Samsung Quits 4K Blu-ray Player Market - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 59 Old 02-15-2019, 12:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Samsung Quits 4K Blu-ray Player Market

https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnarc.../#63f5cf411577
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post #2 of 59 Old 02-15-2019, 01:15 PM
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“But the arrival of HDR10+ also means we now have films appearing on 4K Blu-ray in two separate formats while only a handful of 4K Blu-ray players and TVs are capable of supporting both.“

He should have clarified that there is always a standard HDR10 layer on the same disc, so this is irrelevant for the end user.

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post #3 of 59 Old 02-15-2019, 01:53 PM
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Not surprised by a bit, they're Blu-ray players have always been terrible anyway compared to other manufacturers (Sony, LG, Panasonic, etc.). Plus with Samsung backing HDR10+ (a HDR format I don't think will take off) instead of Dolby Vision shows that these days why buy a television or a 4K player from possibly the only company in the world that doesn't support the much-more popular & superior Dolby Vision.
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post #4 of 59 Old 02-15-2019, 02:11 PM
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So this is really all about Samsung not wanting to support Dolby Vision with the 4K UHD players so they just fold like that. Their players were never anything special, Panasonic, Sony, LG, Pioneer make better UHD disc players today. They will likely still make Blu-ray players only.


The K8500 was the first UHD player on the market so I have to tip my hat to Samsung for that.
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post #5 of 59 Old 02-15-2019, 02:24 PM
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Samsung is at enemity with dolby.

Who cares anyway, their players were not worth it anyway, sony, panasonic, philips makes better 4k blu ray players.

I would probably not even care if there was news that Sam(j)un(k) is quitting the tv market, haven't bought one since they left plasma.
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post #6 of 59 Old 02-15-2019, 06:33 PM
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looks like they are going to drop out of the USA market for UHD AND BD players. Forbes said 4k, and cnet got a clarification of BD as well.

https://www.cnet.com/news/samsung-to...-report-says/#

unexpected ... Initially, I'd have thought this would have been for April fool's
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post #7 of 59 Old 02-16-2019, 01:19 PM
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What the heck....

First Panasonic leaves the U.S. TV market...

Now Samsung stops making players for the U.S. market...

What next?!

Shopping List:
TV: Samsung Q90R, or LG C9, or Sony ...
Blu-ray: Panasonic UB820, or Sony X800M, or Pioneer Elite LX500
Soundbar: Samsung Q90R, or Sennheiser Ambeo, or...
AVR and Speakers: Marantz 8012, or... and GE Triton Reference, or...
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post #8 of 59 Old 02-16-2019, 07:39 PM
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Originally Posted by New24K View Post
What the heck....

First Panasonic leaves the U.S. TV market...

Now Samsung stops making players for the U.S. market...

What next?!
No Samsung is leaving players market everywhere. Cnet reporting is crappy. They said in there that OPPO left US market, but they actually stopped making players completely.

No big loss, Samsung players where nothing special and were worse that pretty much any other maker.
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post #9 of 59 Old 02-17-2019, 08:17 AM
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it should really put the nail in the coffin on HDR10+, just when studios start pumping out hdr10+ titles on disc

leaves only Panasonic, I believe, as only player that will play back hdr10+ content on disc. and very few TV's will support HDR10+
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post #10 of 59 Old 02-17-2019, 08:23 AM
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it should really put the nail in the coffin on HDR10+, just when studios start pumping out hdr10+ titles on disc

leaves only Panasonic, I believe, as only player that will play back hdr10+ content on disc. and very few TV's will support HDR10+
OPPO's latest firmware (just released) for the discontinued 203 and 205 players will also play HDR10+ from disc or from media files. This is kinda sorta an unannounced feature at present, as OPPO is not yet allowed to market that it is in there. So keep it under your hat....
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post #11 of 59 Old 02-17-2019, 01:30 PM
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Originally Posted by New24K View Post
What the heck....

First Panasonic leaves the U.S. TV market...

Now Samsung stops making players for the U.S. market...

What next?!

It's possible Panasonic could enter the USA TV market again one day, they sell OLED TV's in Canada. Their UHD players are pretty huge now in the USA market, so they have brand recognition to go by. I certainly hope they do at some point.


