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post #241 of 363 Old 03-30-2019, 05:52 PM - Thread Starter
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They are 4 feet tall. Eminence beta 10s, peerless dual ring radiators, eminence crossover. I have them crossed at 1khz but the tweeter won’t play max spl at that low crossover, they will at a 3khz crossover. They play reference easily in my room. My next version will have 6 tweets to make them 10 dB more capable at 1 kHz. I played music at 91 dB and it was really loud. Not sure if the meter was correct. It seemed more like 100 dB from past experiences. I might try some higher excursion 12s but that would mean different wood. I love the solid wood cabinets, seems much higher quality than plywood and MDF. Of course they look much better. I am going to stain these gloss black.
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post #242 of 363 Old 03-30-2019, 06:58 PM
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If you go with higher excursion 12s, won’t there be a decline in integration with the tweeters? Also, would you need different wood because the cabinets are not very inert as is?
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post #243 of 363 Old 03-30-2019, 07:56 PM - Thread Starter
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No, I would use a different crossover and the wood is because I can’t find stock solid pine in the width I would need around here. Otherwise I would use the same.
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post #244 of 363 Old 03-30-2019, 09:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Here are some measurements of the new one. Plus my subs with the gain up and the turned down the LFA down 3 clicks.
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post #245 of 363 Old 05-20-2019, 10:50 AM - Thread Starter
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Theater is done! I have to start over from a flood, I will start a new thread when water is diverted and get some walls back up.

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post #246 of 363 Old 05-20-2019, 11:31 AM
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Theater is done! I have to start over from a flood, I will start a new thread when water is diverted and get some walls back up.
Man that sucks. Good luck on the rebuild process bud.
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post #247 of 363 Old 05-20-2019, 11:35 AM
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Theater is done! I have to start over from a flood, I will start a new thread when water is diverted and get some walls back up.
No way! Sorry to hear, were you able to save any of your equipment? I know you just did those new mains too.

Best of luck with the rebuild!
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post #248 of 363 Old 05-20-2019, 11:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Yeah, I have owned this house since 2005 and never had water in the theater area, they messed with the land last summer to divert water from the pool and other side of the house and I warned them. My wife started to tear out the rug which is submerged but knowing her she will want me to tear every wall down including the ceiling. I don't think she realizes how much work went into it over the years. I have layers of walls, not just one. Anyways, maybe I can change the layout of the theater by making one wide room and one set of seats 7 across by making the 17 feet width be the front to back and the 21 feet be the width. The doors would be behind the seats rather than the side. Hell, If I tear all the walls down there won't be doors either. Damn, I really don't want to redo the studs. I could make it much better knowing what I know compared to 14 years ago. I know sealing the room was great for the ULF.

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post #249 of 363 Old 05-20-2019, 11:42 AM
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Theater is done! I have to start over from a flood, I will start a new thread when water is diverted and get some walls back up.


Man that’s a serious kick in the pants. So sorry to hear that!

Were you able to save anything?


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post #250 of 363 Old 05-20-2019, 11:50 AM - Thread Starter
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No way! Sorry to hear, were you able to save any of your equipment? I know you just did those new mains too.

Best of luck with the rebuild!
Still in the cleaning up process. The mains were standing in it and the bottom was submerged(2-3 inches) but no drivers. I had many dayton 10 and 12 inch drivers on the floor in the other room, those are probably toast. They were the Pa 255 and 310. The 310 is still the best woofer I have heard as lmid bass to mid range is concerned, so much detail and easily heard vocals that other drivers do not do as well, including the eminence beta 10a. My processor, amps, projector and such are all well above the floor. Building new speakers is one thing, starting the room over, ugh. It still might give me the chance to have one wide row over two rows. The problem would be the outer seats beyond the screen width and such. We shall see. I will keep the updats on this thread. I have to go home now and rip the baffle wall apart which my XXX 18 subs are screwed into. My last response with them was this too,

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post #251 of 363 Old 05-20-2019, 12:28 PM
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Ugh so sorry to hear this. I live in fear of the same thing happening.

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post #252 of 363 Old 05-20-2019, 02:47 PM - Thread Starter
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I just figure this is a material hobby and nothing lasts forever. I mean it could always be worse, right? I had a couple leaks from the bathroom upstairs which leaked onto my ceiling in the theater with a constant drip of water before we figured it out. Came from the shower, not the toilet. My wife has always wanted to tear the ceilings down knowing there is probably mold or at least mildew growing from that leak. I guess this gives here that chance.

