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post #1 of 18 Old 02-06-2020, 06:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Pole Barn System

Hello, first post.
I am trying to install a audio system in my pole barn. It’s separated into two spaces. (Hang out room 24x16) and the shop (60x40). I would like to have the receive in the hangout room that will run all the speakers. (5 in the hangout, 5 in the shop) I will always want to have the same audio playing in the building. I just want to have the ability to control the volume separately.

With that being said. I would like a In wall volume control for the shop. But every one that I found cannot control five speakers.... So how do I put two 5.1 systems with one receiver and use volume control?

I was thinking of a 6 channel receiver and use the 6th channel to control a 5 channel amp for the shop?
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post #2 of 18 Old 02-06-2020, 06:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Jtpappy View Post
Hello, first post.
I am trying to install a audio system in my pole barn. It’s separated into two spaces. (Hang out room 24x16) and the shop (60x40). I would like to have the receive in the hangout room that will run all the speakers. (5 in the hangout, 5 in the shop) I will always want to have the same audio playing in the building. I just want to have the ability to control the volume separately.

With that being said. I would like a In wall volume control for the shop. But every one that I found cannot control five speakers.... So how do I put two 5.1 systems with one receiver and use volume control?

I was thinking of a 6 channel receiver and use the 6th channel to control a 5 channel amp for the shop?
Is this just to be use for music, radio, etc.? You're not trying to do home theater in two different rooms?

If this is for music, etc., you want to look at a distributed or zone type system.

This can be done with a constant voltage system or a more conventional system with a zone control speaker selector approach. So if you can tell me what sources you want to use and if it's for music only etc. I can make some suggestions for you.

As you've described it so far, yes, you would need a volume control on each speaker with the receivers volume control being used as a master volume control. You would also have a problem driving two sets of 5 speakers safely, without damage to the equipment. You would be better to use two receivers', one for each zone or room.

With some more information, there are much better ways to do it.
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post #3 of 18 Old 02-06-2020, 07:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by b curry View Post

Is this just to be use for music, radio, etc.? You're not trying to do home theater in two different rooms?

If this is for music, etc., you want to look at a distributed or zone type system.

This can be done with a constant voltage system or a more conventional system with a zone control speaker selector approach. So if you can tell me what sources you want to use and if it's for music only etc. I can make some suggestions for you.

As you've described it so far, yes, you would need a volume control on each speaker with the receivers volume control being used as a master volume control. You would also have a problem driving two sets of 5 speakers safely, without damage to the equipment. You would be better to use two receivers', one for each zone or room.

With some more information, there are much better ways to do it.
In the hangout room there will be a Tv that I will connect to the receiver. I would like to play it on both spaces but have the ability to turn down the garage or just shut it off if I am in the room watching the game.

I also am looking for a receiver that can do what I want with the two spaces as I am talking about as well as be able to connect to it Bluetooth and stream my iPhone.

Both spaces with have fronts, rears, and one center. If I use two receivers will I be able to have them playing the same thing at once? I don’t want a 2 zone receiver because zone 2 only has 2 outputs. I need 5 outputs on “zone 2”

Here is a picture of a volume control that I would love but it can’t control 5 speakers. Speaker a controls small room, speaker b controls big shop.
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post #4 of 18 Old 02-06-2020, 09:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Jtpappy View Post
In the hangout room there will be a Tv that I will connect to the receiver. I would like to play it on both spaces but have the ability to turn down the garage or just shut it off if I am in the room watching the game.

I also am looking for a receiver that can do what I want with the two spaces as I am talking about as well as be able to connect to it Bluetooth and stream my iPhone.

Both spaces with have fronts, rears, and one center. If I use two receivers will I be able to have them playing the same thing at once? I don’t want a 2 zone receiver because zone 2 only has 2 outputs. I need 5 outputs on “zone 2”

Here is a picture of a volume control that I would love but it can’t control 5 speakers. Speaker a controls small room, speaker b controls big shop.
With those requirements I think the most cost effective way would be to use two identical 5.1 AVR's.

You can use an HDMI splitter between the TV and the two AVR's. That will allow you to use the TV audio in the garage area with volume control or shut off completely as requested.

If you mount the identical AVR's in the same area, you should be able to use a single remote to control both.

