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post #1 of 27 Old 11-12-2014, 09:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Question about possible iNuke3000dsp Clipping w/ 2 SI 18 subs in Martycubes

I'm new to the iNuke and DIY for that matter and i'm having what I think is clipping on some music and movies. Basically, the yellow ring around the knobs of the amplifier turn red and the bass stops for about 10 seconds and then comes back on and things go back to normal. But, I thought the amp wouldn't do this unless I was overdriving the subwoofers into the red clipping lights. I'm only hitting 3-4 yellow lights on the iNuke and if i get a steady 10 second or so steady 3-4 yellow light-up the iNuke seems like it goes into protection mode.

-My AVR subwoofer level is at 0
-I haven't eq'd the amplifier settings yet, all i have is a HP filter set at 20hz with butterworth at 12db.
-Running the iNuke in Bi-amp 1 mode so I would only need one RCA to XLR coming from my receiver. This still allows me to separate the subwoofers into Channel A & B output so i can have separate independent settings for later eq.
-Knobs on the front of the iNuke 3000dsp are maybe 3 clicks from max (maybe that's too high, not sure but seems like bass is less hard hitting when i turn down the gain knob).
-Speaker wire is neutrik speak-on 12 gauge connections going 1+ and 1- on both sides to both channels of the amplifier/subwoofer.

Any help would be appreciated, don't know much about amplifiers. I do have a UMM-6 Dayton mic and will try to run REW again but I've been having issues with a huge dip in SPL between the 50-70hz range on the REW graph that won't smooth out. This is a separate issue, I will worry about later as i learn more about eq'ing.
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post #2 of 27 Old 11-12-2014, 10:24 PM
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With just two subs with inuke3000dsp, if you listen close to reference you will clip the amp a lot with gains past 3 o'clock. I leave mine at 2 o'clock and have never had amp go into protection mode.

I sold my inuke3000dsp and replaced it with 6000DSP. I give my 390 HO driver 1500 watts and my ultimax 2000. Extra headroom allows me to eq as well.

If i were you I would add a Nearfield sub if you can. It makes a huge difference. Move one of the cubes Nearfield and add a Johnnysub or Minimarty. You will be very happy.

Now I have 3 microcube (equivalent of 2 martycubes) and a MiniMarty. I can play at reference with no clipping in my 4000cuft room. I have two Nearfield and the couch I sit on feels like it might lift off the ground during big bass scenes.
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post #3 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 05:05 AM
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Is pretty easy to get that amp to clip. If you set it correctly initially then you shouldn't have an issue. But if your gains are higher when listing to a lower volume, once the AV volume is increased. The amp that was almost maxed out at say -30 will clip shortly after.
If its not "loud" enough and your clipping it most likely nulls in your room that need to be fixed or Eqed out best you can. If the subs are in two different locations setting the delays correctly is very important. Helped a lot with my room.

Maybe you just need more subs :-) more subs = more DB's = less gain required.
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post #4 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 09:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the flat packs Chalugadp.
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post #5 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 09:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemonslush View Post
Is pretty easy to get that amp to clip. If you set it correctly initially then you shouldn't have an issue. But if your gains are higher when listing to a lower volume, once the AV volume is increased. The amp that was almost maxed out at say -30 will clip shortly after.
If its not "loud" enough and your clipping it most likely nulls in your room that need to be fixed or Eqed out best you can. If the subs are in two different locations setting the delays correctly is very important. Helped a lot with my room.

Maybe you just need more subs :-) more subs = more DB's = less gain required.
Two martycubes is probably max for me, my wife would never go into the living room anymore if I added more subwoofers.

I will try messing around with my gain knob and turn it down to about 2 o'clock as Chalugadp suggested. I do think there is a null in the room as seen when I tried to eq via REW, I had a large probably about 10db drop between 50-70hz range.

Here's a pic of my setup...

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post #6 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 10:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmoneyman2323 View Post
Two martycubes is probably max for me, my wife would never go into the living room anymore if I added more subwoofers.

I will try messing around with my gain knob and turn it down to about 2 o'clock as Chalugadp suggested. I do think there is a null in the room as seen when I tried to eq via REW, I had a large probably about 10db drop between 50-70hz range.

Here's a pic of my setup...

Those subs are pretty much maxed out wattage wise with that amp. If fixing EQ and delays wont do it for you and adding more subs or moving them around is not an option.

The only other thing you can do is upgrade to a ULX, hst or something that can take more power and add another inuke to power it.

I personally was under impressed with my first two marty cubes. I was expecting my ears to be blown away and it was not the case.
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post #7 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 10:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmoneyman2323 View Post
Two martycubes is probably max for me, my wife would never go into the living room anymore if I added more subwoofers.

