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post #181 of 239 Old 03-29-2019, 08:50 AM
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GSG Audio Design - DIY/AIY for the broadest audio community

Quote:
Originally Posted by asarose247 View Post
@Nexgen76



the current home of GSG, about 20 minutes from me . .



gotta give that team major props



I've made a few semi-manageable boxes but . . .



welcome to the 21st century



sweet


Whats that tuned for?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

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post #182 of 239 Old 03-29-2019, 10:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asarose247 View Post
@Nexgen76

the current home of GSG, about 20 minutes from me . .

gotta give that team major props

I've made a few semi-manageable boxes but . . .

welcome to the 21st century

sweet

I have to say, I am a bit jealous

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post #183 of 239 Old 04-05-2019, 12:37 PM
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I have finished the first of my GSG Full Martys! Its quite impressive!!!!

Details here:

GSG Full Marty Build: https://youtu.be/-U1deD_0j9c
UM18-22 Sealed Subwoofer Build: https://youtu.be/7ifac8Rh8gk
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post #184 of 239 Old 04-05-2019, 01:31 PM
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DUDE!

TY for the time and effort and ability for such a thorough and high quality production.

"Its quite impressive!!!!" (sic)
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post #185 of 239 Old 04-05-2019, 01:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nexus99 View Post
I have finished the first of my GSG Full Martys! Its quite impressive!!!!

Details here: https://youtu.be/-U1deD_0j9c
In your video you said for the speak on connector you wired +1 and +2 are you connected to a bridged amp? If not wouldn't it be just +1 and -1? Great video and the finished product came out looking great. Waiting on my kits to arrive hopefully they come out as well as yours did. What is your impression of how they sound?

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post #186 of 239 Old 04-05-2019, 02:08 PM
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I've has the pleasure of hearing the 3 full Marty's that @kevings and I built for him . .
and he did the right thing wrt REW, EQ, etc.

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post #187 of 239 Old 04-05-2019, 06:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by csmithny06 View Post
In your video you said for the speak on connector you wired +1 and +2 are you connected to a bridged amp? If not wouldn't it be just +1 and -1?
Correct, if bridging you would wire +1 and +2 at the amp end. Otherwise +1 -1 on that same end. The other connections remain the same.
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post #188 of 239 Old 04-07-2019, 07:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by csmithny06 View Post
In your video you said for the speak on connector you wired +1 and +2 are you connected to a bridged amp? If not wouldn't it be just +1 and -1? Great video and the finished product came out looking great. Waiting on my kits to arrive hopefully they come out as well as yours did. What is your impression of how they sound?
Hi,

It absolutely is +1 and -1. I will drop a comment in the video to make sure that is corrected. Thanks for the catch.

GSG Full Marty Build: https://youtu.be/-U1deD_0j9c
UM18-22 Sealed Subwoofer Build: https://youtu.be/7ifac8Rh8gk

Last edited by nexus99; 04-07-2019 at 08:03 PM.
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post #189 of 239 Old 04-17-2019, 03:38 AM
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new 21" Home Theater Flat Packs tune to 19Hz: https://shop.gsgad.com/collections/2...ter-flat-packs

also it looks like they will also have a taller version that will be tune slightly lower as well. That should be awesome.

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post #190 of 239 Old 04-17-2019, 06:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by femi View Post
new 21" Home Theater Flat Packs tune to 19Hz: https://shop.gsgad.com/collections/2...ter-flat-packs

also it looks like they will also have a taller version that will be tune slightly lower as well. That should be awesome.

Femi

Nice catch, you beat the site banner
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post #191 of 239 Old 04-17-2019, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by femi View Post
new 21" Home Theater Flat Packs tune to 19Hz: https://shop.gsgad.com/collections/2...ter-flat-packs

also it looks like they will also have a taller version that will be tune slightly lower as well. That should be awesome.

Femi
Hmmm....wonder how tall? I can go up to 35". Been waiting for a partner to share a 4 pack of boxes to Missouri....might be a long wait.
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post #192 of 239 Old 04-17-2019, 11:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by femi View Post
new 21" Home Theater Flat Packs tune to 19Hz: https://shop.gsgad.com/collections/2...ter-flat-packs

also it looks like they will also have a taller version that will be tune slightly lower as well. That should be awesome.

Femi
I just noticed that last night also. I look forward to seeing what they come up with in terms of the taller box. Lucky for me, I'm still in the planning phase and can make changes, so I may end up getting one.... or two... or four...
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post #193 of 239 Old 04-17-2019, 12:12 PM
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Hmmm....wonder how tall? I can go up to 35". Been waiting for a partner to share a 4 pack of boxes to Missouri....might be a long wait.
If I wasn't expecting a baby in november, I'd be game on a split.

Project "lets see how much she really loves me" got postponed thanks to a little blue line on a stick.
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If I wasn't expecting a baby in november, I'd be game on a split.

