Wife approved Infinity 1260 build (lots of pics) - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 33 Old 02-01-2015, 11:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Wife approved Infinity 1260 build (lots of pics)

Decided to build a subwoofer with the Infinity 1260 I had heard so many good things about here on these forums. After modeling in WinISD I decided on a 4.1^ft3 (net) box, tuned to 19.3Hz. Would hopefully give me the lows I was after, and the box size was approved by the wife.

I actually built 2 "test" boxes before the one in the following pics. First was the aforementioned 4.1^ft3, the next a 6.4^ft3. The wife was not happy with the size of box #2 , and as it's output/extension in the same position as the smaller box was only marginally better, the larger was vetoed.

So, on with the pics - Apologies in advance, these are from my phone.

Initial cuts. External dimensions of the carcass are 28Wx21Hx17.5D


Recessed SpeakOn housing. Not the best cuts with a jig saw :




Initial assembly almost complete, keeping it square while glue sets up. Mis-cut a piece of MDF so had to use particle board for port top, shouldn't be a problem:


I used no bracing in the test box and had no issues with it. A little skeleton bracing in this one. Countersunk screw holes for attaching the 1/2" birch ply that will be used for the finished exterior:


Foamed ends, back and bottom. Used an electric stapler instead of spray adhesive to attach foam:


On to the skin. I've owned this router for more than 15 years and never used the plunge functionality, hope it works! Scrap piece screwed to sawhorses, working piece on top of that, screw through the homemade circle jig:


Hey, it worked! Round over and hand sand the inside edge:
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post #2 of 33 Old 02-01-2015, 11:48 AM - Thread Starter
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(Weird, all images get attached to the first post? I thought there was a limit of 10 per)

Glue the birch ply front on:


The front ply was cut 1/2" over the carcass size. A 5 gallon bucket will help keep sawdust out while flush trimming:


The sides were glued on in the same manner as the front, and 1" screws were used from inside the cabinet to help hold. Added the "feet" and kick plate, starting to look like something!


In the "clean" room for finishing. Stain applied:


The 3" oak strips get glued to each side on front. These overhang the outside for now, will be trimmed flush then the same profile applied to the outside edge:


Oak front pieces done, first coat of poly applied:


And in it's final position:





The wife and I still have to go shopping for a stone piece for the top. Will post up graphs in the next couple of days, but it measures about identically to the test box so I'm very happy with it.

Just thought someone might get some ideas for their own build.

Many thanks to all that provide their knowledge and input!

Scott
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post #3 of 33 Old 02-01-2015, 11:54 AM
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Looks awesome...
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post #4 of 33 Old 02-01-2015, 12:07 PM
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Nice work! The box looks well made and I'm digging the 2 tone look.

Hows it sound?

Also, what are your plans for the top of the box?
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post #5 of 33 Old 02-01-2015, 12:20 PM
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Awesome build!
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post #6 of 33 Old 02-01-2015, 12:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toddman36 View Post
Looks awesome...
Thanks! Will post pics once we decide on the top, that should make a big difference.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kevings
Nice work! The box looks well made and I'm digging the 2 tone look.

Hows it sound?

Also, what are your plans for the top of the box
Thanks kevings! The 2-tone was inspiration from some of the builds I've seen here, specifically PassingInterest's speaker cabinets. He does amazing work.

It sounds great to me. According to initial measurements I have an F3 at ~18Hz, which is better than I had hoped for!

We're going with some type of stone top, still have to shop for that. That will add some mass to the box, but won't be anywhere near as heavy as your coffee table build. Weighs in at 90lbs right now.
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post #7 of 33 Old 02-01-2015, 12:35 PM
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Nice job.

The infinity is one of the nicer looking cones which is a bonus for builds like this.
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post #8 of 33 Old 02-01-2015, 12:36 PM
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Another Infinity 1260W ported build. Excellent job! I just finished a pair with pretty much the exact same specs as yours, but no where near the level of finishing. (Acoustically transparent screens hide all sorts of evils.)

You don't find the sides vibrate like crazy with the minimal bracing? I installed full window braces every 6 inches and a double panel for the baffle and am amazed at how much vibration there is.

