Official Panasonic DP-UB820/824 Owner's Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 151 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #4501 of 4901 Old 05-20-2019, 09:05 PM
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Are there any Yamaha RX-A3080 owners from the USA monitoring this thread??

JVC NX7, Yamaha RX-A3080 (7.2.4 speaker layouts; Dolby Atmos & DTS:X), Panasonic UB820, Oppo 103D, ATV4K, Roku Ultra, TiVo Bolt Vox, Vandersteen Model 3 Signatures & VCC-1 Signature, SVS SB-2000 (2), Clark Synthesis Tactile Bass Transducers (2), Polk PSW-12
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post #4502 of 4901 Old 05-21-2019, 06:55 AM
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Originally Posted by docrog View Post
Are there any Yamaha RX-A3080 owners from the USA monitoring this thread??
Well, I own a RX-A3080 but probably can't help as I gave my UB820 to my son (along with my JVC x750) when I replaced it with a UB9000 to go with my JVC NX7. But, do you have a question? Maybe I could help (or someone else here).

1) JVC DLA-NX7 & Sony 65Z9D, Yamaha CX-A5200, Outlaw Audio 7900 & 7700, UDP-203, DP-UB9000, UBP-X800M2, Roku Ultra
2) Sony 75Z9D, Yamaha RX-A3080, 2xOutlaw Audio 2200s, UDP-203, UBP-X700, Roku Ultra
3) Sony 75X940E, Yamaha RX-A2080, UDP-203, UBP-X700, Roku Ultra
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post #4503 of 4901 Old 05-21-2019, 07:19 AM
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I'd like to get a survey of 820 owners who utilize the dual-HDMI outputs. Please simply quote post in the affirmative. Hoping there are maybe 5 or 10 of you checking in here periodically. Much appreciated!

HT: Panasonic DP-UB820 | JVC RS600 | 106" x 45" Stewart ST 100 | Cary Audio Cinema 12 | NAD M27 | Elac Uni-Fi UF5, UC5, Debut F5/B6; Focal CMS Sub
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post #4504 of 4901 Old 05-21-2019, 08:26 AM
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Originally Posted by jh901 View Post
I'd like to get a survey of 820 owners who utilize the dual-HDMI outputs. Please simply quote post in the affirmative. Hoping there are maybe 5 or 10 of you checking in here periodically. Much appreciated!
Affirmative.
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post #4505 of 4901 Old 05-21-2019, 08:47 AM
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Affirmative
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post #4506 of 4901 Old 05-21-2019, 09:00 AM
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Affirmative
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post #4507 of 4901 Old 05-21-2019, 09:25 AM
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Appreciated. Hoping we can track down a few more. Meantime, I'm hoping some of you maintain a fairly large UHD collection and have 7.1 surround.



Do any of you own X-Men Days of Future Past? Simply an easy example, of many, to demonstrate clearly the concern regarding the 820 DTSHD-MA 7.1 or Dolby TrueHD 7.1 Bitstream to PCM conversion.



There's a fairly long Cerebro scene with lots of reverb ("echo"). If you convert the DTS HD Master Audio to PCM in the 820, do you find that the sound is messed up? As if there's a rear channel delay. The bitstream should be obviously fine in comparison.



-------------------------------


I haven't tested this much, but it seems that native PCM 5.1 is being expanded to 7.1.



--------------------------------


Separately, though related in that this is a dual-HDMI problem, is the inability of the 820 to play movies with seamless branching. There are only two clear examples that I have, but there may be more. Both are Sony titles - Leon and Black Hawk Down. Each of them will "pause" ("freeze") periodically for a few seconds before playing again. Hoping we can get confirmation that others have this problem.


_______________________


Finally, I'll simply note, as an aside, that my former player Panny UB900 could not properly send DTSHD-MA 7.1 or Dolby TrueHD 7.1 bitstream when Atmos/DTS:X was included. I'd get rear channel sync pops during playback. Thought it was my AVP. Nope. (My work around was converting to PCM, which I was ok with, generally speaking). The 820 is performing just great with the bitstream (and, oddly, not the PCM!). I'm very pleased to send bitstream, of course, but there's still apparently some dual-HDMI problems.

HT: Panasonic DP-UB820 | JVC RS600 | 106" x 45" Stewart ST 100 | Cary Audio Cinema 12 | NAD M27 | Elac Uni-Fi UF5, UC5, Debut F5/B6; Focal CMS Sub
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post #4508 of 4901 Old 05-21-2019, 09:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post
Appreciated. Hoping we can track down a few more. Meantime, I'm hoping some of you maintain a fairly large UHD collection and have 7.1 surround.