There's a place called Accessories4less that sells factory refurbished AVR's for discount prices. I put a link below that I filtered for 5.1 AVR's with Bluetooth.

There's also a link for an HDMI splitter. You would take the HDMI cable out from the TV and into the splitter. Then two HDMI cables out from the splitter into the input of each AVR.

You can pick up the two AVR's and the splitter for less than $450.

https://www.accessories4less.com/mak...umber_channels[]=5&home_audio_key[]=Bluetooth

https://www.monoprice.com/Product?p_...seq=1&format=2
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post #5 of 18 Old 02-06-2020, 11:07 AM
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That's a pretty nice lookin' Pole Barn!



You plans need some adjusting.....


It seems you want 5 Channel surround in each area.....by any stretch you'd be better off with 2 inexpensive 5 Channel Receivers.


A single Channel line output isn't going to provide Stereo let alone the needed signal multiple channels.


If your not really looking for true "Surround" you can cover that entire area with one Receiver and a couple of Speaker Selector Boxes, one that has a in-line Line Level Attenuator Control. But that 5th Speaker would need explaining.


5 Channel in both?, then two Receivers interconnected or ganged via a Fiber Optic Cord is the sensible solution.

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post #6 of 18 Old 02-06-2020, 11:16 AM
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Just saw b curry 's response,


Basically the same advice, and good advice indeed, however his depends upon the TV being the source for HDMI distribution, and I find that improbable. Most likely either a Cable Box or or Satellite Box is being used, and either will have a Fiber Optic out that can go into a FO-Splitter and one o'dose only runs $10.00

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post #7 of 18 Old 02-06-2020, 12:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post
That's a pretty nice lookin' Pole Barn!



You plans need some adjusting.....


It seems you want 5 Channel surround in each area.....by any stretch you'd be better off with 2 inexpensive 5 Channel Receivers.


A single Channel line output isn't going to provide Stereo let alone the needed signal multiple channels.


If your not really looking for true "Surround" you can cover that entire area with one Receiver and a couple of Speaker Selector Boxes, one that has a in-line Line Level Attenuator Control. But that 5th Speaker would need explaining.


5 Channel in both?, then two Receivers interconnected or ganged via a Fiber Optic Cord is the sensible solution.
Thank you. Is there a way to control an 5 channel amplifier with a volume control knob?
RCA out from 6+ channel main receiver connected to say box and is Bluetooth- into a volume control switch - into the RCA input on rack mount amplifier- out to the 5 speakers in the big shop?

I am not sure if you can control RCA inputs like that or not?
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post #8 of 18 Old 02-06-2020, 12:13 PM - Thread Starter
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If I end up using two receivers. Say I want to play the same song in both rooms off of my iPhone. How would I connect to both receivers at the same time? iPhone only allows one Bluetooth device at once...
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post #9 of 18 Old 02-06-2020, 12:16 PM
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Just saw b curry 's response,


Basically the same advice, and good advice indeed, however his depends upon the TV being the source for HDMI distribution, and I find that improbable. Most likely either a Cable Box or or Satellite Box is being used, and either will have a Fiber Optic out that can go into a FO-Splitter and one o'dose only runs $10.00
He indicated that he was using only a TV as a source and a Bluetooth stream from his iPhone. So I opted for an HDMI splitter with the two AVR's and TV in the "hangout room" where he said he wanted the TV. I tend to think of a Cable Box or or Satellite Box and TV as a single unit; semantics.
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post #10 of 18 Old 02-06-2020, 12:20 PM
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If I end up using two receivers. Say I want to play the same song in both rooms off of my iPhone. How would I connect to both receivers at the same time? iPhone only allows one Bluetooth device at once...
Use a single Blutooth receiver and split its output to each AVR.

https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=38070

Last edited by b curry; 02-06-2020 at 12:24 PM.
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post #11 of 18 Old 02-06-2020, 12:22 PM
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If I end up using two receivers. Say I want to play the same song in both rooms off of my iPhone. How would I connect to both receivers at the same time? iPhone only allows one Bluetooth device at once...
What ever source you use, you would use a splitter to feed each AVR.
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post #12 of 18 Old 02-06-2020, 12:30 PM
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Thank you. Is there a way to control an 5 channel amplifier with a volume control knob?
RCA out from 6+ channel main receiver connected to say box and is Bluetooth- into a volume control switch - into the RCA input on rack mount amplifier- out to the 5 speakers in the big shop?