An F3 of 18hz, nice. Can you post a couple frequency plots?
My boxes start to fall off at about 18hz as well, but I seem to be getting a 10db hump from 30hz to 40hz and a huge suck at at 60hz. Likely all a result of room nodes, however sometimes I wonder if my I-phone 5 mic response falls off in the lowest octaves, even when running the calibration file. Time to bite the bullet and get a Umik-1 I guess.
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post #9 of 33 Old 02-01-2015, 02:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samps View Post
Nice job.

The infinity is one of the nicer looking cones which is a bonus for builds like this.
Thanks Samps. I was debating on the 2-tone cabinet as the driver is already 2-tone itself, but you're right, the cone on the 1260 is pretty sharp. Still trying to figure out if I'm going to put a grill on this, but the wife doesn't appear to be concerned with it so...

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidK442
Another Infinity 1260W ported build. Excellent job! I just finished a pair with pretty much the exact same specs as yours, but no where near the level of finishing. (Acoustically transparent screens hide all sorts of evils.)

You don't find the sides vibrate like crazy with the minimal bracing? I installed full window braces every 6 inches and a double panel for the baffle and am amazed at how much vibration there is.

An F3 of 18hz, nice. Can you post a couple frequency plots?
My boxes start to fall off at about 18hz as well, but I seem to be getting a 10db hump from 30hz to 40hz and a huge suck at at 60hz. Likely all a result of room nodes, however sometimes I wonder if my I-phone 5 mic response falls off in the lowest octaves, even when running the calibration file. Time to bite the bullet and get a Umik-1 I guess.
Thanks David. This sub is in our living room, so I had to make it a bit more refined than if it were a dedicated theater room.

I haven't had much of a chance to play with it, Thursday or Friday I should be able to run some sweeps and get some measurements. I will check the vibration then as well, I didn't find the test box to have much vibration, and this thing is much heavier.
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post #10 of 33 Old 02-05-2015, 05:42 PM - Thread Starter
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OK, a quick update:

Was able to spend a little time measuring/EQing today, here are the results.

Equipment:
* Denon AVR-X2000 - Audyssey XT, not XT32
* Samson GoMic - no calibration via REW or otherwise
* iNuke nu1000DSP driving the DIY 1260
* Existing BIC Acoustech PL-200 that I'm attempting to integrate with - no DSP

I quickly discovered the myriad problems with integrating such dissimilar subs when I placed the test box. I ended up level matching at 32.5Hz, which was half way down from a large peak the PL-200 gave me at around 37Hz. As I'm new to all this it took a lot of time, research and trial-and-error. But what I have now sounds very good to my ears.

Black: DIY 1260 alone, no PEQ, no Audyssey, sub trim set to 0 (middle), appears my room is the reason for anomalies at 37Hz...
Green: DIY 1260 alone, after 45 minutes adjusting PEQ, still no Audyssey and sub trim 0
Purple: Both subs, Audyssey engaged, sub trim bumped to +2.5


Still have some tweaking to do such as re-running Audyssey (hopefully doing something about that 37Hz point), but the current setup sounds really good to me and shakes most of the house at our max listening volume (not near reference).

DavidK442 also asked about vibrations. I played many scenes from Godzilla (2014), the Pod Rising scene from War of the Worlds, and the first 30 seconds from Edge of Tomorrow with a nickel balanced on edge in the center of the top of the sub at various volume levels including much higher than our normal. The only time the nickel fell was during 2 of the 6 runs through the EoT lead-in. This sub is in our living room over our basement, it appears that depending on where I stand/sit there are less vibrations in the floor. The sub itself doesn't appear to vibrate enough to topple the nickel.

I like...
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post #11 of 33 Old 02-05-2015, 06:27 PM
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Great information. Thanks. I am amazed at how similar your response looks to mine. What size room are you playing in and where are you taking measurements? My theater is tiny, 13' X 14.5' with seating against the long wall. Looks like you had to do some serious boosting from 20 to 30 hz. I think you are correct in that the room is playing a huge part; this combination models so much better.

Glad to hear your cabinet does not vibrate excessively. I may have gotten a little carried away with the bracing. Maybe a little less effort on the inside and a little more on the outside...but mom always said its what's on the inside that counts.

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post #12 of 33 Old 02-05-2015, 06:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidK442 View Post
Great information. Thanks. I am amazed at how similar your response looks to mine. What size room are you playing in and where are you taking measurements? My theater is tiny, 13' X 14.5' with seating against the long wall. Looks like you had to do some serious boosting from 20 to 30 hz. I think you are correct in that the room is playing a huge part; this combination models so much better.

