Build new box for subs, or change it up? - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 11 Old 10-26-2018, 06:24 AM - Thread Starter
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Build new box for subs, or change it up?

Well now that I have finally finished my 21" sub in the front of the room I really want to do something with the back of the room. Just to bring you all up to speed, I originally had 4 Infinity 1262's in ported (iClOps) boxes being powered by an iNuke 3000 DSP. I had them set up with two in the front of my room and two in the back of my room. I then acquired a 21" driver and another NU3000 DSP, so I built a massive box for that which is in the front of my room now. That moved all 4 of the infinity's to the back of the room, which looks like this



That is clearly not gonna fly so I need to do something. Originally I was planning on building one big ass box that would match the parameters of the 4 boxes I have now. I had LTD02 come up with something since he had designed the original boxes that worked so well. What I found when I first finished the 21" box was that it was GREAT at very low frequency, but rolled off pretty quick over 50hz. What I ended up doing was EQing the front 21 to cover the low end, and the four 12s to carry it out to 100hz. This was the final result with all subs running.



Knowing that the 12's are not really needed to dig way down, has got me thinking about options. First off I want as much room behind the bar as possible. The current boxes are 16" deep, plus a couple inches for the connectors. I would like to get them 12" or less from the wall. That is doable with a ported box, but makes it very big otherwise. Seems like if I go sealed I would be able to make the box much smaller. I am just not 100% if that would be the best way to go.

I was also wondering if I should look at new subs instead. Some things to keep in mind about possible replacements.

1. There are only 2 connections in the back of the room, and no way to add more.
2. I would like to keep my NU3000DSP to power whatever I end up since I already have it.
3. Max dimensions to work with are 90" long, 41" tall, 12" deep (21.24 cubic feet). If I absolutely had to I can push those somewhat, but that is ideal for max.

So do I build the ported box that LTD02 came up with that matches the performance of the current boxes?
Do I build these subs into a sealed box?
Do I get new drivers and build a box for them?

Lets hear what all you maniacs think!

Thanks,
Sean
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post #2 of 11 Old 10-26-2018, 06:28 AM - Thread Starter
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BTW, here are the sweeps of the subs alone.

Here is the front by itself after EQ


And here are the rears by themselves after EQ


Thought that may be helpful

Sean
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post #3 of 11 Old 10-28-2018, 10:49 AM - Thread Starter
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post #4 of 11 Old 10-28-2018, 11:26 AM
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First thing is to figure out if the levels you have now are adequate. If they are, and you prefer not to lose a single dB, you’ll have to go with ported boxes again for the 12’s. If you’re ok with giving up a handful of dBs, you could build them sealed and be done. If you wish you had more output overall than what you have now, maybe buying new subs for the rear is the way to go.
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post #5 of 11 Old 10-28-2018, 11:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Broke EF View Post
Man, so many responses. Where to begin!


Sean

If you have to keep the infinity drivers, then you could consider a sealed box, or one with a bit less volume as all 4 with enough port area, you could move the tuning up some.



Another option is to buy other drivers that have smaller box volume requirements, and you could sell off those drivers and enclosures to someone else.

Ask your doctor if DIY is right for you. Side effects of DIY may include anxiety, elevated blood pressure, lightheadedness, rapid heartbeat, skeletal muscle flaccidity, euphoria, psychological dependence, insomnia, confusion, blurred vision, implusivity, uncontrolled or repeated movements.
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post #6 of 11 Old 10-28-2018, 11:38 AM
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More pictures of the 12s and 21 please.
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post #7 of 11 Old 10-28-2018, 05:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dtsdig View Post
First thing is to figure out if the levels you have now are adequate. If they are, and you prefer not to lose a single dB, you’ll have to go with ported boxes again for the 12’s. If you’re ok with giving up a handful of dBs, you could build them sealed and be done. If you wish you had more output overall than what you have now, maybe buying new subs for the rear is the way to go.
I think its pretty well balanced right now. Its fun to crank it up sometimes, but I already have plenty of headroom. Right now to be at reference each amp is only about half way up. So I think I should be able to match the current output with sealed boxes? The other thing I am thinking is because I don't need then to dig so low I am not as concerned with the roll off compared to ported.

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Originally Posted by michael hurd View Post
If you have to keep the infinity drivers, then you could consider a sealed box, or one with a bit less volume as all 4 with enough port area, you could move the tuning up some.



Another option is to buy other drivers that have smaller box volume requirements, and you could sell off those drivers and enclosures to someone else.
I had considered changing the port tune a bit which helps get the box dimensions reigned in somewhat.

If different drivers seem to be the way to go, what would be some good options?

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Originally Posted by Craig S King View Post
More pictures of the 12s and 21 please.
Ask and you shall receive! We will start with the 21"












And now the 12's














Here are some pics from my room yesterday to help give you an idea of what I am working with for space.