Do any of you own X-Men Days of Future Past? Simply an easy example, of many, to demonstrate clearly the concern regarding the 820 DTSHD-MA 7.1 or Dolby TrueHD 7.1 Bitstream to PCM conversion.



There's a fairly long Cerebro scene with lots of reverb ("echo"). If you convert the DTS HD Master Audio to PCM in the 820, do you find that the sound is messed up? As if there's a rear channel delay. The bitstream should be obviously fine in comparison.



-------------------------------


I haven't tested this much, but it seems that native PCM 5.1 is being expanded to 7.1.



--------------------------------


Separately, though related in that this is a dual-HDMI problem, is the inability of the 820 to play movies with seamless branching. There are only two clear examples that I have, but there may be more. Both are Sony titles - Leon and Black Hawk Down. Each of them will "pause" ("freeze") periodically for a few seconds before playing again. Hoping we can get confirmation that others have this problem.


_______________________


Finally, I'll simply note, as an aside, that my former player Panny UB900 could not properly send DTSHD-MA 7.1 or Dolby TrueHD 7.1 bitstream when Atmos/DTS:X was included. I'd get rear channel sync pops during playback. Thought it was my AVP. Nope. (My work around was converting to PCM, which I was ok with, generally speaking). The 820 is performing just great with the bitstream (and, oddly, not the PCM!). I'm very pleased to send bitstream, of course, but there's still apparently some dual-HDMI problems.
Affirmative - using dual HDMI

You are correct that the 820 is converting 5.1 to 7.1 even with that setting turned off. You are also correct that there is some odd delay in the surround back channels being created either by this up conversion or some other issue. It occurs with both 5.1 and 7.1 sources. It could be that some kind of matrix processing is being applied to both 5.1 and 7.1 and that process introduces the delay. I hear it mostly on the WB and 20th Century Fox fanfare music. If you listen to it bit-streamed and then PCM it is very obvious.

I asked Panasonic support to kick this up to engineering, as well as the black hawk down issue, last week but have not heard back. We need more people to get on Panasonic for a fix. If it weren't for the tone mapping I need, I would have changed to another player by now because of the audio issue.

Glad to see others noticing this as well...it's been bothering me for over 6 months now.
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post #4509 of 4901 Old 05-21-2019, 10:49 AM
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^Noted. Appreciated.


I'm now paranoid that they'll actually fix this thing at some point and then I'll have the UB900 problem back again! That problem was related to Atmos/DTS:X where the compatible 7.1 sent to my Prepro caused rear channel "sync pops". Not super loud, damage the speakers pops, but rather little "pops" during playback. I tested this with many titles just to be sure. And when there was no Atmos/DTS:X included, well, 7.1 bitstream worked fine every time. As for the "freeze", well, this was definitely a UB900 problem as well.



I sort of think they implement something differently in the UB820, solved the one problem, didn't address the "freeze", and created the PCM issue!

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post #4510 of 4901 Old 05-21-2019, 10:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post
I'd like to get a survey of 820 owners who utilize the dual-HDMI outputs. Please simply quote post in the affirmative. Hoping there are maybe 5 or 10 of you checking in here periodically. Much appreciated!
Negatory

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post #4511 of 4901 Old 05-21-2019, 11:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bwillcox View Post
Well, I own a RX-A3080 but probably can't help as I gave my UB820 to my son (along with my JVC x750) when I replaced it with a UB9000 to go with my JVC NX7. But, do you have a question? Maybe I could help (or someone else here).
Thanks. The 9000 is just as relevant for my question. I'll be sending you a PM.
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post #4512 of 4901 Old 05-21-2019, 12:59 PM
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Red face Please Wait message fix

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clark Burk View Post
The return player to factory defaults may work if it’s responsive. Try this:

1. Turn the unit on.
2. Press and hold [OK], the [Y - Yellow] button and the [B - Blue] button on the remote control at the same time for more than 5 seconds. “00 RET” is displayed on the unit’s display.
3. Press [►] right repeatedly on the remote control until “08 FIN” is displayed on the unit’s display.
4. Press and hold [OK] for more than 5 seconds.

