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post #3811 of 5085 Old 02-17-2017, 04:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MBrown2020 View Post
According to website:
USB self powered device and wide range of DC power options (4.5 to 24VDC)

So, I still need to power it with AC adaptor? I did order it with the miniDSP that arrives Saturday. Do you leave it plugged in at all times? Does the automatic sub turn off still work?
Thanks!
Mine is powered all the time, and yes, my subs do turn off.
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post #3812 of 5085 Old 02-17-2017, 04:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
Mine is powered all the time, and yes, my subs do turn off.
Jerry,
Could you have a look at post #3807 and see if I'm on the right track? Thanks again for all you help!
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post #3813 of 5085 Old 02-17-2017, 05:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MBrown2020 View Post
I just purchased the minDSP 2x4 unbalanced. I plan on using it with 2 SVS PB-2000's & 1 PC-2000 (Same amp & drivers). The subs input sensitivity is 350mV. Is the .9V output on the miniDSP for each of the four outputs or combined (.9V divided by 4). I will be using this with a Marantz AV8802a.

I just did the voltage gain test using a Fluke 114 True RMS voltmeter. I had audyssey enabled by mistake when doing measurements, does it really matter? With MV=0 (reference) SW trim was as follows:
-5.0 = .998V
-5.5 = .940V
-6.0 = .890V
So if I set trims for combined subs (75dB) at -6.0 I should be good?
Thanks!
Each sub gets .9v. You should be just fine.
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post #3814 of 5085 Old 02-20-2017, 06:54 PM
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I was.looking at the 2x4 HD as an active XO and DSP. Is there a LF cutoff and is it adjustable?

With the advanced plug in it is.

I wanted to run my midbass unit between 50Hz to 1kHz. It has a short xmax and in a vented box it could exceed xmech from 25Hz down at rated power. Now I can proceed with the vented design.

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post #3815 of 5085 Old 02-21-2017, 03:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Hanna View Post
I was.looking at the 2x4 HD as an active XO and DSP. Is there a LF cutoff and is it adjustable?

With the advanced plug in it is.

I wanted to run my midbass unit between 50Hz to 1kHz. It has a short xmax and in a vented box it could exceed xmech from 25Hz down at rated power. Now I can proceed with the vented design.
Yes, I believe that all of the MiniDsp's have high pass filtering capability.
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post #3816 of 5085 Old 02-27-2017, 09:29 AM
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Perhaps stupid questions but:

In AustinJerry's guide where it discusses gain matching... I assume this is done with the AVR/Pre-Pro test tones with volume set at reference, so that both subs together achieve 75db at listening position? The Marantz I'm using plays those tones based on what the current volume is set to, which is why I am asking.

Also, though this Marantz has XT32/Sub EQ, I have had no luck with it working correctly (seems to have issues with delays, causing cancellation until distance tweaks are applied). Should I just pick up 4-way Advanced and run both subs off single input channel? My assumption is if Audyssey is trying to EQ the bad (pre distance tweak) output, then it is getting the EQ wrong...trying to adjust for nulls that aren't there after tweaking is completed, possibly making overall EQ worse.
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post #3817 of 5085 Old 02-27-2017, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by domain View Post
Perhaps stupid questions but:

In AustinJerry's guide where it discusses gain matching... I assume this is done with the AVR/Pre-Pro test tones with volume set at reference, so that both subs together achieve 75db at listening position? The Marantz I'm using plays those tones based on what the current volume is set to, which is why I am asking.

Also, though this Marantz has XT32/Sub EQ, I have had no luck with it working correctly (seems to have issues with delays, causing cancellation until distance tweaks are applied). Should I just pick up 4-way Advanced and run both subs off single input channel? My assumption is if Audyssey is trying to EQ the bad (pre distance tweak) output, then it is getting the EQ wrong...trying to adjust for nulls that aren't there after tweaking is completed, possibly making overall EQ worse.
With the latest Marantz AVR's the speaker level-setting test tone levels depend on the MV setting. To achieve a 75dB test tone, you need to increase the MV to zero.

There is no reason why XT32 should not work just fine for two subs. Audyssey will ping each sub separately during the first measurement sweep and time-align the two subs with each other. Where Audyssey sometimes falls short is the time alignment between the combined sub signal and the mains, which is why many of us recommend conducting the "Sub distance tweak" after Audyssey has concluded.

A 2x4 addresses the inter-sub time alignment, which is already being done quite effectively by XT32. IOW, I don't see any reason why you should abandon XT32 in favor of a 2x2. Recall, I wrote my Guide because I was transitioning to Dirac Live on the MiniDSP 88A, which has only one sub input. This is an entirely different situation.
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post #3818 of 5085 Old 02-28-2017, 01:07 PM
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Hmmm, seeing this thread pop up reminded me that I had a MiniDSP question. I'm looking at picking up a unit for myself, and one for my brother. Both for management of a pair of subwoofers each. I've been reading and waffling back and forth between the balanced and unbalanced, and was fairly certain I wanted to go ahead with the balanced model for both, but I wanted to make sure I'm doing this right.

