DIY SI HT18D2 sealed dual opposed sonosubs. - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 224 Old 09-06-2017, 09:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by coolrda View Post
Those look far superior to the Sonotubes.
And heavier

I was looking for 10mm wall thickness(.039inch), but at the moment these 15 mm/0.59inch were the only available. When i knock on the sides on these, it is almost the same thud as when i knock on my Klipsch floorspeakers, Lool. So they are very solid. I got them cut to 1000mm length too, much more precise and fine cut than i would be able to do. They use kind of like a lathe to cut them.
I'll see if i can start cutting the various circles for the endplates next week

Thinking about what to cover the tubes with when they get done ......

PS: if you zoom in, you'll see it says Sonoco on these too, and they are pretty freshly produced too: 15 august

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post #32 of 224 Old 09-07-2017, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Nalleh View Post
My turn to DIY.

1. Would a push-pull design be any better?
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Originally Posted by coolrda View Post
@bossobass is the source that I copied. Everything you'd ever want to know about this design is available there. There really isn't a tune by slot loading the stack this way as its open all the way around, though you do get a FR change. But theres so many advantages to this design. If I had a big room I'd put one of these in each front corner. The aesthetics alone are desirable.

I've built several push/pulls and isobaric with this design with excellent results.
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Originally Posted by LTD02 View Post
having one driver magnet facing out will help reduce even order distortions, but most folks don't find that to be a big benefit.
Mark Seaton explained to me that push-pull only mitigates distortions attributed to asymmetries in movement (motor/cone moving in vs out) and will only reduce even-order distortion. Some drivers may benefit more than others in this alignment. I am planning to test push-pull vs standard DO between a pair of Funk 12" DOs. The amp is in a separate, vented compartment which allows it to be external without breaking the cabinet seal.

You will have to evaluate if PP is worth the added wiring complexity. Some driver motors can emit noise (air turbulence?) from the rear. Lastly, driver distortion may already be low enough to make any marginal reduction in distortion inaudible. I would ask Nick (Stereodynamic) and/or David Gage (dgage) for their opinion before attempting PP.

Knowing the complexity of your Atmos setup, I'm sure you could pull off the PP with ease. If the motor is quiet, I don't think it can hurt. I defer to the experts of course.
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post #33 of 224 Old 09-07-2017, 03:44 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
Mark Seaton explained to me that push-pull only mitigates distortions attributed to asymmetries in movement (motor/cone moving in vs out) and will only reduce even-order distortion. Some drivers may benefit more than others in this alignment. I am planning to test push-pull vs standard DO between a pair of Funk 12" DOs. The amp is in a separate, vented compartment which allows it to be external without breaking the cabinet seal.

You will have to evaluate if PP is worth the added wiring complexity. Some driver motors can emit noise (air turbulence?) from the rear. Lastly, driver distortion may already be low enough to make any marginal reduction in distortion inaudible. I would ask Nick (Stereodynamic) and/or David Gage (dgage) for their opinion before attempting PP.


Knowing the complexity of your Atmos setup, I'm sure you could pull off the PP with ease. If the motor is quiet, I don't think it can hurt. I defer to the experts of course.
Yes, that sums up what i have heard too. Some say that it sounds 'thinner' with PP, but it is actually than the sound is more 'pure'.
If it is noticable for all to hear, is another matter.
I will go the easiest route first, and then if i am not satisfied, i can experiment

EDIT: Another clue here is the endplates. As we know, a driver in a sealed box has different resistance when it moves in vs moving out, and by mounting endplates(or what it's called), the out movement of the cone is also given a resistance. And this can be 'tuned' by the height/free opening between cone and endplate.

I think ....

I have read Bossobass talked about this somewhere, but i can't find it again. Coolrda also mentions this.

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post #34 of 224 Old 09-09-2017, 02:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Some thoughts about the look of the cabs. Normal look is black/fabric like SVS:



I find it boring...

I have some movie posters left from when i made acoustic panels, so with a little work, something like this:



Or:



I have also ordered some 3D wood-wallpaper:



Kind of like the Blackbirds:



What do you think?
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post #35 of 224 Old 09-09-2017, 08:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalleh View Post
Some thoughts about the look of the cabs. Normal look is black/fabric like SVS:



I find it boring...

I have some movie posters left from when i made acoustic panels, so with a little work, something like this:



Or:



I have also ordered some 3D wood-wallpaper:



Kind of like the Blackbirds:



What do you think?
Has to be the Vader sub

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post #36 of 224 Old 09-10-2017, 01:18 AM - Thread Starter
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Has to be the Vader sub
Yeah, and Star wars themed, duals and copied/cloned from @coolrda and @bossobass , i could call them Attack Of The Clones
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post #37 of 224 Old 09-11-2017, 10:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalleh View Post
Some thoughts about the look of the cabs. Normal look is black/fabric like SVS:



I find it boring...

