Sony UBP-X800M2 Anticipation Thread - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 301 Old 01-07-2019, 05:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Sony UBP-X800M2 Anticipation Thread

Buried in all of Sony's product announcements at CES today was the long-awaited successor to the UBP-X800. Rather than introduce an entirely new model, Sony chose to affix an M2 designation to the X800 and basically keep the existing feature set while adding support for Dolby Vision and Hybrid Log Gamma. Good news for consumers that appreciated the X800's rugged frame and beam construction and its universal disc support at an affordable price (Pioneer's $1,100 UDP-LX500 is the only other UHD Blu-ray player currently available that also supports DVD-A and SACD).

Pricing to be announced, availability in May. No additional updates for the current M1 version of the X800. Also, no announcement of an ES version of the X1000 that adds the front panel display and analog audio output.

https://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...300774208.html

"Picture perfect video and audio with the UBP-X800M2
The new X800M2 supports 4K Ultra HD playback, HDR10, Dolby Vision, and Hybrid Log Gamma (HLG) to deliver stunning picture quality. Additionally, 4K upscaling is also possible with the X800M2, transforming non-4K content to highly detailed, near-4K quality content.

The X800M2 also supports the latest and highest quality audio formats, including Hi-Res Audio and DSD. With the X8500 and X800M2, users can achieve the best home cinema experience with seamless pass-through of high-quality Dolby Atmos and DTS:X content, providing optimized picture and sound quality. The X800M2 is compatible with all major disc formats, including SACD/DVD-A, as well as 4K streaming services such as Netflix and YouTube. Users can stream their favorite shows via the Blu-ray player in ultra-high definition."
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post #2 of 301 Old 01-07-2019, 07:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Product info is also available on Sony's website. The spec sheet doesn't show much difference between the X800 and X800M2. Some minor differences at first glance.

UBP-X800M2
- 5 oz. lighter (still heavier than most competitors at 8 lb. 2 oz.)
- adds support for Monkey's Audio lossless codec
- drops support for Miracast screen mirroring
- adds subtitle shift and display info position

https://www.sony.com/electronics/blu...ers/ubp-x800m2

One other interesting highlight that I saw on Sony's product description is an additional heatsink on the disc drive.





When I took a peak under the hood of my X800 last year (see pics below), this is what the interior looked like. The drive was mounted onto suspension rails with a shielded enclosure. The design of the X800 appeared to be all about isolating the signal paths and minimizing interference. But, the only heatsink I saw was the one mounted onto the main processor. From the image of the M2 drive, I don't see where a heat sink would go, since it looks like the drive uses a similar metal top plate. The X800M2 is 5 oz. lighter, so I don't know if Sony eliminated any of the isolation and shielding, while adding the heat sink. It looks like the rest of the heavy duty enclosure from the X800 carries over to the X800M2. Would not surprise me if Sony kept the screwed down wire guides as well.




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post #3 of 301 Old 01-07-2019, 07:06 PM
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I'll probably be picking one of these up, but I thought I heard there was a UBP-X1100ES coming out this year too, and I'd rather get the ES.
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post #4 of 301 Old 01-07-2019, 07:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by qwank View Post
I'll probably be picking one of these up, but I thought I heard there was a UBP-X1100ES coming out this year too, and I'd rather get the ES.

IIRC, Sony announced the X1000ES a couple of months before they unveiled the X800 at CES. The main difference is the front panel display, the two-channel analog audio outputs, the longer ES warranty, and the higher $500 MSRP. Otherwise, the X800 and X1000 are identical.

Would be interesting if Sony made the ES version into a bona fide higher end player this time around, like adding full 7.1 analog audio outputs or going further upmarket with the build quality and processing capability like Pioneer did.
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post #5 of 301 Old 01-07-2019, 08:59 PM
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I wonder if the X800M2 will launch at a lower price than the X800 did? Since they both seem to look the same from the outside. I wish this had come out last year.

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post #6 of 301 Old 01-07-2019, 10:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post
I wonder if the X800M2 will launch at a lower price than the X800 did? Since they both seem to look the same from the outside. I wish this had come out last year.