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post #253 of 363 Old 05-20-2019, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
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I just figure this is a material hobby and nothing lasts forever. I mean it could always be worse, right? I had a couple leaks from the bathroom upstairs which leaked onto my ceiling in the theater with a constant drip of water before we figured it out. Came from the shower, not the toilet. My wife has always wanted to tear the ceilings down knowing there is probably mold or at least mildew growing from that leak. I guess this gives here that chance.
I know that feeling about water damage also. I had my water heater output hose blow off the fitting and run at full pressure for 30 minutes and ended up with only 3 inches of water in the basement. I am still re-doing my wainscotting on the walls, so my stereo room is full of furniture from other rooms, I cannot start my new super monster build till I can clear out my listening room. Good luck with your room, that will be a lot of time and work to re-do. Not all floods are from the outside of the house.
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post #254 of 363 Old 05-20-2019, 02:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Yeah, this room has been changed a few times but never from scratch. I have had 10 different systems in it and why I called this thread 10.0.

I need to take a picture of the drivers again, I forgot how big these things were, damn, they are beefy.

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post #255 of 363 Old 06-03-2019, 03:44 AM
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post #256 of 363 Old 06-03-2019, 03:51 AM
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wow my friend. you have put alot of work into your theater. the pictures are cool but I really wish we could hear your room. I bet it sounds awesome.

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post #257 of 363 Old 06-03-2019, 08:36 AM - Thread Starter
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OK, Just had a couple rain storms and no water in the basement. The theater is gutted and only the bracing is left standing. So I am looking at the bracing and something hit me, I am going to make my speakers part of the wall. No box, just use the wall as the box and screw a front baffle for all my speakers into the braces themselves. All my speakers would be inwall with a baffle, this way I can put even a 15 as atmos because it fits in between the 16 inch wide studs. I will use dual 12s for the front 3 and dual 10s for everything else. Same design as my last speaker made. I just have to seal up the outer wall which leads to the other parts of the basement better. I will get more sound leak through the floor joist above this way but I can add some wood for the ceiling speakers where needed. I will also run all the wire in the wall as well so I won't need soffits to hide them and since my ceilings are lowered(due to pipes), this gives me nothing to hit my head on. I am also thinking about building the riser out of cinder blocks so if it does flood all the wood will be above it. The funny thing is my room will have no walls but all the speakers and wires will be in place first thing so I can actually get started on building the baffles, which is simple, all 16 inches wide. I wonder if I should flush mount them since they will be in wall and wall treatments will surround them anyways.

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post #258 of 363 Old 06-03-2019, 11:51 AM
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OK,.....

If life gives you lemons ......

Some interesting ideas. It stinks that you have to do all of this work, but it sounds like you're going to have some nice improvements when you are all done. At least you will have upgrades and not just "be back where you started."
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post #259 of 363 Old 06-03-2019, 11:59 AM - Thread Starter
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If life gives you lemons ......

Some interesting ideas. It stinks that you have to do all of this work, but it sounds like you're going to have some nice improvements when you are all done. At least you will have upgrades and not just "be back where you started."
Hopefully I can improve what I have learned over the years using less. After all the modeling and listening I am using the 12s for the front and the 10s for the surrounds and ceilings, all designed the same with the same tweeters.
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post #260 of 363 Old 06-03-2019, 06:14 PM
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OK, Just had a couple rain storms and no water in the basement. The theater is gutted and only the bracing is left standing. So I am looking at the bracing and something hit me, I am going to make my speakers part of the wall. No box, just use the wall as the box and screw a front baffle for all my speakers into the braces themselves. All my speakers would be inwall with a baffle, this way I can put even a 15 as atmos because it fits in between the 16 inch wide studs. I will use dual 12s for the front 3 and dual 10s for everything else. Same design as my last speaker made. I just have to seal up the outer wall which leads to the other parts of the basement better. I will get more sound leak through the floor joist above this way but I can add some wood for the ceiling speakers where needed. I will also run all the wire in the wall as well so I won't need soffits to hide them and since my ceilings are lowered(due to pipes), this gives me nothing to hit my head on. I am also thinking about building the riser out of cinder blocks so if it does flood all the wood will be above it. The funny thing is my room will have no walls but all the speakers and wires will be in place first thing so I can actually get started on building the baffles, which is simple, all 16 inches wide. I wonder if I should flush mount them since they will be in wall and wall treatments will surround them anyways.
This is an intriguing idea. I think it's a brilliant way to redo the theater. The only issue is if you get the itch to upgrade......

Are you going to do the REs for subs again?

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post #261 of 363 Old 06-03-2019, 07:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes, thought about what if I want to upgrade and the answer will be my baffle will be floor to ceiling and removable with the screws to access each speaker. Or make a section for the speaker only and just take that portion out to change keeping the baffle size the same height and width and just changing driver layout and/ or size.

