The New PQ Tier thread for Blu-Ray - Discussion - Page 880 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #26371 of 26429 Old 05-23-2020, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by djoberg View Post
Hey Terry,

You are in for a real treat once you get your Atmos system; it truly puts you in a "dome of sound!" I will look forward to you "dropping in" to this thread to give us your impressions...on both the PQ and AQ. Again, the UHD/HDR brings this up to "Reference Level" which is light years ahead of the 2010 Blu-ray version. The Atmos mix also brings it UP to "Reference Level" EXCEPT the LFE isn't as low in demo scenes as the Blu-ray DTS-HD mix was. For the life of me I have no idea why they would "filter" the sound and lower the LFE. That said, the bass/LFE is still quite good!

Denny
Denny,

No-Worries on me saying what I think of Atmos once it's installed and of course then Custom Calibrated.




Terry
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post #26372 of 26429 Old 05-23-2020, 11:48 AM
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Terry,

I noticed on your "Build Page" that you are going to have Chad B. calibrate your system. I'm signed up with him too (for possibly June or July, but who knows where he is at now with the pandemic still wreaking havoc) to calibrate my LG OLED and I'm seriously thinking of having him to do my total SVS sound system too, even though I'm quite satisfied with it now after running my Denon's Audyssey XT32 calibration.

Denny

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post #26373 of 26429 Old 05-23-2020, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by djoberg View Post
Terry,

I noticed on your "Build Page" that you are going to have Chad B. calibrate your system. I'm signed up with him too (for possibly June or July, but who knows where he is at now with the pandemic still wreaking havoc) to calibrate my LG OLED and I'm seriously thinking of having him to do my total SVS sound system too, even though I'm quite satisfied with it now after running my Denon's Audyssey XT32 calibration.

Denny
Denny,

Speaking of Chad and getting hold of him.
I can tell you it's NOT easy buddy.
I'm not being ^^^ cute or a smart-ass I'm just sharing with you what I think.
He is really-really-really good at Both Audio as well as the Video Calibrating !!!

But, he's not a people person is the best way I know to say it.

(I was in sales for years & years so I am a people person and I reply instantly to All Request as an example versus a guy like Chad B)

I have reached-out to him multiple times and still don't have a real Confirmed-Date.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed and hope eventually I will hear back from him, hopefully.

For what an AVS member's opinion is worth ............
I can say that the Biggest difference to me with my H/T was him doing the Audio !!!
It was KILLER after he did his thing especially my BASS.

There was a difference in the Video but nothing at all remotely like the difference to the Audio.

I'm having as you might have seen a lot of Major Up-Grades done in June and therefore I want Chad to redo Both the Audio & Video.

What I don't want to happen is to have to wait months and months for him to come to do the above.

If I find out that's ^^^ going to be the situation I'm more than likely going to look into seeing if there is another Highly-Trained Calibrator I can get sooner.

This latest project for multiple reasons has gone on for like a year from it's beginning.
So I'm not prepared to wait some Crazy Time Frame to get it all Custom-Calibrated once everything is installed.

Terry
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post #26374 of 26429 Old 05-23-2020, 12:45 PM
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^^^^^^^^^

I hear you Terry! I actually contacted Chad last FALL and he did get back to me quickly, only to inform me that he won't be touring Minnesota (where I live) till early summer at the soonest. But again, with the pandemic he is probably WAY BEHIND SCHEDULE since most people aren't letting anyone into their homes. I would have no problem with that myself.

Thanks for the heads up on Chad's "audio skills." You have just persuaded me to have him do it! Regarding the Video calibration, I may just have him do the least expensive one (Express Calibration) since I'm very, very satisfied with the PQ on my LG OLED 77C8 right now. I use one of the Cinema Modes (Dark Room) and have tweaked most of the settings to my liking and I get an amazing picture with good sources. I absolutely LOVE the BLACKS on this OLED and they make the colors POP and increase the depth.

Good luck to you in getting Chad to calibrate your system once it's all installed. BTW, I like your system!
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post #26375 of 26429 Old 05-23-2020, 03:36 PM
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I Still Believe (1080p)

Another "Lionsgate Looker!!

This just "may" make it into Tier 0, but I'm not taking it there. The first few scenes featured tons of color-grading (ORANGE hues) that always serve to take me out of the movie (at least to some extent), resulting in less-than-accurate flesh tones and a softening of the PQ as well. The very first scene also had some overblown contrast giving it a "washed out look."

Okay, now for the good. This was razor-sharp from that point (the first few scenes) on, with excellent depth, vibrant colors, spot on flesh tones, deep blacks and finely-rendered shadow details, and strong contrast. Had the whole movie been like this it could have landed in Tier 0.

