Who wants a UHD HDR version of The Abyss? - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 113 Old 02-12-2016, 09:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by blackssr View Post
I'd settle for a Bluray at this point.
I think I would settle for a nice 480p correct aspect ratio DVD at this point.
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post #32 of 113 Old 02-12-2016, 09:53 AM
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Originally Posted by RLBURNSIDE View Post
Original film print was already inherently HDR.
This statement deserves its own thread. It's crazy what we gave up in the rush to make cinemas digital.
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post #33 of 113 Old 02-12-2016, 10:40 AM
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Originally Posted by mpgxsvcd View Post
I think I would settle for a nice 480p correct aspect ratio DVD at this point.
That's right. My DVD is not even anamorphically enhanced. Windowed boxed. I have a Hidef version on my Tivo that I transferred to my server. It is the theatrical cut not the extended cut. It looks really good.

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post #34 of 113 Old 02-12-2016, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by JGM View Post
This statement deserves its own thread. It's crazy what we gave up in the rush to make cinemas digital.
Mostly a lot of scratches, dirt, missing frames, terrible contrast, excessive grain and poor detail as a result of the film prints being several generations removed from the negative.

Film still has its place as a photographic capture medium, but my nostalgia for it as a projection format has long since died.

The statement that "Original film print was already inherently HDR" is factually incorrect. Theatrical release prints had very poor contrast and would have melted in the gate if projected at the brightness standards for actual HDR as defined by the modern spec.

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post #35 of 113 Old 02-12-2016, 02:33 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mpgxsvcd View Post
I think I would settle for a nice 480p correct aspect ratio DVD at this point.
The thing that's really moronic about UHD blurays is that they didn't do anamorphic encoding, despite the fact that HDMI 2.0 mandates the inclusion of an explicit 21:9 flag which would easily take care of that, by letting the player do its own downscaling.

Of course each movie can have a slightly different vertical resolution since their AR isn't either exactly 16:9 or 21:9, but could be somewhere slightly off. I'd rather they just cropped the extra vertical pixels for movies that have more than 1620 vertical resolution.

What the designers should have done is basically what DVDs did perfectly : specify the movie aspect ratio and store all the data in full frame to maximize the use of all the pixels.
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post #36 of 113 Old 02-12-2016, 08:10 PM
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Did you see that, RL? I gave you a 'like'.

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post #37 of 113 Old 02-12-2016, 09:06 PM
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I have yet to see digital made movie look as good as film. Not to mention 70mm. Most those film issues were because of an inexperienced projectionist.

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post #38 of 113 Old 02-13-2016, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by saprano View Post
Most those film issues were because of an inexperienced projectionist.
The scratches, dirt and damage maybe (though every film print will inevitably accumulate them no matter how carefully they're handled). The poor contrast, grain and detail are endemic problems with release prints that are several generations removed from the negative. The projectionist has no control over those.

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post #39 of 113 Old 02-17-2016, 09:11 AM
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Originally Posted by mpgxsvcd View Post
Where did you get the HD broadcast from? I will lend you an El Gato HDMI capture device if you can let me "borrow" your copy for awhile.
It was on Cinemax or HBO for me, I think Cinemax and I recorded it via WMC. Very obviously not standard def upscaled to HD. Unfortunately it was not the extended cut, so the movie doesn't make as much sense
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post #40 of 113 Old 02-27-2016, 01:28 AM
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I suppose the remaster of the Abyss, well, went to THE ABYSS

Seriously though, we will get to see this UHD version in an EASTER EGG on AVATAR 3. 'I am serious, and don't call me Shirley'...
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post #41 of 113 Old 03-29-2016, 08:43 AM
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I'll make it simple. If the only chance to rewatch / own the disc of The Abyss in an appropriate HD format is to buy a UHD Player, I'll be first in line.


Since the film was shot in Super35 and has a negative area of 1.85:1 I'd really appreciate if that were the aspect ratio we might eventually get.
On LaserDisc the film was released both in letterbox and a director-supervised /-approved 4:3 pan & scan edition.

