Official Panasonic DP-UB820/824 Owner's Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 205 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #6121 of 6197 Old 11-10-2019, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by SubElement View Post
Can someone help me with this Dolby Vision and "low-latency" Dolby Vision thing? I am so incredibly confused...

In discussing if DV should be output in BT.2020 with someone on another forum they mentioned this:




So what is the UB820 doing here? Should it be RGB? Or YPbCr?
You can set color space to auto and the player will figure it out. You don't need to get into the weeds.

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post #6122 of 6197 Old 11-10-2019, 09:46 PM
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You can set color space to auto and the player will figure it out. You don't need to get into the weeds.

Oh yes, I agree completely. But they seem to be implying that if it isn't outputting in RGB it isn't correct. I just wanted to try and understand what is going on between these two revisions of DV.
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post #6123 of 6197 Old 11-11-2019, 06:26 AM
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Originally Posted by bo55554r View Post
i returned the product!
the product is not salable to customers!
there is no end to his flaws!
The UB820 has worked flawlessly for me from day one.
But I was looking for a very good video disc player, which it is.

Maybe you'll do a little more investigating and find a component that actually does what you want it to do next time.
Good luck and goodbye.
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post #6124 of 6197 Old 11-11-2019, 07:44 AM
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Originally Posted by SubElement View Post
Oh yes, I agree completely. But they seem to be implying that if it isn't outputting in RGB it isn't correct. I just wanted to try and understand what is going on between these two revisions of DV.
I am uncertain but I've never had to even look. I just assumed it was outputting correctly because it looked awesome...I am not even sure what "low latency" DV is...I know there are different "Profiles"...some for disc and some for streaming I believe.

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post #6125 of 6197 Old 11-11-2019, 08:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SubElement View Post
Can someone help me with this Dolby Vision and "low-latency" Dolby Vision thing? I am so incredibly confused...

In discussing if DV should be output in BT.2020 with someone on another forum they mentioned this:

So what is the UB820 doing here? Should it be RGB? Or YPbCr?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SubElement View Post
Oh yes, I agree completely. But they seem to be implying that if it isn't outputting in RGB it isn't correct. I just wanted to try and understand what is going on between these two revisions of DV.
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Originally Posted by joshua goard View Post
I am uncertain but I've never had to even look. I just assumed it was outputting correctly because it looked awesome...I am not even sure what "low latency" DV is...I know there are different "Profiles"...some for disc and some for streaming I believe.
With most Dolby Vision TVs, the player sends a 4K24 RGB 8-bit signal to the TV. All the Dolby Vision good stuff is wrapped inside of the RGB container. The TV then decodes the signal and processes the Dolby Vision input.

But Sony TVs don't have the ability to decode and process that full Dolby Vision signal. So Sony worked with Dolby to implement what they call Low Latency Dolby Vision or LLDV. In this case the player does most of the work. It decodes the Dolby Vision content, processes it, and outputs a 4K24 4:2:2 BT2020 12-bit Dolby Vision signal to the Sony TV.

With Sony TVs, 4K24 4:2:2 BT2020 12-bit Dolby Vision is correct.
With other brands of Dolby Vision TVs, 4K24 RGB 8-bit Dolby Vision is correct.

Note there are some TVs such as LG OLEDs that can accept and process either signal.

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post #6126 of 6197 Old 11-11-2019, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by claw View Post
With most Dolby Vision TVs, the player sends a 4K24 RGB 8-bit signal to the TV. All the Dolby Vision good stuff is wrapped inside of the RGB container. The TV then decodes the signal and processes the Dolby Vision input.

But Sony TVs don't have the ability to decode and process that full Dolby Vision signal. So Sony worked with Dolby to implement what they call Low Latency Dolby Vision or LLDV. In this case the player does most of the work. It decodes the Dolby Vision content, processes it, and outputs a 4K24 4:2:2 BT2020 12-bit Dolby Vision signal to the Sony TV.

With Sony TVs, 4K24 4:2:2 BT2020 12-bit Dolby Vision is correct.
With other brands of Dolby Vision TVs, 4K24 RGB 8-bit Dolby Vision is correct.

Note there are some TVs such as LG OLEDs that can accept and process either signal.

