The V.B.S.S. DIY subwoofer design thread - Page 20 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #571 of 1468 Old 10-12-2017, 10:50 PM
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Please someone I need help. I got my Neutrik NL4FX 4-Pole speakON Cable Connector in the mail, and my 3 year old took it and screwed it together. I was only able to tighten it more, not knowing it is permanently tight now. I am searching online and can't find anything on how to take it apart. Is there a better user friendly connector that will fit the inuke n3000? I would love to go pick it up, but will order online if it's to much of a rip off to go local. I hate this connector!

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post #572 of 1468 Old 10-12-2017, 11:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gr4474 View Post
Please someone I need help. I got my Neutrik NL4FX 4-Pole speakON Cable Connector in the mail, and my 3 year old took it and screwed it together. I was only able to tighten it more, not knowing it is permanently tight now. I am searching online and can't find anything on how to take it apart. Is there a better user friendly connector that will fit the inuke n3000? I would love to go pick it up, but will order online if it's to much of a rip off to go local. I hate this connector!


Try a pair of channel locks to unscrew it. It might be cross threaded which is why your having a hard time in screwing it now. Guitar center sells these connectors to at lest by my house they do in there pro audio section of the store.
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post #573 of 1468 Old 10-12-2017, 11:32 PM
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Thanks! I actually just tried 2 pairs of pliers (channel locks) and got it apart. I was at the point that I didn't care if it cracked apart, but it looks ok.

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post #574 of 1468 Old 11-08-2017, 12:40 PM
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Plop so here I am...not exactly posting about the VBSS itself...but the EQ settings for the iNuke for it.

I have an iNuke 3000DSP I also don't own a VBSS. I have a bunch of theater JBL subwoofers with 6 total speakers. I have done some early testing and I'll post pictures soon but I can fairly clearly say that the JBL 2226H (Two of the speakers JBL 2242 or 2245 not sure which it is) responds EXTREMELY well to the VBSS 20hz tune.

I'm going to be doing some more testing but I do think that in general Matts tune here works really well with high efficiency subwoofers. I think Matt has played around with his fair share of JBL so he might be able to speak to that. I think it speaks massively for how well designed(yet simple which is amazing) the VBSS is, it should be a bench mark.
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post #575 of 1468 Old 11-17-2017, 02:45 PM
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If I want to get 2 more subs, say 2x18um, would it be better to do 1x18, and 4x18vbss ? I really want mid bass.

How would one integrate it into the receiver and crossovers? Just have each set use one lfe channel and crossover high around 140hz? Then anything the ultimax won't handle will be handle by the vbss? Is this how you guys are doing it?
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post #576 of 1468 Old 11-20-2017, 01:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarier View Post
If I want to get 2 more subs, say 2x18um, would it be better to do 1x18, and 4x18vbss ? I really want mid bass.

How would one integrate it into the receiver and crossovers? Just have each set use one lfe channel and crossover high around 140hz? Then anything the ultimax won't handle will be handle by the vbss? Is this how you guys are doing it?
If you want more Midbass I would target a different subwoofer. I would look at something in the 15" range from B&C likely or something from JBL like a 2226H. I think you'll get more bang for your buck that way.

The VBSS does great it's just a big woofer if your goal is to get more midbass. Even the Flex 12 etc would likely be a better option.
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post #577 of 1468 Old 11-20-2017, 02:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarier View Post
If I want to get 2 more subs, say 2x18um, would it be better to do 1x18, and 4x18vbss ? I really want mid bass.

How would one integrate it into the receiver and crossovers? Just have each set use one lfe channel and crossover high around 140hz? Then anything the ultimax won't handle will be handle by the vbss? Is this how you guys are doing it?

AVR - set main speakers to small and crossover to 120hz (or 140 or 100 or 80hz). This sets the LPF on your sub outs.
Sub out 1 to amp channel 1 - 4xVBSS - set amp HPF to tune freq (25hz?) or little below.
Sub out 2 to amp channel 2 - 1xUM - set amp HPF to tune freq (10hz?) or little below. Optionally set LPF anywhere from 25hz to 120z depending on integration with the VBSS's.


