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post #61 of 182 Old 01-25-2011, 03:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vläd View Post

It almost as if Summit changed their minds on the audio at the last minute, maybe to make a couple of extra $$ on the same disc that they're producing for the rental industry.

Some corporate bean counter probably figured out they could save 80 cents a copy by switching to BD25 instead of using BD50. Since the video encode was already done with a BD50 in mind, they found they couldn't fit the DTS-HD MA track on a BD25. Bye bye DTS-HD MA track!

Summit Entertainment, if you're reading this..... I'd rather pay $17 for a BD50 with HD video and lossless audio, than pay $13 for a BD25 with lossy audio.

Mark
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post #62 of 182 Old 01-25-2011, 03:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro J View Post

Agreed. Also, someone reported that they talked to a Summit rep who said a lossless track probably wasn't included because it was a BD25. That's complete rubbish. There's plenty of room for a master audio soundtrack.

It was Mark who spoke with the Summit rep. And if you look at Cinema Squid's post (#50) with the BDinfo, no there's not enough space. Looks like (but not confirmed) that the used the same video encode they used on the BD50 "special" version that had plenty of room to breathe.
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post #63 of 182 Old 01-25-2011, 03:51 PM
 
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I will wait for the UK release to see what happens, but the same company just put out The Hole only in 2D
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post #64 of 182 Old 01-25-2011, 05:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CochiseGuy View Post

It was Mark who spoke with the Summit rep. And if you look at Cinema Squid's post (#50) with the BDinfo, no there's not enough space. Looks like (but not confirmed) that the used the same video encode they used on the BD50 "special" version that had plenty of room to breathe.

Yep... the encode on the $13 movie-only version takes up more than 23GB. No room to put a DTS-HD MA track on that BD25 UNLESS they went back and did another (lower bitrate) encode for the video.

Don't give them any ideas.

Mark
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post #65 of 182 Old 01-25-2011, 05:54 PM
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Love malkovich, love Willis, love Mirren,...but I did not love this movie. It wasn't really boring but just could never "get" into the film. There were some funny moments but overall it's just a big dud. I will say this, the dvd PQ on this one is better than Piranha blu ray.
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post #66 of 182 Old 01-25-2011, 08:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoey67 View Post

Love malkovich, love Willis, love Mirren,...but I did not love this movie. It wasn't really boring but just could never "get" into the film. There were some funny moments but overall it's just a big dud. I will say this, the dvd PQ on this one is better than Piranha blu ray.

So basically wait until it hits Netflix streaming?
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post #67 of 182 Old 01-25-2011, 08:20 PM
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Watched my Blockbuster rental copy with the DD5.1 audio. Rather unimpressive and rather bland audio. Explosions and gunfire were pretty pathetic. Not sure what Summit thinking, but they've lost a sale. Movies wasn't that great either, but the audio being stripped down to bare bones was just another kick in the nuts.

FWIW, setup was Oppo 83, Marantz AV7005, Outlaw 7700, Klipsch RB-75s front, rear and surround, Klipsch RC64 center and HSU sub.
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post #68 of 182 Old 01-25-2011, 08:35 PM
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The audio is fine, more than up to the task. Just watched a Netflix copy and loved everything about this film. Great adventure/suspense flick and unbelievable cast. Great PQ too. Well worth a buy, but if you're going to get the knickers in a twist over audio codecs, get the full version with lossless audio.
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post #69 of 182 Old 01-25-2011, 08:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Booth View Post

Yep... the encode on the $13 movie-only version takes up more than 23GB. No room to put a DTS-HD MA track on that BD25 UNLESS they went back and did another (lower bitrate) encode for the video.

Don't give them any ideas.

Mark

I haven't popped in my copy, but I assume there is a bunch of stuff at the beginning, so does that 23GB include the trailers and the "yay for Blu-ray" commercial and any anti-tobacco or AFI commercials (or anything else they can manage to annoy me with)? How much space does that take up?

Just curious if they'd lose all that crap, if they'd have had room for the lossless track.