Okay thank you, would you mind helping me out here because maybe I'm reading these incorrectly. This is what initially started the discussion. This is the HDMI info panel on my LG C9 with:


nVidia Shield Pro outputting Netflix Dolby Vision. Seemingly RGB 8bit in 709



https://imgur.com/a/ufy53Qs


UB820 playing The Matrix in Dolby Vision. Seemingly RGB 8bit in 2020.


https://imgur.com/a/KRnzGz7


Which is "correct"? Should the nVidia Shield Pro be in 2020? Am I misunderstanding how all this should work?
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post #6127 of 6197 Old 11-11-2019, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Pip View Post
Unfortunately, the 820 can only convert HDR to SDR from Amazon prime. Due to a flaw with the Netflix app, it cannot do this conversion for Netflix. The best it can do for projectors with Netflix is to apply the HDR optimizer. This is usually a very subtle improvement.

Also unfortunately, the Amazon prime app on the 820, is so problematic that it’s almost useless. The Amazon prime app is fraught with problems on many devices – not just the 820.

Pip

The 820 has stunning PQ for UHD , and HDR makes a huge difference - however (fortunately) there's a ton of the 4K content via streaming.
So what do people with such projectors that need the HDR conversion (e.g some JVC) do for streaming to get the full (or close enough to it) HDR improvement?
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post #6128 of 6197 Old 11-11-2019, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by cgott42 View Post
The 820 has stunning PQ for UHD , and HDR makes a huge difference - however (fortunately) there's a ton of the 4K content via streaming.
So what do people with such projectors that need the HDR conversion (e.g some JVC) do for streaming to get the full (or close enough to it) HDR improvement?
I recently purchased the Apple ATV4K 64 and I have the Roku Ultra and Netflix on the UB820.

Of those three, my new favorite is the Apple ATV4k because it is working with the HDFury Dolby Vision LLDV EDID hack. You can read more about it at the link in my sig.

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post #6129 of 6197 Old 11-11-2019, 01:11 PM
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I recently purchased the Apple ATV4K 64 and I have the Roku Ultra and Netflix on the UB820.

Of those three, my new favorite is the Apple ATV4k because it is working with the HDFury Dolby Vision LLDV EDID hack. You can read more about it at the link in my sig.
The first post in that thread does not seem to mention the ATV4K?
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post #6130 of 6197 Old 11-11-2019, 01:26 PM
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The first post in that thread does not seem to mention the ATV4K?
Thank you dominic, I did have added a reference in the 1st and 3rd posts, in addition to where the ATV4K is mentioned later in the thread.

I will edit and consolidate the 1st three posts, to better summarize what we know so far.

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post #6131 of 6197 Old 11-12-2019, 06:43 AM
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I know it's being hopeful, but...

Anyone think we'll get Disney+ on this thing?
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post #6132 of 6197 Old 11-12-2019, 08:42 AM
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Originally Posted by bo55554r View Post
is that a joke ? Where is HDR here ? is this a device problem ? Or so it is shown on Netflix ?

this no HDR color system
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Originally Posted by bo55554r View Post
two years Sony could not broadcast Dolby Vision and they had many problems.
now you're saying that the best broadcast quality is on Sony TV ?

how can other manufacturers guarantee Dolby Vision ? they only have 8 BITs
and the system of colors not Dolby Vision or HDR ?
It is well known (but apparently not by all) that Dolby Vision is sent to TVs wrapped inside a 4K RGB 8-bit container. Do some homework.

Sony was unable to add Dolby Vision support to their existing line of TVs; whether it was because they were unable to implement support into their "extreme" processor or for other reasons. So they worked with Dolby and the result was "Low Latency Dolby Vision" (LLDV). LLDV puts most of the work onto the player instead of the TV. LLDV is sent to TVs as a 4K 4:2:2 12-bit signal.

LLDV at 4K 4:2:2 12-bit does not make it better than Dolby Vision at 4K RGB 8-bit. The Dolby Vision inside the RGB 8-bit container is still 12-bit.
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post #6133 of 6197 Old 11-12-2019, 10:20 AM
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Forgive me if this has been addressed before but........Just got the 820 last night, and I'm experiencing some weird issues. Already did a factory reset, as well as installed the latest firmware, but neither corrected the problems.

(1) When I watch Netflix, even the log-In screen, my JVC RS-520 is going into HDR mode, and stays there unless I go into the projector menu and select another picture setting. It does not do this with Amazon unless the signal is actually HDR.

(2) I get Atmos with Netflix, but not Amazon.

