Cube Cubed - Passive Radiator Sub Build - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 29 Old 07-18-2017, 11:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Cube Cubed - Passive Radiator Sub Build

I have always loved passive radiators, so I thought I would finally do a build log along with all the parts needed. Thanks to Parts Express, I am able to bring one of these Passive Radiator Builds to life. My goal was to make a small subwoofer that would still have high spl, for a smaller room all while keeping the cost of the major parts under $200. As I looked around, I haven't found many great subs in that price range, so I thought DIY work might give the best bang for the buck. Here's a list of all the parts chosen for this project along with links:

UPDATE: Complete

Dayton Audio DCS205-4 8" Classic Subwoofer 4 Ohm
2 - Dayton Audio SD215-PR 8" Passive Radiator
Dayton Audio SA100 100W Subwoofer Plate Amplifier
Harrison Labs FMOD Inline Crossover Pair 30 Hz High Pass RCA

I didn't have a separate DSP, so I had to go with an FMOD for the High pass to protect the woofer from over excursion. I did test it, and it was an issue. Although, if you have a DSP you would not need the FMOD. The total cost with the FMod is $190. *Update - once the sub was broken in, the FMOD was unnecessary

The Enclosure is a very small footprint sitting at a 14" cube with 3/4" MDF or a 13.5" cube using 1/2" MDF. So it is a great footprint for a smal room.

When I get home later I'll post the theoretical response before room gain via WinISD. I will say, I have tested this by playing test tones through it and it blew me away. I was very pleased with the SPL this thing can put put out, especially for it's size.
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post #2 of 29 Old 07-18-2017, 11:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Theoretical Frequency Response with no added mass in a 1 cubic foot cabinet.


Theoretical SPL using 100 watt amplifier (106DB)


Cone Excursion without a High Pass


Cone Excursion with 30hz High Pass


When I get it all assembled, I'll post the actual graphs via REW and my UMIK1.
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Last edited by Al Toid; 07-18-2017 at 01:12 PM.
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post #3 of 29 Old 07-18-2017, 11:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Finished Pictures: I may repaint it. My wife likes it so much, she wants it in the living room. That means, it'll need to be white. Oh well..



Size and Cutouts:


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post #4 of 29 Old 07-18-2017, 01:02 PM
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I bet bracing that was sure fun. I will look forward to seeing how it measures in room.


I'd love to see how WinISD would look with the same passives but maybe using a Ultimax 8 and a bit more power. Might be a slightly bigger footprint, but be interesting to see if there is a difference in output.
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post #5 of 29 Old 07-18-2017, 01:32 PM - Thread Starter
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@EndersShadow when I get home later tonight, I'll see if I can model it for you and post the Pictures on here.
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post #6 of 29 Old 07-18-2017, 01:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Toid View Post
@EndersShadow when I get home later tonight, I'll see if I can model it for you and post the Pictures on here.
Realized after the fact is said Ultimax 18, NOT Ultimax 8 which is what I meant .. Its fixed now

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post #7 of 29 Old 07-18-2017, 07:27 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EndersShadow View Post
Realized after the fact is said Ultimax 18, NOT Ultimax 8 which is what I meant .. Its fixed now
The only Problem I am having is that the UM8 has such high excursion, that the PR's can't keep up. I may have to try a few simulations with either more PR's or a different size. So far, it is not looking good for the UM8-22.
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post #8 of 29 Old 07-18-2017, 07:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Toid View Post
The only Problem I am having is that the UM8 has such high excursion, that the PR's can't keep up. I may have to try a few simulations with either more PR's or a different size. So far, it is not looking good for the UM8-22.
Well with a max of 5 (leaving the bottom for a stand of some sort), would that work?