Glad to hear your cabinet does not vibrate excessively. I may have gotten a little carried away with the bracing. Maybe a little less effort on the inside and a little more on the outside...but mom always said its what's on the inside that counts.

Hi David,

Judging by the pic I don't think bracing will be a problem!

I did boost quite a bit at 20Hz to counteract the HPF at 20Hz (modeling showed exceeding xmax quickly without a HPF), as well as a big bump at 29Hz and 66Hz. The rest of the PEQ was to bring spikes down. The larger test box gave a smoother FR initially, but didn't pass the WAF so I had to work with this. My measurements were at the MLP.

Our room is 13.5x17.5 with 8' ceilings, open in the back to front entranceway and the right to the dining room. Hardly ideal, but the 1260 gives us very good output down to 18Hz as well as a lot of tactile response. I ran 15 and 10Hz test tones just for giggles and was surprised that I could actually feel the 15 pretty well, and still feel the 10 (obviously not much SPL there, but still...)

What are the dimensions on your box? I thought you mentioned it was very similar to mine, but my port appears to be much longer than what you have in the picture (mine is 28Wx21Hx17.5D with a 36.25" long port, full 16" width). Those dimensions tuned to 19.3Hz according to WinISD.

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post #13 of 33 Old 02-05-2015, 09:38 PM
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My box is 36"L X 24"H X 16"W.
The total inside volume is 6 cubic feet, but subtracting off the port volume, bracing and the driver brings it down to about 4.5 cuft. My port is 13" W X 2" H. WinISD calculates that a length of 36" will tune to 20 Hz. I have read though that the program tends to over estimate required port length by about 17% so I chopped the length to 30". I checked for the actual port resonance by measuring voltage at various frequencies and came up with 19 to 20 Hz. My port is split down the middle so I was able to block off one side for a tune of around 15 Hz. That however causes the overall response to really fall off below 30 Hz so I run with both ports open.
Looking at your dimensions it seems that my box is actually a bit closer to your larger veto'd test enclosure. I know when my wife saw the two large boxes she was quite interested to know where they were going. Fortunately I have an AT screen so they disappear nicely. I have been quite impressed with the clean, deep bass output, especially in my small room. I can see though the allure of going with 18's. Those 12's are working hard to make the walls pulse at very low frequencies.
I'm sure the tonal balance will be much better when I can shape the response with a digital parametric EQ as you have done. A monumental improvement judging by your graphs.
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post #14 of 33 Old 02-05-2015, 10:02 PM
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I just Googled your PL-200. Looks like a great sub-woofer in it's own right. The two together must give you some serious output.
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post #15 of 33 Old 02-06-2015, 05:18 AM
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Is there a build sheet for a sub like this? Where can I find what panels and all are cut at to build one of these?
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post #16 of 33 Old 02-06-2015, 05:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justphil View Post
Is there a build sheet for a sub like this? Where can I find what panels and all are cut at to build one of these?
These are slot ported designs. Linked below is the best thread I know of for information on this type of ported sub. Most of their designs are for larger 15" and 18" drivers, but it is just a matter of scaling them down for a 12" if that is the direction you want to go. Laying out and building a basic slot ported box isn't too difficult once you know the volume and port parameters.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/155-di...tysub-faq.html

WinISD information
http://www.subwoofer-builder.com/WinISD.htm

WinISD program download (it is free)
http://www.linearteam.dk/?pageid=winisdpro

Goodluck.

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post #17 of 33 Old 02-06-2015, 06:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidK442 View Post
These are slot ported designs. Linked below is the best thread I know of for information on this type of ported sub. Most of their designs are for larger 15" and 18" drivers, but it is just a matter of scaling them down for a 12" if that is the direction you want to go. Laying out and building a basic slot ported box isn't too difficult once you know the volume and port parameters.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/155-di...tysub-faq.html