(3) When in Netflix, and watching material that's just 2 channel audio, the 820 is sending a DD+ 5.1 signal to my Marantz SR 7011 receiver, but all I'm getting is two channel Front L and R audio (because that's all it is). This is a problem because it won't allow the receiver to apply any processing to the signal to turn 2 channel into multi channel audio.

My Samsung 9500 that I have been using does none of the above, however with the 9500 I can get Atmos with Amazon, but not Netflix.

Before I return the unit, I was wondering if anyone else has experienced this, and if so, is there is a fix?

Mark
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post #6134 of 6197 Old 11-12-2019, 12:35 PM
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Forgive me if this has been addressed before but........Just got the 820 last night, and I'm experiencing some weird issues. Already did a factory reset, as well as installed the latest firmware, but neither corrected the problems.

(1) When I watch Netflix, even the log-In screen, my JVC RS-520 is going into HDR mode, and stays there unless I go into the projector menu and select another picture setting. It does not do this with Amazon unless the signal is actually HDR.

(2) I get Atmos with Netflix, but not Amazon.

(3) When in Netflix, and watching material that's just 2 channel audio, the 820 is sending a DD+ 5.1 signal to my Marantz SR 7011 receiver, but all I'm getting is two channel Front L and R audio (because that's all it is). This is a problem because it won't allow the receiver to apply any processing to the signal to turn 2 channel into multi channel audio.

My Samsung 9500 that I have been using does none of the above, however with the 9500 I can get Atmos with Amazon, but not Netflix.

Before I return the unit, I was wondering if anyone else has experienced this, and if so, is there is a fix?
(1) Do you have Advanced Settings...SDR/HDR Conv. (Network Service) turned ON? If so it will convert Netflix menus from SDR to HDR. Turn it OFF if you don't want the menus output in HDR.

(2) There is very little content in Amazon that has an Atmos track.

(3) Do you have Audio set to Bitstream? You want Bitstream audio sent to your AVR.

– Dolby Audio: “Bitstream”
– DTS/DTS-HD: “Bitstream”
– BD-Video Secondary Audio: “Off”

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post #6135 of 6197 Old 11-12-2019, 03:29 PM
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Originally Posted by claw View Post
(1) Do you have Advanced Settings...SDR/HDR Conv. (Network Service) turned ON? If so it will convert Netflix menus from SDR to HDR. Turn it OFF if you don't want the menus output in HDR.

(2) There is very little content in Amazon that has an Atmos track.

(3) Do you have Audio set to Bitstream? You want Bitstream audio sent to your AVR.

– Dolby Audio: “Bitstream”
– DTS/DTS-HD: “Bitstream”
– BD-Video Secondary Audio: “Off”
(1) Changed the SDR/HDR Conv to off, that fixed the always on HDR issue with Netflix

(3) Yes to all. Had them set that way.

So I tried 15 different Netflix titles, all clearly labeled HDR. Out of the 15, only two kicked my projector into HDR mode. Tried the same thing with my Samsung 4K player......All 15 kicked the HDR on
I then Tried a bunch of Amazon HDR content, both the Pannisonic 820 and the Samsung sent an HDR signal to the projector.

I then tried 10 Netflix shows/movies that showed as being Atmos. Out of the 10, the player only sent one to the Marantz as Atmos, the others all played as DD+

Anything that's two channel audio content on Netflix is being sent to the receiver as DD+, even though it's only two channel stereo, therby preventing the receiver from doing any surround processing.

Unless someone has a suggestion, I'm going to assume I've got a defective unit.

Mark
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post #6136 of 6197 Old 11-12-2019, 03:50 PM
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Originally Posted by snave8 View Post
(1) Changed the SDR/HDR Conv to off, that fixed the always on HDR issue with Netflix

(3) Yes to all. Had them set that way.

So I tried 15 different Netflix titles, all clearly labeled HDR. Out of the 15, only two kicked my projector into HDR mode. Tried the same thing with my Samsung 4K player......All 15 kicked the HDR on
I then Tried a bunch of Amazon HDR content, both the Pannisonic 820 and the Samsung sent an HDR signal to the projector.

I then tried 10 Netflix shows/movies that showed as being Atmos. Out of the 10, the player only sent one to the Marantz as Atmos, the others all played as DD+

Anything that's two channel audio content on Netflix is being sent to the receiver as DD+, even though it's only two channel stereo, therby preventing the receiver from doing any surround processing.