Thats a starting point. You'll have to play with those crossover settings to see what works for you, based on tuning frequencies and response graphs and room gains/nulls.
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post #578 of 1468 Old 11-29-2017, 02:14 PM
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I'm thinking about building a couple of these subs for my basement theater. I have a cubby space that I can put the subs into that will allow me to effectively flush mount them into the wall. I'm trying to go as cheap as possible so my question is - can I use a single port for each sub and have them tuned to 15 hz? I know the design calls for two ports per sub but this is just to have the flexibility to tune them differently right? If I can get away with buying two precision ports instead of 4 I can save $30 or so. Thanks in advance for the help.
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post #579 of 1468 Old 11-29-2017, 08:23 PM
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maybe . .

my dual 460 sub uses 4 triangular ports, but i'm on a different computer right now

maybe you can get a resident guru to give you some guidance. my savior was LTD02, but it's tuned for MBM range

changes might be able to be made

FTR, tho I have 2 drivers in about 9.5 ft^3 internal, an option was to make a solid interior divider and have 2 subs in the same box

so I saved about $60 making the triangular ports with scraps . .

also @cuzed2 also built some VBSS variants, you might want to get his input

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post #580 of 1468 Old 11-30-2017, 04:58 AM
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Out of curiosity, has anyone tried this with one of the Dayton plate amps with dsp? Trying to figure out my best option for sailing the seas of waf.

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post #581 of 1468 Old 11-30-2017, 06:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huskerfan73 View Post
I'm thinking about building a couple of these subs for my basement theater. I have a cubby space that I can put the subs into that will allow me to effectively flush mount them into the wall. I'm trying to go as cheap as possible so my question is - can I use a single port for each sub and have them tuned to 15 hz? I know the design calls for two ports per sub but this is just to have the flexibility to tune them differently right? If I can get away with buying two precision ports instead of 4 I can save $30 or so. Thanks in advance for the help.
If you only ever plan on running it at 15hz, then yes you can build it with JUST a single port.

You are correct in that the other port is there to allow for the different tune options.

If it was me, I'd build it in such a way as to be able to add the other port later on, if needed.

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post #582 of 1468 Old 11-30-2017, 06:37 AM
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The V.B.S.S. DIY subwoofer design thread

@mtg90
Do you have a design for your VBSS using a single square, triangle, or slot port at the 15hz tune. I am seriously thinking of building 4-8 of theses for my theater room.

Edit: Also with regards to keeping the port velocity low as at least 2-4 of them will be behind an AT screen.

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post #583 of 1468 Old 11-30-2017, 10:42 AM
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Thanks all for the info and replies. EndersShadow, that sounds like a good idea to always have the option of adding the second port. I'm thinking that by having two and running them tuned to 15hz even though it might not have as much headroom compared to if it was tuned higher I'll still have waaaaay more bass than I'm used to. I currently have a little Definitive sub that I picked up cheap off of craigslist. Pretty sure I'll be in for a treat once I get them up and running. Its going to be a while and I'm going to have to do it in stages (gotta pay for a family trip to Disney first). I'll try to post a few pics once its all done. I know everybody around here likes build pics I'm sure I'll be back at some asking questions about setting up Behringer amps!
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post #584 of 1468 Old 11-30-2017, 07:27 PM
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Originally Posted by winty82 View Post
@mikeTRON250LM

Attached are the dimensions, the only missing one is the port length which will be 41" in total.
Aiming for 20Hz


I've changed laptops since initially designing the sub and now finally I'm ready to build them and all my plans have gone!
What happened to the pictures on my posts?
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post #585 of 1468 Old 11-30-2017, 09:32 PM - Thread Starter
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You can build it with a full width slot port that is 1.5" high x 28" long with a brace running down the middle of the port, This will allow for both the 20hz tune with both halves of the port open or the 15hz tune if one of the halves was closed off.

If just the 15Hz tune is desired then the slot port can be 1" high, full width (22") and 32" long.
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post #586 of 1468 Old 12-01-2017, 07:21 AM
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mtg90, this sounds like an even better option for me to try out. All other dimensions would be the same as what you outlined in your original post?
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post #587 of 1468 Old 12-01-2017, 10:14 AM
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Thank you @mtg90 !


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post #588 of 1468 Old 12-01-2017, 12:29 PM - Thread Starter
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mtg90, this sounds like an even better option for me to try out. All other dimensions would be the same as what you outlined in your original post?
Yep, using the original cabinet dimensions.
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post #589 of 1468 Old 12-01-2017, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtg90 View Post
Yep, using the original cabinet dimensions.
Any plans on starting a thread on the four Goldwood 10" drivers in that 6th order series tuned bandpass sub? Maybe a rough idea of what it outputs at so many watts? Always had a fascination with bandpasses so your design looks very well done.

Any issues with the bandpass yet?
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post #590 of 1468 Old 12-03-2017, 12:27 PM
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@mtg90 ,

I'm meeting with my wife's uncle who is building me two vbss cabs. Just want to make sure I understand the slot port. If it needs to be 28" long then it would extend roughly 17" back from the face and then about 11" up the back wall of the enclosure. I'm I thinking about that correctly?
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post #591 of 1468 Old 12-03-2017, 01:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes that is correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 18Hurts View Post
Any plans on starting a thread on the four Goldwood 10" drivers in that 6th order series tuned bandpass sub? Maybe a rough idea of what it outputs at so many watts? Always had a fascination with bandpasses so your design looks very well done.

