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post #1141 of 1175 Old 02-13-2020, 10:32 PM
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How does the 2x4 bracing around the perimeter compare to braces that span the middle of the cabinet? I don't imagine that any panel with a 2x4 glued to it is going to flex, and it's easier to cut up lengths of 2x4s. Are the acoustics affected by placement of the bracing?

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post #1142 of 1175 Old 02-14-2020, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Llamas View Post
How does the 2x4 bracing around the perimeter compare to braces that span the middle of the cabinet? I don't imagine that any panel with a 2x4 glued to it is going to flex, and it's easier to cut up lengths of 2x4s. Are the acoustics affected by placement of the bracing?

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If you span the middle of the cabinet at the top half.... you can't get the driver in the box. The acoustics are not affected at all by bracing. New developments have shown that adding a pillow will kill the upper end resonances of the box which is a good thing.



Juju

Sub List: 1- Red Five Mini Devastator 18" w/460HO, 1- Red Five Devastator LFE 21", 1- BOSS platform [The Hideaway Theater], 1- 21" "Marty" tuned to 20Hz, 1- 18" "Marty" tuned to 17Hz
Wish List: Anthology http://www.speakerdesignworks.com/Anthology_1.html

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post #1143 of 1175 Old 02-14-2020, 10:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jujuman200 View Post
If you span the middle of the cabinet at the top half.... you can't get the driver in the box. The acoustics are not affected at all by bracing. New developments have shown that adding a pillow will kill the upper end resonances of the box which is a good thing.
I've seen another design that has bracing across the middle just under the speaker installation path, which is what made me curious.

The pillow reminds me, what kind of fill or lining is used in subs? Or does that only apply to speakers operating in higher frequency ranges?

Thanks for making me less dumb.
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post #1144 of 1175 Old 02-14-2020, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Llamas View Post
I've seen another design that has bracing across the middle just under the speaker installation path, which is what made me curious.

The pillow reminds me, what kind of fill or lining is used in subs? Or does that only apply to speakers operating in higher frequency ranges?

Thanks for making me less dumb.
Not all subs/speakers need lining of any kind....As to what to use..... could be pillows, denim insulation, fiberglass insulation or mattress toppers. It doesn't really matter which you choose, they all work about the same.... the difference is not enough to loose sleep over.


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Sub List: 1- Red Five Mini Devastator 18" w/460HO, 1- Red Five Devastator LFE 21", 1- BOSS platform [The Hideaway Theater], 1- 21" "Marty" tuned to 20Hz, 1- 18" "Marty" tuned to 17Hz
Wish List: Anthology http://www.speakerdesignworks.com/Anthology_1.html

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post #1145 of 1175 Old 02-17-2020, 08:48 PM
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@Red Five , @a77cj7 , have you noticed about the Devs (V1 since that's what I have) that you can't localize them at all????? I have mine 56" away from MLP on back corners and with 100 CrossOver, I can't localize them even if I try my best. . They are very safe to use 100 CO.

I have played with 80 vs 100 CO. Done a lot of time alignment using REW to make sure I get very smooth crossover b/w Mains and subs. Here is the interesting part. 80Hz crossover yields better FR as compared to 100Hz but mannn 100Hz crossover pounds like crazy. These subs can produce so clean and heart hitting bass that 100Hz is just so much fun to listen to. I wonder if it has to do with my subs only 56" away from me and with 100hz cross over, I get to feel more sensation (particle velocity)??? I don't know what it is but OMG, these subs with 100Hz kick some serious as*.

I have been using them for a few months now and still can't get enough of them.
FYI: I'm using JBL 4772N as min Mains. These speakers have 2 15" drivers and I still like Devs better than them. I do confess though that FR for my main b/w 50-400Hz have room modes where as Devs have much better FR since they are specifically placed to get good FR b/w 20-100Hz. So may be not a 100% apple to apple comparison but you get these Devs placed properly and get them play nicely with mains and you'r all set .

I do wonder what other subs like JTR Caps or Rythmik FV25HP would sound like compared to DEV???
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post #1146 of 1175 Old 02-17-2020, 09:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harrisu View Post
@Red Five , @a77cj7 , have you noticed about the Devs (V1 since that's what I have) that you can't localize them at all????? I have mine 56" away from MLP on back corners and with 100 CrossOver, I can't localize them even if I try my best. . They are very safe to use 100 CO.

