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post #31 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Milt99 View Post

Holy crap!
A double-down diaper rating from Art.
I think you've just invented a new rating scale.
Forget stars, tomatoes or thumbs, this diaper thing could catch on!

Of course, if I had Art's system (a/v system, not digestive system), I'd probably routinely need diapers too.

Stephen.

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post #32 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 10:52 AM
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Holy smokes, those grabs look pretty damn amazing!

I haven't seen the movie yet. Was going to rent via Netflix, but I might just go buy this for the eye candy alone.
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post #33 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin View Post

but I might just go buy this for the eye candy alone.

I don't think you'd regret it, Rob. Not to mention the sound also.

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post #34 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 11:11 AM
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I found both Video and Audio to be stellar. Additionally big kudos to the disc authors for including the resume feature, why this essential feature is not standard on BR is beyond me.

Thanks for the Caps Xylon.

Best Regards
KvE

PS Where are all the dirty little secrets? Come on Xylon quit holding out show us some bad screencaps.

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post #35 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 42041 View Post

Does anyone think this movie looks a bit open-matte compositionally in 16:9? There tends to be an unusual amount of negative space in the frame

I know Cameron said 1.78:1 was the OAR but I wonder if it was only intended for IMAX screens originally and Cameron put it on blu-ray just to please both the OAR and the fill-my-TV crowd

I don't think it looks open matted at all. The shot composition was obviously framed for the 16:9 ratio. If you tried to crop a 2.35:1 version out of this you would be constantly panning and scanning up and down, and even then, compositionally, the image would be far too cramped.

I believe 1.78:1 was definitely the OAR. This aspect ratio was probably used in particular because of the use of 3D. Perhaps Cameron felt that 3D is more effectively utilized with a 16:9 ratio. Or, perhaps he wanted to accommodate both 16:9 and 2.35:1, but worked with 16:9 as his primary ratio.

There is one indicator that a 2.35:1 could have potentially been cropped out of this and that is the fact that the subtitles are placed very high in the frame. If you scale the image and use an anamorphic lens (or zoom), the subtitles will fall comfortably in the bottom of the image.

In either case, it seems clear to me that this film was shot with 1.78:1 in mind. 2.35:1 may be a preferred ratio for many people (myself included), and some CIH users are up in arms, but to blow up this image to accommodate a 2.35:1 screen would be too destructive IMHO. There are a myriad of shots that I noticed that would have been compositionally undermined if they were cropped for 2.35:1 (yes, CROPPED for 2.35:1). Just look at any of Xylon's screenshots on page 1 and imagine them cropped on the top and bottom. No way 2.35:1 was the intended ratio.

Avatar represents one instance where 16:9 is the preferred ratio. If you have a scope screen, I don't think it would be right to hack off a significant portion of the image by blowing it up to fit your screen. If you do, then as far as I'm concerned, you belong in the exact same category as those who zoom 2.35:1 movies out to fit their 16:9 screens.

Watching Avatar in my home theater is the single most awesome audio and visual feast I have experienced, and watching it in 16:9 didn't diminish it one bit.
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post #36 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 12:19 PM
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Anyone can confirm if the US and Europe release are the same encode ? Looks like to me.

Kilgore, in one of the Avatar making of available online, you can see what Cameron sees when he shoots on his monitor. The frame for the 16/9 and the scope are there and the scope is a bit up (not centered). If someone can frame grab this, guys with projectors here will be able to replicate in scope the original frames Cameron shot. Just by calculating the masking place on the monitor.
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post #37 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 12:44 PM
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What's up with "Dancing with Pocahontas"?
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post #38 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 12:55 PM
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The only time it might work for CIH set-ups is if they released a separate 2.35:1 version in the future and it was carefully composed by the filmmakers. Then it would probably look decent. But just doing it yourself is going to cut off some good stuff.
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post #39 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 01:24 PM
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Originally Posted by mikenike View Post

What's up with "Dancing with Pocahontas"?

It's a joke. I laughed. Didn't you?
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post #40 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 01:25 PM
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I think he's just curious if the disc was actually printed as such.
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post #41 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 01:27 PM
 
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I did a review for my site here since the film arrived today, really enjoyed it and impressive looking disc.

Shame i cannot get screencaps yet due to the Sony Vaio laptop BD drive not playing the disc, it needs a firmware update, i guess Xylon uses a different computer drive than me.

http://www.darkrealmfox.com/film_rev.../04/24/avatar/
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post #42 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 01:40 PM
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Well, thanks to Xylon i gave in and bought it, and just finished watching it. It is stellar indeed. More vibrant even than i remember it being in the theater.

