Toole interested to see DIYSG speaker measurements - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 17 Old 08-06-2017, 05:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Toole interested to see DIYSG speaker measurements

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/89-spe...l#post54593004

I don't know if anyone who designs DIYSG/DIY speakers has been following the thread so I posted it here for anyone interest in posting measurements in the thread. It would be interesting if a DIY speaker could get thrown into this "Speaker Shootout". It has been suggested in the thread and I just saw Toole commented on it today.
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post #2 of 17 Old 08-06-2017, 08:46 PM
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Thanks, just made a post. Really good to see him engaged and realistic about DIY capabilities unlike many manufacturers.
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post #3 of 17 Old 08-07-2017, 03:03 AM
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post #4 of 17 Old 08-07-2017, 05:17 AM
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Adding link to @mtg90 's HTM series thread here. First post has measurements

http://www.hificircuit.com/community...er-thread.609/

Edited :
There are few more from @bwaslo and others here, though in many cases the measurement images are no longer seen.
http://www.hificircuit.com/community...r-designs.564/


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post #5 of 17 Old 08-07-2017, 05:43 AM
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I could probably assemble one of the HTM-12's and ship it to him if he wanted to check it out. Some of the other kits might be a bit big for shipping a completed cabinet.

I likely have measurements for most of the other kits, but at some point along the way never got around to posting them or forgot. The website work is a lot to keep up with for just one person, which explains why it looks the way it does. I've been working on a new site for over a year.
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post #6 of 17 Old 08-07-2017, 11:28 AM
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Awesome!
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post #7 of 17 Old 08-07-2017, 11:33 AM
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@Erich H ,

Would it be at all possible to have FIR filters available for those wanting to run them active? Charge the same, and people can choose the passive crossover with parts, or to download the filter for the speaker.

I think it would be amazing for more people to experience the advantages of an active setup.

I appreciate all the work you guys do to help the community. Thank you.
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post #8 of 17 Old 08-07-2017, 12:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dbuudo07 View Post
@Erich H ,

Would it be at all possible to have FIR filters available for those wanting to run them active? Charge the same, and people can choose the passive crossover with parts, or to download the filter for the speaker.

I think it would be amazing for more people to experience the advantages of an active setup.

I appreciate all the work you guys do to help the community. Thank you.
I use to post active XO settings for people to use instead of the passive and NOBODY used them. People talk about active all the time but reality is passive is just so convenient.
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post #9 of 17 Old 08-07-2017, 02:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tuxedocivic View Post
I use to post active XO settings for people to use instead of the passive and NOBODY used them. People talk about active all the time but reality is passive is just so convenient.
I hear you. I just thought it would be great to have on the DIYSoundgroup page as an option. Might help a few people go down that path.
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post #10 of 17 Old 08-07-2017, 02:09 PM
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Nothing is stopping you from running active, just a bit more DIY
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post #11 of 17 Old 08-07-2017, 08:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tuxedocivic View Post
I use to post active XO settings for people to use instead of the passive and NOBODY used them. People talk about active all the time but reality is passive is just so convenient.

...and in most cases, particularly for first-timers, passive is likely to provide better performance (less chance of running into gain structure-based noise problems).


on the other hand, it might be kind of cool to have some recommended eq settings for avr's that have that or for folks running passive with external amps and an eq in between.


the upper-end yamaha avr's for example appear to offer several bands of peq per speaker. that is actually quite a bit of flexibility for fine tuning.

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post #12 of 17 Old 08-07-2017, 09:03 PM
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Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post
...and in most cases, particularly for first-timers, passive is likely to provide better performance (less chance of running into gain structure-based noise problems).
Yes, plug and play.... unless the end user has cobbled together one of their own passive crossover disasters using a generic recipe on the internet, without considering driver impedance, driver padding, baffle step effects, and on and on.

On the other hand, with today's powerful DSP amplifiers, it could be as easy as downloading "X" file, uploading to amplifier, making sure the outputs are going to the correct drivers, and ~ voila.
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post #13 of 17 Old 08-07-2017, 09:14 PM
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Originally Posted by michael hurd View Post
Yes, plug and play.... unless the end user has cobbled together one of their own passive crossover disasters using a generic recipe on the internet, without considering driver impedance, driver padding, baffle step effects, and on and on.

On the other hand, with today's powerful DSP amplifiers, it could be as easy as downloading "X" file, uploading to amplifier, making sure the outputs are going to the correct drivers, and ~ voila.

agree.


having some sort of file standard that manufacturers could provide their settings into and then which avr's could download and implement could be pretty spiff (but i wouldn't hold my breath waiting for that one!).
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post #14 of 17 Old 08-07-2017, 09:46 PM
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Right now I have a feeling active designs could turn into "I see you have active crossover files for X amp with dsp. I have Y amp with DSP can I get files for my amplifier as well". The problem is no one wants to use just one brand of amp/DSP and available options within DSP's differ between different manufacturers.

It's nearly as hard to put together an active design as it is a passive one, however it become much more work to do an active design for a half dozen different DSP's. I've also seen first hand how the same filter settings don't always produce the same result on different DSP's. So I wouldn't trust just copy and pasting the same active settings designed on one DSP to work equally well on different one without testing it first.

The only way I'd consider do active is if someone was to use a specific amp with DSP that the active design was developed and tested on. I have a Crown CDi1000 and I have considered doing active designs using that amp which will work on any of the other CDi as well as XTi and DSi amps, pretty sure they all share the same DSP. I just don't know if enough people would be interested in buying a specific amp to use with the active design. The draw with passive crossovers is that it doesn't matter what amp you have it's just plug and play.
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post #15 of 17 Old 08-07-2017, 10:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post
I could probably assemble one of the HTM-12's and ship it to him if he wanted to check it out. Some of the other kits might be a bit big for shipping a completed cabinet.

I likely have measurements for most of the other kits, but at some point along the way never got around to posting them or forgot. The website work is a lot to keep up with for just one person, which explains why it looks the way it does. I've been working on a new site for over a year.
I think that would be an awesome opportunity for you, Eric. Not that you're not busy enough.

I've attended Dr. Toole's lectures over the years. His influence on me is probably why I hounded you and Mark for off-axis measurements so much before I took the first step to DIYSG. You might learn something that will permit you to improve the design a bit somehow---maybe something in the crossover. We could all upgrade!
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post #16 of 17 Old 08-08-2017, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by mtg90 View Post
Right now I have a feeling active designs could turn into "I see you have active crossover files for X amp with dsp. I have Y amp with DSP can I get files for my amplifier as well". The problem is no one wants to use just one brand of amp/DSP and available options within DSP's differ between different manufacturers.

It's nearly as hard to put together an active design as it is a passive one, however it become much more work to do an active design for a half dozen different DSP's. I've also seen first hand how the same filter settings don't always produce the same result on different DSP's. So I wouldn't trust just copy and pasting the same active settings designed on one DSP to work equally well on different one without testing it first.

The only way I'd consider do active is if someone was to use a specific amp with DSP that the active design was developed and tested on. I have a Crown CDi1000 and I have considered doing active designs using that amp which will work on any of the other CDi as well as XTi and DSi amps, pretty sure they all share the same DSP. I just don't know if enough people would be interested in buying a specific amp to use with the active design. The draw with passive crossovers is that it doesn't matter what amp you have it's just plug and play.

True, but if one already had one of those amps or planned use one, it could be beneficial. It could also help one deciding which amp they go with.
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post #17 of 17 Old 08-11-2017, 11:15 AM
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I've been working on a new site for over a year.
don't worry you'll never catch Mark Seaton for the amount of time a new website has been in the oven.
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