The New PQ Tier thread for Blu-Ray - Discussion - Page 843 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #25261 of 26023 Old 11-26-2018, 05:41 PM
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^^^^^^^

BTW, I'm glad you weren't disappointed with A Cure For Wellness, even if it didn't crack your top 20/30. I hope that you enjoyed the film itself as well.

But you do raise an interesting point, and that's we may be reaching a point where the UHD/HDR movies/series are starting to leave behind FHD quality. In a not-so-distant future it will be necessary to keep an separate list for UHD films.
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post #25262 of 26023 Old 11-27-2018, 06:56 AM
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There are so many good movies, I mean I've seen at least 10 really good looking Pixar movies that already fill up half the top 20!

Plus, say what you like about streaming, but watching Netflix-made shows in 4K/HDR is absolutely gorgeous, I love the 1.78:1 / 1.85:1 / 1.90:1 aspect ratios but that gives me a direct comparison to what Dolby Vision Netflix offers (Even if its "only" 25Mbit/s bit rate) and they put almost every blu-ray movie to shame.

Which frustrates me even more since Netflix uses about 1/8th of the bit rate and 1/4 (if not 1/8) of the resolution for their MOVIES which look compressed and AWFUL. I don't watch a lot of 4K/HDR physical discs because of the price, but I just ordered:

- Skyscraper (Got really high marks)
- Chappie (one of my favourit tier 0 blu-rays)
- Oblivion (top 5 - top 10 for me when it came out on blu-ray in 2013)
- Everest (never seen)

all on 4K/HDR blu-ray. Can't wait
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post #25263 of 26023 Old 11-27-2018, 09:46 AM
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^^^^^^^^

Did you order those from Amazon? They had quite a good selection UHDs for cheap this past Black Friday/Cyber Monday. I don't have 4K capability just yet, but I ordered my first couple of UHDs. My receiver does 4k, I just need the player and TV,

I saw Chappie UHD for cheap as well, I haven't seen it, (have the previous two Blomkamp movies) but, damn, didn't know it had great PQ quality. I know reviewers gave it high scores, but they usual aren't that accurate in my experience and opinion. Missed opportunity there.

Here in Mexico we still don't have, in general, the internet infrastructure to sustain 4k streaming. You still find a lot of cable programming in SD, since they want to charge good money for HD 720p streaming that's sold as the greatest thing ever, lol. I have access to a Netflix account, but I never use it. I'm still old fashioned and I like watching movies on disc,.mostly because it's simpler and easier.

But the moment 4k streaming becomes a reality, I might give it a chance. I still like buying my physical discs, but it's true it's become a more expensive hobby by the day...only to get slipless covers and cheap eco-cases. Most UHD packages I've seen in store don't look like a premium product to me.

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post #25264 of 26023 Old 11-27-2018, 12:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SnellTHX View Post
I don't watch a lot of 4K/HDR physical discs because of the price, but I just ordered:

- Skyscraper (Got really high marks)
- Chappie (one of my favourit tier 0 blu-rays)
- Oblivion (top 5 - top 10 for me when it came out on blu-ray in 2013)
- Everest (never seen)

all on 4K/HDR blu-ray. Can't wait
Some good choices Snell!!

I just watched Skyscraper in 4K (and reviewed it) a few weeks ago. It looks fantastic! I have Oblivion on 1080p and that also looks great (I'll probably pick up the UHD version at some point, for it is really inexpensive). I also have Chappie in 4K and love the PQ. I have Everest on 1080p and it has awesome PQ. Here is my review for it:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/150-b...l#post41104874

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post #25265 of 26023 Old 11-28-2018, 01:09 PM
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Well, reviews of Mission: Impossible--Fallout (UHD) are starting to roll out and they look quite promising PQ-wise. John Archer is the only one who rails strongly against the "stylistic choices" that involve heavy grain, color-grading and lots of low-lighting in certain scenes. As we saw before, our resident reviewer, Ralph Potts, gave it a huge thumbs up for PQ.