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No Samsung is leaving players market everywhere. Cnet reporting is crappy. They said in there that OPPO left US market, but they actually stopped making players completely.

No big loss, Samsung players where nothing special and were worse that pretty much any other maker.


They were just ok, their UHD players were probably their best players despite being all plastic like most of their players.
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post #12 of 59 Old 02-18-2019, 07:21 PM
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I read some where that this is basically one more step in the coffin of physical discs becoming obsolete because the sales of the discs just aren't what was expected.
Also that many movies these days are available to stream before the disc version becomes available.

I have never in my life had a netflix account or hulu or any other movie subscription and even now I just prefer to buy movies and watch at my own pace. Just the other day I watched a movie I bought back in 2016 that I just never got around to that was still shrink wrapped and didn't have to worry about if Netflix still have it up blah blah blah......

I understand that people like me are in the minority now and people don't the value the concept and idea of ownership and the convenience of online streaming and such is basically King of the domain. For analogy purposes it's like the difference between people who own their house and property and those who rent from others.
I mean people will say things like it's better to own your own property than rent an apartment because at the end of the day when the owner either kicks you out or you decide to move else where you have nothing to show for years of having given money away to said person.

The one thing that I notice with people that have all these subscription to these sites is that most don't even use it or take full advantage it. I had a gym membership to planet fitness the last couple years and finally realized the last 4-5 months that going to the gym has been getting harder and difficult and I would go weeks at a time without stepping inside and yet I didn't cancel membership and was essentially wasting money every month on something I'm not fully using. I finally canceled my membership, bought a few weights and cardio stuff and started working out at home and it's been the best decision I ever made and have been working out more consistently and efficiently at home.
It's like people that have these subscriptions to many different things and while although they may not be super expensive.... at the end of the year that's still money that could've been used to do something. The money I'm going to save this year from the membership cancellation I'll probably put towards something.

I know everything has its time and one day physical media will surely die but.............. hopefully its after I'm long gone from this earth

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post #13 of 59 Old 02-19-2019, 11:45 AM
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I read some where that this is basically one more step in the coffin of physical discs becoming obsolete because the sales of the discs just aren't what was expected.

Also that many movies these days are available to stream before the disc version becomes available.



I have never in my life had a netflix account or hulu or any other movie subscription and even now I just prefer to buy movies and watch at my own pace. Just the other day I watched a movie I bought back in 2016 that I just never got around to that was still shrink wrapped and didn't have to worry about if Netflix still have it up blah blah blah......



I understand that people like me are in the minority now and people don't the value the concept and idea of ownership and the convenience of online streaming and such is basically King of the domain.



The one thing that I notice with people that have all these subscription to these sites is that most don't even use it or take full advantage it. I had a gym membership to planet fitness the last couple years and finally realized the last 4-5 months that going to the gym has been getting harder and difficult and I would go weeks at a time without stepping inside and yet I didn't cancel membership and was essentially wasting money every month on something I'm not fully using. I finally canceled my membership, bought a few weights and cardio stuff and started working out at home and it's been the best decision I ever made and have been working out more consistently and efficiently at home.

It's like people that have these subscriptions to many different things and while although they may not be super expensive.... at the end of the year that's still money that could've been used to do something. The money I'm going to save this year from the membership cancellation I'll probably put towards something.



I know everything has its time and one day physical media will surely die but.............. hopefully its after I'm long gone from this earth
For me streaming is for.convenience and.physical media.is for.quality. With all the streaming services the.compression artifacts are obvious and distracting. But...there is some.really great programming so we subscribe and drop depending on.what interests us. But for serious film viewing I'm always going to buy the disc.

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post #14 of 59 Old 02-19-2019, 01:23 PM
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I myself was holding off buying a 4k bluray player, until HDMI 2.1 was offered by the makers of the players.
I know it was a big question when HDMI 2.1 was coming out,but I always argued it would be in 2019 and it is.
You can check my post out,8K is now and see I said 2019.
I have a 65c OLED and really hate streaming,even 4k looks no better then my Panasonic 1080 bluray.
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post #15 of 59 Old 02-19-2019, 01:32 PM
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Not a huge loss here. The only Samsung player I have is the UBD-K8500 and only because I got it free. Otherwise it’s always been Panasonic & Sony. The Panasonic UB9000 & 820 are the best players out now.