If this doesn’t work it sounds like your player may need service.
Just want to say this fix worked. Saved me from sending the unit back to Panasonic or taking it to get fixed somewhere.
Thanks again!
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post #4513 of 4901 Old 05-22-2019, 06:55 AM
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4k UHD Black Hawk Down playback OK

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Originally Posted by jh901 View Post
Separately, though related in that this is a dual-HDMI problem, is the inability of the 820 to play movies with seamless branching. There are only two clear examples that I have, but there may be more. Both are Sony titles - Leon and Black Hawk Down. Each of them will "pause" ("freeze") periodically for a few seconds before playing again. Hoping we can get confirmation that others have this problem.
My setup is dual-HDMI (HDMI 1---->Sony 4k projector; HDMI 2--->Sony AV receiver). Playback of 4K Black Hawk Down (both theatrical & extended cuts) was flawless with NO FREEZES or AUDIO DELAYS.
My 820 is on the latest firmware BTW. Haven't tried my copy of LEON yet.
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post #4514 of 4901 Old 05-22-2019, 07:03 AM
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Originally Posted by rexdragon View Post
My setup is dual-HDMI (HDMI 1---->Sony 4k projector; HDMI 2--->Sony AV receiver). Playback of 4K Black Hawk Down (both theatrical & extended cuts) was flawless with NO FREEZES or AUDIO DELAYS.
My 820 is on the latest firmware BTW. Haven't tried my copy of LEON yet.

Ok. Much appreciated!


So, the question then comes down to Atmos vs. Dolby TrueHD 7.1.


If your AVR has the Atmos enabled, then is there an easy way to disable such that the 7.1 is processed? Would be terrific if we were able to nail down the problem and repeat it.

HT: Panasonic DP-UB820 | JVC RS600 | 106" x 45" Stewart ST 100 | Cary Audio Cinema 12 | NAD M27 | Elac Uni-Fi UF5, UC5, Debut F5/B6; Focal CMS Sub
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post #4515 of 4901 Old 05-22-2019, 03:40 PM
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Right now i am using an xbox one s for my uhd blu ray player. Would using this Panasonic as a standalone player instead have a noticeable difference?
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post #4516 of 4901 Old 05-22-2019, 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted by rogerpm5k View Post
Right now i am using an xbox one s for my uhd blu ray player. Would using this Panasonic as a standalone player instead have a noticeable difference?
Noticeable? Yes, particularly on UHD BDs that were mastered dark. (The Revenant, or Solo: A Star Wars Story.) That, on an LG B7A OLED TV.

The 820 is much more expensive than an Xbox One S. I can't guess whether the difference would be worthwhile for you.

Last edited by bobknavs; 05-23-2019 at 10:17 AM.
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post #4517 of 4901 Old 05-23-2019, 08:17 AM
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Right now i am using an xbox one s for my uhd blu ray player. Would using this Panasonic as a standalone player instead have a noticeable difference?
I just checked acouple movies and played them both on xbox and the ub820 and I saw a pretty big difference in Dark knight rises 4k the colors were different the first plane scene inside the plane it looked too green on xbox and the sand before they get in the plane looked alittle too yellow the clouds look overblown white and the whole picture doesnt seem tight enough I also checked war of the planet of the apes 4k and xbox just looked kinda bland while hdr really shined on the pany the picture just looks more crisp and detailed I also checked alien covenant ready player one rampage wonder woman and sicario and pretty much every movie has a more vibrant crisper cleaner look and it seems to upscale regular blurays pretty well so Im keeping the panasonic for movies I tested the ub820, a sony x800m2 along with the xbox one s all same movies same settings and I felt its a big enough difference where to me its worth the price the sony was great too but panasonic usually seemed to have the better picture and better hdr. So if youre thinking about it just buy one and do a comparison you should see a difference and I dont know if its just me but I couldnt get my xbox one s to show in dolby vision which the ub820 does great. hope that helps
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post #4518 of 4901 Old 05-24-2019, 04:28 PM
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Captain America PCM showing not Atmos

Hi folks...

Playing the 4K disc Captain America The Winter Soldier, it has an Atmos track as the 1st track...for some reason this is showing as PCM 2.0 on my Anthem MRX 1120’s display, even tho it sounds Multi Channel...I have had no issues playing Atmos discs in the past...is there a setting on the 820 that may be causing this PCM 2.0 to be sent? Everything is set to bitstream on the Panny as far as I know and using HDMI (video and audio out)...Thanks folks

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post #4519 of 4901 Old 05-24-2019, 08:32 PM
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Right now i have a Sony X800 BD player. What would the benefits be if i went with the Panasonic DP-UB820 over the Sony? I have a BenQ LK970 laser DLP PJ. I want to watch 4k movies on the BD player but the PJ i have does not have HDR. I heard the Panasonic can "trick" the 4k to make it seem HDR? I could be completely wrong. Sorry if i was all over the place I am a newbie with most of this stuff!
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post #4520 of 4901 Old 05-24-2019, 09:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sound2017 View Post
Right now i have a Sony X800 BD player. What would the benefits be if i went with the Panasonic DP-UB820 over the Sony? I have a BenQ LK970 laser DLP PJ. I want to watch 4k movies on the BD player but the PJ i have does not have HDR. I heard the Panasonic can "trick" the 4k to make it seem HDR? I could be completely wrong. Sorry if i was all over the place I am a newbie with most of this stuff!
Search on "SDR 2020".