Whatever price the X800M2 carries at launch, I would guess that the price will take a huge tumble by the time Black Friday rolls around. That happened with both the X800 and the X700 (although the discounting was steeper for the X800 the year before than with the X700 last month).

I had also hoped that the update had come last year (or better yet, came to the existing X800 units via firmware update). But, it looks like Sony's on a biannual update cycle for its UHD optical players, with the lower end X700 carrying over unchanged this year and getting its update next year. I was disappointed that Sony left the X800 to languish without adding DV support, while the feature was added to the supposedly lower end X700.

With the optical player market in decline, I guess it makes sense for Sony to iterate and carry over as much as they can from one model run to another, rather than redesigning the entire player every year. They introduced the lauded frame-and-beam design with the 4k upscaling BDP-BX1, and carried over that design approach to the 4k Blu-ray X800 and X1000ES. The X800M2 has a good market niche as a lower cost Oppo alternative.

But, I have to wonder if Sony wants to put out their own statement piece to match the high end models that Pioneer and Panasonic offer, since they still have not announced a replacement for the ES series X1000. With Oppo exiting the market, there is an opportunity right at that $600-$700 price point. With the X800's Mediatek SoC supposedly underpowered for DV support, I have to wonder which chipset they will use for the X800M2. Sony makes the two high end X1 video processors for their Bravia TVs. Why wouldn't they want to use that chipset for a higher end UHD optical player?

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I just hope this isn’t an X700 in an X800 shell. Not that my X700 hasn’t been fine I am hoping for more DV implementation options like a true auto option and an option for forced if I wanna use it.

Can’t wait to see early impressions and reviews as I will most likely wait till a hopefully holiday sale price unless my X700 dies or something and I’m forced to it sooner.
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Basically they put the X700 SoC inside an X800 for Dolby Vision...

I don't even care because my TV doesn't support DV anyway so I will stick with the standard X800
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post #9 of 301 Old 01-08-2019, 07:24 AM
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Originally Posted by MisterXDTV View Post
Basically they put the X700 SoC inside an X800 for Dolby Vision... [IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif[/IMG]

I don't even care because my TV doesn't support DV anyway so I will stick with the standard X800
Well at least you get the better drive from the X800 and support back for DVD-A along with hi-res and better build vs the X700.

So should still be a worthy upgrade for those that liked the X800 but went to the X700 just for DV.
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Hopefully, Sony adds a better drive in the X800M2 that can play triple layer 4k discs without freezing during playback, a quiet drive, and has automatic DV detection.
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Hopefully, Sony adds a better drive in the X800M2 that can play triple layer 4k discs without freezing during playback, a quiet drive, and has automatic DV detection.
My launch X800 has not run into any issues with triple layer discs.
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I really hope Sony will replace the 100Mbit lan with gigabit. Any chance to play Atmos MKV over lan?
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I really hope Sony will replace the 100Mbit lan with gigabit. Any chance to play Atmos MKV over lan?
No reason for Sony to do that since it doesn't fully support everything streaming over the network. Plus you can use wireless with the X800 and easily stream at much higher bitrates than it 100Mbps wired connection..

Sure it would be nice, but only if it could play more content. But Disc players are typically not very good media players. And that has been the case with Sony and most other disc players for many, many years.

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I really hope Sony will replace the 100Mbit lan with gigabit. Any chance to play Atmos MKV over lan?

The spec sheet doesn't say anything about the Ethernet connection, but the photo of the back panel on Sony's website shows the connector labeled as "LAN (100)." Granted, it looks like Sony simply recycled the photo from the current X800, since the model number does not have the M2 designation and photo still shows the Gracenote logo (Sony has announced that its Blu-ray players will no longer support Gracenote after February 28).