Project "lets see how much she really loves me" got postponed thanks to a little blue line on a stick.
If you're going to let something little like a baby getting in the way then I don't think we can be partners anyway!. JK...Congrats on the new addition! First?
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post #195 of 239 Old 04-17-2019, 02:00 PM
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If I wasn't expecting a baby in november, I'd be game on a split.

Project "lets see how much she really loves me" got postponed thanks to a little blue line on a stick.
Congrats on the baby!!
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If you're going to let something little like a baby getting in the way then I don't think we can be partners anyway!. JK...Congrats on the new addition! First?
My second, 3rd for my wife (the father of her first passed away back in 2011). Our son is autistic though, so a new baby is going to require some serious re-working of the house.

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Congrats on the baby!!
Thanks!
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https://shop.gsgad.com/collections/subwoofer-drivers

This page has is most of my favorite pro drivers all in one place. I wonder if they are going to get the new Lavoce subs when they come out? They looked pretty good when I sim'd them earlier


http://www.lavocespeakers.com/category-template/?id=2

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post #198 of 239 Old 05-23-2019, 09:12 PM
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Hmmm....wonder how tall? I can go up to 35". Been waiting for a partner to share a 4 pack of boxes to Missouri....might be a long wait.
I’m in Creve Coeur and just ordered a pair of Minis. Just placed the order yesterday, so probably not too late to have Kevin rework the shipping.
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post #199 of 239 Old 05-24-2019, 04:08 AM
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I’m in Creve Coeur and just ordered a pair of Minis. Just placed the order yesterday, so probably not too late to have Kevin rework the shipping.
Hey I;m interested. I've decided on a pair of 21" HT flatpacks. I can text Kevin and see what can be done. Do you have a loading dock in your area? I'll PM you too. Thanks.
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Yeah, more DIY suppliers.
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post #201 of 239 Old 05-25-2019, 10:49 AM
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Still looking for a split in MO, Eastern OK. NW ARK. SE Kansas.
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Hey GSG Audio Design...spill the goods on the new 'taller' 21" cube...do we have dimensions yet?






''''''''''''''''''''

EDIT>>>>>>>The new cab is 28.25 wide x 42 tall x 23.5 deep according to an email exchange with Kevin. Should be on the site before too long. I think I'm going with the 32" version....42" just makes life harder for placement in my room.

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Hey GSG Audio Design...spill the goods on the new 'taller' 21" cube...do we have dimensions yet?






''''''''''''''''''''
Word. a Marty+ for a 21" is what I've been waiting for.
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post #204 of 239 Old 06-16-2019, 09:01 AM
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Hey GSG Audio Design...spill the goods on the new 'taller' 21" cube...do we have dimensions yet?






''''''''''''''''''''
https://shop.gsgad.com/pages/contact-us

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post #205 of 239 Old 06-16-2019, 10:42 AM
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Ya....I started there. The site does say they will post dimension and design once testing was completed so I might just have to wait it out.
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post #206 of 239 Old 07-01-2019, 12:24 PM - Thread Starter
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GSG Audio Design - DIY/AIY for the broadest audio community

@rhyvun bought a 4 pack of these Full Marty flatpacks. He's built one.



He'd like to do a sanity check on the expected capability for a single. On data-bass what type of system should one of these full marty flatpacks be comparable to?

https://data-bass.com/#/systems?_k=lojfx2



He's got a UM18-22 driver and one channel of an NX6000D amplifier.



I went over to hear it today over lunch - and the driver was moving like I'd expect a UM18-22 to move under full bore, but it wasn't as loud as I expected. I suspect something is still off with his setup, maybe his source input, maybe some sort of loudness mode engaged to limit dynamics, but we ran out of time to troubleshoot. He showed me his NX6000D settings, they looked correct. The amp input and output levels were looking good on the NX6000D. He's running subwoofer 1 output of his Denon x3400h AVR to channel A input and output. He's wired up his subwoofer correctly based on his description to me. I know the sensitivity on the UM18-22 isn't terribly high, so that might be playing into my initial expectation. It sounded great, just wasn't as loud in his room as we both expected. I didn't have my calibrated mic with me - - if I did, I'd make short work of this question myself to verify we were in the right ballpark on output - - but looking for confirmation that we should we be looking at about 115dB+ on a single full marty as a peak output at say 30hz range with a properly running setup.

By the way - fantastic job on the CNC cut boards, numbered for assembly and perfect fit. Michael was showing me how easily everything went together. Hats off to the designers!!! I was super impressed with the ease of assembling the cabinets!

Here's my buddy Michael standing next to the first unit he completed this weekend in his living room temp test setup.

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Last edited by Archaea; 07-01-2019 at 12:51 PM.
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post #207 of 239 Old 07-01-2019, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
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He'd like to do a sanity check on the expected capability for a single. On data-bass what type of system should one of these full marty flatpacks be comparable to?
https://data-bass.com/#/systems?_k=lojfx2

He's got a UM18-22 driver and one channel of an NX6000D amplifier.

