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post #1 of 6 Old 02-08-2020, 09:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Video dropouts

I'm having an issue with one of my components and for the life of me I cannot figure out whats causing it. I suspect something is "going bad" but I don't know if its the TV, Receiver, cables or something else. This is the equipment i've had set up for the past 3+ years:
  • Yamaha RX-V779 Receiver
  • Samsung UN65KS8000 65" TV
  • Verizon FiOS One Cable Box
  • Apple TV 4K


The TV is wall mounted, my front and center speaker are in-wall, and my mid/rear speakers are in the ceiling. I had a renovation done 3 years ago and we ran all of the wiring then. I ran a 25' HDMI (4K/18GB compatible) to the office which is behind my family room. In the closet of the Office I have a media cabinet which is where the receiver is located. So its HDMI from the TV to the receiver (HDMI1) and then the Cable box and Apple TV are connected via HDMI I have it set up so that the FiOS Remote powers on the receiver, the cable box and TV. If I want to watch the Apple TV I can use the Yamaha remote to switch to HDMI2 and then the Apple TV remote to navigate. Its all pretty simple and straightforward

So, heres the issue I've been having for the past 2-3 weeks. When I power on the system (Receiver, TV, Cable Box), I will get audio right away, but on the TV I get a message stating no HDMI input is found. It takes anywhere from 1-2 minutes for the picture to actually show up. So the screen is actually on because I get that message, but just no picture. If I switch to the Apple TV, it'll be the same thing - its at least a minute before it switches. If I switch back to TV, same thing - instant audio, but delayed video.

That led me to think the receiver was having an issue switching sources. I went and picked up a new receiver, connected it and the first time I powered it on I ran into the same exact problem. I ended up returning that receiver since that wasn't the problem.

So in the office I have a very inexpensive Westinghouse 40" 1080P TV. What I did was took the HDMI cable that would typically run to the Samsung TV and ran it to the Westinghouse. I powered it on and everything came up normally. Audio and video were instantly on. I started thinking that maybe it was the cables, so I replaced everything (except the 25' because thats run through the ceiling and I can't get to it. Same Issue. Theres a few other things I've tried.

Direct from cable box to tv (bypassing the receiver entirely) and I the same delay.
Plugging the Apple TV into the TV HDMI2 (leaving the receiver/Cable as HDMI1) - Audio delay with the Cable box, but Apple TV, No delay.
Plugged the receiver into HDMI2 on the the TV, and got the same delay.

It seems like a cycle.. Whenever I narrow it down to something, its not that. I'm 99.999% sure its not the receiver because the same exact thing happened with a totally different receiver.. even a different brand (Sony), and it has happened when I've taken the receiver out of the equation. I've replaced all of the cables (except one) and I dont think its that one because when I ran the AppleTV direct I used that cable and not only was there no delays, it actually ran at a higher quality (4K HDR.. when I go through the receiver it only does 4K SDR). It seems like its the TV, although I dont know that its a bad port because it occurs on HDMI1 and 2, but only when its the receiver/cable box connected. Its almost as if the TV cant handle everything being connected. I did a full reset of the TV (as per Samsungs instructions) but still the same thing. Its not under warranty since I've had it 3 years, but its quite a hassle to go buy a 65" TV to test it out only to find out thats not the issue either. ( Even though it worked on the Westinghouse, its only 1080P and I'm wondering if its just so basic its not using all of the functionality.

Is there any other tests I could try to either pinpoint it to the TV or eliminate that from being the problem? I'm totally stumped.
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post #2 of 6 Old 02-08-2020, 10:30 PM
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Did you install the 25' cable in a conduit? That is the basic recommendation for in-wall installations because it's safer and easier to upgrade your cabling and you can control the bend radius.


What kind of cable is the 25' cable? Is it a certified High Speed HDMI cable (which is passive) with the QR label or is it an active cable or a "regular" HDMI cable (not certified)?


If you are using ARC/CEC then disable that on all HDMI connected devices and then use the individual remotes to operate your system. If you don't have any issues then it's probably a CEC issue of which there is very little you can do because CEC is not standardized.

