Originally Posted by Josh Z
HDR did not exist at the time those movies were made. Every last one of them was timed for the color and contrast properties of the film prints available with projection at the standard ~15 FL.
I'm sorry, but that's not correct. The directors of these movies did not intend for them to be seen in HDR. HDR didn't even exist. Re-grading the movies for HDR now is revisionism, no better than colorizing black & white.
It may be your personal subjective opinion that HDRing old movies makes them look "better," but that was never the expectation or the intention when they were made.
It's exactly this kind of thinking that has resulted in countless old movies being color regraded into the modern teal-and-orange style.
HDR isn't a new invention, our eyes have been seeing in high dynamic range for millions of years.
And yes, from the start, the film industry has been trying to, and succeeding in, improving film colour and I see no reason why we can't benefit from high dynamic range.
More importantly, neither do the studio execs. I work for a major studio and I can assure you, HDR is all over, it's the talk of the town. And it's not just some "buzz word", it represents huge progress.
Catalog titles can be re-released to take advantage of higher resolution, bit depth, colour gamut and HDR and will sell more as a result. What I see as your opinion is that only 3/4 of those are desirable for remasters.
HDR is necessary if your goal is to improve the colours.
Which the film industry has continuously tried to do from the beginning
I mean, heck, they used to advertise the color process used in movies (Technicolor..etc) as a selling point. It's a little disingenuous to think that all those directors and actors wouldn't want people to see their performances in a more natural way, that obviously looks much, much better even to the untrained eye. HDR is simply better than SDR, there is no doubt.
Actually, wasn't it Technicolor itself that just came up with a chip to dynamically HDR-ify SDR content? Dynamic extrapolations will never be as good as the real thing, but in this case, we can actually get the real thing, because all that dynamic range is already there, waiting, in the film negatives.
There's a ton of image detail that has never before been seen on the screen that is dying to come out.
If you want want to see HDR, you want watch the 4K SDR version. Both will be on UHD Blurays and streaming apps. So I'm not sure what the point is of this, other than for me to say I like something that you don't, and we can both get exactly what we want. Nobody's forcing anyone to watch HDR content. Or even buy it.
On UHD Bluray you get both grades. There is literally no reason to complain or worry about HDR ruining people's Wizard of Oz experience on their tiny old black and white or early colour CRTs.
Btw, HDR is terrific
for old black and white movies. I've done some tests with some old footage and you just see so much more detail, it's really stunning and makes the old new again.
And I mean, isn't that the point of watching those old movies on your new 2016 TV? It's absurd to upgrade just the TV but not the pixels that it's showing, in the best possible way. Nobody's saying that artistic intent shouldn't be preserved.
But SDR is not
an artistic intent, it's a limitation that we no longer have to live with. There are tons of colorists who are loving working in this new HDR era, it gives them a much larger palette to choose from and that means their artistic vision can augment and improve upon the original work done a half century (or even a full century) ago.
Maybe it's just me, but I believe in progress. And HDR represents probably a far bigger step towards visual realism than any other aspect of image quality. It would be foolish to leave that on the table and take only those other things. WCG without HDR isn't the same.
The colour volume depends on the gamut and the DR. I think it's irrational to expand to P3 without HDR if your goal is to have more saturated colours. HDR makes a far bigger and better difference than rec 709 vs P3, although there's no reason to not get both.