That allows a non-HDR signal to be sent with the HDR gamut.

Not something I've tried, as I have an HDR TV, rather than a proj.
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post #4521 of 4901 Old 05-25-2019, 12:18 AM
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Does anyone know what does 0 represent in the gamma value in the panasonic ?


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post #4522 of 4901 Old 05-25-2019, 02:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sound2017 View Post
Right now i have a Sony X800 BD player. What would the benefits be if i went with the Panasonic DP-UB820 over the Sony? I have a BenQ LK970 laser DLP PJ. I want to watch 4k movies on the BD player but the PJ i have does not have HDR. I heard the Panasonic can "trick" the 4k to make it seem HDR? I could be completely wrong. Sorry if i was all over the place I am a newbie with most of this stuff!
You are on the right track and will benefit from a UB820 but your thinking about it a bit backwards. The biggest benefit of the UB820 for projector owners is its ability to modify the disc content to match the projector capabilities. This will leave you with the best possible picture with the least hassle. The UB820 does all the processing and the projector just has to spit out the image.

I made a UB820 & JVC Guide, you can follow it and adjust your projector settings accordingly.

The BenQ LK970 is a unique projector since it doesn't support HDR or BT2020. That means when you follow my guide, you'll have to set your UB820 to SDR/BT.709 (not SDR/BT.2020) to match your projectors capabilities. You will essentially be feeding your projector a 4K SDR/BT709 image, which is what you want to do since that is all your projector can handle.

Also, don't get too hung up on "HDR", it isn't what most people think it is. Even on HDR capable projectors and displays, 100% Black, White, Red, Green, Blue is the same in SDR or HDR. It's not like when you watch "HDR" content the display magically gets brighter or has greater black levels. That is why SDR looks better on an "HDR" display, it isn't secret HDR sauce, it's just a better display. Most people do not understand that and this post will likely lead to confusion.

My projector has "HDR" and can handle BT2020 (Wide Color Gamut) signals...but 4K still looks better with the UB820 in SDR2020 mode and that is true for almost all projector owners.
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post #4523 of 4901 Old 05-25-2019, 03:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asharma View Post
Hi folks...

Playing the 4K disc Captain America The Winter Soldier, it has an Atmos track as the 1st track...for some reason this is showing as PCM 2.0 on my Anthem MRX 1120’s display, even tho it sounds Multi Channel...I have had no issues playing Atmos discs in the past...is there a setting on the 820 that may be causing this PCM 2.0 to be sent? Everything is set to bitstream on the Panny as far as I know and using HDMI (video and audio out)...Thanks folks
Any input would be appreciated, thanks folks

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post #4524 of 4901 Old 05-25-2019, 11:06 AM
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Any input would be appreciated, thanks folks
Seems like not a lot of response. My take would be to double check the audio track when the movie is playing. Some movies default to 2 channel and must be changed to get the multi channel mix. Other than that not really up on the receiver so I can’t help much there.
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post #4525 of 4901 Old 05-25-2019, 11:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreamliner View Post
Also, don't get too hung up on "HDR", it isn't what most people think it is. Even on HDR capable projectors and displays, 100% Black, White, Red, Green, Blue is the same in SDR or HDR. It's not like when you watch "HDR" content the display magically gets brighter or has greater black levels. That is why SDR looks better on an "HDR" display, it isn't secret HDR sauce, it's just a better display. Most people do not understand that and this post will likely lead to confusion.
I don't understand this comment. I accept the fact that black levels on HDR content on my HDR display are not blacker (since black is black), and perhaps it is true that, say, green is not more green from an HDR source, but the dynamic range of HDR on an HDR display is noticeably different than with SDR. For example, a sunny scene outdoors looks like much more close to what you would see in terms of dynamic range if you went outside your house on a sunny day. It is indeed "brighter."

And I would say that SDR looks better on a HDR display primarily due to the upscaling of content to 4k, and also because it is a "better display" in terms of contrast levels, black levels, etc. But SDR on an HDR display does not look as good as the same material in HDR.