I have played with 80 vs 100 CO. Done a lot of time alignment using REW to make sure I get very smooth crossover b/w Mains and subs. Here is the interesting part. 80Hz crossover yields better FR as compared to 100Hz but mannn 100Hz crossover pounds like crazy. These subs can produce so clean and heart hitting bass that 100Hz is just so much fun to listen to. I wonder if it has to do with my subs only 56" away from me and with 100hz cross over, I get to feel more sensation (particle velocity)??? I don't know what it is but OMG, these subs with 100Hz kick some serious as*.

I have been using them for a few months now and still can't get enough of them.
FYI: I'm using JBL 4772N as min Mains. These speakers have 2 15" drivers and I still like Devs better than them. I do confess though that FR for my main b/w 50-400Hz have room modes where as Devs have much better FR since they are specifically placed to get good FR b/w 20-100Hz. So may be not a 100% apple to apple comparison but you get these Devs placed properly and get them play nicely with mains and you'r all set .

I do wonder what other subs like JTR Caps or Rythmik FV25HP would sound like compared to DEV???


have you noticed about the Devs (V1 since that's what I have) that you can't localize them at all?????
Yes..... ALL of the Devs have that quality to them.... I have a 16Hz LFE 6ft from me... you would not know it unless you looked around...

I get to feel more sensation (particle velocity)??? I don't know what it is but OMG
Yes... your distance from the port plays a part....


If you have not been up on the latest haps..... OPEN your V1 hatch and place one cheap bed pillow [may need 2. experiment] inside AWAY from the port opening, secure it in place, keep airflow clear to the port then recheck your gasket, seal it up..... You are welcome...... enjoy..


Juju

Sub List: 1- Red Five Mini Devastator 18" w/460HO, 1- Red Five Devastator LFE 21", 1- BOSS platform [The Hideaway Theater], 1- 21" "Marty" tuned to 20Hz, 1- 18" "Marty" tuned to 17Hz
Wish List: Anthology http://www.speakerdesignworks.com/Anthology_1.html


Last edited by jujuman200; 02-17-2020 at 09:33 PM.
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post #1147 of 1175 Old 02-17-2020, 09:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jujuman200 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Five View Post
I feel like there should be an LFE challenge, can you crawl inside, seal it back up and then come out alive after playing through Bass I Love You [IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif[/IMG]
You MIGHT live... but, there WILL be a mess inside.....[IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif[/IMG][IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/eek.gif[/IMG]


Juju


It cant be that bad. Have you watched any of the car audio videos on YouTube? These guys are sitting just infront of 4th or 6th order BP enclosures with 4 to 8 18" to 21" woofers and 5 to 10kw woofer. Don't get me wrong the air gets squeezed out of your lungs past 155db but you will survive no questions about it. Some people do it for fun.


https://youtu.be/Pye19dyYmOk
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post #1148 of 1175 Old 02-17-2020, 10:04 PM
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Originally Posted by harrisu View Post
@Red Five , @a77cj7 , have you noticed about the Devs (V1 since that's what I have) that you can't localize them at all????? I have mine 56" away from MLP on back corners and with 100 CrossOver, I can't localize them even if I try my best. . They are very safe to use 100 CO.

I have played with 80 vs 100 CO. Done a lot of time alignment using REW to make sure I get very smooth crossover b/w Mains and subs. Here is the interesting part. 80Hz crossover yields better FR as compared to 100Hz but mannn 100Hz crossover pounds like crazy. These subs can produce so clean and heart hitting bass that 100Hz is just so much fun to listen to. I wonder if it has to do with my subs only 56" away from me and with 100hz cross over, I get to feel more sensation (particle velocity)??? I don't know what it is but OMG, these subs with 100Hz kick some serious as*.

I have been using them for a few months now and still can't get enough of them.
FYI: I'm using JBL 4772N as min Mains. These speakers have 2 15" drivers and I still like Devs better than them. I do confess though that FR for my main b/w 50-400Hz have room modes where as Devs have much better FR since they are specifically placed to get good FR b/w 20-100Hz. So may be not a 100% apple to apple comparison but you get these Devs placed properly and get them play nicely with mains and you'r all set .

I do wonder what other subs like JTR Caps or Rythmik FV25HP would sound like compared to DEV???
I've the same set up and concur the feeling on adding DEV's to my setup too. For some reason JBL 4722's weren't cutting midbass well in my space, but ever since devs added the mid bass is something one should only hear it. They bring life to every thing, I feel like going back watching everything again.
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post #1149 of 1175 Old 02-17-2020, 10:09 PM
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My Devs are V1 version with Lavoce SAN 21" and I really enjoy them. I'm pleased to retain them for myself and no regrets for losing some extra space in the front.
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post #1150 of 1175 Old 02-17-2020, 10:29 PM
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Originally Posted by harrisu View Post
@Red Five , @a77cj7 , have you noticed about the Devs (V1 since that's what I have) that you can't localize them at all????? I have mine 56" away from MLP on back corners and with 100 CrossOver, I can't localize them even if I try my best. . They are very safe to use 100 CO.