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post #16 of 59 Old 02-19-2019, 01:45 PM
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Well this sucks, I had the K8500, I think it was their first 4K player, and that thing has been bullet proof since day one. I bought a sony 4K player for my bedroom since I couldn't find the Samsung, and because I needed one with 2 HDMI outs, and that Sony has been a pain since day 1, returned it 3 times because HDMI 2 audio out would work 5 minutes and then NEVER again. Not to mention is has had random freezes to the point you have to unplug it to get it back working. I hate all the darn kids /s and their stupid streaming. Don't get me wrong we have Netflix and Prime, but I still buy discs for movies I want to watch day one, as a matte of fact I just bought 3 today, 1 4k and 2 blu ray, at best buy over lunch. I have close to 2000 discs, I prefer owning the movie, I can pretty much take them anywhere and watch them, most every home has either a stand alone blu ray or console. With streaming you have crap quality and blah sound, not that I have an Atmos set up or anything but I do have a very nice 5.1 and want the uncompressed audio. Im going to be sad when they stop making discs because I am going to be stuck either having to sign up for some service or finding somewhere to buy them, and unless things have improved GREATLY since Ultraviolet even buying and doing the streaming that way was STILL awful. I don't have anything that uses movies anywhere, sure I could stream it from my phone to my chromecast, but then I am held hostage by how good a wifi signal my phone decides it want's to pick up.
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post #17 of 59 Old 02-19-2019, 06:11 PM
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Well there's plenty of oldies on here saying how they are physical media forever but I'm 40 and never bought a 4K player and never planned to. Bluray was enough for me and I moved to streaming only. Vudu and iTunes have great quality and I don't see any compression artifacts. All these fogies saying they see them is just fake news (that's tongue in cheek)
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post #18 of 59 Old 02-19-2019, 06:36 PM
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there is little money to be made now for the big boys on blu ray. samsung and apple are going all in on streaming at his point in advanced markets. oppo, now samsung, what next for discs?


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post #19 of 59 Old 02-19-2019, 07:57 PM
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Well there's plenty of oldies on here saying how they are physical media forever but I'm 40 and never bought a 4K player and never planned to. Bluray was enough for me and I moved to streaming only. Vudu and iTunes have great quality and I don't see any compression artifacts. All these fogies saying they see them is just fake news (that's tongue in cheek)
Color me an old fogie then. The artifacts are not as noticeable on our 55-60" TV's, but they sure as heck are on our 105" wide projector/screen setup in our dedicated home theater.

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post #20 of 59 Old 02-19-2019, 09:26 PM
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Originally Posted by the7mcs View Post
I read some where that this is basically one more step in the coffin of physical discs becoming obsolete because the sales of the discs just aren't what was expected.
Also that many movies these days are available to stream before the disc version becomes available.
Quote:
Also, streaming has come to dominate Americans’ viewing habits, especially in high-income households that would be enticed by expensive 4K HDR Blu-ray players. Physical media sales have been declining at double-digit percentage rates for a few years running. Even within those sales, 4K Blu-rays account for only 5.3 percent of sales compared to the aging DVD format, which still sits at 57.9 percent, according to Forbes.
https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2019...u-ray-players/

Just got that on my cell phone news feed today. Unfortunate news. I prefer to own the media myself as well. Wonder why they didn't mention regular Blu-ray players which should be 52.6 percent of sales going by the figures in that article. Which is what I have since I haven't jumped on the 4k anything yet. I'm still waiting for everything to settle down.

I think a lot of the problem is the consumer is just burnt out of having to shell out lots of money every 10 years to refresh their library with the higher resolution format media and devices. The Industry has overplayed its hand.

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post #21 of 59 Old 02-19-2019, 10:03 PM
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So I have dated 2 girls within the past couple years and both of the only had DVDs as dedicated players and don't even have Blu Ray players that can be bought for like $25-$30 these days. Both girls just use net-flix to watch whatever. They also aren't dedicated to picture and audio quality as most people on here tend to be.