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post #42 of 113 Old 04-19-2016, 04:50 PM
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Now that Cameron has announced he'll be doing like a dozen Avatar sequels until 2023, I think we all just need to accept it.
The Abyss is lost to history.
With nothing but an out of print non-anamorphic widescreen dvd, future generations will find it unwatchable and it will be lost and forgotten.
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post #43 of 113 Old 04-19-2016, 11:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Lazarus Dark View Post
With nothing but an out of print non-anamorphic widescreen dvd, future generations will find it unwatchable and it will be lost and forgotten.
Much like the Avatar sequels beyond the first one, I should imagine.
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post #44 of 113 Old 04-20-2016, 02:29 PM
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It's up to Fox, I have inside info I cannot share.

Fox will only release the Abyss and True Lies in conjunction with the theatrical debut of an Avatar sequel.

4K masters from Relliance, and extras are already finished.

Fox is to blame.
Not Cameron.
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post #45 of 113 Old 04-20-2016, 02:43 PM
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35mm film has more dynamic range than SDR, and the higher bit depth used in HDR can capture more nuance than the lower bit depth used in SDR.

So while I would hate to see Abyss or other films goosed up for HDR, I would love to see them preserved in an HDR container that gives us the wider dynamic range, and better color fidelity, which is closer to the original first print than SDR 8 bit can convey.
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post #46 of 113 Old 05-26-2016, 12:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post
It's exactly this kind of thinking that has resulted in countless old movies being color regraded into the modern teal-and-orange style.
Trends in color timing existed in the VHS era where everything was orange and yellow.
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post #47 of 113 Old 05-26-2016, 12:34 PM
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The Abyss is one of my favorite movies. So the answer is yes. An UHD HDR version would be great. Count me in. Of course it should be in correct AR and extended version.
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post #48 of 113 Old 05-26-2016, 12:54 PM
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Trends in color timing existed in the VHS era where everything was orange and yellow.
Are you arguing that we should continue to make the same mistakes that studios did in the VHS era?

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post #49 of 113 Old 05-27-2016, 05:24 PM
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Are you arguing that we should continue to make the same mistakes that studios did in the VHS era?
I believe the mistake is unavoidable. Older movies will conform to an altered state.
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post #50 of 113 Old 05-29-2016, 07:01 PM
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HDR version of Avatar?! Sure! HDR version of The Abyss? Eh..WTF?! I don't recall it being HDR material to begin with, except for a few scenes that might go wonderfully in HDR.
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post #51 of 113 Old 06-02-2016, 01:15 PM
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Originally Posted by homogenic View Post
I believe the mistake is unavoidable. Older movies will conform to an altered state.
Well, you are wrong. The mistake is easily avoided.

Step 1) Look at the colors the movie was photographed in.
Step 2) Ask yourself, "Should I arbitrarily change all the colors in this movie for no reason whatsoever?"
Step 3) Just don't do it.

There you go. Problem averted. It's actually much simpler to not screw it up than it is to go out of the way to deliberately screw it up.

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post #52 of 113 Old 06-03-2016, 05:51 PM
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I believe the mistake is unavoidable. Older movies will conform to an altered state.
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Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post
Well, you are wrong. The mistake is easily avoided.

Step 1) Look at the colors the movie was photographed in.
Step 2) Ask yourself, "Should I arbitrarily change all the colors in this movie for no reason whatsoever?"
Step 3) Just don't do it.

There you go. Problem averted. It's actually much simpler to not screw it up than it is to go out of the way to deliberately screw it up.
Personally I think he's right. Technically, by transferring to digital, you've already significantly altered the film from its original directors intent. If you want true original intent, you need a film projector in your house and a big screen. Most directors don't even shoot with home video in mind, they shoot for large theater screen experience, which looks less than ideal on most peoples tv, compared to modern hdtv shows, shot with small tv screens in mind and framed for small screens.
Not to mention, just by scanning, even at high resolution with high quality intentions, you are likely getting different colors than originally intended. So color correction is a necessity. If original intent is out of the question, I say may as well make it look good for the modern equipment it will actually be shown on and in a way that modern audiences find more enjoyable.

