Crown XLS vs Behringer iNuke -A mostly subjective comparison. - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 62 Old 02-11-2014, 10:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by laugsbach View Post

In my iNuke 6000 the stocks fans were NMB Tech 3110KL and were rated at 46 CFM, 4000RPM, static pressure of 66.0 Pa and a noise level of 40dB. I replaced it with another NMB fan rated at 36 CFM, 2700 RPM, static pressure of 29.0 Pa and a noise level of 26dB. This works for my situation...smile.gif

Do you happen to know the model number of the fans you used?

Also, where did you purchase from?

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post #32 of 62 Old 02-11-2014, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by jpmst3 View Post

...Also, where did you purchase from?

Here you go...

http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/3110SB-04W-B40-E00/P14747-ND/2615560
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post #33 of 62 Old 02-11-2014, 12:26 PM
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Thanks!

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post #34 of 62 Old 02-11-2014, 06:10 PM
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So how long would people expect the Crown XLS series to last? I need a second amplifier now that I have surrounds coming in (Sometimes may want to use them as Direct 2 Channels and play music to entertain hence an amplifier since I never seem to get enough power out of my AVR). My Crown XLS has been good to me never close to clipping lights, it feels quite sturdy to me in my hands, and doesn't seem to get hot no matter how hard I push it. It just seems to chug along. When I stress tested it hard at my fraternity house even after hours of playing music it wasn't hot, air blowing from back wasn't hot, so I think I prefer that over the Behringer inuke where I have to do a mod.
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post #35 of 62 Old 02-11-2014, 10:56 PM
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"I wouldn't be too concerned. Most PA amps are run hard with up to 1/3 rated power (average) so it needs to get rid of a lot of heat constantly. A subs amp will have some periods of high output then long periods of little to no activity so the heat generated is nowhere near as high or constant."

+1.

add to that the amps in a home are typically in climate controlled rooms, not sitting outside in 95 degree summer heat.

i suppose we'll find out if they start blowing up as they came out about 3 years ago.

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post #36 of 62 Old 02-11-2014, 10:58 PM
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the crown xls are a good value too. they just don't have the sweet dsp that the inuke offers. that's a really nice feature set.

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post #37 of 62 Old 02-11-2014, 11:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tential View Post

So how long would people expect the Crown XLS series to last?
At home, used within it's limits and not abused, > 20 years.
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Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post

"I wouldn't be too concerned. Most PA amps are run hard with up to 1/3 rated power (average) so it needs to get rid of a lot of heat constantly. A subs amp will have some periods of high output then long periods of little to no activity so the heat generated is nowhere near as high or constant."

+1.

add to that the amps in a home are typically in climate controlled rooms, not sitting outside in 95 degree summer heat..
I never used any of my PA gear outdoors festival style, but did some sem-outdoor, and I still have some Yamaha P series amps in service in the HT that are 20 years old from that rig. I took industrial 60cm fans to blow onto each rack and kept amps a half rack space apart to aid cooling. Never had a failure and they were used much harder than a home unit would be.

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post #38 of 62 Old 02-12-2014, 06:30 AM
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Predicting how long anything will last in the electronic world is futile at best.

Yes, there are predictive calculations for just about any component, but each environment and situation is different as well as the range of each component.

Whether mechanical or electronic or a combination of both (consumer grade lifespans) it varies wildly and is a waste of time predicting it. It could fail tomorrow or never fail in your lifetime.

Take hard drives, I have literally installed thousands of them. Some fail within the first month, some have been spinning continuously for over 10 years. Once again, some are left on perpetually and some are powered up and down multiple times a day. it's a crap shoot, that's one reason we back up data. Most hard drives get thrown out due to age, not failure, but there are regular routine failures that occur often.

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post #39 of 62 Old 02-12-2014, 09:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post

the crown xls are a good value too. they just don't have the sweet dsp that the inuke offers. that's a really nice feature set.

+1
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post #40 of 62 Old 02-12-2014, 10:17 AM
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Originally Posted by jpmst3 View Post

Predicting how long anything will last in the electronic world is futile at best.

Yes, there are predictive calculations for just about any component, but each environment and situation is different as well as the range of each component.

Whether mechanical or electronic or a combination of both (consumer grade lifespans) it varies wildly and is a waste of time predicting it. It could fail tomorrow or never fail in your lifetime.