I will try messing around with my gain knob and turn it down to about 2 o'clock as Chalugadp suggested. I do think there is a null in the room as seen when I tried to eq via REW, I had a large probably about 10db drop between 50-70hz range.

Here's a pic of my setup...

That's a beautiful room , I'm jealous. Lemon us right . If no more subs then a uxl driver will give you 4 more dbs.
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post #8 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 10:22 AM
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Are they wired for a 2ohm load?

I have my 3000 wired in dual mono like you with a 2ohm load and I've gotten it to clip lots with a lot of ULF. But I'm running sealed so I'm talking about when I'm pushing 10hz content really hard for long durations. Like the car explosion in Die Hard 5. The lights only get to about 3 yellow and CRACK! Scares the crap out of me. But this is because the amp basically runs out of current into those low impedance loads and finally gives up, I think. At tuning you'll have a low impedance so if a lot of the content is right around your tuning when this happens, it's sucking up a lot of current right at that point.

Maybe I'm bottoming my subs, dunno, but I think it's clipping. I could be clipping my minidsp too, didn't think of that. But ya, I'm not totally shocked by what you're experiencing. Unless you're wired for 4ohm, then it's a little more puzzling.
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post #9 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 11:01 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chalugadp View Post
That's a beautiful room , I'm jealous. Lemon us right . If no more subs then a uxl driver will give you 4 more dbs.
Thanks for the kind words can't really afford the UXL drivers right now saving for other things. the photo is a little misleading as I zoomed in on the front stage so it looks like my main seating is really close to the screen, but that's my front row I guess you would call it. My main seating is where I was standing to take the pic with a 4 row theater seating (cheap) |O|O|O|O|. I would like to add a riser and then change the front seating to be the same configuration |O|O|O|O|. Right now just not an option money wise as I'm about to gut my kitchen and update starting in January.
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post #10 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 11:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tuxedocivic View Post
Are they wired for a 2ohm load?

I have my 3000 wired in dual mono like you with a 2ohm load and I've gotten it to clip lots with a lot of ULF. But I'm running sealed so I'm talking about when I'm pushing 10hz content really hard for long durations. Like the car explosion in Die Hard 5. The lights only get to about 3 yellow and CRACK! Scares the crap out of me. But this is because the amp basically runs out of current into those low impedance loads and finally gives up, I think. At tuning you'll have a low impedance so if a lot of the content is right around your tuning when this happens, it's sucking up a lot of current right at that point.

Maybe I'm bottoming my subs, dunno, but I think it's clipping. I could be clipping my minidsp too, didn't think of that. But ya, I'm not totally shocked by what you're experiencing. Unless you're wired for 4ohm, then it's a little more puzzling.
Yup, 2 ohm to each sub running on separate channels. I'm wired for bi-amp 1 though instead of dual mono so I didn't have to run 2 RCA-XLR cables to the iNuke. Still gives me the ability to eq the subs separately.
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post #11 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 11:10 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemonslush View Post
Those subs are pretty much maxed out wattage wise with that amp. If fixing EQ and delays wont do it for you and adding more subs or moving them around is not an option.

The only other thing you can do is upgrade to a ULX, hst or something that can take more power and add another inuke to power it.

I personally was under impressed with my first two marty cubes. I was expecting my ears to be blown away and it was not the case.
I will take another stab at eq-ing, but how do I fix delays for the subs? Is this something I can test for in REW and then adjust the delay in the iNuke software? I know the iNuke software has the option just don't know how to get an accurate number for the delay.
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post #12 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 11:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmoneyman2323 View Post
I will take another stab at eq-ing, but how do I fix delays for the subs? Is this something I can test for in REW and then adjust the delay in the iNuke software? I know the iNuke software has the option just don't know how to get an accurate number for the delay.
You measure the distance between both subs to your LP. Take the distance from the close sub and subtract it from the furthest sub. You want to delay the closer sub so its sound wave gets to your LP at the same time your furthest sub would. If they are slightly off it can cause issues.

Your DSP has the delay set it feet. Make sure to have each sub on their own channel instead of bridged. I use mine in bi-amp mode.
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post #13 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 11:52 AM
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There have been at least two members that have said they have clipped their nu6000DSP's with two cubes as well.
They ended up having to upgrade to 4 cubes and two 6000DSP's.

The SI-18's have a lot of excursion.
Problem is, they only handle 600watts. So you are more likely to fry the coil, than run out of excursion. (Unless you use them in an IB, more like the video.)

Last edited by BassThatHz; 11-13-2014 at 03:03 PM.
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post #14 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 12:11 PM
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It's always about size of room and how loud you listen. lower your gains if your clipping. Gains at 12 o'clock will almost never clip uo to reference unless your using eq. Often people forget to mention they are using 10dbs of peq boost.