My panties aren't all in a bunch around no lossless (honestly, I can't tell a difference...my ears suck) but it's the principle of the thing and the precedent it sets. As a renter, I am getting tired (and bitter) of all the recent hits the studios are dealing us.
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post #70 of 182 Old 01-25-2011, 08:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post

The audio is fine, more than up to the task. Just watched a Netflix copy and loved everything about this film. Great adventure/suspense flick and unbelievable cast. Great PQ too. Well worth a buy, but if you're going to get the knickers in a twist over audio codecs, get the full version with lossless audio.

This may be true if one were to watch the film and use only their television speakers, but for me, it was pretty flat and uninspiring. No depth and absolutely no low end when it came to the explosions and gunfire.

Glad it was just a rental though. Movie was just so-so and not something I'd probably want to watch again.
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post #71 of 182 Old 01-25-2011, 08:54 PM
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I saw this movie on another site in a link at Amazon for $12.99 and jumped on it. I did not realize that it had a lossy track vs a lossless track. I just assumed the cheaper version had less extras and was not a flipper disc.

Then I read this thread... Oh well. Not happy, but at this point I am going to just keep it. Really surprised that they gave us a lossy track on an action movie.
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post #72 of 182 Old 01-25-2011, 09:18 PM
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PQ is really good but the audio is really flat if you have good subs waiting for that "oomph" forget it, that never came. At least with Air bender and Piranha the great mix made up for it even if you find the movie not enjoyable. Even with my dual ULS-15, they were taking a nap for most the movie and never really came out to play.

Maybe with the blu ray DTS, it's different, hope someone can find out if that's the case it will interesting to see.
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post #73 of 182 Old 01-25-2011, 10:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Booth View Post

Squid,
Thank you for sharing that! Now, it would be terrific if someone with the Special Edition version could be so kind as to run it through BDInfo and post the results.

Mark

Here you go...

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Spoiler  
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)


Code:
DISC INFO:

Disc Title:     RED
Disc Size:      34,388,458,501 bytes
Protection:     AACS
BD-Java:        Yes
BDInfo:         0.5.6

PLAYLIST REPORT:

Name:                   00001.MPLS
Length:                 1:51:09 (h:m:s)
Size:                   30,769,041,408 bytes
Total Bitrate:          36.91 Mbps

VIDEO:

Codec                   Bitrate             Description     
-----                   -------             -----------     
MPEG-4 AVC Video        28024 kbps          1080p / 23.976 fps / 16:9 / High Profile 4.1

AUDIO:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
DTS-HD Master Audio             English         3998 kbps       5.1 / 48 kHz / 3998 kbps / 24-bit (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48 kHz / 1509 kbps / 24-bit)
Dolby Digital Audio             Spanish         640 kbps        5.1 / 48 kHz / 640 kbps
Dolby Digital Audio             English         192 kbps        2.0 / 48 kHz / 192 kbps

SUBTITLES:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
Presentation Graphics           English         21.052 kbps                                     
Presentation Graphics           Spanish         18.424 kbps                     

FILES:

Name            Time In         Length          Size            Total Bitrate   
----            -------         ------          ----            -------------   
00001.M2TS      0:00:00.000     1:51:09.663     30,769,041,408  36,906          

CHAPTERS:

