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post #1 of 21 Old 08-10-2019, 09:28 AM - Thread Starter
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HT bonus room layout help

Hi all. I could really use some help and input on this project. I have moved to Tampa Fl and made sure to get a house that has a bonus room for my home theater. It wasn't as large as I wanted but I know it will work. My challenge is just on the layout of where everything will go with it being so small. Maybe its because I'm used to having something much larger. I have included a couple pictures as well as two layouts I am considering. I don't have the fancy/shmancy software to design it so it isn't exactly to scale. Here are the key issues I am trying to resolve.

1. 5.1 or 7.1/2: am I better off keeping things simple with 5.1 or should I try to go with 7.1 surround like I'm used to?
2. seating design: This sectional is big enough that it fills the back of the room. It is really comfy but should I drop it for something else smaller? I like to be able to lay down while i watch stuff lol.
3. Speakers. Where the hell do i put the surrounds?? the room is small enough to where I am wondering if i'm better off just putting them in the ceiling at the edge of the room. If I got a smaller couch I could put them on stands on the sides. If i put them in the ceiling, should i do 7.1?
4. Media cabinet location: as you can see my current option isn't amazing. It would have to go right outside the room in the hall. Clearance from the couch to the wall is 18" so i don't think I can put it in the room realistically with the current seating.
5. Screen size: 135" will work no problem based on the calculations. I was looking to go 150 but based on placing the projector at 1' 4" from the wall, 150" is the absolute MAX that the 5050ub can throw with a throw of 14' 10". so 150 at max for the projector or 135?

Thank you in advance for your advice and support.
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post #2 of 21 Old 08-10-2019, 11:33 AM
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The whole point of a 7.1 speaker layout is to have a pair of surrounds at your sides and another pair of surrounds behind you so that you can hear side-vs-rear separation in the surround field.



That's not possible with the seating at/near the back wall (no space behind you for the rear speakers).

In your situation, I would do a 5.1 set-up with the surrounds on the side walls, as far back as possible (back corners of the room), mounted a couple feet above seated ear height. Corner placement will help provide good envelopment in the surround field.

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post #3 of 21 Old 08-10-2019, 03:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post
The whole point of a 7.1 speaker layout is to have a pair of surrounds at your sides and another pair of surrounds behind you so that you can hear side-vs-rear separation in the surround field.



That's not possible with the seating at/near the back wall (no space behind you for the rear speakers).

In your situation, I would do a 5.1 set-up with the surrounds on the side walls, as far back as possible (back corners of the room), mounted a couple feet above seated ear height. Corner placement will help provide good envelopment in the surround field.
Makes sense. What about screen size and the media cabinet location?
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post #4 of 21 Old 08-10-2019, 04:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overdose View Post
What about screen size and the media cabinet location?
Not a problem having the media cabinet just outside the door.

Make the screen as large as you can. Even if you make the screen as wide as the entire front wall, you'll still end up with a roughly 45-degree viewing angle for your seating distance. That's not too wide (in this day & age of HD and UHD, I've seen plenty of home theatres with 55-60 degree viewing angle).

The other option is to build a false wall a couple feet from the real wall and hide your speakers & subs behind an acoustically transparent screen. Will give an incredibly clean look to the room (look ma, no speakers).

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post #5 of 21 Old 08-11-2019, 02:38 AM
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Would you be open to doing something with those French doors?

We can see a hint of what's outside the room but I kind of wonder if a single door entry, if something like this isn't possible?

If you don't have your speakers yet, then maybe some shallow columns could host surround speakers, done with shallow in-wall speakers.

Three seats in 13' of width is nice to have decent separation from side surround speakers, but I do think an ATMOS 5.1.4 setup might work really well, with having
no side surrounds to deal with.
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post #6 of 21 Old 08-11-2019, 02:46 AM
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Yeah, if you can, remove the french doors (which are usually terrible for sound isolation and can rattle), put in a single door, get the couch off the back wall (where sound quality is terrible usually), and you should be in much better shape.
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post #7 of 21 Old 08-11-2019, 05:49 AM
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Much of what can be done with this space hinges on making the entry area décor friendly with the rest of the house, to me.

The room could also be flipped end for end. Those windows hidden in the an AT space, but be kept accessible, by having that end of the
acoustically transparent end wall hinged.

I also don't know what you have for gear, but the front end could be rather small, and hidden in the front AT space.
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post #8 of 21 Old 08-11-2019, 06:39 AM
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I have a smaller room than yours (13'2" deep and 12'4" wide) and have a full 7.1.4 setup. You may want to consider replacing the very large sectional with some theater recliners. That would allow you to get them off the back wall and still allow for good clearance with the french doors. Here's some pics of my space to give you some ideas.
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post #9 of 21 Old 08-11-2019, 06:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post
Not a problem having the media cabinet just outside the door.