So with the most recent girl I've been dating she invited me over her place to watch a movie and I grabbed a Blu Ray disc (this was before I knew she didn't have a player) and went over. That's when I discovered that she only had a DVD player and here's the kicker.... she genuinely thought that a DVD player could play Blu Ray disc and even went on to argue with me about it and was then asking me the difference between a DVD and a Blu Ray disc and why the Blu Ray disc wouldn't work.

I mean this is America in 2019 we are talking about not some 3rd world country that is still struggling to even get electricity and water operating 24/7

I didn't even bother telling her about the new UHD 4k format.

Anyways she tried looking up the movie I brought over on Net Flix and sure enough it wasn't available. She tried other places like Prime and she had to pay for it. I don't remember if the movie had the rent option or if it was just strictly a buy option. At that point I told her not to even bother about it.

And that's the thing with streaming sites and especially Net Flix that likes to take down things all the time and shuffle things and their availability. I've been on a recent kick lately watching old time spaghetti westerns, and war movies that I grew up on as kid and I know those probably wouldn't be available on netflix but I've purchased the discs and in the future when nostalgia hits and I feel like re-watching them I don't have to offer up a prayer and hope I can find it on Net Flix or have to pay to rent it again or something like that.

At any rate I guess in this world we live in you either learn to adapt and roll along with the changing times or get left behind.... I just don't quite agree with the concept of being on a subscription base model to watch my movies. I mean isn't that why so many people are cutting cable cords these days? I mean yes the price you pay per month for Net Flix is a lot cheaper than cable and while I have never had a Net Flix subscription I can take a guess and say that prices that people are paying per month now has probably increased slightly over the years, and it will continue to grow ever so slightly until one day people are paying like $50 a month and clamoring and longing for the days of being able to just buy their discs but sadly those days will be long gone and most likely never coming back ;-)

I should add that the only media that I download and buy digitally is music from itunes...... maybe perhaps because it's easy to burn the music to disc and thus have it physically if need be helps I don't know.

Recently I've been burned with some games that I had bought over the app store on my iphone that I noticed I can't even redownload anymore. I mean these are things that I paid money for and it's just gone like that. And of course the problem is I'm not going to call up Apple and complain even though I really should (and many more people in my situation should speak up and not let these companies get away with things like this) so in essence I'm telling that "hey, it's cool... I don't mind. You can totally screw me over again in the future like that again too :-D
But I have certainly learned my lesson from that experience and not buying any games for my phone that ain't free to begin with ;-)
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post #22 of 59 Old 02-20-2019, 03:36 AM
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Disc players are about done. OOPO is out and soon all makers will be out.

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post #23 of 59 Old 02-20-2019, 05:16 PM
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Disc players are about done. OOPO is out and soon all makers will be out.
There's a lull in 4K action, for sure.

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post #24 of 59 Old 02-21-2019, 04:07 AM
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There's a lull in 4K action, for sure.
Peeps don't wanna pay $30 or more for a movie.
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post #25 of 59 Old 02-21-2019, 05:00 AM
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I think a lot of the problem is the consumer is just burnt out of having to shell out lots of money every 10 years to refresh their library with the higher resolution format media and devices. The Industry has overplayed its hand.
This is an odd comment IMO. First I think we all can agree that the UHD BD represents the highest quality available presently. Who is forcing anyone to go buy the highest quality version; the BD and DVD is still available for every one. If you say to yourself UHD is BS just skip it. I still watch DVDs of films that I can't get in BD and I know in my theater they look like fecal remnants but I accept what I can get. Some films mean a lot to me such as Blade Runner, The Matrix or 2001 A Space Odyssey. These I want in the highest quality I could ever reasonably obtain and I'm willing and happy to pay a premium for the opportunity. I don't look at my 1000+ BDs and try to replace all of them or would even want to bother if the UHD version came out.