I am not sure if you can control RCA inputs like that or not?
Yes, two ways.

You would use the pre-outs of an AVR to feed some kind of mixing board and then feed a 5 channel amplifier.

Or, you can use the pre-outs of the AVR and feed a 5 channel amplifier and the place a volume control between each amplifier output and each speaker.

A total of 5 volume controls ether way you do it.

So you'll have the cost of a 5 channel amplifier and a mixer or 5 additional volume controls and more complicated wiring.

Or you can use 2 AVR's
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Y’all are awesome! Two AVRs it is! Thank you guys so much for the information!! One last question. Best wire for runs up too 100 feet?
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If you can do without 5.1 channel surround, you can simply use the zone 2 outputs on an AVR and feed a multi channel distribution amplifier.

That can be a conventional design with one speaker unit per channel or a constant voltage, 70v system with multiple speakers.

Either will support stereo or mono sound.
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post #15 of 18 Old 02-06-2020, 12:53 PM
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Y’all are awesome! Two AVRs it is! Thank you guys so much for the information!! One last question. Best wire for runs up too 100 feet?
Copper 14AWG is more that adequate.

In your case, maybe look for copper low voltage wire. The stuff used for landscape lighting. I use the same for my outdoor theater. You can usually find it on sale in the spring from HomeDepot, etc.

Monoprice has a 1000 ft. spool on sale for $89.00. Ignore the part where they say "These cables are not designed to be used as speaker wire cables". It's stranded copper wire with a good dialectic insulator and works great as a speaker wire.

https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_...SABEgLkOPD_BwE


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post #16 of 18 Old 02-06-2020, 01:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Jtpappy View Post
Y’️all are awesome! Two AVRs it is! Thank you guys so much for the information!! One last question. Best wire for runs up too 100 feet?
Copper 14AWG is more that adequate.

In your case, maybe look for copper low voltage wire. The stuff used for landscape lighting. I use the same for my outdoor theater. You can usually find it on sale in the spring from HomeDepot, etc.

Monoprice has a 1000 ft. spool on sale for $89.00. Ignore the part where they say "These cables are not designed to be used as speaker wire cables". It's stranded copper wire with a good dialectic insulator and works great as a speaker wire.

https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_...SABEgLkOPD_BwE


That’s to funny. I own a landscaping company and have 20-30 spools of this stuff in the shop! Never knew it was good to use on audio.
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post #17 of 18 Old 02-06-2020, 01:29 PM
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That’s to funny. I own a landscaping company and have 20-30 spools of this stuff in the shop! Never knew it was good to use on audio.
I would just add that I'm assuming that your not pulling inside a wall. If you're pulling inside a wall you want to use wire that's rated CL2/CL3/CMP for fire/insurance compliance.

Yes, it's ok. I used to work for a company that supplied machinery for making copper wire. Won't go into it but it's it's ok and usually cheaper.
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post #18 of 18 Old 02-07-2020, 08:10 AM
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The only real consideration to using Landscape Wire (...which I have done quite often...) is that "work-ability" can be more difficult. Most 14 ga. would / should have 105 Strands....and certainly at least 64 Strands. Anything under the lower figure can be quite rigid...and somewhat dangerous because the individual conductors can easily penetrate your fingers like a needle!

But really, there are two very good reasons for selecting a Wire with more strands than less...especially on longer runs.

  • Better HF performance
  • Reduction of the "Skin Effect"
The latter bears some explanation. Fewer & larger diameter Strands, while great for simply passing higher voltage (600v +) create a situation where the Low Voltage current spends time jumping between the individual conductors as it is passing through...something that is eliminated when the strands are smaller and more densely packed. While that would be no issue when pushing extreme amounts of current down a longish run, when your simply powering a normal speaker at normal volume, both efficiency and resulting frequency loss can occur.


But be advised that unless your pushing over 200 watts of power down a 100'+ line, 14 gauge is actually overkill. You could only "see" the difference on a Oscilloscope, not hear it.

I use the following Wire quite often in both 16 & 14 ga.: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0193RRNGY/

The 14 gauge is quite often out of stock as it is quite popular.

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