"He who asks feels dumb for a few minutes, but he who does not ask remains dumb forever."

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post #43 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 01:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn View Post

I trust you ! I watched it last night. When that space scene on the way to Pandora comes up I needed a second diaper ! The whole film looked great and as you said the audio is great as well. I really like the occasional aggressive use of the surrounds.

Art

Study that scene carefully, it looks incredible but also very fake, it's almost too much clarity (if that's possible) .

Jason

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post #44 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaGamePimp View Post

Study that scene carefully, it looks incredible but also very fake, it's almost too much clarity (if that's possible) .

Jason

I've posted several times before that the CGI struck me as very fake in numerous scenes involving the environment and machinery. Very detailed, yet very CGI'ish at the same time. It was posted that it was possibly an intentional effect by Cameron & Co., but I don't know for sure.

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post #45 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 02:00 PM
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Yeah I have no idea if it was intentional or not but it took me right out of the movie because it felt more like a tech demo vs something genuine. Don't get me wrong though, my jaw hit the floor too and if I had any adult diapers I would have changed mine as well .

Jason

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post #46 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 02:06 PM - Thread Starter
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post #47 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 02:07 PM - Thread Starter
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post #48 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 02:47 PM
 
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I'm curious what is achieved by comparing a Blu-ray to a DVD in a Blu-ray forum?
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post #49 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Fast Fizzy View Post

I'm curious what is achieved by comparing a Blu-ray to a DVD in a Blu-ray forum?

Many, MANY people out there are still convinced that there is no great difference between Blu-ray and standard DVD. I know plenty personally.

I find these comparisons help to show the difference. I've given links of shots like these to people who are on the fence about buying into Blu-ray and comparisons like these help a great deal.

You'd be surprised how many people with brand spanking new 50" hi-def TV's are still running DVD'S and standard cable, thinking that Blu-ray isn't worth it.

If Avatar on Blu-ray won't convince these yahoos, nothing will.
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post #50 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 03:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 42041 View Post

Does anyone think this movie looks a bit open-matte compositionally in 16:9? There tends to be an unusual amount of negative space in the frame

I know Cameron said 1.78:1 was the OAR but I wonder if it was only intended for IMAX screens originally and Cameron put it on blu-ray just to please both the OAR and the fill-my-TV crowd

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilgore View Post

I don't think it looks open matted at all. The shot composition was obviously framed for the 16:9 ratio. If you tried to crop a 2.35:1 version out of this you would be constantly panning and scanning up and down, and even then, compositionally, the image would be far too cramped.

I believe 1.78:1 was definitely the OAR. This aspect ratio was probably used in particular because of the use of 3D. Perhaps Cameron felt that 3D is more effectively utilized with a 16:9 ratio. Or, perhaps he wanted to accommodate both 16:9 and 2.35:1, but worked with 16:9 as his primary ratio.

There is one indicator that a 2.35:1 could have potentially been cropped out of this and that is the fact that the subtitles are placed very high in the frame. If you scale the image and use an anamorphic lens (or zoom), the subtitles will fall comfortably in the bottom of the image.

In either case, it seems clear to me that this film was shot with 1.78:1 in mind. 2.35:1 may be a preferred ratio for many people (myself included), and some CIH users are up in arms, but to blow up this image to accommodate a 2.35:1 screen would be too destructive IMHO. There are a myriad of shots that I noticed that would have been compositionally undermined if they were cropped for 2.35:1 (yes, CROPPED for 2.35:1). Just look at any of Xylon's screenshots on page 1 and imagine them cropped on the top and bottom. No way 2.35:1 was the intended ratio.

Avatar represents one instance where 16:9 is the preferred ratio. If you have a scope screen, I don't think it would be right to hack off a significant portion of the image by blowing it up to fit your screen. If you do, then as far as I'm concerned, you belong in the exact same category as those who zoom 2.35:1 movies out to fit their 16:9 screens.

Watching Avatar in my home theater is the single most awesome audio and visual feast I have experienced, and watching it in 16:9 didn't diminish it one bit.

Cameron talked about his aspect ratio choices in this interview:

Quote:


What do you think the best format is to view this film in?