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post #26 of 59 Old 02-21-2019, 09:06 AM
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This is an odd comment IMO. First I think we all can agree that the UHD BD represents the highest quality available presently. Who is forcing anyone to go buy the highest quality version; the BD and DVD is still available for every one. If you say to yourself UHD is BS just skip it. I still watch DVDs of films that I can't get in BD and I know in my theater they look like fecal remnants but I accept what I can get. Some films mean a lot to me such as Blade Runner, The Matrix or 2001 A Space Odyssey. These I want in the highest quality I could ever reasonably obtain and I'm willing and happy to pay a premium for the opportunity. I don't look at my 1000+ BDs and try to replace all of them or would even want to bother if the UHD version came out.

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I'm convinced it's the highest quality available. I'm also convinced we are in law of diminishing returns with regard to discs. In other words the difference between DVD and BD is greater than the difference between BD and UHD BD. Both gaps have narrowed with up-scaling possibilities.

I understand if people don't want to cross the latest media bridge, particularly if the buy-in is serious money. Whatever, manufacturers don't seem to be showing much enthusiasm regarding disc players.

Discs have been an important revenue stream for movie makers. Some movies are in theaters for five minutes. Some never are.

Though I appreciate UHD BD disc for a few well-thought-of-films, the biggest advance for me has been the TV. Cheers!

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post #27 of 59 Old 02-21-2019, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn View Post
This is an odd comment IMO. First I think we all can agree that the UHD BD represents the highest quality available presently. Who is forcing anyone to go buy the highest quality version; the BD and DVD is still available for every one. If you say to yourself UHD is BS just skip it. I still watch DVDs of films that I can't get in BD and I know in my theater they look like fecal remnants but I accept what I can get. Some films mean a lot to me such as Blade Runner, The Matrix or 2001 A Space Odyssey. These I want in the highest quality I could ever reasonably obtain and I'm willing and happy to pay a premium for the opportunity. I don't look at my 1000+ BDs and try to replace all of them or would even want to bother if the UHD version came out.
Art
My comment was targeted at the
Quote:
4K Blu-rays account for only 5.3 percent of sales
and the reason why. I agree with you on replacing DVD's with the higher quality blu ray versions on certain beloved titles. I did try watching one or two DVDs on the projector and it was like going back to when youtube was just 240 resolution in comparison .

As for the forcing, well not so much forcing but trying to convince the consumer to buy the next best thing in quality and technology through aggressive ad campaigns and tech reviews etc...


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Originally Posted by Panson View Post
I'm convinced it's the highest quality available. I'm also convinced we are in law of diminishing returns with regard to discs. In other words the difference between DVD and BD is greater than the difference between BD and UHD BD. Both gaps have narrowed with up-scaling possibilities.

I understand if people don't want to cross the latest media bridge, particularly if the buy-in is serious money. Whatever, manufacturers don't seem to be showing much enthusiasm regarding disc players.

Discs have been an important revenue stream for movie makers. Some movies are in theaters for five minutes. Some never are.

Though I appreciate UHD BD disc for a few well-thought-of-films, the biggest advance for me has been the TV. Cheers!
Might be time for the movie companies to start offering Movies on Thumb Drives in a box If the trend of companies pulling out of optical players continues and since most TVs and Streaming boxes (such as roku) have thumb drive ports. A 100gig flash drive is relatively cheap when bought as a single consumer item and it offers the same storage space as a 3 layer blu ray disk at 100gigs with a higher transfer rate at 180mbps than either blu ray at 54mbps or 4k blu ray at 100mbps. There would be no need to deal with an any upgrading disk players to support the latest format since a lot of the consumers already own a device which can play them. A 200gig version would be even better to add all the extras and stuff since the current 4 layer blu ray disk can only hold 128gigs.
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post #28 of 59 Old 02-21-2019, 10:36 AM
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Originally Posted by the7mcs View Post
So I have dated 2 girls within the past couple years and both of the only had DVDs as dedicated players and don't even have Blu Ray players that can be bought for like $25-$30 these days. Both girls just use net-flix to watch whatever. They also aren't dedicated to picture and audio quality as most people on here tend to be.

So with the most recent girl I've been dating she invited me over her place to watch a movie and I grabbed a Blu Ray disc (this was before I knew she didn't have a player) and went over. That's when I discovered that she only had a DVD player and here's the kicker.... she genuinely thought that a DVD player could play Blu Ray disc and even went on to argue with me about it and was then asking me the difference between a DVD and a Blu Ray disc and why the Blu Ray disc wouldn't work.