Here is a sample of a good review:

https://bluray.highdefdigest.com/620...lefallout.html

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post #25266 of 26023 Old 11-28-2018, 06:18 PM
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Jack Ryan: Shadow Recruit (UHD)

As expected, this final installment in the Jack Ryan 5 Film Collection took the 4th installment up another notch! Colors were more punchy, details were just as good or better (especially in facial texture), clarity was sharp as a tack in numerous scenes, and black levels were definitely inkier with incredible shadow details in several prolonged night scenes (with one of my favorites being about 1/3 way through the film where Costner and Pine were sitting on a bench in a park). Depth was also excellent at times and contrast was very strong.

My only "gripes" would be some very short "soft shots" that obscured details and depth, along with a couple of shots with faltering blacks that came across as "noisy." I could mention some strong "color-grading" (wait, I just did), but thankfully the details were still intact.

Tier Recommendation: Tier 0* (.75)

PS I was going to give this a .66 rating, but felt the above-mentioned negatives should be penalized as such.
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post #25267 of 26023 Old 11-28-2018, 06:29 PM
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^^^^^^^^^^

I forgot to mention that the color-grading did affect flesh tones at time. Also, the audio mix (DTS HD Neural Upmix) was pretty solid.
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post #25268 of 26023 Old 11-28-2018, 06:56 PM
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Ready Player One (UHD)

recommendation:
Tier 0* (0.75)

Agree with everything djoberg said below, especially the AQ. The grain in some of the real world shots can be a bit heavy and I like grain as it's a part of film but I think it can be distracting with the Oasis scenes so sharp and clean.

The LFE in the audio is off the chart good, there's an explosion towards the end that just rumbles for a good 10 seconds, never heard anything like it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by djoberg View Post
Ready Player One (UHD)

We had an emergency and had to come home last night, so I was able to watch the copy of Ready Player One which arrived while I was gone. The short of it is this:;

The movie was a LETDOWN.
The PQ was EXCELLENT!
The AQ was the real WINNER!!!

PQ-wise, I was very impressed with details in "The Oasis," even more so than in the real world. Colors were also topnotch "in there" but in the real world they were quite drab (thanks to some heavy-handed color-grading...in TEAL). Black levels were mesmerizing, as were shadow details. This film was, as you can imagine, filled with CGI and this was a mixed bag. It would be amazingly sharp and detailed one minute, and soft and lacking detail the next. Thankfully the majority of it was razor-sharp.

Again, the audio mix was FANTASTIC!! I couldn't resist turning it to Reference Level during action scenes and the precision of the Dolby Atmos "object-based" sound was surreal! The LFE/bass was also incredible, with explosions sending waves of energy across my room!!

Tier Recommendation: Tier 0* (.75)

PS I almost went with 1.0 and I would have no argument with those who opt for that placement.
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I find your lack of schadenfreude disturbing.
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post #25269 of 26023 Old 11-28-2018, 07:59 PM
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^^^^^^^^

Damn, I need to get that movie. I was hoping the UHD to hit my price point this past BF, but didn't happen. I have the feeling this will be one of those titles that I know I'll want to upgrade down the road, that's why I passed on the regular BD.

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post #25270 of 26023 Old 11-29-2018, 04:56 AM
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John Wick


I originally watched this movie a few years back when I found it on Netflix. I never use Netflix for movies (only the gorgeous looking 4K/Dolby Vision shows!) due to the poor quality, but three years I didn't think much of Keanu Reeves as an actor (never liked Matrix, Constantine was great though), and John Wick looked like another $5 rental DVD /'Netflix movie' that you just watch with a couple friends after playing COD/FIFA and no one is really paying attention cause they're all on their phones anyway. Since then I've seen John Wick used in plenty of $$$$ showrooms, and come across threads like these where the blu-ray has been awarded reference status. Later I watched John Wick: Chapter 2 on 1080p blu-ray, gave it tier 1 and John Wick movies are two of my all time favourites.