Cameron: The film was released in two formats. We released it in 16×9 and cinemascope aspect ratio. Obviously, the 35 mm prints were all in the scope ratio and with the IMAX stuff, we tried to take advantage of the height. The highest and best format for this movie is the 16×9, which plays beautifully. We finished the picture in 16×9 and then we vertically extracted the cinemascope when we were mastering the film for theatrical release.

In the theatrical release of the movie, it played in 3-D in non-IMAX digital theaters in both formats. We did that by selecting whichever theater was going to look best in which format. But, for the home, we wanted to go with the full picture. I really think it helps, with the sense of vertigo underneath the flying creatures, to have that little bit of extra frame down there, when they're looking down over cliffs. It enhances the sense of height.

Even though I love the cinemascope ratio compositionally, I actually found myself falling in love with the movie in 16×9, as we went along, and I prefer to watch it in that. Everyone thought the best viewing conditions for the movie were in 3-D, but in 3-D what we struggled with was the light levels. We struggled to get the light levels up, in the theaters. You get such a bright, crisp, dynamic picture on the DVD and Blu-ray. Something actually comes back to the viewing experience that you don't get in the theaters, with the colors and the strength of the contrast.

The Blu-ray/DVD will only be in 16×9?

Cameron: Yeah. There will be no letterbox scope video.

Will the 3-D also be in 16×9 when it comes out?

Cameron: Absolutely, yeah.


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post #51 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 03:28 PM
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I just got back from the store and have Avatar in hand. The *only* reason that I bought it was because of this thread. DAMN YOU XYLON!!!
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post #52 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 03:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin View Post

Holy smokes, those grabs look pretty damn amazing!

I haven't seen the movie yet. Was going to rent via Netflix, but I might just go buy this for the eye candy alone.

I was going to just rent it as well, but all these reports pushed me into the store today and I bought it Hope I can watch it tom.........tonight is out......bunch of kids over. Looking forward more to the video than audio for a change.
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post #53 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 03:46 PM
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I just got back from the store and have Avatar in hand. The *only* reason that I bought it was because of this thread. DAMN YOU XYLON!!!

Ha! You fell for, Rob. The video SUCKS on this disc, and the audio is twice as bad. You just wasted your money on a turd. You totally got worked, dude.

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post #54 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Toe View Post

I was going to just rent it as well, but all these reports pushed me into the store today and I bought it Hope I can watch it tom.........tonight is out......bunch of kids over. Looking forward more to the video than audio for a change.

Todd, you're SO not going to be disappointed in any aspect of the disc. Knowing your preferences, I'd be shocked if I was wrong. One of your concerns was the sound you heard in the theater, and from my perspective, it blows it away.

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post #55 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 03:53 PM
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Originally Posted by sb1 View Post

Ha! You fell for, Rob. The video SUCKS on this disc, and the audio is twice as bad. You just wasted your money on a turd. You totally got worked, dude.

Revenge is a dish best served cold.
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post #56 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by sb1 View Post

Todd, you're SO not going to be disappointed in any aspect of the disc. Knowing your preferences, I'd be shocked if I was wrong. One of your concerns was the sound you heard in the theater, and from my perspective, it blows it away.


Good to know Stephen Sounds like the low end is a bit conservative though from various reports (would you agree?)..........but we will see, or should I say hear Either way sounds like overall it is a killer disc
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post #57 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 04:03 PM
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Revenge is a dish best served cold.

Hehehe. You won't regret the purchase. If you do, blame Xylon.

Stephen.

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post #58 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 04:05 PM
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Sounds like the low end is a bit conservative though from various reports (would you agree?)

Yeah I believe they tamed down a lot of the LFE for the home theatre mix in certain sequences (hometree). I read that FilmMixer seems to have similar thoughts in another thread.
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post #59 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 04:05 PM
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Good to know Stephen Sounds like the low end is a bit conservative though..........but we will see, or should I say hear Either way sounds like overall it is a killer disc

I wouldn't really call it conservative. I'd call it balanced, which is the main thing for me in any track. There is no certain aspect that calls attention to itself here, other than awesomeness. Truly impressive for me.

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post #60 of 247 Old 04-24-2010, 04:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sujay View Post

Yeah I believe they tamed down a lot of the LFE for the home theatre mix. I read that FilmMixer seems to have similar thoughts in another thread.

Not to dispute you or FM's claim's, but if it's tamed, it's not apparent on my system. I have a far more impressive sounding movie than I saw in the theater, that's for sure.

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