Take hard drives, I have literally installed thousands of them. Some fail within the first month, some have been spinning continuously for over 10 years. Once again, some are left on perpetually and some are powered up and down multiple times a day. it's a crap shoot, that's one reason we back up data. Most hard drives get thrown out due to age, not failure, but there are regular routine failures that occur often.
Amps are not electromechanical like HDDs so prediction of MTBF is not just a guess but has decades of observation and temperature is the general killer. Nothing can predict a random component failure, but on average, lifetimes can be reasonably predicted.

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post #41 of 62 Old 02-12-2014, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by A9X-308 View Post

Amps are not electromechanical like HDDs so prediction of MTBF is not just a guess but has decades of observation and temperature is the general killer. Nothing can predict a random component failure, but on average, lifetimes can be reasonably predicted.

Of course the amps are not electromachanical, but still shows that the lifespan is not easily predictable, only a guess.

My point is that most HDs I see have an 80,000+ MTBF, but there are failures on a regular basis due to one condition or another despite the predicted/average 9+ year life span of continuous use...

It is difficult to predict failure rates here because of all the varying factors. One person's fan mod flows more CFM, others are in a rack dense environment, some are climate/humidity controlled environment, some are on 24 hours a day, some for an hour every other week some are being used to their limits at all time, some never get close.

You simply can't say they will all last for XXX time. It is impossible to tell even without the random elements, let alone the variance in manufacturing, materials, etc.

The MEAN is only an average lifespan, hardly anywhere near accurate for each device. Some will last forever, some only a few hours.

The very term MTBF already is an admission that there is no real accurate predictor, only an average.

I guess what I am saying is that to say you should expect 3 years out of this amp is purely wild speculation at best. smile.gif

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post #42 of 62 Old 06-14-2016, 12:56 PM
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Waking up an old thread..would like to know which is better Behringer NU3000 or crown xls 1502? I need one for driving my Polk rtis and denon x6200 on the other end. Behringer is $100 cheaper though and has more power. The following comparison does not help much as i never owner any amp earlier.
http://www.crutchfield.com/compare_8...er-NU3000.html

My main concern is quality of brands / ease of use in long term instead of model numbers mentioned in above posts.
thanks
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post #43 of 62 Old 06-14-2016, 01:53 PM
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Originally Posted by argentum246 View Post
Waking up an old thread..would like to know which is better Behringer NU3000 or crown xls 1502? I need one for driving my Polk rtis and denon x6200 on the other end. Behringer is $100 cheaper though and has more power. The following comparison does not help much as i never owner any amp earlier.
http://www.crutchfield.com/compare_8...er-NU3000.html

My main concern is quality of brands / ease of use in long term instead of model numbers mentioned in above posts.
thanks
Either one will get the job done. I prefer the Crown because of the quiet fans out of the box. Also I'm not sure whether the iNukes are as clean for mains, but I don't personally have the supporting info on hand.
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post #44 of 62 Old 06-14-2016, 02:12 PM
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Thanks John,
I agree with you on fans . Crown have good looking units and quite fans. But if you see the specs the Behringer has far better watt / price ratio. I was about to buy crown but the specs of Behringer stopped the deal. Hence i need enlightenment here.
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post #45 of 62 Old 06-14-2016, 03:24 PM
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Was the Crown 20hz rolloff ever confirmed? Some people say yes and others say no. Probably not a factor for mains but interesting none the less.
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post #46 of 62 Old 06-14-2016, 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by argentum246 View Post
Thanks John,
I agree with you on fans . Crown have good looking units and quite fans. But if you see the specs the Behringer has far better watt / price ratio. I was about to buy crown but the specs of Behringer stopped the deal. Hence i need enlightenment here.

How much power do you really need on your mains? 300w is still a lot of headroom.

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Was the Crown 20hz rolloff ever confirmed? Some people say yes and others say no. Probably not a factor for mains but interesting none the less.
It was measured in another recent thread here. There was no more noticeable roll off than other amps tested.
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post #47 of 62 Old 06-14-2016, 04:57 PM - Thread Starter
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IMO the Crowns are a higher quality product, but the Behringers are a better bargain. As stated above, the Crowns are a better fit for a listening room due to their quiet fans. Be forewarned, the S/N of both of these amplifiers is not the highest so you might get some hiss at idle. It all depends on what you expect and can tolerate.
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post #48 of 62 Old 06-14-2016, 05:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Magibeg View Post
Was the Crown 20hz rolloff ever confirmed? Some people say yes and others say no. Probably not a factor for mains but interesting none the less.