I have some movie posters left from when i made acoustic panels, so with a little work, something like this:



Or:



I have also ordered some 3D wood-wallpaper:



Kind of like the Blackbirds:



What do you think?
Never thought about using movie art. I second the Vader theme. I like it. I'm tired of the wood look for now. Paints and fabrics are in. I like the ostrich. The flocking idea looks cool.
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post #38 of 224 Old 09-12-2017, 05:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by coolrda View Post
Never thought about using movie art. I second the Vader theme. I like it. I'm tired of the wood look for now. Paints and fabrics are in. I like the ostrich. The flocking idea looks cool.
Who doesn't like Vader

I'm thinking i can do a two-in-one: i will use the wood wall paper, and then make the movie posters like a sock, that can be mounted over the cab, covering the wood. Like Deftech Supercube.

BTW: what is the opening between your end plates and the plate the driver is mounted on? In other words: how long is the feet of your cabs?
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post #39 of 224 Old 09-12-2017, 06:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Nalleh View Post
Who doesn't like Vader

I'm thinking i can do a two-in-one: i will use the wood wall paper, and then make the movie posters like a sock, that can be mounted over the cab, covering the wood. Like Deftech Supercube.

BTW: what is the opening between your end plates and the plate the driver is mounted on? In other words: how long is the feet of your cabs?
Four inches.
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post #40 of 224 Old 09-13-2017, 01:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Four inches.
Thanks, i will make it so

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post #41 of 224 Old 09-13-2017, 04:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Finally got a start today on the many circles needed, with two sheets of 3/4 inch MDF.
I made a REALLY simple circle jig, and it was not perfect, but i made it work
I broke a bit for the router after 4 inches, LOOL, so had to do a trip to the store and get a couple new ones. After that it went pretty easy.



So i got more than half of them cut today, will do the rest tomorrow.



After that there is more work, cutout for drivers, holes for the feets, connectors, sanding painting, etc, but the big circles is the most work, so i am happy i am well on the way with that.
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post #42 of 224 Old 09-14-2017, 02:19 PM - Thread Starter
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More progress.

Here is a pic of my super simple adjustable circle jig, mad from some part included with the router, and som aluminium piece.



Ok, so i am done with the circles, and started on the radiuses, around the egdes.



Nice stack.



Just some sanding left, and i can start painting and gluing.




Still waiting for the drivers, will hopefully be here in two weeks.

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post #43 of 224 Old 09-15-2017, 10:10 AM - Thread Starter
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After some sanding, it was time to glue it all together, first the two endplates.



I use expanding PU-glue, so i have to cut away the overrrun when it is dried.



And after it dried a little, gluing the endplates to the tubes. I taped some plastic over the tubes, so that hopefully the overrrun of glue doesn't get stuck on the tubes.



Got a good start on the bottom/top plates too.



Rest of the feets to the right.



Some more sanding, and then paint
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post #44 of 224 Old 09-16-2017, 01:06 PM - Thread Starter
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The cabs are pretty much done, wood wise. Glad i put the plastic over the tubes, as there was some work cleaning up after the glue dried. But all good now, and ready for som black paint.



All in all, the cabs themselves has been a easy job, compared to a normal square box. A bit timeconsuming with the router job, but still easy.

Top tip: use a vacuumcleaner for all the dust from the MDF sheets. It was so much cleaner to work, as the dust is almost nonexistent this way. And believe me MDF work is dusty !

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post #45 of 224 Old 09-17-2017, 09:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Here we go.




Found a ultra matte black paint. Still wet on pics.




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post #46 of 224 Old 09-19-2017, 08:22 AM - Thread Starter
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Almost forgot, i had to paint the feet to, so screwed them onto a board, wich made it easier to work with.




Some small things to button up, but running out of materials to finish them, like drivers, t-nuts, speakon connectors, wall paper, etc (all of it ordered though), so it's the waiting game a while forward now

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post #47 of 224 Old 09-20-2017, 07:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Amp choise !

I am considering a Behringer NU4-6000 or a EP4000.

The load will be 4 subs with 4ohms, so can be either 1x4ohm pr ch(NU4-6000) or 2x2ohm (EP4000).

Any recommendations? Wich one is best?


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post #48 of 224 Old 09-20-2017, 08:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Nalleh View Post
Amp choise !

I am considering a Behringer NU4-6000 or a EP4000.

The load will be 4 subs with 4ohms, so can be either 1x4ohm pr ch(NU4-6000) or 2x2ohm (EP4000).

Any recommendations? Wich one is best?


@coolrda @Scott Simonian
I'd go with the 6K or 2xEP4K's bridged into 8 ohm.
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post #49 of 224 Old 09-20-2017, 08:17 AM - Thread Starter
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I'd go with the 6K or 2xEP4K's bridged into 8 ohm.
The 6k can't do 2 ohm on each channel so i would have to either run them in series(8ohm), or get two 6k's.
That's why i said the NU4-6k, the 4-ch model.

Did you run 2 EP4K on the 4 drivers in your Fatmans?