Make the screen as large as you can. Even if you make the screen as wide as the entire front wall, you'll still end up with a roughly 45-degree viewing angle for your seating distance. That's not too wide (in this day & age of HD and UHD, I've seen plenty of home theatres with 55-60 degree viewing angle).

The other option is to build a false wall a couple feet from the real wall and hide your speakers & subs behind an acoustically transparent screen. Will give an incredibly clean look to the room (look ma, no speakers).

First of all, thank you all so much for the truly excellent feedback. Moving all the way across the country has been a lonely journey and building this home theater was feeling a bit overwhelming. You guys are some good dudes. If you're ever in Tampa let me buy you a drink haha.

Back the business of cinema. I am planning to get the Epson 5050ub. Based on several calculators, getting to the 150" screen is the absolute max throw size i can do in that room (the projector would be 1'4" from the back wall". So my thought is that adding another wall for an AT setup would make that screen smaller. The bonus room is 2nd floor and on the other side of the 'front' and 'back' walls the roof slopes down. Otherwise, i could look into creating more room for the AT approach.
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post #10 of 21 Old 08-11-2019, 07:34 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tedd View Post
Would you be open to doing something with those French doors?

We can see a hint of what's outside the room but I kind of wonder if a single door entry, if something like this isn't possible?

If you don't have your speakers yet, then maybe some shallow columns could host surround speakers, done with shallow in-wall speakers.

Three seats in 13' of width is nice to have decent separation from side surround speakers, but I do think an ATMOS 5.1.4 setup might work really well, with having
no side surrounds to deal with.
Based on the feedback, i am attaching some pictures of the entry. These pictures are from the 2nd floor landing.

Tedd: thank you for sending your proposed layout concept. Very cool! To make sure I understand, are you saying you would add a AV closet in the hallway space? I have another closet that could work that is about 15' down the hall. Should I consider that?

Lindahl: Would replacing these french doors with a single door be expensive?

Tedd: To respond to your 2nd comment, flipping the room end to end and then blocking out the windows is a very creative idea. I just went and measured the side window. It is 5' 6" so if I put a 2nd wall where the window ends I would lose a lot of room. When I moved out here I sold my last setup with the house so that I could upgrade a few things. I will post my proposed setup to get further feedback.

Mojo: Cool setup man! You did a LOT with a smaller space. My wife doesn't like the HT seating concept. She told me last night that she wants to be able to "cuddle". could be worse!
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post #11 of 21 Old 08-11-2019, 08:10 AM
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I would consider the av rack 15' away. Might be a headache come a 20' run for 4K, but for a short walk, and some sort of easy way to control gear, it would be on the radar
and likely a far better solution since both sides are open. (Sometimes ideas are just stepping stones, and just part of a progression to a better solution.)

No reason those home theater seats couldn't be a sectional, or a loveseat + single seat seating solution.

You could simply do a hinged panel to hide the deep side window. The idea being to have a dark room, for best video performance, and yet still have easy access to the
window, to air the room. You don't have more then 2' of room depth to give up, but those panels to hide the windows, needn't eat up room depth. They just need a purpose in
the room's final décor, to effectively disguise them.

You might not need to replace those doors at all. They could stay in place with one locked down. Or they could get mirrored panels put in, and then be blanked off inside.

Much of how I would do such a space, is about the interior look of the room you would be after, and about if one can do some DIY, or the overall budget to work with.

You could still panel off one door and create a bit of a feature wall entry look. I've often thought of a hdtv movie poster light box and a small bit of feature wall as a way to eliminate
one door of a French door. Basically remove the door and build in a new section of wall, with a proper frame for the remaining door.
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post #12 of 21 Old 08-11-2019, 08:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Gear

attached is my proposal for the budget including gear. I am trying to keep it under 10K which is difficult it seems.

2019 New HT Build Proposal
Hardware Pick Cost Aquisition
Projector 5050 UB 2600
Sub Monolith by Monoprice 10 440 complete
towers CHANE A5.4 880
Surrounds Chane A1.5 548
Center Chane A2.4 -
receiver TBD 600
Atmos speakers TBD 600 ?
screen Silver ticket 150" 450
Room darkening Velvet and curtains 400
Couch 1200 ?
Door upgrade 1200 ?
Installation Labor 1000 ?




Total 9918
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post #13 of 21 Old 08-11-2019, 08:30 AM
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Something like this perhaps, with in-wall speakers for surround speakers?

Big floor to ceiling fabric covered panels could be hinged, to 'stealth" out the windows. An AT space also hides a lot of av clutter, so that's a nice plus for a smaller space also.
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post #14 of 21 Old 08-11-2019, 11:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tedd View Post
Something like this perhaps, with in-wall speakers for surround speakers?