Number          Time In         Length          Avg Video Rate  Max 1-Sec Rate  Max 1-Sec Time  Max 5-Sec Rate  Max 5-Sec Time  Max 10Sec Rate  Max 10Sec Time  Avg Frame Size  Max Frame Size  Max Frame Time  
------          -------         ------          --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  
1               0:00:00.000     0:07:11.264     27,644 kbps     45,378 kbps     00:00:21.980    32,372 kbps     00:00:20.895    30,190 kbps     00:02:03.832    144,107 bytes   630,731 bytes   00:03:47.518    
2               0:07:11.264     0:06:52.161     28,016 kbps     39,916 kbps     00:09:34.407    31,982 kbps     00:08:39.519    30,056 kbps     00:10:02.476    146,064 bytes   746,309 bytes   00:10:40.723    
3               0:14:03.425     0:06:50.034     28,222 kbps     45,956 kbps     00:15:48.322    31,237 kbps     00:15:44.318    29,783 kbps     00:15:39.313    147,138 bytes   642,942 bytes   00:15:48.739    
4               0:20:53.460     0:03:13.109     28,136 kbps     36,965 kbps     00:22:10.454    30,418 kbps     00:21:58.025    29,892 kbps     00:21:52.769    146,688 bytes   627,035 bytes   00:23:19.356    
5               0:24:06.570     0:05:03.886     28,125 kbps     42,047 kbps     00:25:10.342    30,539 kbps     00:27:31.232    29,635 kbps     00:27:31.232    146,633 bytes   599,820 bytes   00:25:14.679    
6               0:29:10.457     0:06:46.114     28,056 kbps     39,005 kbps     00:31:19.085    30,508 kbps     00:32:05.882    29,625 kbps     00:32:59.227    146,272 bytes   756,436 bytes   00:33:25.420    
7               0:35:56.571     0:07:30.116     28,038 kbps     40,189 kbps     00:41:51.884    30,387 kbps     00:42:03.562    29,608 kbps     00:41:38.871    146,176 bytes   559,264 bytes   00:38:43.988    
8               0:43:26.687     0:05:45.845     28,217 kbps     43,755 kbps     00:49:11.531    31,233 kbps     00:49:07.527    30,244 kbps     00:44:37.716    147,108 bytes   527,655 bytes   00:49:12.532    
9               0:49:12.532     0:06:44.403     28,153 kbps     40,351 kbps     00:51:51.108    30,916 kbps     00:53:22.908    29,766 kbps     00:53:23.033    146,779 bytes   588,772 bytes   00:50:52.340    
10              0:55:56.936     0:07:15.184     28,123 kbps     39,637 kbps     00:58:34.135    30,639 kbps     00:57:53.386    29,587 kbps     00:57:48.381    146,618 bytes   557,658 bytes   01:02:00.550    
11              1:03:12.121     0:06:29.889     28,078 kbps     37,448 kbps     01:07:29.420    30,434 kbps     01:03:56.165    29,332 kbps     01:03:18.711    146,385 bytes   650,209 bytes   01:06:15.346    
12              1:09:42.011     0:05:42.258     27,994 kbps     42,840 kbps     01:14:53.947    30,853 kbps     01:13:30.489    29,462 kbps     01:13:30.489    145,946 bytes   648,222 bytes   01:13:18.352    
13              1:15:24.269     0:05:27.910     27,993 kbps     34,672 kbps     01:15:27.523    30,490 kbps     01:15:31.860    29,826 kbps     01:20:26.238    145,943 bytes   593,238 bytes   01:15:43.580    
14              1:20:52.180     0:06:21.923     28,081 kbps     40,336 kbps     01:26:06.911    30,729 kbps     01:26:30.310    29,584 kbps     01:26:25.138    146,399 bytes   629,921 bytes   01:24:48.958    
15              1:27:14.103     0:05:50.683     27,922 kbps     43,039 kbps     01:31:25.229    31,526 kbps     01:31:21.225    29,922 kbps     01:31:16.554    145,573 bytes   776,826 bytes   01:30:24.252    
16              1:33:04.787     0:05:27.118     27,924 kbps     40,041 kbps     01:37:22.920    31,041 kbps     01:37:22.711    30,232 kbps     01:37:26.674    145,584 bytes   771,540 bytes   01:33:26.601    
17              1:38:31.906     0:04:44.742     28,114 kbps     37,374 kbps     01:39:03.479    30,276 kbps     01:41:10.856    29,173 kbps     01:41:05.768    146,574 bytes   689,831 bytes   01:39:03.687    
18              1:43:16.648     0:07:53.014     27,751 kbps     46,605 kbps     01:45:46.006    31,809 kbps     01:45:19.730    31,041 kbps     01:45:14.641    144,706 bytes   757,576 bytes   01:45:11.013    

STREAM DIAGNOSTICS:

File            PID             Type            Codec           Language                Seconds                 Bitrate                 Bytes           Packets         
----            ---             ----            -----           --------                --------------          --------------          -------------   -----           
00001.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     6669.580                28,024                  23,363,536,378  127,069,863     
00001.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       eng (English)           6669.580                3,998                   3,333,517,036   19,156,342      
00001.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x81            AC3             spa (Spanish)           6669.580                640                     533,573,120     3,126,405       
00001.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x81            AC3             eng (English)           6669.580                192                     160,071,936     1,042,135       
00001.M2TS      4608 (0x1200)   0x90            PGS             eng (English)           6669.580                21                      17,551,339      104,460         
00001.M2TS      4609 (0x1201)   0x90            PGS             spa (Spanish)           6669.580                18                      15,360,554      91,627


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post #74 of 182 Old 01-25-2011, 10:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vläd View Post

Here you go...