I mean this is America in 2019 we are talking about not some 3rd world country that is still struggling to even get electricity and water operating 24/7

I didn't even bother telling her about the new UHD 4k format.

Anyways she tried looking up the movie I brought over on Net Flix and sure enough it wasn't available. She tried other places like Prime and she had to pay for it. I don't remember if the movie had the rent option or if it was just strictly a buy option. At that point I told her not to even bother about it.

And that's the thing with streaming sites and especially Net Flix that likes to take down things all the time and shuffle things and their availability. I've been on a recent kick lately watching old time spaghetti westerns, and war movies that I grew up on as kid and I know those probably wouldn't be available on netflix but I've purchased the discs and in the future when nostalgia hits and I feel like re-watching them I don't have to offer up a prayer and hope I can find it on Net Flix or have to pay to rent it again or something like that.

At any rate I guess in this world we live in you either learn to adapt and roll along with the changing times or get left behind.... I just don't quite agree with the concept of being on a subscription base model to watch my movies. I mean isn't that why so many people are cutting cable cords these days? I mean yes the price you pay per month for Net Flix is a lot cheaper than cable and while I have never had a Net Flix subscription I can take a guess and say that prices that people are paying per month now has probably increased slightly over the years, and it will continue to grow ever so slightly until one day people are paying like $50 a month and clamoring and longing for the days of being able to just buy their discs but sadly those days will be long gone and most likely never coming back ;-)

I should add that the only media that I download and buy digitally is music from itunes...... maybe perhaps because it's easy to burn the music to disc and thus have it physically if need be helps I don't know.

Recently I've been burned with some games that I had bought over the app store on my iphone that I noticed I can't even redownload anymore. I mean these are things that I paid money for and it's just gone like that. And of course the problem is I'm not going to call up Apple and complain even though I really should (and many more people in my situation should speak up and not let these companies get away with things like this) so in essence I'm telling that "hey, it's cool... I don't mind. You can totally screw me over again in the future like that again too :-D
But I have certainly learned my lesson from that experience and not buying any games for my phone that ain't free to begin with ;-)
I think this is very common for both sexes who aren't that tech driven.

In America you need to tell us what the next best thing as very overtly. "You only have DVD, I have DVD 2." "Woah, that must be better than DVD 1, I need that!"

DVD, Blu-Ray, UHD as the average consumer shopping Target bins... what do I know.

I think we are going to see a streaming backlash soon enough though. With all content providers starting up their own services, you're going too see exclusivity become king in the streaming market. You'll need to subscribe to 10 different things to get what you used to get with just Netflix and Hulu. Customers will get frustrated with this.

The question will be, do they just buy from google or iTunes, or do they seek physical media like they used to. Time will tell.
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post #29 of 59 Old 02-21-2019, 06:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BBruin66 View Post

I think we are going to see a streaming backlash soon enough though. With all content providers starting up their own services, you're going too see exclusivity become king in the streaming market. You'll need to subscribe to 10 different things to get what you used to get with just Netflix and Hulu. Customers will get frustrated with this.

The question will be, do they just buy from google or iTunes, or do they seek physical media like they used to. Time will tell.
You already see this with paywalls for online news. And you know what consumers do? Find a free source or just skip it. No one is going back to thew days of physical newspapers or magazines. People won't have a backlash, they will evaluate which content they value and only pay for that. The only harm will come to content companies. Physical media is on its death bed.

Look at streaming music. Its the predominant source for the majority these days. Major retailers have removed the CD section. The CD is no longer relevant. If you think the movie industry is the last saving grace then you have blinders on.

Its the same with video games. More and more dont buy the physical disc, they pay for the digital download.

Where this is all going is obvious. Its not moving back into the past.
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Last edited by almostinsane; 02-21-2019 at 06:09 PM.
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post #30 of 59 Old 02-22-2019, 07:14 AM
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There is still a market for physical books. I think there will always be at least a niche market for physical copies of movies too. There is no arguing that the market is indeed shrinking.
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