Big floor to ceiling fabric covered panels could be hinged, to 'stealth" out the windows. An AT space also hides a lot of av clutter, so that's a nice plus for a smaller space also.
Is the AT silver screen good? I mainly don't want to lose resolution on 4k because of the weave. Also, any suggestions on in wall and atmos speakers to pair with Chane?
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post #15 of 21 Old 08-11-2019, 02:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overdose View Post
Based on several calculators, getting to the 150" screen is the absolute max throw size i can do in that room (the projector would be 1'4" from the back wall". So my thought is that adding another wall for an AT setup would make that screen smaller.
But it would be closer. A 150" screen 16' away would give you the exacts same size image with a 131" screen that was 14' away.
Quote:
The bonus room is 2nd floor and on the other side of the 'front' and 'back' walls the roof slopes down. Otherwise, i could look into creating more room for the AT approach.
You might be misunderstanding where the false wall would go. It would be closer to you than the real front wall (i.e., inside the room, not outside the room where the roof slopes down). It's just some lumber nailed together to form a frame. The largest opening is covered by an acoustically transparent screen. You can staple black cloth to the wood to cover the rest of the openings.

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post #16 of 21 Old 08-13-2019, 06:43 AM - Thread Starter
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But it would be closer. A 150" screen 16' away would give you the exacts same size image with a 131" screen that was 14' away. You might be misunderstanding where the false wall would go. It would be closer to you than the real front wall (i.e., inside the room, not outside the room where the roof slopes down). It's just some lumber nailed together to form a frame. The largest opening is covered by an acoustically transparent screen. You can staple black cloth to the wood to cover the rest of the openings.

OK i see your point. Yes when you move the screen towards the viewer it is larger. Do you think that making the room smaller with the AT wall will feel cramped? The pictures of other people's HT rooms look so much larger. Would i need to pull up the carpet to build that frame?
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post #17 of 21 Old 08-13-2019, 07:52 AM
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Do you think that making the room smaller with the AT wall will feel cramped?
No. You have a 16-foot long room and you sit at one end of it. You said your projector has to be 1'4" from the back wall. If you place the false wall 1'4" from the front wall, you can then move the projector rearward to a shelf on the back wall. 16" of space behind an acoustically transparent screen should be able to accommodate speakers & subs.
Quote:
Would i need to pull up the carpet to build that frame?
No need. Just assemble the frame so that it is a tight fit between the walls & ceiling. Friction will keep it in place.

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post #18 of 21 Old 08-13-2019, 08:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overdose View Post
Based on the feedback, i am attaching some pictures of the entry. These pictures are from the 2nd floor landing.

Tedd: thank you for sending your proposed layout concept. Very cool! To make sure I understand, are you saying you would add a AV closet in the hallway space? I have another closet that could work that is about 15' down the hall. Should I consider that?

Lindahl: Would replacing these french doors with a single door be expensive?

Tedd: To respond to your 2nd comment, flipping the room end to end and then blocking out the windows is a very creative idea. I just went and measured the side window. It is 5' 6" so if I put a 2nd wall where the window ends I would lose a lot of room. When I moved out here I sold my last setup with the house so that I could upgrade a few things. I will post my proposed setup to get further feedback.

Mojo: Cool setup man! You did a LOT with a smaller space. My wife doesn't like the HT seating concept. She told me last night that she wants to be able to "cuddle". could be worse!

Totally understand. Maybe a couch with recliners and a chaise on one end will allow for cuddling when she is present and for you to kick your feet up with a recliner and a drink and watch a movie when you're alone. Here's a few I found, but I'm sure there are many other options out there that could work for your space.



https://www.overstock.com/Home-Garde...9/product.html


https://www.ashleyfurniture.com/p/co...ectional-sofas
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post #19 of 21 Old 08-13-2019, 09:58 AM
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The room would visually shrink, but you now don't have front speakers/subs visible. And you should have a similar brightness level, with the smaller AT screen.

As for losing resolution, your eyes won't be fully resolving the resolution at that distance anyways. And there's some advantages like your center channel can be
an identical speaker match, to your LR.

And with but one row, you can drop the screen down. Having the bottom of the screen 16-18" off the floor, is an option.

I would suggest a little more AT space depth so your sub can fit back there, and you can have 6" of air, between the backside of the screen, and the speaker face.
That way, there's no timbre shifting happening.
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post #20 of 21 Old 08-14-2019, 08:24 AM
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I'm diggin' the examples of false wall/screen walls on this thread!!!
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post #21 of 21 Old 08-19-2019, 10:24 PM
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HT bonus room layout help

Replacing the french doors with a single door would be pretty cheap and easy to do.

1 remove the doors
2 pull the molding off the wall carefully (reuse it)
3 frame in the door opening
4 add drywall
5 paint (you have extra paint for the room and hallway?)
6 cut down the molding and add it back
7 buy door and re-hang

Probably a few hundred in labor at most plus some for the door. Definitely a 1-day job.

For resale you could add a closet and sell it as another bedroom.
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