Having re-watched what I though was just another "Jason Statam-esque" gun-fu movie in proper (2k) quality, the movie looks absolutely excellent. While John Wick 2 looks cleaner, sharper, more 'digital', John Wick still remains razor sharp, but with fine detail, good contrast and a more 'film' look to it. There were certain close up with facial details that looked reference, but a few outdoor shots looked out of focus and very soft (Particularly the scenes in John Wick's garden, or the safe-house at the end), which brings the movie closer to tier 1.25. The final scene in the rain looked amazing and made up for the poor shots you otherwise found outside.

John Wick Chapter 2 probably leans closer to 0.75 or 0.9 , while John Wick further north to 1.25, but I'll give it the same rating I gave the Chapter 2.


Tier recommendation: 1
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post #25271 of 26023 Old 11-29-2018, 09:45 PM
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^^^^^^^^^^^

Snell,

Good review of John Wick! I tried finding my review on it but it never came up. I did find John Wick 2 and I rated that at Tier 0 (.66). Darth also gave it a Tier 0 ranking.

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post #25272 of 26023 Old 11-29-2018, 10:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AmerCa View Post
^^^^^^^^

Damn, I need to get that movie. I was hoping the UHD to hit my price point this past BF, but didn't happen. I have the feeling this will be one of those titles that I know I'll want to upgrade down the road, that's why I passed on the regular BD.
It's a gorgeous movie and as mentioned the audio is bananas!
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post #25273 of 26023 Old 11-30-2018, 07:15 PM
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Trolls (1080p)

Okay, my granddaughter went to my "Animated Blu-ray Section" (consisting of nearly 100 titles!) about 2 hours ago and she finally said,"Grandpa, let's watch Trolls!" I knew I had seen and reviewed it and had been impressed with it but I forgot just how amazing the PQ was, especially the COLORS, TEXTURE and DEPTH.

After viewing it I looked up my review and back in March of 2017 I had nominated it for a spot in the TOP FIVE. I just checked Phantom's latest rankings and it appears it's sitting at #8 right now. I agree with that for I'm thinking it still deserves a place in the TOP TEN. Here is my review:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/150-b...l#post51450025

Tier Recommendation: Tier 0* (somewhere in TOP TEN)

PS The Audio Mix (DTS:HD Neural:X) is just as incredible as the PQ! I had to keep it at -15 to protect the "little ears" of my granddaughter, but it was actually loud enough for me at that setting.
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post #25274 of 26023 Old 12-01-2018, 11:46 PM
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Gods Of Egypt (2016 - Lionsgate}



Tier Recommendation: 0 (0.55)

Other scores:

Djoberg (1.5):. https://www.avsforum.com/forum/150-b...l#post44423017

Gods Of Egypt is officially my first UHD title, although, of course, I currently don't have 4k capability. But since it actually was cheaper than the regular BD, the decision was obvious.

I totally understand the reasons why Djoberg gave this disc a 1.5 placement, which it isn't shabby at all. Those reasons are the sometimes very dubious CGI and, at times, terrible green screens. I remember first seeing this film in a low quality version, and I actually stopped watching the movie like 20-25 minutes in just because it looked so cheap. But then I caught it again on TV, and I actually enjoyed the movie.

But the 1080p version is very impressive. Yes, it makes the dubious CGI more obvious many times, but at least you see it with gorgeous clarity, and it isn't afraid to expose its flaws. But when the film is visually amazing, it looks AMAZING. Contrast was fantastic in daylight/clear scenes, but in darker scenes it keeps its composure and still offers many remarkable qualities. I agree with pretty much all the positives Djoberg talks about in his review, but I can forgive the CGI and ocassional softness, because the PQ is consistently beautiful, with great clarity, contrast, colors and detail. This is a disc that despite its flaws I'd use as a reference disc. I can totally imagine the HDR giving the PQ an extra push, and maybe one day I'll be reviewing the UHD.

This movie is very tongue-in-cheek, so it isn't to be taken seriously at all. I believe that's one of the reasons this film got so much flak. Nobody expected the director of films like The Crow, Dark City or Knowing to make a film that feels low budget, and very campy at that. But the visuals are really great and the audio stomps. This is a movie to have fun with, and you shouldn't expect something like 300 or Immortals, which have a darker tone and a take themselves a little more seriously.