1) My setup will be using the .2 output from an AVR (undecided model, but mid-upper range Denon/Marantz probably) and will be sent to an iNuke 6000 (non-DSP), and then a pair of sealed UXL-18 subs. I will want to apply some form of Linkwitz Transform, and then tweak the final response as required. I haven't measured output voltage, but let's assume I'm using a Marantz 6011, and it will be "adequate". The input sensitivity on the iNuke is 0.82Vrms. The unbalanced MiniDSP outputs 0.9Vrms I think this means that I would be OK using the unbalanced version, but is there any reason not to go with the balanced version, to take advantage of the higher 4Vrms output? Will this make the load easier on the amps, or create excessive hum or have some other unforseen issues? Are there any other pros or cons like lower noise that would make one version stand out better in this situation? Should I just go balanced in case I change amps down the road to something less sensitive?

2) My brother's setup uses the .2 output from a Marantz 7009, and his amp is a Crown XLS2502 driving a pair of Ultimax 15s in sealed enclosures. The Crown has an input sensitivity of 1.4Vrms, so I'm fairly certain the balanced model is the better choice in his situation, using the 2Vrms output, is that correct?

I've read about gain structure, and I think the general feelings on input sensitivity is "as long as you have at least that amount you should be fine", but I wanted to make sure. Also, I thought I remembered reading something negative about the balanced model that didn't affect the unbalanced... it might have been noise floor or something, I can't remember. Any input would be appreciated.


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post #3819 of 5085 Old 02-28-2017, 01:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OJ Bartley View Post
Hmmm, seeing this thread pop up reminded me that I had a MiniDSP question. I'm looking at picking up a unit for myself, and one for my brother. Both for management of a pair of subwoofers each. I've been reading and waffling back and forth between the balanced and unbalanced, and was fairly certain I wanted to go ahead with the balanced model for both, but I wanted to make sure I'm doing this right.

1) My setup will be using the .2 output from an AVR (undecided model, but mid-upper range Denon/Marantz probably) and will be sent to an iNuke 6000 (non-DSP), and then a pair of sealed UXL-18 subs. I will want to apply some form of Linkwitz Transform, and then tweak the final response as required. I haven't measured output voltage, but let's assume I'm using a Marantz 6011, and it will be "adequate". The input sensitivity on the iNuke is 0.82Vrms. The unbalanced MiniDSP outputs 0.9Vrms I think this means that I would be OK using the unbalanced version, but is there any reason not to go with the balanced version, to take advantage of the higher 4Vrms output? Will this make the load easier on the amps, or create excessive hum or have some other unforseen issues? Are there any other pros or cons like lower noise that would make one version stand out better in this situation? Should I just go balanced in case I change amps down the road to something less sensitive?

2) My brother's setup uses the .2 output from a Marantz 7009, and his amp is a Crown XLS2502 driving a pair of Ultimax 15s in sealed enclosures. The Crown has an input sensitivity of 1.4Vrms, so I'm fairly certain the balanced model is the better choice in his situation, using the 2Vrms output, is that correct?

I've read about gain structure, and I think the general feelings on input sensitivity is "as long as you have at least that amount you should be fine", but I wanted to make sure. Also, I thought I remembered reading something negative about the balanced model that didn't affect the unbalanced... it might have been noise floor or something, I can't remember. Any input would be appreciated.
The inuke is fine with the unbalanced, the crown needs the balanced.
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post #3820 of 5085 Old 02-28-2017, 01:18 PM
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I started with the unbalanced and had to get the balanced because of switching gear, its just slightly more work wiring.Get the balanced version for flexibilty
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post #3821 of 5085 Old 02-28-2017, 01:39 PM
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Thanks guys! So definitely no issues using balanced for the inuke? I won't overdrive anything with the 2Vrms?

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post #3822 of 5085 Old 02-28-2017, 01:46 PM
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MiniDSP

I use a balanced with my inuke. It works great!
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post #3823 of 5085 Old 02-28-2017, 02:08 PM
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I am also using the balanced with an Inuke 3000. Works fine.
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post #3824 of 5085 Old 03-02-2017, 07:45 AM
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I thought one of the updates for the Crown DriveCore 2 models was support for balanced/unbalanced as well as pro/consumer (1.4Vrms / 0.775Vrms) input sensitivity

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bassment View Post
The inuke is fine with the unbalanced, the crown needs the balanced.