WinISD information
http://www.subwoofer-builder.com/WinISD.htm

WinISD program download (it is free)
http://www.linearteam.dk/?pageid=winisdpro

Goodluck.
Thanks for your reply =)
trying to figure out how to use that program I may as well be trying to learn the Chinese language and all its dialects. Was hoping for plans.
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post #18 of 33 Old 02-06-2015, 06:20 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidK442 View Post
My box is 36"L X 24"H X 16"W.
The total inside volume is 6 cubic feet, but subtracting off the port volume, bracing and the driver brings it down to about 4.5 cuft. My port is 13" W X 2" H. WinISD calculates that a length of 36" will tune to 20 Hz. I have read though that the program tends to over estimate required port length by about 17% so I chopped the length to 30".
I was not aware of WinISD's miscalculation of port length, good to know. Thanks for that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidK442
I checked for the actual port resonance by measuring voltage at various frequencies and came up with 19 to 20 Hz. My port is split down the middle so I was able to block off one side for a tune of around 15 Hz. That however causes the overall response to really fall off below 30 Hz so I run with both ports open.
Blocking one of the ports hadn't even occurred to me, I'll give that a try when I have some time and see how it responds.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidK442
Looking at your dimensions it seems that my box is actually a bit closer to your larger veto'd test enclosure. I know when my wife saw the two large boxes she was quite interested to know where they were going. Fortunately I have an AT screen so they disappear nicely. I have been quite impressed with the clean, deep bass output, especially in my small room. I can see though the allure of going with 18's. Those 12's are working hard to make the walls pulse at very low frequencies.
I'm sure the tonal balance will be much better when I can shape the response with a digital parametric EQ as you have done. A monumental improvement judging by your graphs.
Yep, your boxes are closer to my 2nd test box (32Wx29Hx18D with ~26" port). That one gave me slightly better SPL, but extension was almost identical to the smaller box, so the wife's veto didn't get me all that upset

I agree, I wanted to go with a larger driver, but WAF and the fact that the 1260 produces as much as we need (?, that can't be right!) for our living room @ $62, I just couldn't justify it. Couldn't build a big enough box to let say an SI HT 18 flex it's muscles.

And yes, the PEQ goes a long way, at least in my room. On my first test box I used an old plate amp I had laying around, after taking measurements of that I immediately looked into DSP options! miniDSP came to mind initially, but the plate amp was very old anyway, so jumped on the nu1000DSP instead.

Best of luck with your builds!
Scott
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post #19 of 33 Old 02-06-2015, 06:30 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justphil View Post
Is there a build sheet for a sub like this? Where can I find what panels and all are cut at to build one of these?
Quote:
Originally Posted by justphil
Thanks for your reply =)
trying to figure out how to use that program I may as well be trying to learn the Chinese language and all its dialects. Was hoping for plans.
@justphil :
I don't have a cut sheet per se (I am old school I guess, everything drawn out on graph paper with a pencil) but here are my panel dimensions

2 - 28 x 17.5 - Top & Bottom
2 - 28 x 19.5 - Front & Back
1 - 19.5 x 16 - Long side (opposite port exit)
1 - 18 x 16 - Short side (port exit)
1 - 25 x 16 - Port top
1 - 10.5 x 16 - Port side

Lots of posts around showing how to assemble, the link to the Martysub FAQ DavidK442 posted has tons of information. I build a bit differently than most, top and bottom panels are full size, everything else fits between them.
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post #20 of 33 Old 02-06-2015, 06:34 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidK442 View Post
I just Googled your PL-200. Looks like a great sub-woofer in it's own right. The two together must give you some serious output.
For the price I feel it's a good sub for 30Hz and above. It's the sub that got me started down the rabbit hole though, purchased that last September and immediately started looking around for MORE!

(And I've got to say, as I'm new to all this, it's been a real b**ch figuring out how to integrate the 2 in my room)
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post #21 of 33 Old 02-08-2015, 05:20 PM
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Very nice job on your subwoofer!

I have been impressed with the Infinity drivers. I built a sealed unit that has two of the 1262 drivers in a dual opposed arrangement in a box that is 17" by 24" by 24". It holds its own with an SVS PB 12 plus 2 that is also in the room.
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post #22 of 33 Old 02-22-2015, 11:39 AM - Thread Starter
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OK, to put the cap on this (literally and figuratively)...

The wife picked out the stone and the top was ready Friday. I would have preferred something much darker (and less grey/white), but she's happy with the look so who am I to argue? With top the entire unit weighs in at ~165lbs.




And I figured out a couple of things I was doing wrong with the setup/measurements, here's the measurement now from 10 - 120Hz.
Black: Both PL-200 and DIY 1260 together after running Audyssey
Blue: Both subs plus front L&R (volume adjusted down to our normal loudest level, thus the drop on the lower end) after Audyssey


I could drive myself crazy trying to get a better response, but as it sounds really good to us, and it's a living room vs. a dedicated theater space, I'm going to leave it alone. At least for awhile...