But I have a soft spot for all things ridiculous that are aware of its ridiculousness and absurdity, and fully embrace it. That, I can have fun with it.
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post #25275 of 26023 Old 12-02-2018, 05:47 PM
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^^^^^^^^^^

Hey AmerCa,

When I first saw your review, I thought you were reviewing Exodus: Gods and Kings, which had a very similar look in many departments (including the same "negative" areas of SOFTNESS and COLOR-GRADING). But there is a BIG difference, for IMHO opinion Exodus: Gods and Kings has much better PQ. Here is my review of that title (which is the 1080p version):

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/150-b...l#post33399481

I should mention that was back in 2015 so I may have a slightly different opinion of it now.

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post #25276 of 26023 Old 12-02-2018, 05:57 PM
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^^^^^^

I also have that movie, but have yet to see it. I look forward to it, after reading your review.

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post #25277 of 26023 Old 12-04-2018, 10:04 AM
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Today is the release date of Mission: Impossible--Fallout. I ordered the Mission Impossible 6 Film Collection and that won't arrive until December 12th. So, if any of you are able to view this before then, I sure would appreciate hearing your thoughts on the PQ. I head the movie itself is the BEST in the Franchise.

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post #25278 of 26023 Old 12-04-2018, 11:34 AM
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^^^^^^^^^^^

I just received an email from Amazon informing me that my Mission Impossible Collection will be arriving tomorrow!

From all the reviews I've read on the UHD Collection, each one of the six movies looks better than their 1080p counterpart. If you are a fan I would encourage you to get the 6 Movie Collection, for the price is right!!
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post #25279 of 26023 Old 12-04-2018, 12:28 PM
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^^^^^^°

That's awesome, man. I'm a fan of the franchise, but I only have the 4th entry, while the 3rd one is probably my favorite, but I've passed it because it doesn't have lossless audio. I have yet to watch the last two movies, but I'm sure I'd like them.

Looking forward to your review of all movies. Maybe I should stop looking for the individual releases and buy the UHD box set for a good price.

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post #25280 of 26023 Old 12-04-2018, 05:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AmerCa View Post
^^^^^^°

That's awesome, man. I'm a fan of the franchise, but I only have the 4th entry, while the 3rd one is probably my favorite, but I've passed it because it doesn't have lossless audio. I have yet to watch the last two movies, but I'm sure I'd like them.

Looking forward to your review of all movies. Maybe I should stop looking for the individual releases and buy the UHD box set for a good price.

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I already have three of the titles (MI:3, Ghost Protocol and Rogue Nation), with Ghost Protocol and Rogue Nation being my favorites out of the first FIVE. I still think my upgrading to all SIX is worth it, with the PQ having a definite uptick in resolution/definition.

I can't "price talk," but if you can get them where I got them, you will be impressed and happy! Almost half the price of other places!!
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post #25281 of 26023 Old 12-05-2018, 03:40 AM
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I thought it was a great movie, but highly overrated. its a 7/10 movie in a franchise that largely consists of 5-6/10 movies. Yes it was the best of the bunch, but that doesn't say much. I prefer Skyfall and Casino Royale to it any day of the week.
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post #25282 of 26023 Old 12-05-2018, 03:51 AM
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I've heard nothing but gleaming reviews for its picture quality, 9/10s, 4.5 stars etc. I think I'll get this disk myself despite poor cinema experience.

Though I find it weird some reviewers refer to IMAX shots? IMDB lists as Arriflex 235/435 for 95% shots and I think the helicopter scene is the RED 8K camera...
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post #25283 of 26023 Old 12-05-2018, 08:35 PM
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Mission: Impossible---Fallout (UHD)

I just finished watching this and I am DRAINED!! The action in this 2+ hour film is incredible and it is exhausting to watch. I still can't figure out how Tom Cruise is able to "do what he does" with him being over 50 years old!