I am definitely using the REs, my favorite sub driver by far! I want two more! They will also be in the same wall so I will have to extend the front extra to fit them. Nothing in room but seats, screen, and projector. I will also place all speakers and subs behind the screen to hide them. The screen is 10-11 feet wide so plenty of space.
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post #262 of 363 Old 06-11-2019, 12:09 AM
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Man, sorry to hear about the water..... Ive got first hand experience with that. We spent 50k redoing ours, only to have it flood with 2 feet of water the day we paid for it.... literally 40k down the drain (we couldnt get flood insurance at the time, its not available since it happens so much in my area)

At first, I did the wall is my sub box thing.... In my experience, the bracing of the wall needed to be about 10x what I had thought lol i had 4 x 18s in there, braced with 5x the 2x4 and 2 x 6s you could need and it shook the wall apart the first month hahaha.

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post #263 of 363 Old 06-11-2019, 07:53 AM
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Damn what a loss

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In my experience, the bracing of the wall needed to be about 10x what I had thought lol i had 4 x 18s in there, braced with 5x the 2x4 and 2 x 6s you could need and it shook the wall apart the first month hahaha.
You're absolutely right about the reactive forces of direct radiator subs, it'll shake the wall apart.
Dual opposed manifold works great.
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post #264 of 363 Old 06-13-2019, 09:28 AM - Thread Starter
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I might just build the subs and place in the room which will be the most quiet. I have experienced shaking the walls and upstairs too many times once I went baffle sub wall.
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post #265 of 363 Old 08-12-2019, 09:26 PM - Thread Starter
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2 months later and I finally started a little. I will start a new thread when it is finished but update here.

Quick shot of some of the room.



Here is an idea I will try first for the front speakers. I really like the Dayton Pa310, crystal clear vocals, better than my JBL 2035 in that regard.


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post #266 of 363 Old 08-13-2019, 05:50 AM
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Here is an idea I will try first for the front speakers. I really like the Dayton Pa310, crystal clear vocals, better than my JBL 2035 in that regard.

Love to hear more about this design.....

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post #267 of 363 Old 08-13-2019, 08:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Once I test it and if it is good with a natural smooth response I will do more. It is a Morel horn loaded silk dome and the Dayton 310. I have a JBL 2035 and eminence beta 10s lying around and I prefer the Dayton on vocal clarity and fullness. Not sure how to say it, weight, bottom end(midbass), but not punch like most people want midbass. I cross over lower than normal because these are not meant for PA max output blasters. I just want clean reference in room. After all these years having 130 dB capable speakers playing 85 dB with 105 dB periodic peaks is wasteful when a 115-120 dB speaker can do the same. Now this is my room and the farther you are away the more you need. I figure most won't sit that far away of a screen or they can't see detail.
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post #268 of 363 Old 08-13-2019, 09:29 AM
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Once I test it and if it is good with a natural smooth response I will do more. It is a Morel horn loaded silk dome and the Dayton 310. I have a JBL 2035 and eminence beta 10s lying around and I prefer the Dayton on vocal clarity and fullness. Not sure how to say it, weight, bottom end(midbass), but not punch like most people want midbass. I cross over lower than normal because these are not meant for PA max output blasters. I just want clean reference in room. After all these years having 130 dB capable speakers playing 85 dB with 105 dB periodic peaks is wasteful when a 115-120 dB speaker can do the same. Now this is my room and the farther you are away the more you need. I figure most won't sit that far away of a screen or they can't see detail.
Thanks. What box size are you using, or thinking of using. Its hard to see if these are IB or not.

My main listening positions in my room are about 12 feet back give or take. I wont muddy up your thread with a embedded pic of my setup, besides just linking to it here .

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post #269 of 363 Old 08-13-2019, 09:43 AM
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Removable panels looks good as you can test how many drivers per channel.Will you be doing 8 dayton 310 and 8 morel silk domes per l,c,r, surround l ,surround r?

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post #270 of 363 Old 08-13-2019, 10:48 AM - Thread Starter
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I am going to use what I have from my previous designs first. I have to test these first before I commit to more. I have two more 12s and then I have 6 of the 10s which I will use the dual ring radiator for those which are my favorite tweeters so far. They are going to be Sealed speakers and subs but they will be enclosed on the back side, just larger than normal sharing the wall. The subs will have a box built within the wall 2 feet deep, I am going to make them 15 cubes each in the front corners you see on the sides. If I ever get two more they will go on the sides of the center. I am building into the laundry room rather than into the theater.
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