Unless someone has a suggestion, I'm going to assume I've got a defective unit.
All Netflix audio is DD+ as far as I know. My Denon allows me to apply Dolby Surround mixing to it.

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post #6137 of 6197 Old 11-12-2019, 04:01 PM
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All Netflix audio is DD+ as far as I know. My Denon allows me to apply Dolby Surround mixing to it.
ATMOS is supported in NETFLIX with 820.
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post #6138 of 6197 Old 11-12-2019, 05:08 PM
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ATMOS is supported in NETFLIX with 820.
Still DD+ but with Atmos metadata.

Everything works fine here.
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post #6139 of 6197 Old 11-12-2019, 08:12 PM
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So guys has anyone went from an xbox one x as a player to this Panasonic? I want a great disc player and I seem to be getting stuttering on the latest update from Xbox. I'm not that worried about apps as I have a roku and lg c8 oled. The ability to play discs back in Dolby Vision is intriguing too. I'm really sick of the little issues with the Xbox and am ready to use it for gaming only I think. Which it is pretty great at. Thanks for any insight in advance!
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post #6140 of 6197 Old 11-12-2019, 09:56 PM
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So guys has anyone went from an xbox one x as a player to this Panasonic? I want a great disc player and I seem to be getting stuttering on the latest update from Xbox. I'm not that worried about apps as I have a roku and lg c8 oled. The ability to play discs back in Dolby Vision is intriguing too. I'm really sick of the little issues with the Xbox and am ready to use it for gaming only I think. Which it is pretty great at. Thanks for any insight in advance!
Yup. Xbox One S to Sony X800, to Sony X700, to Panasonic. I'll say this, the Xbox is PURE TRASH for disc playback and especially streaming. Everything is dim and looks like crap. HDR is broken and it doesn't even look like HDR.
When I play a movie on Vudu on my Xbox and then play the same movie on my Sony z9d built in app the Xbox looks like it doesn't even know what HDR is...The Panasonic would be like comparing a Farrari to a piece of $#!T...Lol, that is a little extreme, but yeah, the Panasonic blows the Xbox away. It's night and day.

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post #6141 of 6197 Old 11-12-2019, 10:49 PM
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.....Anything that's two channel audio content on Netflix is being sent to the receiver as DD+, even though it's only two channel stereo, therby preventing the receiver from doing any surround processing.
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All Netflix audio is DD+ as far as I know. My Denon allows me to apply Dolby Surround mixing to it.
My Denon also allows Dolby or DTS Surround mixing applied to two channel Netflix, so I'd assume you're Marantz does as well (Denon and Marantz are sibling units.) To do this, change from "Auto Surround" to "Movie Mode" (Denon terminology).

Quote:
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So I tried 15 different Netflix titles, all clearly labeled HDR. Out of the 15, only two kicked my projector into HDR mode. Tried the same thing with my Samsung 4K player......All 15 kicked the HDR on....

Unless someone has a suggestion, I'm going to assume I've got a defective unit.
The 820 Netflix app has known issues with HDR (well documented in this thread). Although your issue seems rare, it could be a one off or a temporary problem. Are these 13/15 issues consistent? Each title always does the same? To diagnose issues specific to your unit, it would be helpful to list some specific HDR titles which do not activate HDR on your projector, and the two titles that do. That way someone can compare their 820 to yours.

Unfortunately, the 820 Amazon app also has known issues, ie. stuttering, although this occurs on many other streaming devices also. Prime Video problems are widespread and hardly limited to Panasonic.

Lastly, as has been well discussed in this thread, the 820 is a fantastic player for discs, but as a streaming device, it is both limited and clunky.

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post #6142 of 6197 Old 11-13-2019, 07:44 AM
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My Denon also allows Dolby or DTS Surround mixing applied to two channel Netflix, so I'd assume you're Marantz does as well (Denon and Marantz are sibling units.) To do this, change from "Auto Surround" to "Movie Mode" (Denon terminology).



The 820 Netflix app has known issues with HDR (well documented in this thread). Although your issue seems rare, it could be a one off or a temporary problem. Are these 13/15 issues consistent? Each title always does the same? To diagnose issues specific to your unit, it would be helpful to list some specific HDR titles which do not activate HDR on your projector, and the two titles that do. That way someone can compare their 820 to yours.

Unfortunately, the 820 Amazon app also has known issues, ie. stuttering, although this occurs on many other streaming devices also. Prime Video problems are widespread and hardly limited to Panasonic.