Tier Recommendation: 1.0*

PS The Dolby Atmos mix was okay, but with very little action and rather subdued ballads in the music concert portions of the movie, it didn't serve much purpose.

PPS The acting was VERY GOOD...but I do wish that Christian movie producers would use Christian actors instead of "pretty faces" from "secular Hollywood."

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post #26376 of 26429 Old 05-24-2020, 05:17 AM
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How To Train Your Dragon 3

I have many, many animated movies to catch up to and this one blew my mind completely. It looks a noticeable step above the likes of Coco and Moana, which were the top reference movies before HDR became all the rage. This movie had looks of solid (absolute) blacks, Hiccoughs enchanted sword is one the brightest elements I've ever seen on my B6 OLED (probably peaked at 750 nits ) razor-sharp best-in-class CGI throughout.

Linus from Linus Tech Tips uses this movie to assess the HDR performance of monitors like the Apple XDR Pro Display and its Asus equivalents, and I now understand why. The textures, detail and pop is phenomenal

Tier recommendation: 0 (Top 10)
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post #26377 of 26429 Old 05-24-2020, 06:44 AM
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^^^^^^^^^

I put it in the Top 3!!!!

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/150-b...l#post58086952
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post #26378 of 26429 Old 05-24-2020, 12:06 PM
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Originally Posted by djoberg View Post
^^^^^^^^^

I hear you Terry! I actually contacted Chad last FALL and he did get back to me quickly, only to inform me that he won't be touring Minnesota (where I live) till early summer at the soonest. But again, with the pandemic he is probably WAY BEHIND SCHEDULE since most people aren't letting anyone into their homes. I would have no problem with that myself.

Thanks for the heads up on Chad's "audio skills." You have just persuaded me to have him do it! Regarding the Video calibration, I may just have him do the least expensive one (Express Calibration) since I'm very, very satisfied with the PQ on my LG OLED 77C8 right now. I use one of the Cinema Modes (Dark Room) and have tweaked most of the settings to my liking and I get an amazing picture with good sources. I absolutely LOVE the BLACKS on this OLED and they make the colors POP and increase the depth.

Good luck to you in getting Chad to calibrate your system once it's all installed.

I'm in contact with Chad currently just waiting for the "Confirmed-Date" from him.

BTW, I like your system!
I appreciate the compliment !!!


Terry
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post #26379 of 26429 Old 05-30-2020, 03:15 AM
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The Invisible Man


Some shots are absolute reference, with great detail and crystal clear sharpness, but a lot of the scenes are dim and looked noisy and flat.

Tier recommendation: 1.25
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post #26380 of 26429 Old 05-31-2020, 01:11 PM
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John Wick: Chapter 3

Pretty much the same level of reference as John Wick & John Wick: Chapter 2.

John Wick 3 shows how to make dark & gritty night time scenes look sharp and clean. Plethora of details, the mirror scene in particular is amazing.


Tier recommendation: 0.75
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post #26381 of 26429 Old 06-01-2020, 02:11 PM
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The Postcard Killings

recommendation: Tier 2.0*

It feels unusual these days reviewing a new movie actually shot on film. The serial killer thriller was shot on location across Europe and adopts a mildly subdued color palette. There is palpable and cinematic grain in the clean video. Free of deleterious processing, it's a fine transfer that looks very presentable on Blu-ray.

Released about a week ago by RLJ Entertainment, the main feature receives a serviceable AVC encode on a BD-25. While the video quality lacks the razor-sharp trait of new digital productions, there is visible fine detail and excellent clarity.


The Postcard Killings isn't reference quality but has fairly standard picture quality for a new release in 2020.
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post #26382 of 26429 Old 06-01-2020, 09:19 PM
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Jaws (UHD)

The BEST it's ever looked, to be sure!!

Amazing references scenes sprinkled throughout, with excellent clarity, details and depth, along with strong contrast, nice colors, accurate flesh tones, and inky blacks. The only "negatives" were several scenes where the age (45 years old) was evident in softness, a bit of noise (or heavy grain) and some washed out daytime shots at the beach.

If you're a fan of this classic, you'll probably never see it better than this!

Tier Recommendation: 1.0*

PS Some may be inclined to assign this to Tier 0 but IMHO they be comparing this to previous releases, but if they compare it to current titles they should, if honest, conclude it's not really "Reference Quality" all the way through.

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post #26383 of 26429 Old 06-01-2020, 10:38 PM
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Jaws: this isn't anywhere reference to me compared to others out there but https://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?go=1&...144631&i=4&l=1
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post #26384 of 26429 Old 06-02-2020, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wesslan1 View Post
Jaws: this isn't anywhere reference to me compared to others out there but https://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?go=1&...144631&i=4&l=1
What are we looking at here?
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post #26385 of 26429 Old 06-02-2020, 11:31 AM
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What are we looking at here?
Remove my "but" as it just confuse. It was meant to say I don't think this UHD of Jaws is reference at all but that is just my opinion.
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post #26386 of 26429 Old 06-03-2020, 09:38 AM
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Remove my "but" as it just confuse. It was meant to say I don't think this UHD of Jaws is reference at all but that is just my opinion.
I see.