I have played with 80 vs 100 CO. Done a lot of time alignment using REW to make sure I get very smooth crossover b/w Mains and subs. Here is the interesting part. 80Hz crossover yields better FR as compared to 100Hz but mannn 100Hz crossover pounds like crazy. These subs can produce so clean and heart hitting bass that 100Hz is just so much fun to listen to. I wonder if it has to do with my subs only 56" away from me and with 100hz cross over, I get to feel more sensation (particle velocity)??? I don't know what it is but OMG, these subs with 100Hz kick some serious as*.



I have been using them for a few months now and still can't get enough of them.

FYI: I'm using JBL 4772N as min Mains. These speakers have 2 15" drivers and I still like Devs better than them. I do confess though that FR for my main b/w 50-400Hz have room modes where as Devs have much better FR since they are specifically placed to get good FR b/w 20-100Hz. So may be not a 100% apple to apple comparison but you get these Devs placed properly and get them play nicely with mains and you'r all set .



I do wonder what other subs like JTR Caps or Rythmik FV25HP would sound like compared to DEV???


I haven’t played much with localization, since my mini’s are between my mains up front.

Location seems to vary heavily from person to person. 80hz is a good safe bet. There are people that claim to get it at 60hz, others are fine at 120hz.

If it works great for you at 100, I wouldn’t question it, just enjoy it.

I do love the sound signature of my devs.

Chris
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post #1151 of 1175 Old 02-18-2020, 07:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by harrisu View Post
@Red Five , @a77cj7 , have you noticed about the Devs (V1 since that's what I have) that you can't localize them at all????? I have mine 56" away from MLP on back corners and with 100 CrossOver, I can't localize them even if I try my best. . They are very safe to use 100 CO.

I have played with 80 vs 100 CO. Done a lot of time alignment using REW to make sure I get very smooth crossover b/w Mains and subs. Here is the interesting part. 80Hz crossover yields better FR as compared to 100Hz but mannn 100Hz crossover pounds like crazy. These subs can produce so clean and heart hitting bass that 100Hz is just so much fun to listen to. I wonder if it has to do with my subs only 56" away from me and with 100hz cross over, I get to feel more sensation (particle velocity)??? I don't know what it is but OMG, these subs with 100Hz kick some serious as*.

I have been using them for a few months now and still can't get enough of them.
FYI: I'm using JBL 4772N as min Mains. These speakers have 2 15" drivers and I still like Devs better than them. I do confess though that FR for my main b/w 50-400Hz have room modes where as Devs have much better FR since they are specifically placed to get good FR b/w 20-100Hz. So may be not a 100% apple to apple comparison but you get these Devs placed properly and get them play nicely with mains and you'r all set .

I do wonder what other subs like JTR Caps or Rythmik FV25HP would sound like compared to DEV???

It would mostly depend on the location of speakers and Devs. I was running my front xover at 100Hz initially and switched to 80Hz later. My mains are wide at 30 degrees out from center, the sound stage feels larger with the 80Hz xover. I would agree about not being able to localize them much at all even at 100Hz. First subs that I can stand with a higher than 40Hz xover on the center channel

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post #1152 of 1175 Old 02-18-2020, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by jujuman200 View Post
If you have not been up on the latest haps..... OPEN your V1 hatch and place one cheap bed pillow [may need 2. experiment] inside AWAY from the port opening, secure it in place, keep airflow clear to the port then recheck your gasket, seal it up..... You are welcome...... enjoy..