Any issues with the bandpass yet?
I can start a thread on that at some point, if enough people want me to. It does have more output then the VBSS but it also has an issue I didn't realize would be as bad as it was.

The font chamber is smaller then it should be for the drivers, this causes a peak in the response near 115hz. I thought no bid deal EQ that flat and all should be well, if anything that peak being EQ'ed down will provide greater headroom and reduction in compression over that range (which it does). The issue is that the GRS drivers tend to have pretty high distortion when pushed up around xmax and where is the excursion peak on this design? Well it's centered around 35hz. So what happens is that as the divers are pushed near xmax in that range the 3rd and 4th harmonics from 30-40hz land right on that peak in the response and they get amplified by it. If a larger front chamber was used (about twice the current volume of that chamber) that would eliminate the peak in the response and also and give more output below 80hz but doing so would make for a sizably larger enclosure overall.

Above the issues in the 30-40hz range range distortion drops like a rock and is impressively low above 50hz which is the acoustic low of the bandpass design working like it should.

Overall the sub in it's current format works ok for what it is, just not quite as good as it could be.

Here is the sim in Hornresp with 400w input, roughly the output of a single channel on an inuke 3000. Could power 4 of these in total off that amp.
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post #592 of 1468 Old 12-03-2017, 05:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtg90 View Post
Yes that is correct.



I can start a thread on that at some point, if enough people want me to. It does have more output then the VBSS but it also has an issue I didn't realize would be as bad as it was.

The font chamber is smaller then it should be for the drivers, this causes a peak in the response near 115hz.

Above the issues in the 30-40hz range range distortion drops like a rock and is impressively low above 50hz which is the acoustic low of the bandpass design working like it should.

Overall the sub in it's current format works ok for what it is, just not quite as good as it could be.
Ahhhh,

Yes, that 115Hz peak would be problematic if using a conventional 80 to 100 Hz XO--the larger chamber would need a redesign making it larger. Thanks for the reply, series tuned BPs I always found interesting and wondered how wide of a response you can tune the things. Crossing my fingers for a 25Hz and 70Hz tune but that does not seem attainable without response looking like two mountains with a deep valley.

Thanks for the reply and that design is outstanding for 75 bucks in drivers. I ponder how something like four Anarchy 7" drivers or the Dayton UM8 driver would handle that design. Would I be correct in thinking that 6th order series tuned bandpasses require stout cones, strong motors and a lot of thermal mass? I do like the idea of push-pull sub loading and one dimension that is about a foot deep--to slide behind my couch. One of these days... Thanks again for the information and have a great weekend.
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post #593 of 1468 Old 12-06-2017, 06:08 PM
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OK, what am I missing ? We are suppose to use the full length of the port but as you can clearly see the port will basically hit the inside of the cabinet.

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post #594 of 1468 Old 12-07-2017, 12:08 PM - Thread Starter
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There should be about 2" from the port flare to the rear wall of the cabinet, the closeness there effectively gives some extra length to the port allowing a lower tuning then normal.
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post #595 of 1468 Old 12-07-2017, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtg90 View Post
There should be about 2" from the port flare to the rear wall of the cabinet, the closeness there effectively gives some extra length to the port allowing a lower tuning then normal.
Thanks, so I guess I need to glue that back flare piece on while the port is in place ... and what glue do i use ?
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post #596 of 1468 Old 12-08-2017, 04:30 AM
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Originally Posted by HFGuy View Post
Thanks, so I guess I need to glue that back flare piece on while the port is in place ... and what glue do i use ?
The back flare piece fits through the hole. In fact you could use it as a template to draw the circle for the hole. Wish I'd done that, I ended up making the holes a bit too big.

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post #597 of 1468 Old 12-10-2017, 07:44 AM
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How would these compare to a Marty microcube? Am I correct that you can run two off of a 1000 dsp?

I'm on the fence about whether these are too big for my living room...
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post #598 of 1468 Old 12-10-2017, 08:41 AM
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Two would destroy a single microcube. You can run two off a 1000dsp, but a 3000dsp is a better option.
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post #599 of 1468 Old 12-10-2017, 11:51 AM
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I always recommend making a cardboard version of what you plan to build when waf is involved. They are pretty big.

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post #600 of 1468 Old 12-10-2017, 01:24 PM
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Quote:
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Two would destroy a single microcube. You can run two off a 1000dsp, but a 3000dsp is a better option.
But would 2 be better than/as good as two microcubes?
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