shipping address/payment method provided and a commercial invoice is not requested), it came to just under $80 when converted to USD. Arrived 18 days after order placed.

Mandis Shop - Original Remote Control Panasonic UB9000 N2QAYA000172

Photo of UB820 remote vs the UB9000 remote I received:
Thanks Claw...just ordered this. $110 CDN and no tracking Here’s hoping!

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post #4491 of 5162 Old 05-19-2019, 07:59 PM
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HDR Picture Modes

Hi guys,

Anyone use these at all and more importantly what does it do to the image if changing from one to another . I think they are Standard, natural, light and bright.
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post #4492 of 5162 Old 05-20-2019, 07:33 AM
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Hi guys,

Anyone use these at all and more importantly what does it do to the image if changing from one to another . I think they are Standard, natural, light and bright.
I had my RS4500 Custom Calibrated by Chad B. so I use his settings.

Terry

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post #4493 of 5162 Old 05-20-2019, 08:04 AM
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I had my RS4500 Custom Calibrated by Chad B. so I use his settings.

Terry
The question pertains to the differences in the 820's HDR settings. Did your calibrator reference these?

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post #4494 of 5162 Old 05-20-2019, 09:01 AM
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The question pertains to the differences in the 820's HDR settings. Did your calibrator reference these?
I was not in the H/T when he did the Audio as well as the Video.
I do know both were set-up to work with one another.
And I recall Chad setting both the RS4500 as well as the UB820 to work together for all HDR content.
I'm referring to the Auto-Tone-Mapping feature of the UB820 Panasonic to work with the JVC RS4500 Laser projector.

Terry
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post #4495 of 5162 Old 05-20-2019, 02:24 PM
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Originally Posted by tigerhonaker View Post
I was not in the H/T when he did the Audio as well as the Video.
I do know both were set-up to work with one another.
And I recall Chad setting both the RS4500 as well as the UB820 to work together for all HDR content.
I'm referring to the Auto-Tone-Mapping feature of the UB820 Panasonic to work with the JVC RS4500 Laser projector.
Terry
Which AVR are you using?
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post #4496 of 5162 Old 05-20-2019, 02:45 PM
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Which AVR are you using?
Marantz AV8805 ...............


















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post #4497 of 5162 Old 05-20-2019, 03:01 PM
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I just hooked up my UB820 and there is an audio feature that "speaks" every command that you give the player. e.g. "Tray open", etc. The odd thing is that it barks out these commands at a rate that seems like 50% faster than normal. How do I turn this feature off? I've looked through the various menus to no avail. Help please.
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post #4498 of 5162 Old 05-20-2019, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by todaxy View Post
I just hooked up my UB820 and there is an audio feature that "speaks" every command that you give the player. e.g. "Tray open", etc. The odd thing is that it barks out these commands at a rate that seems like 50% faster than normal. How do I turn this feature off? I've looked through the various menus to no avail. Help please.
There is a "Voice Guidance Setting" in the Audio section of the main Settings menu. Disable it there, and you'll be good to go!

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post #4499 of 5162 Old 05-20-2019, 03:19 PM
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If you guys can live without the HDR button, Amazon has the N2QAYA000085. IIRC, it’s the remote for the DMP-BDT700 BD player. I picked one up for $20 a few months ago.
It seems to be stocked on an irregular basis so it’s worth checking every so often. It’s the best price I’ve found for one these premium Panny remotes.
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post #4500 of 5162 Old 05-20-2019, 03:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DLCPhoto View Post
There is a "Voice Guidance Setting" in the Audio section of the main Settings menu. Disable it there, and you'll be good to go!
I must have missed that! Thanks, I'll check it out.
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