Everyone's idea of enough bass is different. I started with one 15" with 300 watts for couple of years and thought it was great. Now I have 4 subs with 5000 watts. It is addictive.
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post #15 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 12:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Maybe in the next few months I will buy a mini marty from you chalugadp and put it in the back of the room, which is about another 6 feet behind my main listening position. I don't really want a 25 ft. audio cable running across the room though, I will have to think about it. But first things first, when I get home I'm going to play around with the gain and the delay and see if I can get things fixed.
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post #16 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 01:22 PM
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All you need to do to run the amp in Dual-mono is to buy a Y-cable and then you have 1 output from the AVR, and 2 inputs to the Inuke. Maybe the problem is running it in Bi-amp mode ( I have no idea what this does btw). Just another thought...

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post #17 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 01:44 PM
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Biamp mode should just split it for him. That's what I do. Can't imagine it would cause a problem.
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post #18 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 01:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tuxedocivic View Post
Biamp mode should just split it for him. That's what I do. Can't imagine it would cause a problem.
Didn't think it would but thought I'd bring it up since I was lacking knowledge in that area...

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Question about possible iNuke3000dsp Clipping w/ 2 SI 18 subs in Martycubes



I don't want to derail the discussion, but how do you like the 88 Special paired with the Tempests? Do they blend well together? Thanks!
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post #20 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 06:33 PM
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"10db drop between 50-70hz range"

Might try measuring and seeing if moving seating a bit closer or further from front soundstage helps this out. Also might try swapping racks and sub locations to see if 1/4 room width placement helps out at all.
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post #21 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 08:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by rhodesj View Post


I don't want to derail the discussion, but how do you like the 88 Special paired with the Tempests? Do they blend well together? Thanks!
I like the 88 special a lot, the sound is a little louder than the tempests though. So when doing Audessy correction it wants to lower the center channel down about 1.5 - 2 compared to the tempests. I think its great though. Miles better and clearer than my previous store bought klipsch. I will probably always be a fan of DIY now just because of what you get for the money spent.
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post #22 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 08:47 PM - Thread Starter
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"10db drop between 50-70hz range"

Might try measuring and seeing if moving seating a bit closer or further from front soundstage helps this out. Also might try swapping racks and sub locations to see if 1/4 room width placement helps out at all.

I was truly estimating on the 10db number i didn't save my REW graph (did it multiple times, thought i was doing something wrong). I know it was a good 8 or more db, it was pretty significant and it was definitely 50-70hz range. I tried adjusting a few things but i kept getting a consistent dip in that range, and REW wouldn't even give me eq parameters to fix the dip for my iNuke.

I talked it over with my wife and she said I can put a mini-marry in the back of the room, about 5-6 feet behind my main seating area, and I will put another iNuke3000 in the room to even out the bass more and get more db.

Also, after playing around with the gain i'm down to about 2 o'clock on the gain knobs now (will probably go a little lower), the lights are still going crazy on certain scenes of movies and the bass is nice I guess, I just liked the bass better when i had the gain knob up higher (fuller deeper shaking bass).
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post #23 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 08:51 PM
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Put a MiniMarty with ultimax driver and you will be very happy.
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post #24 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 08:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by chalugadp View Post
Put a MiniMarty with ultimax driver and you will be very happy.
I will definitely be pm'ing you after the new year (going TDY to Taiwan soon for my job for a month). Is the ultimax much better than the SI's i have now? Is it worth the extra money, I bought the SI D4's b-stock via that link you posted in another thread (great deal by the way).

Either way, I will be buying a mini marty in January from you if you will still be making flatpacks.
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post #25 of 27 Old 11-13-2014, 09:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmoneyman2323 View Post
I will definitely be pm'ing you after the new year (going TDY to Taiwan soon for my job for a month). Is the ultimax much better than the SI's i have now? Is it worth the extra money, I bought the SI D4's b-stock via that link you posted in another thread (great deal by the way).

Either way, I will be buying a mini marty in January from you if you will still be making flatpacks.
Will still be making them and yes in Minimarty the ultimax is about 4 dbs better if you give it 2000 watts like I do. To me it's definitely worth it.
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post #26 of 27 Old 11-14-2014, 07:18 AM
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Have you tried messing with the phase of either sub yet? I had some weird dips in my response to, flipped the phase on one of my subs 180 deg. and it fixed everything and gave me some additional output. They may just be cancelling each other out and not summing correctly, maybe... another thing to try at least.

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post #27 of 27 Old 11-14-2014, 04:35 PM
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Did you by chance do a fan mod? I know I have a 6000DSP which will power cycle like you describe if there isn't enough airflow.
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