The wireless connection will retain the dual band wi-fi transceiver (the X700 only operates in the crowded and interference-prone 2.4 GHz band). Nothing about whether the X800M2 will support wireless AC or if it will stay with the older wireless N standard.
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Is M2 Dolby Vision profile 5 to work on Sony DV TV's? Will it work LG DV TV's. Do VUDU App on the M2 have UHD DV Atmos capabilites?
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post #16 of 301 Old 01-11-2019, 01:26 AM
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Is M2 Dolby Vision profile 5 to work on Sony DV TV's? Will it work LG DV TV's. Do VUDU App on the M2 have UHD DV Atmos capabilites?
I’d imagine it’ll be just like the X700. Definitely will work on Sony TVs no doubt and most likely all DV capable TVs. I don’t remember ever reading that the X700 didn’t work on certain TVs for DV.

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post #17 of 301 Old 01-13-2019, 06:18 PM
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In a ideal world I like the ES version of this, but I could easily work with this especially if the ES is a lot more expensive.

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post #18 of 301 Old 01-16-2019, 05:38 PM - Thread Starter
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In a ideal world I like the ES version of this, but I could easily work with this especially if the ES is a lot more expensive.

The last time, the ES version only added a front panel display, two-channel analog audio outputs, and a RS-232 port for installations. Cost an extra $200 for a player that was otherwise identical to the X800. The ES models though do come with a much longer warranty.


As I wrote earlier, I was hoping to see Sony try something around the $700-$800 price point that would be a true successor to the Oppos. Pioneer and Panasonic have introduced their own statement pieces, but those are over $1k.
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Originally Posted by Woochifer View Post
The last time, the ES version only added a front panel display, two-channel analog audio outputs, and a RS-232 port for installations. Cost an extra $200 for a player that was otherwise identical to the X800. The ES models though do come with a much longer warranty.


As I wrote earlier, I was hoping to see Sony try something around the $700-$800 price point that would be a true successor to the Oppos. Pioneer and Panasonic have introduced their own statement pieces, but those are over $1k.
I still have an Oppo BDP-105 and paid the full price as it has analog outputs both RCA and XLR. Some people like myself use the analog outs to a high end preamp and amplifier for better stereo playback. That feature does not come for free. My X-800 is good for the price but expect to pay more for the same type features the others include you mentioned. Not going to happen unfortunately.
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The last time, the ES version only added a front panel display, two-channel analog audio outputs, and a RS-232 port for installations. Cost an extra $200 for a player that was otherwise identical to the X800. The ES models though do come with a much longer warranty.


As I wrote earlier, I was hoping to see Sony try something around the $700-$800 price point that would be a true successor to the Oppos. Pioneer and Panasonic have introduced their own statement pieces, but those are over $1k.
Regarding their 4K Blu-ray and Blu-ray disc playing abilities, I think at this point I could make a safe bet that most will fail within ES' 3-year warranty period. I feel (don't have all the data yet) 4K players have proven to be one of the most unreliable launches in electronics history.
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Regarding their 4K Blu-ray and Blu-ray disc playing abilities, I think at this point I could make a safe bet that most will fail within ES' 3-year warranty period. I feel (don't have all the data yet) 4K players have proven to be one of the most unreliable launches in electronics history.
And all my UHD BD players I've owned since launch in February 2016 have been fine.
I've owned four stand alone UHD BD players(Samsung, Sony, Oppo, and Philips) and three Xboxes(two XB1S and an XB1X).

The UHD BD launch was miles ahead of the crappy 2K BD launch in June 2006. Those BD players at launch were turkeys.
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And all my UHD BD players I've owned since launch in February 2016 have been fine.
I've owned four stand alone UHD BD players(Samsung, Sony, Oppo, and Philips) and three Xboxes(two XB1S and an XB1X).

The UHD BD launch was miles ahead of the crappy 2K BD launch in June 2006. Those BD players at launch were turkeys.
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I salute your optimism, and also for negotiating the minefield of issues very well. Keep us updated.

History tells us not much BR competition in 2006. Many were still heady over DVD and HD DVD. There were choppy waters in the first year of Sony players, but they began to get a handle on it soon after. At the two year mark BR was a more successful launch than DVD.

Buying early is usually not a good idea. I waited until Sony BDP-S360, and it's still operating beautifully in my den.

We're almost three full years into 4K player launch, and people are still having myriad problems. My focus is reading ability. Simple fact, more layers introduce more reading challenges.