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post #3825 of 5085 Old 03-02-2017, 12:16 PM
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I thought one of the updates for the Crown DriveCore 2 models was support for balanced/unbalanced as well as pro/consumer (1.4Vrms / 0.775Vrms) input sensitivity
I'm not sure atbroome, the specs on the Crown website say 1.4, so I'm just assuming that's standard.


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post #3826 of 5085 Old 03-02-2017, 12:19 PM
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Features tab lists 0.775V/1.4v switchable:

http://www.crownaudio.com/en/products/xls-2502

Quote:
Originally Posted by OJ Bartley View Post
I'm not sure atbroome, the specs on the Crown website say 1.4, so I'm just assuming that's standard.

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post #3827 of 5085 Old 03-02-2017, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by atbroome View Post
Features tab lists 0.775V/1.4v switchable:

http://www.crownaudio.com/en/products/xls-2502
Ah, thanks for that! I assume my brother knows about it, but I'll bring it up just in case. I think I'll stick with balanced for both mine and his, especially if there are no issues resulting from the higher output voltage.


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post #3828 of 5085 Old 03-03-2017, 07:06 AM
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It's likely if you have that big of a peak it's related to a room mode which is going to be very difficult to tame even with DSP. Try moving the sub a bit and see if you can get that peak down. I don't imagine it would be a big problem to cut the signal twice separately since you can use the miniDSP input level slider down much further than -16dB. But if you cut it too far then you could run into signal-noise-ratio problems.

As for the boost, 6-8dB is quite a bit and I'd encourage caution. As you said, if you are sending 0dBFS signals (i.e. in REW) and you're still under the output limit in the meters even after applying your boost, then you should be okay in the miniDSP... but that doesn't mean you aren't causing the amp to clip. If the output voltage from the miniDSP exceeds the amp's input sensitivity by a significant margin, then you could be clipping the input of the amp. There's multiple places for clipping to occur and it's best to err on the side of caution with all of them:
- If your AVR/pre-pro MV and sub trim are both high, you could be clipping the sub out signal (what are your input levels like in the miniDSP meter with a 0dBFS input signal?)
- If the output voltage from the AVR is too high for the miniDSP you could be clipping the input of the miniDSP
- If the miniDSP has too much boost you could be clipping its output (doesn't seem to be a problem as you describe above)
- If the miniDSP output voltage is too high for the amp, you could be clipping the input of the amp, or clipping the amp output if the input is not attenuated
Everything is a cascading effect, if the signal gets clipped in any one of those cases then it passes all the way down the line to the sub, and sending the sub a square wave is no bueno. I'd do some testing, particularly at the frequencies where your boost is highest, to check the voltage coming out of the miniDSP to see how it compares to the amp's input sensitivity, and also where the levels are on the miniDSP output meter.
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post #3829 of 5085 Old 03-04-2017, 04:31 PM
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Hi, I have a question, is it possible to set the miniDSP for one sub to play frequencies from 22hz & up and set the other sub to play frequencies from 21hz & down. If so how?


Thanks
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post #3830 of 5085 Old 03-04-2017, 06:32 PM
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Hi, I have a question, is it possible to set the miniDSP for one sub to play frequencies from 22hz & up and set the other sub to play frequencies from 21hz & down. If so how?


Thanks
Femi
Shouldn't be a problem. Route two separate outputs (either from 1 input or 2 inputs) and then you set the crossovers for each one. You'd need a HPF for the one playing >22Hz, and a LPF for the one playing <22Hz.
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post #3831 of 5085 Old 03-05-2017, 12:45 PM
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Need help

New to minidsp. I got a 10x10 HD and I'm trying to get a second sub to play but no luck. I've only got 1 sub out on my avr (Onkyo TX-NR809) but I'm run that to input 1 on the minidsp and trying to use outputs 1 and 2 on the mini, but only getting sound out of output 1. What am I doing wrong?
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post #3832 of 5085 Old 03-05-2017, 02:25 PM
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In the routing tab (matrix router), you need to make sure outputs 1 and 2 are both enabled ("yes") for input 1.
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post #3833 of 5085 Old 03-05-2017, 02:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigus View Post
In the routing tab (matrix router), you need to make sure outputs 1 and 2 are both enabled ("yes") for input 1.
That's how I have it. On my setup, 10x10 with a macbook pro, the choices are on or off for the outputs, and both 1 and 2 outputs are on under input 1.
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post #3834 of 5085 Old 03-05-2017, 03:03 PM
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That's how I have it. On my setup, 10x10 with a macbook pro, the choices are on or off for the outputs, and both 1 and 2 outputs are on under input 1.
Make sure there's no crazy HPF or LPF enabled, make sure there's no unusual crossover settings enabled, and check that the output isn't attenuated or muted.
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post #3835 of 5085 Old 03-05-2017, 03:36 PM
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Originally Posted by bpgunning View Post
Make sure there's no crazy HPF or LPF enabled, make sure there's no unusual crossover settings enabled, and check that the output isn't attenuated or muted.
That was it. Thanks guys. They had x-over filters set from the factory. Got both playing now. That took about 8 hours of my day on that problem alone.
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post #3836 of 5085 Old 03-05-2017, 04:19 PM
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I have a question about using a mini dsp so set distances for my 4 subs.