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Spoiler  
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)


Code:
DISC INFO:

Disc Title:     RED
Disc Size:      34,388,458,501 bytes
Protection:     AACS
BD-Java:        Yes
BDInfo:         0.5.6

PLAYLIST REPORT:

Name:                   00001.MPLS
Length:                 1:51:09 (h:m:s)
Size:                   30,769,041,408 bytes
Total Bitrate:          36.91 Mbps

VIDEO:

Codec                   Bitrate             Description     
-----                   -------             -----------     
MPEG-4 AVC Video        28024 kbps          1080p / 23.976 fps / 16:9 / High Profile 4.1

AUDIO:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
DTS-HD Master Audio             English         3998 kbps       5.1 / 48 kHz / 3998 kbps / 24-bit (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48 kHz / 1509 kbps / 24-bit)
Dolby Digital Audio             Spanish         640 kbps        5.1 / 48 kHz / 640 kbps
Dolby Digital Audio             English         192 kbps        2.0 / 48 kHz / 192 kbps

SUBTITLES:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
Presentation Graphics           English         21.052 kbps                                     
Presentation Graphics           Spanish         18.424 kbps                     

FILES:

Name            Time In         Length          Size            Total Bitrate   
----            -------         ------          ----            -------------   
00001.M2TS      0:00:00.000     1:51:09.663     30,769,041,408  36,906          

CHAPTERS:

Number          Time In         Length          Avg Video Rate  Max 1-Sec Rate  Max 1-Sec Time  Max 5-Sec Rate  Max 5-Sec Time  Max 10Sec Rate  Max 10Sec Time  Avg Frame Size  Max Frame Size  Max Frame Time  
------          -------         ------          --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  
1               0:00:00.000     0:07:11.264     27,644 kbps     45,378 kbps     00:00:21.980    32,372 kbps     00:00:20.895    30,190 kbps     00:02:03.832    144,107 bytes   630,731 bytes   00:03:47.518    
2               0:07:11.264     0:06:52.161     28,016 kbps     39,916 kbps     00:09:34.407    31,982 kbps     00:08:39.519    30,056 kbps     00:10:02.476    146,064 bytes   746,309 bytes   00:10:40.723    
3               0:14:03.425     0:06:50.034     28,222 kbps     45,956 kbps     00:15:48.322    31,237 kbps     00:15:44.318    29,783 kbps     00:15:39.313    147,138 bytes   642,942 bytes   00:15:48.739    
4               0:20:53.460     0:03:13.109     28,136 kbps     36,965 kbps     00:22:10.454    30,418 kbps     00:21:58.025    29,892 kbps     00:21:52.769    146,688 bytes   627,035 bytes   00:23:19.356    
5               0:24:06.570     0:05:03.886     28,125 kbps     42,047 kbps     00:25:10.342    30,539 kbps     00:27:31.232    29,635 kbps     00:27:31.232    146,633 bytes   599,820 bytes   00:25:14.679    
6               0:29:10.457     0:06:46.114     28,056 kbps     39,005 kbps     00:31:19.085    30,508 kbps     00:32:05.882    29,625 kbps     00:32:59.227    146,272 bytes   756,436 bytes   00:33:25.420    
7               0:35:56.571     0:07:30.116     28,038 kbps     40,189 kbps     00:41:51.884    30,387 kbps     00:42:03.562    29,608 kbps     00:41:38.871    146,176 bytes   559,264 bytes   00:38:43.988    
8               0:43:26.687     0:05:45.845     28,217 kbps     43,755 kbps     00:49:11.531    31,233 kbps     00:49:07.527    30,244 kbps     00:44:37.716    147,108 bytes   527,655 bytes   00:49:12.532    
9               0:49:12.532     0:06:44.403     28,153 kbps     40,351 kbps     00:51:51.108    30,916 kbps     00:53:22.908    29,766 kbps     00:53:23.033    146,779 bytes   588,772 bytes   00:50:52.340    
10              0:55:56.936     0:07:15.184     28,123 kbps     39,637 kbps     00:58:34.135    30,639 kbps     00:57:53.386    29,587 kbps     00:57:48.381    146,618 bytes   557,658 bytes   01:02:00.550    
11              1:03:12.121     0:06:29.889     28,078 kbps     37,448 kbps     01:07:29.420    30,434 kbps     01:03:56.165    29,332 kbps     01:03:18.711    146,385 bytes   650,209 bytes   01:06:15.346    
12              1:09:42.011     0:05:42.258     27,994 kbps     42,840 kbps     01:14:53.947    30,853 kbps     01:13:30.489    29,462 kbps     01:13:30.489    145,946 bytes   648,222 bytes   01:13:18.352    
13              1:15:24.269     0:05:27.910     27,993 kbps     34,672 kbps     01:15:27.523    30,490 kbps     01:15:31.860    29,826 kbps     01:20:26.238    145,943 bytes   593,238 bytes   01:15:43.580    
14              1:20:52.180     0:06:21.923     28,081 kbps     40,336 kbps     01:26:06.911    30,729 kbps     01:26:30.310    29,584 kbps     01:26:25.138    146,399 bytes   629,921 bytes   01:24:48.958    
15              1:27:14.103     0:05:50.683     27,922 kbps     43,039 kbps     01:31:25.229    31,526 kbps     01:31:21.225    29,922 kbps     01:31:16.554    145,573 bytes   776,826 bytes   01:30:24.252    
16              1:33:04.787     0:05:27.118     27,924 kbps     40,041 kbps     01:37:22.920    31,041 kbps     01:37:22.711    30,232 kbps     01:37:26.674    145,584 bytes   771,540 bytes   01:33:26.601    
17              1:38:31.906     0:04:44.742     28,114 kbps     37,374 kbps     01:39:03.479    30,276 kbps     01:41:10.856    29,173 kbps     01:41:05.768    146,574 bytes   689,831 bytes   01:39:03.687    
18              1:43:16.648     0:07:53.014     27,751 kbps     46,605 kbps     01:45:46.006    31,809 kbps     01:45:19.730    31,041 kbps     01:45:14.641    144,706 bytes   757,576 bytes   01:45:11.013    

STREAM DIAGNOSTICS:

File            PID             Type            Codec           Language                Seconds                 Bitrate                 Bytes           Packets         
----            ---             ----            -----           --------                --------------          --------------          -------------   -----           
00001.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     6669.580                28,024                  23,363,536,378  127,069,863     
00001.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       eng (English)           6669.580                3,998                   3,333,517,036   19,156,342      
00001.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x81            AC3             spa (Spanish)           6669.580                640                     533,573,120     3,126,405       
00001.M2TS      4354 (0x1102)   0x81            AC3             eng (English)           6669.580                192                     160,071,936     1,042,135       
00001.M2TS      4608 (0x1200)   0x90            PGS             eng (English)           6669.580                21                      17,551,339      104,460         
00001.M2TS      4609 (0x1201)   0x90            PGS             spa (Spanish)           6669.580                18                      15,360,554      91,627



Thank you vlad!

So, the Special Edition version of 'Red' not only includes a DTS-HD MA lossless audio track, it's video is encoded at a higher bit rate!

Cinema Squid's BDInfo results for the rental disc (BD25):

MPEG-4 AVC Video - 25779 kbps - 1080p/23.976 fps/16:9/High Profile 4.1

vlad's BDInfo results for the SE disc (BD50):

MPEG-4 AVC Video - 28024 kbps - 1080p/23.976 fps/16:9/High Profile 4.1

About 2,300 kbps improved bit rate for the SE version!

Granted, that difference isn't likely noticeable to the eye, but it's interesting that Summit used two different video encodes. They had to "dumb it down" to get it to fit on a BD25.

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post #75 of 182 Old 01-25-2011, 11:36 PM
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Just watched this. I bought the BB exclusive BD/DVD flipper disc. I enjoyed the movie. However, I think they missed opportunities for some really kick ass LFE. Overall the PQ & AQ was decent. Nothing demo worthy.