It should say something that Sony took longer to introduce their 4K players. They perhaps weren't as concerned about rushing to market (there was competition this time) as trying to get it right. I'm sure they did their best, but problems are still happening. Simple fact, more layers introduce more reading challenges.

Even though it involves law of diminishing returns, I'm optimistic for 4K player future. I think they'll get it right eventually. They have to.
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My oldest UHD BD player now is my launch SOny X800 I got in 2017. It has been nearly flawless in my use. It's certainly had no issues with triple layer discs. And the couple of times I had minor issues in 2017 were fixed by going to one HDMi cable for audio and video.

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My oldest UHD BD player now is my launch SOny X800 I got in 2017. It has been nearly flawless in my use. It's certainly had no issues with triple layer discs. And the couple of times I had minor issues in 2017 were fixed by going to one HDMi cable for audio and video.
Your amazing success aside, I think the real hero of "The 4K Story" is the TV, not the 4K player, or the 4K and Fake 4K software.

I've said enough in this regard. I don't wish to detract from the thread's main purpose. Cheers.
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It should say something that Sony took longer to introduce their 4K players. They perhaps weren't as concerned about rushing to market (there was competition this time) as trying to get it right. I'm sure they did their best, but problems are still happening. Simple fact, more layers introduce more reading challenges.

Although you qualify it with the "perhaps," I don't think that second sentence is accurate based upon my serviceable recollections about Sony's earlier UHD BD player posture. My understanding is that Sony's original position was that they weren't even going to make a player. This goes back to that period of time (more than 2.5) years ago wherein Sony had 4K displays for sale in their stores (including the one I visited in Century City) and the 4K server pre-loaded with Sony Pictures content via a proprietary connection that did not play friendly with any other manufs. I vaguely recall being told 'Sony isn't making a player.' So I think it's a little gratuitous to say this was all calculated towards eventually 'getting it right.'


For instance, Sony has seemingly been no less prone to baffling behavior in connection with DV than other manufs that released players earlier. I think that a corollary dynamic over the past 18 months or so though has been the arguably diminishing importance to many consumers of any packaged media player.


Another issue during that about same timeframe that's come to be an issue for me personally is that the studios' UHD BD catalog support has not been what I'd hoped. IMO and for my wallet, in 2018 the licensed boutique 1080 BD release market became more interesting than what catalog the studios are releasing directly on either 1080 or UHD BD. And HDR of any flavor is not in the equation for most of those releases, so it diminishes the HDR "halo" even if its launch had been smooth sailing.


IMO the amount of sturm und drang around DV in particular and HDR in general has been disproportionate to the quantity of catalog UHD BD titles released. We've certainly passed the point wherein I'm more concerned about DVD-A and SA-CD playback ability/quality than I am a player's compatibility with all HDR flavors.

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Although you qualify it with the "perhaps," I don't think that second sentence is accurate based upon my serviceable recollections about Sony's earlier UHD BD player posture. My understanding is that Sony's original position was that they weren't even going to make a player. This goes back to that period of time (more than 2.5) years ago wherein Sony had 4K displays for sale in their stores (including the one I visited in Century City) and the 4K server pre-loaded with Sony Pictures content via a proprietary connection that did not play friendly with any other manufs. I vaguely recall being told 'Sony isn't making a player.' So I think it's a little gratuitous to say this was all calculated towards eventually 'getting it right.'


For instance, Sony has seemingly been no less prone to baffling behavior in connection with DV than other manufs that released players earlier. I think that a corollary dynamic over the past 18 months or so though has been the arguably diminishing importance to many consumers of any packaged media player.


Another issue during that about same timeframe that's come to be an issue for me personally is that the studios' UHD BD catalog support has not been what I'd hoped. IMO and for my wallet, in 2018 the licensed boutique 1080 BD release market became more interesting than what catalog the studios are releasing directly on either 1080 or UHD BD. And HDR of any flavor is not in the equation for most of those releases, so it diminishes the HDR "halo" even if its launch had been smooth sailing.