XLS2500 was only down ~1db at 10z compared to a Crest CC5500:








XLS could also maintain really decent power down to 10hz:


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post #49 of 62 Old 06-14-2016, 08:42 PM
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A bit of hiss is expected but what about the quality of products itself. Is it worth to get crown with less power and paying $100 more when you have other sensitive and costly components connected to it?
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post #50 of 62 Old 06-15-2016, 11:50 AM
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A bit of hiss is expected but what about the quality of products itself. Is it worth to get crown with less power and paying $100 more when you have other sensitive and costly components connected to it?

If the application for the amp is mains then I'd for sure take the Crown.


The iNukes have harmonic distortion that starts to rise around 3khz. Whether or not you'd be able to hear it in a blind test is another debate, but regardless, it is distortion that's easily measured.
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post #51 of 62 Old 06-15-2016, 12:05 PM
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Thanks lukeamdman,
I think i shall go with crown 1502 then.
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post #52 of 62 Old 06-15-2016, 01:03 PM
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Thanks lukeamdman,
I think i shall go with crown 1502 then.
I don't think you'll be sorry. I use Crown XLS 2000's for my mains and my subs and am very happy with them. I have 1099's for mains which are very high sensitivity. With no input and just the amps on you can hear hiss if you are about a foot from the speakers. But at any reasonable listening distance you can't hear a thing.

As far as the fans go, I have four amps running and you simply cannot hear the fans. In fact, for the first six months I had them I didn't even think the fans were coming on. One day I was working on the back side of my rack and just happened to notice that the fans on the amps were all running. I couldn't believe it because I couldn't hear them at all above normal background noise.

One last thing - regarding the roll-off below 20Hz, I run two sealed HST-18's and they are flat down to 10Hz. If the amps themselves roll off, the room makes up for it.

Edit: Forgot to mention. Originally I had an iNuke for my subs. Didn't last a day because I couldn't tolerate the fan noise and I didn't want to do the fan mod.
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post #53 of 62 Old 06-25-2016, 09:33 PM
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My iNuke3000DSP has been on dedicated IB duty since last early last year, always left on, always worked great.

This morning, I found it with the fan stopped (which is nice, because it's loud) but instead of orange lights around the volume knobs, it's now red. And not working. Tried to power-cycle it and it must've thrown full power to the drivers, because they both bucked like they were being defibrillated. Not good.

So, to those concerned about longevity, my iNuke lasted 14 months.
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post #54 of 62 Old 09-28-2016, 08:54 AM
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What Crown amp would be comparable to an iNuke 3000dsp?

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post #55 of 62 Old 09-28-2016, 09:16 AM
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What Crown amp would be comparable to an iNuke 3000dsp?

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It looks like the XLS 2500 would be if we are looking at the specs straight across.

What are you looking to use it with?

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post #56 of 62 Old 09-28-2016, 09:28 AM
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I'm currently using an iNuke 3000dsp with (2) of these: http://www.parts-express.com/dayton-...ndle--300-7094

Wanted to see other options. Love the iNuke except for fan noise.

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post #57 of 62 Old 09-28-2016, 11:50 AM
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Love the iNuke except for fan noise.

So change it.
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post #58 of 62 Old 09-28-2016, 11:54 AM
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So change it.
Which is why I'm asking for alternative amps. I have not seen a fan replacement recommendation that matches stock airflow and yields less noise. Care to suggest one?

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post #59 of 62 Old 09-28-2016, 12:05 PM
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Which is why I'm asking for alternative amps. I have not seen a fan replacement recommendation that matches stock airflow and yields less noise. Care to suggest one?

Don't know one off the top of my head, but there are dozens of threads about changing the fans in iNukes. Plenty of members have found viable alternatives. There are a few members that swear their amp thermals with anything but the factory fans, but they seem to be the exception. Some of them are running in warmer than normal climates.

As you know, there is a lot more to the airflow capabilities of a fan than just the CFM number.

There is also a thread around about reversing the flow of the air from the fans and it's effect on cooling.

It just seems a fan change would be much easier/cheaper than switching amps.

Also, I'm not sure if you utilize the DSP in the iNuke, but they are touted as being much better than the DSPs on most amps. More food for thought.
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post #60 of 62 Old 09-28-2016, 12:17 PM
 
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Also, I'm not sure if you utilize the DSP in the iNuke, but they are touted as being much better than the DSPs on most amps. More food for thought.
Especially the XLS amps as they have only crossover dsp, would need a minidsp along with the XLS.
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