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post #8 of 11 Old 10-28-2018, 06:24 PM
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I would either keep the 12s or upgrade to 4 pa 460 driver. They would work with your inuke 3k and have more output than the 12s. You could tune them a little bit higher and they should work decently well in 12" deep 21cf box. Worst case scenario you could get 3 pa460 and run them as 3 or 6 ohm load on the amp
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post #9 of 11 Old 10-29-2018, 06:55 AM
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Do all your boxes have the same tuning frequency?

If it was me, I'd keep the 12's you have now but build new MBM boxes tuned to a max of 35 - 40hz, which IIRC means only about 2.5cf per driver (about 1/2 what your current boxes are). They can be in a box that is only 8" deep, so thats what I'd do, and I'd scale up the height and width to match, but put all 4 in one large box. You could section each driver into its own part, or do all as one. Thats my thought.

Alternately, the CS1214/CS1200 is still a popular driver and has been selling in the 30 dollar range still for a bit. If you do SEALED then you could buy a MESS of those and put them in a large sealed box (like 8 or more drivers) and just stick that at the back, then sell the Infinities (they are selling for about 50-60 bucks a pop plus shipping online IIRC).

Or do the obviously and just stick the Infinities in a sealed box.

If you DONT do either of those, I'd look at the PA 15 or 18's in sealed boxes, and do 3-4 of em. That I think would get you the midbass you like/want and still keep the depth smaller than what you have. The PA drivers do well in sealed boxes and would provide more cone surface area and likely hit the F3 you need.

IIRC the i-clops is 18x18x36 or something like that. I think all of these options could be put in boxes that are 10" or less in depth assuming you front fire the drivers. The 12's have the smaller mounting depth, with the CS1214 having only a 6 1/16th mounting depth, compared to the 6 3/8th of the Infinities.
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post #10 of 11 Old 10-29-2018, 07:16 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EndersShadow View Post
Do all your boxes have the same tuning frequency?

If it was me, I'd keep the 12's you have now but build new MBM boxes tuned to a max of 35 - 40hz, which IIRC means only about 2.5cf per driver (about 1/2 what your current boxes are). They can be in a box that is only 8" deep, so thats what I'd do, and I'd scale up the height and width to match, but put all 4 in one large box. You could section each driver into its own part, or do all as one. Thats my thought.

Alternately, the CS1214/CS1200 is still a popular driver and has been selling in the 30 dollar range still for a bit. If you do SEALED then you could buy a MESS of those and put them in a large sealed box (like 8 or more drivers) and just stick that at the back, then sell the Infinities (they are selling for about 50-60 bucks a pop plus shipping online IIRC).

Or do the obviously and just stick the Infinities in a sealed box.

If you DONT do either of those, I'd look at the PA 15 or 18's in sealed boxes, and do 3-4 of em. That I think would get you the midbass you like/want and still keep the depth smaller than what you have. The PA drivers do well in sealed boxes and would provide more cone surface area and likely hit the F3 you need.

IIRC the i-clops is 18x18x36 or something like that. I think all of these options could be put in boxes that are 10" or less in depth assuming you front fire the drivers. The 12's have the smaller mounting depth, with the CS1214 having only a 6 1/16th mounting depth, compared to the 6 3/8th of the Infinities.
You bring up a good point, well a few good points actually, about them front firing. To be honest, I would rather not actually front fire the infinity's since they look meh. Besides that, my OCD cant handle them...



I really like the look of the PA drivers a lot. My brother in law has a pair of them in full Marty boxes, and they look (and sound) fantastic! The downside to replacing drivers is just the cost. I am trying to stay focused on getting my car built, which means its taking all of my money.

I wonder if I should build a new ported box with a higher tune for now, and upgrade to some RS S390 HO's later. Looks like I am going to have to play around in WINISD later today.


Sean
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post #11 of 11 Old 10-29-2018, 09:45 AM
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Build new box for subs, or change it up?

You could always cover them with a grill if they look ugly lol......

If your trying to save space, ANY driver you choose will need to be front firing otherwise your gonna need at least the same depth you have now, saving you nothing.

What about building boxes like Mike did for his rear section only then put the bar top ON it! I think someone in Chicago did that with a VBSS style build.

Also the VBSS box would be a option for you as they have a 35hz tune option.... reconfigure the dimensions accordingly.....

VBSS Build - Wide & Shallow
https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?sha...6&share_type=t

This same thing could be done with your infinities (ported or sealed) so they fire into your rear row of seats like Mikes.

Then you don’t need to care if you think the driver is ugly, it’s hidden....


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Last edited by EndersShadow; 10-29-2018 at 09:53 AM.
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