I went over to hear it today over lunch - and the driver was moving like I'd expect a UM18-22 to move under full bore, but it wasn't as loud as I expected. I suspect something is still off with his setup
Not to step on GSG's toes or anything, but I'll toss in my $0.02. I think you picked up on some of the potential places to look, but you may have missed the biggest one - room acoustics & placement

Once a subwoofer leaves 'free air' (or it goes from the model to being built & measured in practical circumstances), it really can't be compared apples to apples. Room acoustics & placement play a huge part in subwoofer performance. In your lower frequencies, wavelengths start to approach the size of your room in various dimensions, and can completely nullify sound at specific frequencies. It's not even an apples to oranges comparison... Think of the model as being the 'ability' of the system, where as your specific application dictates the actual performance. Imagine having a 300hp car with a flat torque curve; just because you push the pedal down half way doesn't mean that the car will always accelerate at the same rate... there are a lot of factors at play such as the gearing, elevation changes, pedal mapping, etc

You are at the point where a UMIK & REW would come in handy. It becomes very difficult to gauge performance with your ears when it is over a frequency range. Also, if you can, just try moving the sub around. You may have dramatically different results, as when moving that subwoofer, you are effectively altering what frequencies are constructive & deconstructive at various points around the room.

EDIT: To add in the above, I believe that data-bass only shoes a UM18 in a sealed box. I don't remember seeing any ported enclosures with a UM18
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post #208 of 239 Old 07-01-2019, 12:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Understood,

which is why I walked all around through the room, and through the kitchen behind the room, and through the entry room to the side. We played about 15 minutes of demo clips, movies and music, and while I was walking around I didn't hear hotspotting, or big nulls/modes at least to the ear. I have an omnimic, but this was just a unplanned quick and dirty showing he offered to get my opinion. I'll go back later and measure and see exactly what we are dealing with. I'd also like to go over his source equipment settings with a fine toothed comb. Some sort of LFC or night mode may be engaged possibly too on the player or the AVR.



This isn't it's final resting place. He just threw it in the living room to turn it on for a first go and see what she would do before installing it in the theater room. He asked me to swing by because he felt a little underwhelmed with the output. Again it sounded really good, and I think Michael's anticipation of how loud it was realistically going to be was perhaps exaggerated over what is fair and realistic for a single driver -- yet at the same time, I too walked away slightly baffled by the seemingly low output levels — especially based on the NX6000D showing input and output levels nearing clipping point, and the driver excursion levels visually hitting about like I'd expect. This at the couch, the cabinet, or walking around the room.



I have no experience with the NX6000D amps, but I'm assuming they should be very similar to my iNuke DSP 6000 amps that I have plenty of experience with.



I also have eight, UM18-22 in sealed boxes, and am plenty used to crazy capable bass systems, so I'll admit that without my calibrated mic, it's just a simple subjective impression that holds no real weight. I told Michael I could bring my mic back tomorrow or wednesday and get some objective data.



When I went over he had the subwoofer channel trim at +10

I turned that down to 0 (told him it really should be -3 or less ideally), and then kept turning the input attenuator knob up on channel A of the amplifier (seeking more SPL output) until it was absolutely maxed out, and while the DSP software showed it was uniformly nearly clipping/occasionally flashing red -- it just didn't subjectively seem that loud. Luckily he has 4 of the cabinets. -- three more to build.



More objective testing at his place is needed to shore this up...

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(13) JBL CBT 70j-1 | Denon x7200wa | Sherbourn PA 7-350 amplifier | (8) Ultimax 18" sealed subwoofers | (4) iNuke DSP 6000 amplifiers | (4) MB Quart 12" subwoofers mounted direct mounted to Berkline theater chairs BOSS style | Epson 5040UB Projector | Jamestown 144" acoustic transparent 2.35:1 screen w/ Seymour XD fabric

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post #209 of 239 Old 07-01-2019, 02:07 PM
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Quote:
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Word. a Marty+ for a 21" is what I've been waiting for.
The new cab is 28.25 wide x 42 tall x 23.5 deep according to an email exchange with Kevin. Should be on the site before too long. I think I'm going with the 32" version....42" just makes life harder for placement in my room.
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post #210 of 239 Old 07-03-2019, 05:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Archaea View Post
More objective testing at his place is needed to shore this up...
Yeah, that sounds more like an AVR type issue to me. I'd turn that gain up as you did, rerun the room correction from scratch until it sets the trim in the negatives, and see how it goes.

I originally ran my Yamaha AVR with the gain knob pretty low on a single full marty, and it put the trim up pretty high. I attempted to correct it (exactly as you did) for a quick idea, but it caused some strange issues... Rerunning YPAO from scratch with the gain in a more 'appropriate' spot (based off guess and check, apparently) cleared up my issues 100%.

Modern AVRs are fussy beasts. I swear you need a PhD in forum surfing to understand how to fix any issues with their room correction process. I am an EE and they still confuse me when I'm trying to clear up an issue.


If you are still concerned that there may be something wrong with the sub, you could always do a sweep and check that the tuning frequency is correct based off a few factors... never a bad sanity check. I'm not so sure how you could troubleshoot a bad driver - I'm sure somebody will have some good input there.
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