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Quote: There exists, for everyone, a sentence - a series of words - that has the power to destroy you. Another sentence exists, another series of words, that could heal you. If you're lucky you will get the 2nd, but you can be certain of getting the 1st. - Philip K. Dick
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post #9 of 29 Old 07-18-2017, 09:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EndersShadow View Post
Well with a max of 5 (leaving the bottom for a stand of some sort), would that work?
It ended up working by adding 4 passive radiators each with 50g of mass and your box size ends up being 2.5 cubic feet. You still need to add a 30hz highpass to bring in cone excursion, but you get about 12 more hz at F3 and around the same SPL. For all the added cost and size, I am not sure it would be worth it. Thoughts?




Compared with SPL.
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post #10 of 29 Old 07-18-2017, 10:01 PM
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Nnope not worth it. With that much cubic feet needed it would almost be worth it to step up to a 10, 12 or even 15" passive.

But then your getting into large box sizes.

I like where your going with this build.
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post #11 of 29 Old 07-19-2017, 11:52 AM - Thread Starter
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I think you are right. Sometime, I'll have to check out an Ultimax 18 with their new max excursion PR's. That would be pretty sweet. Of course, I am a sucker for PR's.
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post #12 of 29 Old 07-19-2017, 06:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Toid View Post
I think you are right. Sometime, I'll have to check out an Ultimax 18 with their new max excursion PR's. That would be pretty sweet. Of course, I am a sucker for PR's.
Don't waste your money on the 18 inch Dayton PR's. Had one only last about 2 compression sweeps before the spider glue joint totally came undone lol.
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post #13 of 29 Old 07-19-2017, 08:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Don't waste your money on the 18 inch Dayton PR's. Had one only last about 2 compression sweeps before the spider glue joint totally came undone lol.
Wow! That is nuts! I can't believe that. Did Parts Express send you a new one? Did it hold up? Thanks for the heads up on the 18" P.R.'s. They look great, but if there are some type of quality control issues, then that is not good.
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post #14 of 29 Old 07-20-2017, 06:49 AM
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Wow! That is nuts! I can't believe that. Did Parts Express send you a new one? Did it hold up? Thanks for the heads up on the 18" P.R.'s. They look great, but if there are some type of quality control issues, then that is not good.
They probably would have, but it was just easier and faster to glue it myself. There was 2 of the PR's in a box, and only one failed, so it definitely is a QC issues. PSI car audio has PR's that are the same price as the Daytons, I've never used them but they HAVE to be better quality being made in USA
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post #15 of 29 Old 07-22-2017, 02:18 PM - Thread Starter
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I'll post a better graph once I feel the subwoofer is fully broken in.
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post #16 of 29 Old 07-26-2017, 10:30 AM - Thread Starter
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Here is the final build and video build log. I must say, I am very impressed with this little sub. It really pounds very tight clean bass. I know this isn't an Ultimax 18, but for the size/cost, it is perfect. If you are looking for a budget sub, I am very impressed with this. I actually paired this with my custom sound bar, that I should have a build log up for shortly. The sound with both combined, is absolutely amazing. You can DIY so much better than what you can buy for the money, it is ridiculous. I hope you guys enjoy the build!

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post #17 of 29 Old 07-26-2017, 02:20 PM
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I was going to build a Dayton classic either 10" or 12" but I may do this instead. Amazing how simple the build is. This looks great!


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post #18 of 29 Old 07-26-2017, 02:58 PM - Thread Starter
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I was going to build a Dayton classic either 10" or 12" but I may do this instead. Amazing how simple the build is. This looks great!


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Thanks! It really is such an easy build and the sound is unbelievable! I hope you do build it, you iwll not be disappointed. I would be thoroughly excited to see your build!
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post #19 of 29 Old 07-26-2017, 08:57 PM
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Cube Cubed - Passive Radiator Sub Build

Outside of measurements do you think a yun 200watt plate amp would also work?

Actually does this amp LR as well? Or are they just pass through?
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post #20 of 29 Old 07-26-2017, 09:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Outside of measurements do you think a yun 200watt plate amp would also work?