I just wrote a short review on Ralph Potts' site and I'm going to post it here. I'm tired or I would write more, but suffice it to say I'm perfectly satisfied with my purchase.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/187-o...l#post57225430

Before I give my placement recommendation I want to say that the IMAX scenes were TOP TIER BLU scenes all the way through! Many of the Letter-boxed scenes that took place in daytime scenes or in well-lit interiors were either Tier Blu or a high Tier Gold. The darker scenes (with a lot of softness, grittiness, and a few murky blacks) fell somewhere in Tier 2 (or even Tier 3). Without the dark scenes this would have landed in Tier Blu, to be sure. Averaging things out I'd put it right here......

Tier Recommendation: 1.0*
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post #25284 of 26023 Old 12-06-2018, 02:40 PM
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Fireworks

recommendation: Tier 1.25*

This new anime film follows in the footsteps of Your Name, which I covered earlier in the thread. Animated by SHAFT, Fireworks' traditional animation is bolstered with select CGI elements and a couple of extravagant sequences more or less designed as eye candy.

Released by GKIDS and distributed by Shout Factory, Fireworks has somewhat ordinary character designs but mostly stunning background details. It receives a fine technical transfer and Blu-ray presentation with deep black levels. It doesn't break the mold of recent anime films on Blu-ray but its strong picture quality fits right alongside better examples on the format.

Blu-ray Picture Quality Tiers (updated through July 13, 2017)
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post #25285 of 26023 Old 12-06-2018, 09:51 PM
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Power Rangers Revisited

Quote:
Originally Posted by AmerCa View Post
Saban's Power Rangers [Open Matte version] (2016 - Lionsgate)



I'm reviewing the Open Matte version released by Zima in Mexico, which, if not completely the same, should be pretty close to the American version. I'm planning to get the UHD version when the price is right to get the original AR and the ATMOS track ( Mexican edition only gets 5.1 DTS-MA.)

Tier Recommendation: 1.5

Here are a couple of reviews, one fof the UHD, which apparently is much superior to the bluray, and one for the regular bluray:

Djoberg's (UHD)(0.25): https://www.avsforum.com/forum/150-b...l#post54926104

Snell's (1.0): https://www.avsforum.com/forum/150-b...l#post55214526
This past Black Friday was the time for "the right price" for getting this film in its OAR and with ATMOS mix. While I did expect an audio improvement, I was surprised by the jump in PQ I got. The US version is decidedly and definitely an improvement over the Mexican transfer in all respects. Now I can agree with the glowing reviews on PQ that put this title in the reference tier, or close to it.

The Mexican version I've seen it like five times, and the more I watched it, the more I felt it belonged closer to tier 1.75 than to tier 1.5, so when I put the US version, the jump in quality was readily apparent: better colors, better contrast, overall better clarity and detail, and superior black levels. I didn't feel it truly belonged to the reference tier -except for some scenes/shots- , but certainly the PQ was remarkable, just a bit shy of tier 1. Overall, a fantastic video presentation marred by occasional softness, grain, and small black crush at some spots.

There are been many reports recently between differences between ATMOS tracks and DTS-MA mixes, the latter mostly reserved to regular BDs (Sony, Fox, Disney). As stated in my review, the audio mix is truly reference even in the DTS-MA 5.1 version, but the ATMOS mix (Dolby TrueHD core) is even better, and I wasn't sure how that could be possible, except for the obvious addition of overhead speakers. But the ATMOS mix is more balanced and I swear there's more bass in many scenes. It's my impression that the DTS-MA got some audio elements better, but overall the ATMOS mix proved to be the superior mix. In any case, the audio mix for this movie is reference. I'm sure I'll be watching this disc many more times in the future.

Tier Recommendation: 1.25 (US Edition)
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post #25286 of 26023 Old 12-07-2018, 09:00 PM
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Mission: Impossible (UHD)

Okay, I thought it would be prudent to "start at the beginning" and go through the whole 6 Film Series chronologically. I just checked the current rating of MI:1's 1080p version and it stands at 3.0. This one will fare MUCH BETTER! How much better? Probably a whole tier and maybe a smidgen more!