Maybe I'm missing something or not understanding.
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post #4526 of 4901 Old 05-25-2019, 12:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clark Burk View Post
Seems like not a lot of response. My take would be to double check the audio track when the movie is playing. Some movies default to 2 channel and must be changed to get the multi channel mix. Other than that not really up on the receiver so I can’t help much there.
Thanks Clark...that’s the thing, I can chose the Dolby TrueHd track on the disc and when I press the playback info button info shows as 4k24 but with PCM 2.0...it’s the 2nd row in the playback info status window that shows PCM 2.0. The first line in the status window shows Dolby TrueHD...is that any help?

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post #4527 of 4901 Old 05-25-2019, 12:07 PM
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Originally Posted by smitty View Post
I don't understand this comment. I accept the fact that black levels on HDR content on my HDR display are not blacker (since black is black), and perhaps it is true that, say, green is not more green from an HDR source, but the dynamic range of HDR on an HDR display is noticeably different than with SDR. For example, a sunny scene outdoors looks like much more close to what you would see in terms of dynamic range if you went outside your house on a sunny day. It is indeed "brighter."

And I would say that SDR looks better on a HDR display primarily due to the upscaling of content to 4k, and also because it is a "better display" in terms of contrast levels, black levels, etc. But SDR on an HDR display does not look as good as the same material in HDR.

Maybe I'm missing something or not understanding.
HDR content does have more color space available (BT2020 vs Rec 709) aka "Wide Color Gamut" but if you put in a SDR test disc and pulled up 100% Black, White, Red, Green, Blue it would be the exact same as doing the same thing with a HDR test disc. The test image says "100% White, go!" and the projector sends out "100% White". Perhaps I could have picked a better example, because if the display was correctly hitting the appropriate 709/2020 targets, the color intensity should be different. The targets are closer than people think though, especially blue.

This is why so many projector owners are gravitating towards the UB820 for disc playback. To make "HDR" on a projector, compromises are made. How do you make a scene appear twice as bright as the rest of the movie? Simple, make the rest of the movie half as bright. This is the reason so many projector owners complain about "dark 4K HDR" and why tone-mapping to SDR makes 4K discs beautiful.

If your brightness only goes to "10" it will make the average brightness of the movie "5" to create the HDR effect with peaks of "10", where it would otherwise have all 10 available. But if you have a super high brightness panel that goes to say "15", then the average brightness is say "8" for the same effect. What usually ends up happening is an artificial clamping down of SDR to make HDR appear more brilliant. This is why tone mapping is starting to roll out. To match content to display ability.

Now, it may be true that if you have a panel capable of more it will restrict SDR through color profiles and picture modes, but if you turn the brightness up on your panel I don't think it only gives you say 50% brightness in SDR, but 100% in HDR.

Here is another misnomer for you: Most people think OLED's are the brightest HDR there is. Not true. The advantage of OLED is black level, not peak brightness. There are currently at least 15 LED TV models with higher peak brightness than the brightest OLED panel you can buy.
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post #4528 of 4901 Old 05-25-2019, 12:14 PM
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Thanks Clark...that’s the thing, I can chose the Dolby TrueHd track on the disc and when I press the playback info button info shows as 4k24 but with PCM 2.0...it’s the 2nd row in the playback info status window that shows PCM 2.0. The first line in the status window shows Dolby TrueHD...is that any help?
So you select Atmos on the Winter Soldier Disc and the Panasonic playback info screen says PCM 2.0? What does it say with other 4K Atmos discs? I can check my Winter Soldier disc in a couple hours but I'm 99.9% sure it's Atmos being sent to my receiver...
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post #4529 of 4901 Old 05-25-2019, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Dreamliner View Post
So you select Atmos on the Winter Soldier Disc and the Panasonic playback info screen says PCM 2.0? What does it say with other 4K Atmos discs? I can check my Winter Soldier disc in a couple hours but I'm 99.9% sure it's Atmos being sent to my receiver...
I’ll check mine later too but it sounds like it may be AVR related. I hate to say it as I know he’s up to date on the AVR firmware updates but check that too but it sounds like it may be AVR related. My WS copy is from Europe, the 3 disc version set but I’ll check it later. May not be apples to apples but I’ll check.
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post #4530 of 4901 Old 05-25-2019, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Dreamliner View Post
So you select Atmos on the Winter Soldier Disc and the Panasonic playback info screen says PCM 2.0? What does it say with other 4K Atmos discs? I can check my Winter Soldier disc in a couple hours but I'm 99.9% sure it's Atmos being sent to my receiver...
Thanks man, on the Anthem receiver it says Atmos on any other disc...I believe on the status window on the panny it says Dolby TrueHd on any other Atmos disc but it definitely doesnt say pcm 2.0.

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