Lastly, as has been well discussed in this thread, the 820 is a fantastic player for discs, but as a streaming device, it is both limited and clunky.

Pip

The only HDR/Atmos title that plays both consistently is the movie "Dolomite Is My Name", everything else is hit or miss and inconsistent.
As far as everything on Netflix being DD+, there are many titles that are only two channel audio. With my Samsung 9500 player, they all show as two channel stereo on my Marantz info menu, thereby allow the receiver to turn them into multi channel, but with the 820 they show as 5.1, and the receiver can only add processing to the 5,1 signal, such as turn it into 7.1. It cannot create multi channel sound out of a signal it recognizes as already being multi channel, such as DD+
I know there's another thread for the UB9000, but anyone know if the same "limited and clunky" issues are common with that unit as well? I know there very similar devices.
Thanks.

Mark
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post #6143 of 6197 Old 11-13-2019, 04:38 PM
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I tried a search without much luck.


Apparently the 820 has a function where to conserve power, the player will shut off after it has been paused for about 20 minutes. Is there any way to turn this "feature" off?

Bill
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post #6144 of 6197 Old 11-13-2019, 04:59 PM
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I tried a search without much luck.

Apparently the 820 has a function where to conserve power, the player will shut off after it has been paused for about 20 minutes. Is there any way to turn this "feature" off?
I've read the whole thread recently (hard work!) and I remember this. Lots of people posted saying they hate it, but it's baked in with no configurable option sorry.

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post #6145 of 6197 Old 11-13-2019, 05:08 PM
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I've read the whole thread recently (hard work!) and I remember this. Lots of people posted saying they hate it, but it's baked in with no configurable option sorry.

Darn. Guess I'll have to make my bathroom breaks shorter and less often.


If I stop the player instead of pause it, does it restart at the same place? Guess I'll have to try that tonight.

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post #6146 of 6197 Old 11-13-2019, 05:17 PM
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Darn. Guess I'll have to make my bathroom breaks shorter and less often.

If I stop the player instead of pause it, does it restart at the same place? Guess I'll have to try that tonight.
Dunno, I haven't even got one But "resume play" is a "feature of some discs" as far as I know. The BD-Live ones. They can choose whether to give you that feature and/or bookmarks etc when they author the discs. There's zero excuse for not doing it, but some do not. Therefore it would be better if it had been a player feature and not a disc feature, so that the evil studios who don't author discs nicely and use the feature can't take it away from us. This problem was well known when 4K Blu-Ray was being created, so it's a shame they didn't fix it (eg by making it mandatory).

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post #6147 of 6197 Old 11-13-2019, 05:17 PM
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If I stop the player instead of pause it, does it restart at the same place? Guess I'll have to try that tonight.
It has the Resume option, but that may disappear in seconds, depending on the movie. On projectors that have a long resync delay, you may not see that option.
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post #6148 of 6197 Old 11-13-2019, 06:11 PM
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Dunno, I haven't even got one But "resume play" is a "feature of some discs" as far as I know. The BD-Live ones. They can choose whether to give you that feature and/or bookmarks etc when they author the discs. There's zero excuse for not doing it, but some do not. Therefore it would be better if it had been a player feature and not a disc feature, so that the evil studios who don't author discs nicely and use the feature can't take it away from us. This problem was well known when 4K Blu-Ray was being created, so it's a shame they didn't fix it (eg by making it mandatory).

Owners manual says Resume does not work for BD-Video.

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post #6149 of 6197 Old 11-14-2019, 08:32 PM
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So guys has anyone went from an xbox one x as a player to this Panasonic? I want a great disc player and I seem to be getting stuttering on the latest update from Xbox. I'm not that worried about apps as I have a roku and lg c8 oled. The ability to play discs back in Dolby Vision is intriguing too. I'm really sick of the little issues with the Xbox and am ready to use it for gaming only I think. Which it is pretty great at. Thanks for any insight in advance!
I'm actually in the market for a 4K player as I'm using my Xbox One X right now. Of course it's not as good as a stand alone player but it does the job. Tops on my list is the Panny UB820. It was between that and the Sony X800m2. Will see what Black Friday brings.

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post #6150 of 6197 Old 11-15-2019, 04:48 AM
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Angry Tray won't eject

My disc tray won't eject. I tried the sequence in the user manual without luck. Is there a manual eject (with a paper-clip, etc)? I did not see one. Figures, I think I've had the player over a year.
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