Thanks again for all the comments, and to those that share their vast knowledge and experience here on AVS!

Scott
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post #23 of 33 Old 02-22-2015, 12:05 PM
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OK, to put the cap on this (literally and figuratively)...

...And I figured out a couple of things I was doing wrong with the setup/measurements, here's the measurement now from 10 - 120Hz.
Black: Both PL-200 and DIY 1260 together after running Audyssey
Blue: Both subs plus front L&R (volume adjusted down to our normal loudest level, thus the drop on the lower end) after Audyssey


I could drive myself crazy trying to get a better response, but as it sounds really good to us, and it's a living room vs. a dedicated theater space, I'm going to leave it alone. At least for awhile...

Thanks again for all the comments, and to those that share their vast knowledge and experience here on AVS!

Scott
Great build!

You can fix that drop at 80-120 Hz by adjusting phase and/or sub distance in the software. There's a thread somewhere that explains how to do it. I can't seem to locate it, so maybe someone else can chime in?

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post #24 of 33 Old 02-22-2015, 01:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Great build!

You can fix that drop at 80-120 Hz by adjusting phase and/or sub distance in the software. There's a thread somewhere that explains how to do it. I can't seem to locate it, so maybe someone else can chime in?
Thanks Augerhandle.

I've been working phase and delay the past couple of days, both with and without fronts, just can't seem to get it right. As I'm new to all this, I figure either A) my hearing is the problem, B) my setup isn't correct or C) (most likely) a combination of A & B Also, the only DSP I have other than Audyssey on my AVR-X2000 is on the nu1000DSP powering the DIY sub.

Because I don't really know what I'm doing it's mostly been trial-and-error, with a lot of reading here. It certainly measures much better than before but there is room for improvement. I will probably leave it as-is for a week or so, read up some more on setup theory and practice, then start all over again! What else am I going to do during winter here in SE Michigan?
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post #25 of 33 Old 02-22-2015, 01:49 PM
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Thanks Augerhandle.

I've been working phase and delay the past couple of days, both with and without fronts, just can't seem to get it right. As I'm new to all this, I figure either A) my hearing is the problem, B) my setup isn't correct or C) (most likely) a combination of A & B Also, the only DSP I have other than Audyssey on my AVR-X2000 is on the nu1000DSP powering the DIY sub.

Because I don't really know what I'm doing it's mostly been trial-and-error, with a lot of reading here. It certainly measures much better than before but there is room for improvement. I will probably leave it as-is for a week or so, read up some more on setup theory and practice, then start all over again! What else am I going to do during winter here in SE Michigan?
I found the link! https://www.avsforum.com/forum/155-di...ow-thread.html

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post #26 of 33 Old 02-22-2015, 03:41 PM
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Great project with impressive results...and most importantly, wife approved.
Thanks for documenting the build and various measurements.
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post #27 of 33 Old 02-22-2015, 04:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Great project with impressive results...and most importantly, wife approved.
Thanks for documenting the build and various measurements.
Thanks David. Looking forward to seeing how your builds come out!
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post #28 of 33 Old 02-22-2015, 04:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks, I've seen that one before but will look through it again. The biggest problem I'm running into (I think) is that I only have DSP capabilities on the 1260 build. Maybe I'll look into bypassing the amp on the PL-200 and drive it with the nu1000DSP. That would really get the wife's eyes rolling!
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post #29 of 33 Old 02-22-2015, 04:44 PM
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Thanks, I've seen that one before but will look through it again. The biggest problem I'm running into (I think) is that I only have DSP capabilities on the 1260 build. Maybe I'll look into bypassing the amp on the PL-200 and drive it with the nu1000DSP. That would really get the wife's eyes rolling!
I believe you can set/change delay on the subs with the nu1000DSP, and change distances with your AVR. Check out post #3 in his thread.

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post #30 of 33 Old 02-22-2015, 06:26 PM
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You can use audyssey to give you good starting points for distance/delay. Run audyssey with only the farther sub connected. Just do the first position and check the sub distance it sets. Write that down. Now do that again but with only the nearer sub. You will then need to calculate the proper delay in milliseconds to enter into the inuke. Just subtract the shorter distance from the longer and translate the difference. That should give you a good starting point. When I did this I tried a hundred different delays thinking I could do better and I ended up with the result audyssey calculated. Audyssey appears to be darn good at determining distance.
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