The GOOD: Facial DETAILS were superb in the many close-ups throughout the movie! This was its greatest virtue, though details in general were also good in close to slightly mid-range shots. Anything beyond that tended towards softness, if not downright blurry. COLORS were also excellent when primaries rose to the occasion. BLACK LEVELS weren't too shabby with some fairly good SHADOW DETAILS to boot. DEPTH was appreciable at times.

The BAD: As mentioned above, there was considerable softness/blurriness in far off shots. But there was also a fair amount of softness in poorly-lit environments (gloomy interiors, some night time scenes, etc.). Flesh tones suffered greatly (with either a "red push" or "orange") when the color-grading became egregious. Contrast also failed on occasion. And lastly, black levels did falter several times...turning either murky or too dark causing some black crush.

This is a hard one to call, but thankfully the GOOD outweighed the BAD. I was going to raise this an exact tier above its blu-ray counterpart, but I'm feeling generous tonight soooo.....

Tier Recommendation: 1.75*

PS The audio SUCKED! The Dolby TrueHD upmix held its own in the FRONT channels, but action in the SURROUNDS was rare and big explosions yielded very little fruit in my DUAL SUBS.
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post #25287 of 26023 Old 12-07-2018, 09:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djoberg
PS The audio SUCKED! The Dolby TrueHD upmix held its own in the FRONT channels, but action in the SURROUNDS was rare and big explosions yielded very little fruit in my DUAL SUBS.
Noooo. I'd have traded a lesser PQ in exchange for a better audio. But I guess that's the best they could get from the original master. At least the PQ is improved, but I expected a better placement for a UHD titles, especially for the prices they're charging for these new 4k transfers.

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post #25288 of 26023 Old 12-08-2018, 04:14 AM
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First Blood (UHD)

recommendation:
Tier 1.75*

Details are nice and even throughout, lots of nuances in clothing and other textures. The color palette is muted for much of the movie in the dreary Pacific Northwest location but primaries really pop when present; oranges and yellows in explosions are spectacular. Black levels and shadows are rendered nicely in the many night and cave scenes. The forest scenes sometimes present a bit gray at times but overall black levels are good. I was concerned about the encode with all the dark scenes but I saw no banding at all. There is also a nice layer of fine grain throughout.
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post #25289 of 26023 Old 12-08-2018, 06:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AmerCa View Post
Noooo. I'd have traded a lesser PQ in exchange for a better audio. But I guess that's the best they could get from the original master. At least the PQ is improved, but I expected a better placement for a UHD titles, especially for the prices they're charging for these new 4k transfers.

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The PQ is definitely improved, but it still "showed its age." It's obvious they didn't do a true 4K Remaster but rather an "upscale." In reading reviews on MI:2 it sounds like the PQ is much better and the AQ is a notch better too, though still lacking in the surrounds and bass/LFE.

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post #25290 of 26023 Old 12-08-2018, 03:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djoberg View Post
Mission: Impossible---Fallout (UHD)

I just finished watching this and I am DRAINED!! The action in this 2+ hour film is incredible and it is exhausting to watch. I still can't figure out how Tom Cruise is able to "do what he does" with him being over 50 years old!

I just wrote a short review on Ralph Potts' site and I'm going to post it here. I'm tired or I would write more, but suffice it to say I'm perfectly satisfied with my purchase.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/187-o...l#post57225430

Before I give my placement recommendation I want to say that the IMAX scenes were TOP TIER BLU scenes all the way through! Many of the Letter-boxed scenes that took place in daytime scenes or in well-lit interiors were either Tier Blu or a high Tier Gold. The darker scenes (with a lot of softness, grittiness, and a few murky blacks) fell somewhere in Tier 2 (or even Tier 3). Without the dark scenes this would have landed in Tier Blu, to be sure. Averaging things out I'd put it right here......

Tier Recommendation: 1.0*
So some amazing reference shots, mostly good shots and a few horrible shots here and there.

Sounds reasonable! haha
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