I have this problem with Star Wars. I don't mind the sfx updates in the special editions but I hate the edits done to the film itself. However, I can't stand the 1970's colors of the Despecialized Editions, I greatly prefer the modern colors (and sound) of the Blurays (though they are a bit too blue). So I ended up having to make my own edited version of the Blurays.
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post #53 of 113 Old 06-04-2016, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Lazarus Dark View Post
Personally I think he's right. Technically, by transferring to digital, you've already significantly altered the film from its original directors intent. If you want true original intent, you need a film projector in your house and a big screen. Most directors don't even shoot with home video in mind, they shoot for large theater screen experience, which looks less than ideal on most peoples tv, compared to modern hdtv shows, shot with small tv screens in mind and framed for small screens.
Not to mention, just by scanning, even at high resolution with high quality intentions, you are likely getting different colors than originally intended.
Your reasoning here makes no sense at all. Blu-ray and especially UHD are very capable of preserving the original theatrical look of a movie. Countless Blu-rays do that right now.

Even if some compromises need to be made and the disc can only look 90% like the original, is it your argument that we should just throw up our hands and say, "Oh well, if it can't be perfect, there's no sense even trying. We might as well change everything!"? How does that make any sense?

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So color correction is a necessity.
There is a profound difference between "correction" and "changing."

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If original intent is out of the question,
Original intent is never out of the question. Never.

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I say may as well make it look good for the modern equipment it will actually be shown on and in a way that modern audiences find more enjoyable.

I have this problem with Star Wars. I don't mind the sfx updates in the special editions but I hate the edits done to the film itself. However, I can't stand the 1970's colors of the Despecialized Editions, I greatly prefer the modern colors (and sound) of the Blurays (though they are a bit too blue). So I ended up having to make my own edited version of the Blurays.
This attitude makes me very sad.

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post #54 of 113 Old 07-24-2016, 12:16 AM
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Here ya go. James Cameron himself confirms a new 4k scan and an HDR grading session will be done




"On that note, he has some good news for fans who have been clamoring for a Blu-ray release of “The Abyss.”

“We’ve done a wet-gate 4K scan of the original negative, and it’s going to look insanely good,” Cameron said. “We’re going to do an authoring pass in the DI for Blu-ray and HDR at the same time.”

He said to expect that some time early next year. "




http://variety.com/2016/film/news/ja...se-1201821558/

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post #55 of 113 Old 07-24-2016, 02:41 AM
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post #56 of 113 Old 07-24-2016, 09:46 AM
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Rad.
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post #57 of 113 Old 07-24-2016, 10:04 AM
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Being that he stated an HDR grading pass was conducted during the wet gate restoration scan, does that mean a UHD Blu-ray will drop as well? Count me in if it's on a BD-100 with adequate bitrate, hopefully Dolby Vision, and killer Dolby Atmos.

Now, we need UHD Blu releases of True Lies and the hopefully fantastic 4k restoration of T2!
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post #58 of 113 Old 07-25-2016, 01:14 AM
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Being that he stated an HDR grading pass was conducted during the wet gate restoration scan, does that mean a UHD Blu-ray will drop as well? !
Automatically means a UHD BD? No.
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post #59 of 113 Old 07-25-2016, 08:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Wink

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Rad.
Yes now I will be asking for the same thing to be done for the movie "RAD". Probably the "Best" worst movie of all time.
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post #60 of 113 Old 07-25-2016, 08:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Hitchman View Post
Being that he stated an HDR grading pass was conducted during the wet gate restoration scan, does that mean a UHD Blu-ray will drop as well? !
Automatically means a UHD BD? No.
Well, hopefully with the restored T2 getting a theatrical re-release soon, albeit in converted 3D, and with Avatar 2 on its way Fox will see an opportunity to release a UHD disc like they did with ID4.
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