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post #76 of 182 Old 01-26-2011, 05:21 AM
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Originally Posted by longfellowfan View Post

This sucks. Rental will be dead if this keeps up. Without lossless audio and extras there is no reason to rent a physical copy. I can watch this on demand and get DD 5.1. I am a audio guy and my biggest reason for upgrading is the audio. Rant over

Sorry, but the truth is here:

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Originally Posted by Slaine View Post

Joe Public won't even notice of course, which is a shame because the studios truly deserve some negative PR as a result of these shenanigans.

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Originally Posted by sb1 View Post

Joe Schmoe probably won't notice a difference either way, regardless of which track is playing.

Exactly.

The bulk of the buyers will look at the price and snap it up to play on their equipment that (at best) only supports DD5.1. They wouldn't be able to even hear the lossless track even if it was on the disc.

Heck, a good percentage of the buyers probably are listening through their TV speakers or (judging from the number of them out there) though some sort of 2.1 sound bar setup.

While I think lossless should be the standard, to say this will hurt the studios in the marketplace is silly.

The "MySpace", smart phone and MP3 generation doesn't care. Nor does the typical middle American who probably is lucky if they figured out how to watch TV on their set in the correct aspect ratio.
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post #77 of 182 Old 01-26-2011, 05:30 AM
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There is enough feedback elsewhere on differences between audio codecs with some re-releases. Superman Returns comes to mind and I remember some folks jumping on the lossless release regards of a rather outrageous price at the get go on ebay as it wasn't easy finding a copy on store shelves. Me? I just kept the HD-DVD purchased for peanuts as the movie wasn't good enough to buy again.

I got the NF rental for Red and haven't watched it yet. I assume this company will monitor sales and see how they go and stay tuned I suppose. Many probably will not support this though there may be some early preorder purchases because of unawareness accompanied with a $12.99 price but that may be minimal with forums all the rage over this now!

The company may be taking a chance but at least they did so as they full well know of connection straight to a display as we do. They may be unto something because I bet if you search polls in forums for what the priority is for Joe, it is the video (even though this isn't the same as the SE). I remember myself starting one back when.
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post #78 of 182 Old 01-26-2011, 07:15 AM
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My $12.99 special is going back to Amazon today. I pre-ordered and it was shipped on Monday at $17.99. I asked Amazon for an adjustment and they just sent me a form e-mail response on how prices change from time to time. Guessing the "guaranteed lowest price adjustment" will be coming, but I don't want the movie with just DD. I knew we had to be careful and check when the format came out, but never thought it would be a problem today. Normally the reduced cost versions lack the DVD cut, digital copy or some extras, which is not an issue for me.

This is the last time I pre-order a movie that's coming out in multiple versions until I know the specs.
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post #79 of 182 Old 01-26-2011, 08:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Booth View Post

Thank you vlad!

So, the Special Edition version of 'Red' not only includes a DTS-HD MA lossless audio track, it's video is encoded at a higher bit rate!

It seems the Special Edition's Spanish DD 5.1 dub also got bumped down to DD 2.0 for the Movie-Only Edition.

FYI vläd, in BDInfo you can right-click on the video bitrate images and save them directly rather than using the Windows snipping tool.
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post #80 of 182 Old 01-26-2011, 08:43 AM
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The NF rental says nothing about SE on the disc or the sleeve accompanied. I read back where that is a different case with BV rentals though.

For the heck of it, I am going to listen to this barebones disc via HDMI connection to a display only and see what I think (which I haven't done since I don't know when). I've read varying opinions so far with the SQ on this specific disc when listening via one's audio system.

The morale of this release and upcoming ones low priced with other options to purchase is as always: BUYER BEWARE. I cannot help but feel though that some think they did OK for the price.
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post #81 of 182 Old 01-26-2011, 08:52 AM
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Rented the "full meal deal audio version" yesterday and I will have to echo some of the other comments here .. the soundtrack was strangely muted somehow .. during explosion and gunshot scenes, it just did not pump it out like I would have expected .. voices sounded fine .. don't know if this is an intentional mix, however, I expect it is ..