I never trust an atom, they make up everything.
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post #3 of 6 Old 02-09-2020, 09:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post
Did you install the 25' cable in a conduit? That is the basic recommendation for in-wall installations because it's safer and easier to upgrade your cabling and you can control the bend radius.


What kind of cable is the 25' cable? Is it a certified High Speed HDMI cable (which is passive) with the QR label or is it an active cable or a "regular" HDMI cable (not certified)?


If you are using ARC/CEC then disable that on all HDMI connected devices and then use the individual remotes to operate your system. If you don't have any issues then it's probably a CEC issue of which there is very little you can do because CEC is not standardized.
Thanks for the response.. The 25' cable is made by BlueRigger, it says its category 2 certified, certified to have a bandwidth of 18 Gigabits per second and ATC (Authorized Testing Center) certified. When it finally makes the connection I'm getting the full resolution and everything works perfectly fine - its just that delay thats odd. I reconnected the AppleTV this morning direct using the 25' cable and I am getting 4K HDR - I only get 4K SDR through the receiver, which is probably a limitation of the equipment. I'm Ok with that.

I just ordered a new 25' cable, I'm going to try and bypass the one I have thats in the ceiling and see whether it still occurs. if it does, then I know its not the ceiling cable.. If it doesn't then I have another issue because unfortunately, no - it wasn't run through a conduit so replacing that cable isn't going to be easily doable. (as soon as the walls were sealed up and painted and I was able to connect the equipment I realized we had made a big mistake in not running a 2nd wire as a fallback.)
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post #4 of 6 Old 02-09-2020, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by hls811 View Post
Thanks for the response.. The 25' cable is made by BlueRigger, it says its category 2 certified, certified to have a bandwidth of 18 Gigabits per second and ATC (Authorized Testing Center) certified. When it finally makes the connection I'm getting the full resolution and everything works perfectly fine - its just that delay thats odd. I reconnected the AppleTV this morning direct using the 25' cable and I am getting 4K HDR - I only get 4K SDR through the receiver, which is probably a limitation of the equipment. I'm Ok with that.

I just ordered a new 25' cable, I'm going to try and bypass the one I have thats in the ceiling and see whether it still occurs. if it does, then I know its not the ceiling cable.. If it doesn't then I have another issue because unfortunately, no - it wasn't run through a conduit so replacing that cable isn't going to be easily doable. (as soon as the walls were sealed up and painted and I was able to connect the equipment I realized we had made a big mistake in not running a 2nd wire as a fallback.)
Ok, it sounds like the BlueRigger cable is a certified Premium High Speed cable. You really can't do any better than that, even tho 25' is pushing the upper limits. Keep in mind that no cable is 100% guaranteed to work in every system. There are just too many variables (installation, components, etc) that also come into play. And it's possible to get a bad cable or have a cable failure. Just make sure you have a little bit of slack at both ends of the cable connection to reduce the possibility of placing undo strain on the HDMI inputs, which is a concern of 25' passive cables because the wire gauge is usually thicker and reduces the bend radius.

Laying the new cable on the floor and thoroughly testing it before installation is a very wise move. If the cable works, but you have issues after installation, then the installation is faulty (most likely too sharp of a bend or too many sharp bends in the cable run). It's also not a good idea to use wall plates. The cable should be a direct connection, source to sink.

Don't feel bad about not running a conduit. Up until a few years ago, a conduit wasn't really necessary with 1080i/p. One could use extenders, adapters, wall plates, 90 degree bends, etc. and still get a reliable signal. With the advent of 4k and 4k HDR, that all changed so cable installation and management has now become as important and critical as picking out the right equipment. For those of us who have our components close together, like on a media console, it's not that big of a deal. Unfortunately, the opposite is true for those long runs, and I consider a long run anything more than about 15'. And, to add insult to injury, there are folks who don't have issues at all!