I have 4 subs. One on either side of my tv and one on either side of my couch. My denon 4520 has Audyssey xt32 but I am just running from sub1 into input 1 of my minidsp HD. Sub 1 is routed to all 4 outputs. I ran audyssey 4 times once with each sub turned on and the others off in the app. I wrote down the distances calculated by audyssey for each sub. Should I now set the delay for each sub in the output tab for each? How does feet translate to ms?

EDIT: I just saw Jerry's guide for doing this. I used the distances calculated in Audyssey XT32 with the minidsp inline instead of manually calculating the distance. It would be hard to manually calculate the distance as I am using PSA Triax's that have 3 drivers in a triangle shape.

My subs distances were calculated as such:

Sub 1 15.5 ft (front left)
Sub 2. 14.6 ft (front right)
Sub 3. 12.9 ft (rear left)
Sub 4. 7.2 ft (rear right)

These are definitely not the distances that would be measured with a measuring tape. Sub 4 is right next to me.

I will use Sub 1 and then figure the delay to add to the other 3, is this correct?

Is there any reason to use both sub outs on my 4520 instead of what I am doing?

Thanks
Ray

Last edited by raynist; 03-05-2017 at 04:33 PM.
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post #3837 of 5085 Old 03-05-2017, 04:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raynist View Post
I have a question about using a mini dsp so set distances for my 4 subs.

I have 4 subs. One on either side of my tv and one on either side of my couch. My denon 4520 has Audyssey xt32 but I am just running from sub1 into input 1 of my minidsp HD. Sub 1 is routed to all 4 outputs. I ran audyssey 4 times once with each sub turned on and the others off in the app. I wrote down the distances calculated by audyssey for each sub. Should I now set the delay for each sub in the output tab for each? How does feet translate to ms?

EDIT: I just saw Jerry's guide for doing this. I used the distances calculated in Audyssey XT32 with the minidsp inline instead of manually calculating the distance. It would be hard to manually calculate the distance as I am using PSA Triax's that have 3 drivers in a triangle shape.

My subs distances were calculated as such:

Sub 1 15.5 ft (front left)
Sub 2. 14.6 ft (front right)
Sub 3. 12.9 ft (rear left)
Sub 4. 7.2 ft (rear right)

These are definitely not the distances that would be measured with a measuring tape. Sub 4 is right next to me.

I will use Sub 1 and then figure the delay to add to the other 3, is this correct?

Is there any reason to use both sub outs on my 4520 instead of what I am doing?

Thanks
Ray
Your approach is correct. The distances calculated by Audyssey will include delay introduced by the electronics in the subs. These distances should be accurate for using to set the delays in the MiniDSP. If you have REW, you can measure sub outputs to make sure the distances produce the smoothest response.
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post #3838 of 5085 Old 03-05-2017, 04:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
Your approach is correct. The distances calculated by Audyssey will include delay introduced by the electronics in the subs. These distances should be accurate for using to set the delays in the MiniDSP. If you have REW, you can measure sub outputs to make sure the distances produce the smoothest response.
Thanks!

I found your calculation for taking ft to ms, great guide! Answered all of my questions above.

Last edited by raynist; 03-05-2017 at 05:33 PM.
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post #3839 of 5085 Old 03-05-2017, 04:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raynist View Post
Is there any reason to use both sub outs on my 4520 instead of what I am doing?

Thanks
Ray
If the AVR and Audyssey are capable of EQing the 2 sub outs independently, then you could use 1 for front and 1 for rear, and it may apply some extra processing in addition to just the distance. But if it sounds good the way you're doing it, it might not be necessary.

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post #3840 of 5085 Old 03-05-2017, 04:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OJ Bartley View Post
If the AVR and Audyssey are capable of EQing the 2 sub outs independently, then you could use 1 for front and 1 for rear, and it may apply some extra processing in addition to just the distance. But if it sounds good the way you're doing it, it might not be necessary.

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XT32 is quite good at equalizing subs on its two outputs. If @raynist can place each sub pair equidistant from the MLP, this approach would work as well. The guide I wrote, and which raynist has been following, was developed when I moved from Audyssey to Dirac Live on a MiniDSP 88A, which has only one sub input.
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