Plenty of 'professional' reviewers are giving it five stars and 10/10 saying its so perfect and reference, but I think they are wearing rose-tinted nostalgia glasses that makes it look a lot better.

I have always disliked this, because the goal is looking like reality. It doesn't matter if its a 4K scan, 8K scan or 16K scan, if some one who has never seen the movie can tell its from the 70s or 80s just by looking at a scene or a face then it does not deserve anywhere near perfect score....


But I still will watch it and give it a score myself I just some how doubt it will hold up to modern standards (at least well enough to be called 'reference') <-- Something I'd show my mates to brag about how good my TV looks.
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post #26387 of 26429 Old 06-03-2020, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wesslan1 View Post
Jaws: this isn't anywhere reference to me compared to others out there but https://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?go=1&...144631&i=4&l=1
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnellTHX View Post
I see.

Plenty of 'professional' reviewers are giving it five stars and 10/10 saying its so perfect and reference, but I think they are wearing rose-tinted nostalgia glasses that makes it look a lot better.

I have always disliked this, because the goal is looking like reality. It doesn't matter if its a 4K scan, 8K scan or 16K scan, if some one who has never seen the movie can tell its from the 70s or 80s just by looking at a scene or a face then it does not deserve anywhere near perfect score....


But I still will watch it and give it a score myself I just some how doubt it will hold up to modern standards (at least well enough to be called 'reference') <-- Something I'd show my mates to brag about how good my TV looks.
As you two know, I gave it a 1.0 ranking and I'm even considering lowering it a notch or two after watching it again. There are some "Reference shots" in it, but there's also a lot of "non-reference shots." Again, if one thinks this is truly Reference and deserving of a Perfect Score, they are NOT comparing it with current Tier 0 titles...period!

I think I will change my "official score" right now to...

Tier Recommendation: 1.25*

PS I almost feel like giving it a 1.5 but my "generous gene" just kicked in so I'll leave it at 1.25!
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post #26388 of 26429 Old 06-05-2020, 03:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djoberg View Post
Jaws (UHD)

The BEST it's ever looked, to be sure!!

Amazing references scenes sprinkled throughout, with excellent clarity, details and depth, along with strong contrast, nice colors, accurate flesh tones, and inky blacks. The only "negatives" were several scenes where the age (45 years old) was evident in softness, a bit of noise (or heavy grain) and some washed out daytime shots at the beach.

If you're a fan of this classic, you'll probably never see it better than this!

Tier Recommendation: 1.0*

PS Some may be inclined to assign this to Tier 0 but IMHO they be comparing this to previous releases, but if they compare it to current titles they should, if honest, conclude it's not really "Reference Quality" all the way through.

I've been hearing very good things about the transfer struck for the Jaws UHD. Having already owned the movie on multiple formats, I will get it down the line.


The House That Dripped Blood

recommendation: Tier 2.5*

Having always been more of a Hammer man myself, this horror anthology offering from their rival Amicus wasn't always on my radar. Scream Factory issued the 1971 British horror movie just two years ago on Blu-ray. The good news is that it receives a modern film scan from the original camera negative. Rich color reproduction and nigh perfect black levels make for superficially rewarding picture quality. Warm, healthy flesh-tones and a ripe contrast have the British movie looking better than ever with outstanding detail.

The one issue here is that subtle ringing and processing can be spotted on larger displays. Some mild filtering has been applied, even if the pin-sharp presentation lacks any outward sign of trouble. The House That Dripped Blood certainly pops with a clarity and color fidelity uncommon for its period.

Shout Factory cleanly encodes the pristine presentation with top-notch AVC.
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post #26389 of 26429 Old 06-06-2020, 11:51 AM
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What's the word on the new 4k releases of A New Hope and The Empire Strikes Back? Are they any good? What about the 1080p releases included with the 4k ones?
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post #26390 of 26429 Old 06-07-2020, 02:14 PM
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Quote:
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I've been hearing very good things about the transfer struck for the Jaws UHD. Having already owned the movie on multiple formats, I will get it down the line.
I do believe you will be pleased, for as I have said "it has never looked this good and perhaps it's the best it will ever look."