Actually does this amp LR as well? Or are they just pass through?
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You could, however I wouldn't. This sub is only rated to take a max of 150 watts, so you take the chance of blowing it. But beyond that, you only gain about 1db more SPL with no gain on the response. So I am not sure I would waste the money getting more expensive amp. here is the graph showing the theoretical SPL of 100 watss vs 150 watts. 150 is in blue and 100 is green.

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post #21 of 29 Old 07-27-2017, 08:29 AM
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Awesome build... makes me think about building 2 of these for my loft setup due to their compact size to replace my single Outlaw LFM-1. Would allow for more flexible placement options, and help with room nulls. Additionally you could flush mounted the 3 sides with the drivers by using a second baffle, and then after adding a grill, have a good WAF factor as well....

Question:

Could you use something like a Crown XLS1000 to drive these? I know you dont need a ton of power, but I forget if you'd need a highpass of some sort (thats automatically built into the plate amp), since IIRC these act like a ported sub......

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I'll post a better graph once I fell the subwoofer is fully broken in.
Can you tell me how far away this measurement was taken.

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post #22 of 29 Old 07-27-2017, 08:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Can you tell me how far away this measurement was taken.
That would be really cool. I did this at normal mic placement of 1 meter. I am really pleased with it. I started with this in my theater room. I have since put this in my living room upstairs, connected to my custom soundbar, I just finished designing. I am working on a write up for that as well. I am really impressed with it for it's size. I especially like the clarity, small footprint and of course the price. I typically run the gain about 3/8 of the way.



Final resting spot, but I think it'll get a paint job to white. That is a chair next to it. It actually can fit right under it, if I wanted to place it there.

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post #23 of 29 Old 12-16-2017, 09:02 PM - Thread Starter
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I found this to be exciting. Someone built this sub and put a great veneer and stain on it. It looks great and he is really happy with it. Check it out.

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post #24 of 29 Old 12-17-2017, 09:22 PM
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Just a random question about passive radiators..

In a sealed multi-way speaker how does the midrange driver (if it's not in a separated chamber) know that it's a midrange driver and not a passive radiator for
the woofer? Is it because it's electrically connected?
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post #25 of 29 Old 12-17-2017, 10:27 PM - Thread Starter
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A passive radiator has no magnet or way to hook it up to any crossover, so it would not be seen the same way a mid-range would. In other words, there is nothing giving it a signal. The pressure inside the box along with the PR and weight tune a box. Having said that, a typical 3 way system, the midrange is in it's own sealed enclosure, so no reason to worry about that.
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post #26 of 29 Old 02-01-2018, 09:33 AM
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Thank You very much. What do you guess would happen if they were inside the same box? Do you think the midrange would somehow be forced by the woofer?

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post #27 of 29 Old 12-18-2018, 11:06 AM
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Hi Al Toid,

Thanks alot for sharing your build. I'm about to start building my first DIY subwoofer using your design.
The only part I'm wondering if if you used some type of filling, like Polyfill.

I'll make sure to post some pics when done

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post #28 of 29 Old 12-18-2018, 03:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4891ttt View Post
What do you guess would happen if they were inside the same box? Do you think the midrange would somehow be forced by the woofer?
Yes. The MR output would be modulated by the LFE pressure variations inside the box, causing distortion, and because of the much greater volume displacement of an LF driver compared to a MR, it may cause the MR driver to exceed it's excursion limits and be permanently damaged. They're in separate enclosures for a reason.


Edit; just noted the date of the post I'm replying to.

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post #29 of 29 Old 12-19-2018, 02:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Hi Al Toid,

Thanks alot for sharing your build. I'm about to start building my first DIY subwoofer using your design.
The only part I'm wondering if if you used some type of filling, like Polyfill.

I'll make sure to post some pics when done

Manuel
Manual, I tried it both with and without polyfill and didn't notice any appreciable difference. Honestly though Polyfill is only a few dollars at a big box store like Walmart, so it never hurts to put some in.
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