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post #50 of 224 Old 09-20-2017, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Nalleh View Post
The 6k can't do 2 ohm on each channel so i would have to either run them in series(8ohm), or get two 6k's.
That's why i said the NU4-6k, the 4-ch model.

Did you run 2 EP4K on the 4 drivers in your Fatmans?
I meant 6k as in the 4ch version you listed. The Farman sound better with 2 amps into 8 ohm bridged vs 1 4 ohm bridged.
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post #51 of 224 Old 09-20-2017, 12:27 PM - Thread Starter
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I meant 6k as in the 4ch version you listed. The Farman sound better with 2 amps into 8 ohm bridged vs 1 4 ohm bridged.
Ok, got it
I think i have to start with one amp, or else i am tripping my breaker, i think
But the 'limit' for the driver is 600W RMS, correct?

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post #52 of 224 Old 09-28-2017, 10:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Got some more parts today: a Inuke6K, some speakon plugs, XLR cables and the wallpaper. Wallpaper looks very nice with a real strucutre to it and a matte finish. Will be cool to see it on the «barrels»

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post #53 of 224 Old 09-29-2017, 06:40 AM
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Where are you planning on attaching the speakon connector on the sub?

The neutrick connection I've always heard mentioned is THIS ONE because it it airtight. Also as a FYI, I suggest using 4 pole connectors (even if you only use 2), because they are IMHO better built.

I'm using these in my setup

Installed in both subs
Sub cable at the amp end
Sub cable on the sub end
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post #54 of 224 Old 09-29-2017, 07:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Nalleh View Post
Ok, got it
I think i have to start with one amp, or else i am tripping my breaker, i think
But the 'limit' for the driver is 600W RMS, correct?
I'm putting a 1000w to each of six mk1's at the present and its taken all of that and sounds much better. The 600watts is Xmech, not a thermal limit. While I got about 1db more [email protected](sub max out but never heard it bottom and it sounds clean), I get more above that.
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post #55 of 224 Old 09-29-2017, 12:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EndersShadow View Post
Where are you planning on attaching the speakon connector on the sub?

The neutrick connection I've always heard mentioned is THIS ONE because it it airtight. Also as a FYI, I suggest using 4 pole connectors (even if you only use 2), because they are IMHO better built.

I'm using these in my setup

Installed in both subs
Sub cable at the amp end
Sub cable on the sub end
Yes, i see now that i have them in my hand that they are not airtight, so i will look into it and see what can be done.
And these are all 4pole, so i should need only one plug/cable for each cab.

Quote:
Originally Posted by coolrda View Post
I'm putting a 1000w to each of six mk1's at the present and its taken all of that and sounds much better. The 600watts is Xmech, not a thermal limit. While I got about 1db more [email protected](sub max out but never heard it bottom and it sounds clean), I get more above that.
Got it. I am going to test with one and two Inuke6K, and see what i need for the volume level i use. I have two nukes now, so i just borrow the one from my Crowsons to find out.

Starting to get exited now, the drivers should be here early next week ! Can’t wait

Dual Atmos Receivers - Atmos 13.1.8/DTS X 9.1.8/Auro 3D 13.1 - Denon AVCX8500H+AVRX7200WA - Klipsch+KEF - 6xSI18" - 12xJBL 12" w/6xSLAPS M12 downfiring VNF - 3x2 stacked Crowson MA - 4xBK-LFE - 6xNU6K(fan&trig mod) - Minidsp 10x10HD - Oppo UDP203 - XBox OneX - Apple TV4K - JVC RS600 Dreamscreen V2 120"- Philips 65OLED873.
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post #56 of 224 Old 09-29-2017, 01:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalleh View Post
Yes, i see now that i have them in my hand that they are not airtight, so i will look into it and see what can be done.
And these are all 4pole, so i should need only one plug/cable for each cab.
Lot of hot glue around the seal should help if you cant source the one I linked to for a decent price (since your in Norway).
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post #57 of 224 Old 09-29-2017, 03:12 PM
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Coming along nicely.
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post #58 of 224 Old 09-30-2017, 04:36 AM - Thread Starter
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Lot of hot glue around the seal should help if you cant source the one I linked to for a decent price (since your in Norway).
Yes, that’s what i thought too. We’ll see. I’ll make it work

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Coming along nicely.
Thanks Fun to be doing some DIY again

Got the wallpaper on today. I have not laid wallpaper, ever before !, so it is not perfect, and in good lighting you can see the « spiraling» of the sonotubes, but i expected that, and in the darker corners they are ment to be, they are perfect

Let the glueing begin.



One done.



One more to go.



Voila, «The Barrels Of Destruction».



They really have a cool finish with this old wood look.



Tried a panorama somewhat where they will be.



And a mock-up with the endplates on.



Maybe not for everyone, but different, for sure
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post #59 of 224 Old 09-30-2017, 10:26 AM
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They look quite awesome.....

Another thought.... if at a later date you get "bored" you could always slice em in half and run them like figure 8's stacked on top each other front firing....
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post #60 of 224 Old 09-30-2017, 12:15 PM
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