The menu on the BD has a speaker icon on the right hand side of the menu bar .. don't know what that had to do with anything, I've never noticed this on other BD's .

The soundtrack was clean and clear, just not dynamic ..

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post #82 of 182 Old 01-26-2011, 08:52 AM
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Ordered this, then saw this thread, then canceled my order. This can wait until the real version comes down in price. Never saw it, so it is a blind buy for me.
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post #83 of 182 Old 01-26-2011, 09:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mgkdragn View Post


The soundtrack was clean and clear, just not dynamic ..

I experienced the same thing last night in my viewing. I watched the movie only edition DD5.1.

First time viewing for me and I enjoyed it more than I thought and the audio was just missing dynamics.
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post #84 of 182 Old 01-26-2011, 09:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NetworkTV View Post

The "MySpace", smart phone and MP3 generation doesn't care. Nor does the typical middle American who probably is lucky if they figured out how to watch TV on their set in the correct aspect ratio.

Right, the one that fills up the whole screen...

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post #85 of 182 Old 01-26-2011, 09:51 AM
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Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post

The audio is fine, more than up to the task. Just watched a Netflix copy and loved everything about this film. Great adventure/suspense flick and unbelievable cast. Great PQ too. Well worth a buy, but if you're going to get the knickers in a twist over audio codecs, get the full version with lossless audio.

Unless the mix is somehow different (doubt it) going to the lossless version wont solve the audio issues that have been talked about here. Sounds to me like it is just a flat mix
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post #86 of 182 Old 01-26-2011, 10:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toe View Post

Unless the mix is somehow different (doubt it) going to the lossless version wont solve the audio issues that have been talked about here. Sounds to me like it is just a flat mix

My viewing was of the lossless version .. and I think you're right ..

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post #87 of 182 Old 01-26-2011, 10:04 AM - Thread Starter
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I went to the theater to see this movie. I don't remember it sounding like a flat mix then. Then again, it didn't stand out as an awesome mix either.
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post #88 of 182 Old 01-26-2011, 10:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bachelor View Post

I experienced the same thing last night in my viewing. I watched the movie only edition DD5.1.

First time viewing for me and I enjoyed it more than I thought and the audio was just missing dynamics.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toe View Post

Unless the mix is somehow different (doubt it) going to the lossless version wont solve the audio issues that have been talked about here. Sounds to me like it is just a flat mix

This is absolutely correct. Any perceived deficiencies in the AQ very likely have nothing to do with the codec. Only a direct A-B comparison between lossy and lossless version can determine if there's any difference, but odds are there is not unless different mastering was used. It's possible that some degree of DRC was employed in the mastering, but most likely it would be present on both versions.
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post #89 of 182 Old 01-26-2011, 11:01 AM
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DVD Talk reviewed the HD Audio version and gave it 4.5 stars saying "The DTS-HD 5.1 Dolby Digital sound mix skillfully details the world of "Red," from one-liners to explosive mayhem. Directionals are striking here, placing the listener in the middle of a few startling bullet exchanges. The same can be said of the fisticuffs, with men tossed around the frame, boosted by a lively track that keeps aural matters crisp and purposeful. Dialogue exchanges are direct and frontal, blended well with scoring cues and the occasional rock song. The disc provides a wonderful jolt when charged up, with an active low-end supplying the perfect amount of rumble to the rampage. It's an immersive mix. A Spanish track is also available."

Sounds like a pretty good mix to me. I have a good sound system, so I think I'll just go and give the Best Buy special edition a try. I'll be sure to look at the specs before buying this time.
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post #90 of 182 Old 01-26-2011, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bachelor View Post

I experienced the same thing last night in my viewing. I watched the movie only edition DD5.1.

First time viewing for me and I enjoyed it more than I thought and the audio was just missing dynamics.

I have to agree with all who have posted this mix to be flat. I was watching the SE edition we picked up at BB last night and I was worried that things did not sound right. My wife even commented that (we did think the story was ok) the sound just did not compare to recent purchases such as a-team and expendables.

I even tried re-watching parts of it using Audyssey DSX multichannel and it really was not impressive with LFE moments.

I was glad to see this topic going to confirm it wasn't just my setup.
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