Having said that, it is NOT "Reference Quality" IMO, even though many are touting it as such on Ralph Potts' website where Ralph gave it a perfect score of 100 for PQ. I disagreed with him but then I realized that his "criteria" for analyzing and scoring PQ is different than ours, especially when it comes to "Director's Intent." For example, in Jaws there are definitely a number of scenes with a very SOFT FOCUS. Ralph knows this but he says it was the director's intention so it shouldn't be penalized in the PQ score since it looks "the way it should look" and "the way it looked in the Cinema." I countered that by saying we would indeed penalize scenes with softness because it hinders "clarity" and that is one of the criteria we go by in our placement recommendation. The vast majority of AVS members that joined our discussion agreed with Ralph and I basically said, "It's all a matter of CRITERIA for analyzing and scoring PQ" and I emphasized that on this Thread we are looking objectively for EYE CANDY, not on how true the Blu-ray lines up with what the Director had in mind.

I also stated what I did in my review; that a title's PQ should not simply be judged by comparing it with its previous releases, but on how it compares to current titles in any given tier. That too did not go over very well! Oh well, sometimes I need to learn to keep my thoughts to myself when I'm visiting other threads that review Blu-rays.

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post #26391 of 26429 Old 06-07-2020, 02:21 PM
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^^^^^^^^

By the way, I read Matt's review of the Jaws UHD release on Do.Blu.com and he did NOT imply at all that it was "Reference Quality" and he ranked the PQ "4 out of 5 stars."
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^°°°°°^
Isn't that the sane crowd who always criticizes Disney for their audio mixes? Director's "intent" doesn't count in those cases? But since every one of us has a different criteria for judging PQ or AQ, most of those discussions lead nowhere.

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post #26393 of 26429 Old 06-08-2020, 06:52 AM
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^^^^^^

Yes, AmerCa....same crowd, but to their credit they DO penalize the "Audio Score" when the bass/LFE is lacking due to the Studio/Director limiting the low frequency. This is why I'm baffled that they aren't consistent when it come to the "PQ Score."

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Hmmm...*sigh*. My Vizio TV now has a vertical line of dead pixels. Fortunately, it's very thin, at a 1/4 of the left side, but of course it's noticeable, especially in clear/daylight scenes. My TV is out of warranty so there's nothing I can do about it. So, when watching movies I just tried to pretend it isn't there. Dammit.

I just hope it stays that way, and the line doesn't "expand".

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post #26395 of 26429 Old 06-08-2020, 06:16 PM
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Are the rankings here applicable for the same movies streamed via iTunes, by any chance? I’m looking for some movies to stream on a new TV (which I haven’t bought yet).

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post #26396 of 26429 Old 06-08-2020, 08:23 PM
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Are the rankings here applicable for the same movies streamed via iTunes, by any chance? I’m looking for some movies to stream on a new TV (which I haven’t bought yet).
In theory, yes. But it all depends on the bitrate. So if a movie receives stellar PQ marks here, it should translate to the streaming version.

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post #26397 of 26429 Old 06-08-2020, 08:48 PM
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Hmmm...*sigh*. My Vizio TV now has a vertical line of dead pixels. Fortunately, it's very thin, at a 1/4 of the left side, but of course it's noticeable, especially in clear/daylight scenes. My TV is out of warranty so there's nothing I can do about it. So, when watching movies I just tried to pretend it isn't there.

I just hope it stays that way, and the line doesn't "expand".

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Yikes! Do you remember that this is exactly what happened to my Flagship Sony 75" LCD/LED? I bought in 2016 and it developed a "red vertical line" (which was VERY noticeable) and my warranty had just expired! I was told it would cost several thousand dollars to repair it so I ended up throwing it away and replacing it with my 77" LG OLED. Needless to say, I bought a 5-year extended warranty on this from Best Buy...just in case!

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post #26398 of 26429 Old 06-08-2020, 08:58 PM
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^°^°^°^°^
Wow. I didn't remember the specifics, but apparently, it's a common issue with faulty panels? My line is dark blue, but very thin. I can notice it, but I can "forget" about it when watching a movie. This just happened, and I've watched two movies, and well, it sucks, but it's not terrible. I can live with it for the time being.

The irony of it all is that my TV is for watching exclusively my BDs, and very occasionally, some music videos from a flash drive. It really doesn't have that many hours. My two other cheaper and smaller TVs are still working after many years of heavy usage without issues. Hilarious!

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post #26399 of 26429 Old 06-08-2020, 09:51 PM
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^^^^^^^^^^^^

My line was somewhat thin but dark red and I tried to ignore it but to no avail. The "bright side" of this was, of course, getting the OLED that I always wanted...at a price which was no longer in the stratosphere.

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post #26400 of 26429 Old 06-08-2020, 09:58 PM
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Sorry about your panel's issues, AmerCa. Knock on wood, my OLED hasn't suffered any burn-in yet. Some models have pixel cleaning functions that can occasionally fix issues. I'd call your manufacturer and check out your hardware guide.

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