I never trust an atom, they make up everything.
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post #5 of 6 Old 02-11-2020, 09:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post
Ok, it sounds like the BlueRigger cable is a certified Premium High Speed cable. You really can't do any better than that, even tho 25' is pushing the upper limits. Keep in mind that no cable is 100% guaranteed to work in every system. There are just too many variables (installation, components, etc) that also come into play. And it's possible to get a bad cable or have a cable failure. Just make sure you have a little bit of slack at both ends of the cable connection to reduce the possibility of placing undo strain on the HDMI inputs, which is a concern of 25' passive cables because the wire gauge is usually thicker and reduces the bend radius.

Laying the new cable on the floor and thoroughly testing it before installation is a very wise move. If the cable works, but you have issues after installation, then the installation is faulty (most likely too sharp of a bend or too many sharp bends in the cable run). It's also not a good idea to use wall plates. The cable should be a direct connection, source to sink.

Don't feel bad about not running a conduit. Up until a few years ago, a conduit wasn't really necessary with 1080i/p. One could use extenders, adapters, wall plates, 90 degree bends, etc. and still get a reliable signal. With the advent of 4k and 4k HDR, that all changed so cable installation and management has now become as important and critical as picking out the right equipment. For those of us who have our components close together, like on a media console, it's not that big of a deal. Unfortunately, the opposite is true for those long runs, and I consider a long run anything more than about 15'. And, to add insult to injury, there are folks who don't have issues at all!
Thank you again for the help.. I must say - I'm completely at a loss for what it could be. On Sunday I took the TV off of the wall and brought it into the office, I put it a few feet away from the receiver and ran a 6' cable direct from receiver to the TV - I bypassed the ceiling cable. Every time, sound and video came on together. It had to be the cable causing the problem. I mounted the Tv back again, powered it on - and while there was still a delay with the video it was no longer a minute or more, video would come on within a few seconds (5-10). I was thinking it was definitely the cable. So, just to make sure, I went and ordered another 25' cable - I just laid it out across the room, nothing pretty - direct from receiver to the tv, again bypassing the ceiling cable - First time, it worked perfect.. powered off/on a few times and then it would start to occur - Audio first, and then TV the same 5-10 second delay. I can live with that, its really not a big deal, but the face its happening with the new cable too? I just can't see having a 2nd cable with the same results. I would think if I had a bad cable I'd see something with the image quality or resolution - not just a delay. I'm still leaning towards it being the TV having an issue handling the switching and the cables are fine.. I'm at a loss, but at the same time if the delay stays at 5-10 seconds I'll deal with it. I'm not replacing an otherwise gret TV over that - I just wish something would pinpoint exactly what it is.
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post #6 of 6 Old 02-11-2020, 09:30 PM
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Thank you again for the help.. I must say - I'm completely at a loss for what it could be. On Sunday I took the TV off of the wall and brought it into the office, I put it a few feet away from the receiver and ran a 6' cable direct from receiver to the TV - I bypassed the ceiling cable. Every time, sound and video came on together. It had to be the cable causing the problem. I mounted the Tv back again, powered it on - and while there was still a delay with the video it was no longer a minute or more, video would come on within a few seconds (5-10). I was thinking it was definitely the cable. So, just to make sure, I went and ordered another 25' cable - I just laid it out across the room, nothing pretty - direct from receiver to the tv, again bypassing the ceiling cable - First time, it worked perfect.. powered off/on a few times and then it would start to occur - Audio first, and then TV the same 5-10 second delay. I can live with that, its really not a big deal, but the face its happening with the new cable too? I just can't see having a 2nd cable with the same results. I would think if I had a bad cable I'd see something with the image quality or resolution - not just a delay. I'm still leaning towards it being the TV having an issue handling the switching and the cables are fine.. I'm at a loss, but at the same time if the delay stays at 5-10 seconds I'll deal with it. I'm not replacing an otherwise gret TV over that - I just wish something would pinpoint exactly what it is.

Did you test it direct from the ATV4k to the tv and not go thru the receiver? With the use of a receiver, that is your switching device, not the tv, unless you are using ARC/CEC which can be a problem in a lot of systems.


So.....



Test the new cable with a direct connection, ATV4k to the tv, bypassing the receiver.


Disable ARC/CEC on all of your HDMI connected devices and see if that improves the situation with the 25', certified Premium High Speed HDMI cable.

I never trust an atom, they make up everything.
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