IMO the amount of sturm und drang around DV in particular and HDR in general has been disproportionate to the quantity of catalog UHD BD titles released. We've certainly passed the point wherein I'm more concerned about DVD-A and SA-CD playback ability/quality than I am a player's compatibility with all HDR flavors.
I think Sony's first versus Samsung's premature first proves my point about development. Sony kicking its Blu-ray history to the curb was never going to happen.

SA-CD CD layer, and HDR10 for me. Cheers.
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post #27 of 301 Old 01-22-2019, 07:54 PM
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I should have said earlier: Welcome to the Forum, Panson.

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Originally Posted by Panson View Post
I think Sony's first versus Samsung's premature first proves my point about development. Sony kicking its Blu-ray history to the curb was never going to happen.

SA-CD CD layer, and HDR10 for me. Cheers.
Your post doesn't make sense/I don't understand (what you think is) your point. It's non sequitur on multiple levels: The relationship (such as it is) between the three sentences and all three's relationship to the portions of my comments that you've bolded.

The first sentence is just tautology. You're assuming many things, including that if Sony had introduced a player sooner it would have been "premature" (if you just mean according to you, okay, but that's not really broadly helpful). It's also quite possible that Sony's engineers weren't avoiding "rushing" or were busying "trying to get it right" but were instead marking time to learn from other manufs' efforts. Unless you have a link to an interview with a Sony engineer knowledgeable on the subject, we just don't know either way. I would argue that, whatever significance you want to try to ascribe to how robust Sony's first UHD BD player entry was compared to Samsung's, that's countered by the fact that many of us are still here in these discussion fora pages going back and forth about HDR issues and DV implementation. So Sony's later introduction of a player--regardless of whether it was calculated or incidental--can be read to not at all mean what you want it to.

Again, I don't understand the significance vis-a-vis your comments of bolding my last sentence. In case I wasn't clear, I'm saying that while all this DV ballyhoo has been going on (and on), say, MGM started licensing A-list titles like Silence Of the Lambs to Criterion and Frankenheimer's Iceman Cometh has been announced (for March) on 1080 BD. Those are just two examples of titles that interest me personally more than, say, The Last Knight in admittedly impressive DV.

And if you really are happy with "just" SA-CD single layer and plain Jane HDR, one might argue that a "premature" player from whomever might have met your needs (which, if I'm understanding you right, would be more limited than someone who wants DSD, 5.1 from SA-CD and DVD-A and full DV compatibility).

On one level, I appreciate the pith. But on another, if you really want to be understood you may need to unpack your remarks a bit more.

Last edited by Paul.R.S; 01-23-2019 at 10:41 AM.
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post #28 of 301 Old 01-22-2019, 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Woochifer View Post
The last time, the ES version only added a front panel display, two-channel analog audio outputs, and a RS-232 port for installations. Cost an extra $200 for a player that was otherwise identical to the X800. The ES models though do come with a much longer warranty.
Also the optional rack mounting kit (which I have). Although the X800 has the holes for the rack mount kit, they're not threaded.
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post #29 of 301 Old 01-23-2019, 10:36 AM
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Please stick to technical discussion of the upcoming player.
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Please use the report post button to alert staff to problematic posts. Never quote or respond to them yourself.

Panasonic DP-UB820 -> Yamaha CX-A5100 -> Sony XBR-75X940C; Mediabridge 6' and 15' HDMI cables.
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post #30 of 301 Old 01-23-2019, 04:03 PM
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It looks like Sony is working on 6 new models. Thanks given to our friends over at AVF for the info. Whether or not we see most of them over here is uncertain.

UBP-X1100ES, UBP-X800M2, UBP-CX80M2, UBP-X850, UBP-UX80M2 and UBP-X750.

Look down the chart. https://launchstudio.bluetooth.com/ListingDetails/8229


Hopefully, the x1100 has a few upgrades the x1000 lacks. Assuming it still has analog outs, it could stand a bit a refinement in the audio section. The x1000 has a grainy midrange with limited soundstaging and imaging.
Sony could also include a useful front display, to say the one on the x1000 is limited is being polite. An improved remote is a must and would turn the x1100 into a real competitor to the Panny 9000 and Pioneer LX-500.
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