Juju

Hmmm. Last time I checked Quad thread, I remember something was being tested with pillows. At that time I think it was still in trail and error mode. Seems like it worked out well. Thx for bringing to my attention. What difference did you get from it and was it easily noticeable? Also, when you put the hatch back, do you use same screw locations and put the screws back right in?
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post #1153 of 1175 Old 02-18-2020, 11:39 AM
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It would mostly depend on the location of speakers and Devs. I was running my front xover at 100Hz initially and switched to 80Hz later. My mains are wide at 30 degrees out from center, the sound stage feels larger with the 80Hz xover. I would agree about not being able to localize them much at all even at 100Hz. First subs that I can stand with a higher than 40Hz xover on the center channel
In my case on suspended floor, when I use 100Hz, I start getting TR even on small drum beat. TR + Clean Bas = great chest slam. I don't like 100Hz being too hot though. The curve I use for sub has 100hz 2.6dB hot only. 80 Goes to 3.5dB and 50hz to 6dB and 30-20hz goes to 8dB hot.
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post #1154 of 1175 Old 02-18-2020, 11:49 AM
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I've the same set up and concur the feeling on adding DEV's to my setup too. For some reason JBL 4722's weren't cutting midbass well in my space, but ever since devs added the mid bass is something one should only hear it. They bring life to every thing, I feel like going back watching everything again.
I think 4722N are very capable speakers. The only they won't pound on midbass is most likely the room modes. Its the same in my case. I have room modes swinging 10dB +/- b/w 70-600Hz for L/C/R and therefore the speakers can't really provide clean punch. But if the room modes are corrected, they can do some good damage. In my case thought, having subs close with 100hz gives very good TR as well. So its a win win for me to run them @ 100hz.
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post #1155 of 1175 Old 02-18-2020, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Randy_J View Post
It cant be that bad. Have you watched any of the car audio videos on YouTube? These guys are sitting just infront of 4th or 6th order BP enclosures with 4 to 8 18" to 21" woofers and 5 to 10kw woofer. Don't get me wrong the air gets squeezed out of your lungs past 155db but you will survive no questions about it. Some people do it for fun.
I figured it would be more of a brown-note scenario.
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post #1156 of 1175 Old 02-18-2020, 01:38 PM
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[snip]..... What difference did you get from it and was it easily noticeable? Also, when you put the hatch back, do you use same screw locations and put the screws back right in?
The thing that the pillow(s) do is to take the very slight ringing sound out of the box. Now, is it a night and day difference? NOPE, but a noticeable one if you are looking for it. Instruments like the acoustic bass seem to be the most revealing of this.


IMHO, the music sounds more realistic and less like it's being reproduced by electronics.


Yes, use the same screw holes as before but, MAKE SURE that your gasket is good. The smallest air leak WILL hurt performance.


Juju
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Sub List: 1- Red Five Mini Devastator 18" w/460HO, 1- Red Five Devastator LFE 21", 1- BOSS platform [The Hideaway Theater], 1- 21" "Marty" tuned to 20Hz, 1- 18" "Marty" tuned to 17Hz
Wish List: Anthology http://www.speakerdesignworks.com/Anthology_1.html

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post #1157 of 1175 Old 02-23-2020, 01:29 AM
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@Red Five
Hello again,
I have finally built my 2 devastators LFE's and my FP20000Q from Simbossen has just arrived. These things are absolute beasts. I do have some follow up questions though. My devastators are with B&C 21SW115 4ohm drivers. And I was wondering what limiter I should set on them in my amp. It has voltage limiter and knowing my resistance I can calculate power limiter (P=V^2/R). But my amplifier manual provides Vpeak and Vrms limiter options. they are as follows:
Vpeak Vrms
195 138
170 121
140 99
116 82
100 71
80 57
66 47
54 38

If I calculate correctly 116V peak option is the max allowed for this driver because the power limit becomes 3364W Peak, 1681W RMS. Is that correct or I am misguided on something? How much power can these drivers handle in this enclosure. Thanks a lot.
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post #1158 of 1175 Old 02-23-2020, 05:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Vilius Abeciūnas View Post
@Red Five

Hello again,

I have finally built my 2 devastators LFE's and my FP20000Q from Simbossen has just arrived. These things are absolute beasts. I do have some follow up questions though. My devastators are with B&C 21SW115 4ohm drivers. And I was wondering what limiter I should set on them in my amp. It has voltage limiter and knowing my resistance I can calculate power limiter (P=V^2/R). But my amplifier manual provides Vpeak and Vrms limiter options. they are as follows:

Vpeak Vrms

195 138

170 121

140 99

116 82

100 71

80 57

66 47

54 38



If I calculate correctly 116V peak option is the max allowed for this driver because the power limit becomes 3364W Peak, 1681W RMS. Is that correct or I am misguided on something? How much power can these drivers handle in this enclosure. Thanks a lot.
I will take a look at it when I'm on HR next. I would guess 2000 watts would be close to where the sub is running out of excursion. That is what I remember for the 21DS115, the SW might have a little more excursion left, but velocity would probably be a limiting factor at that point. What tune are you running on the LFE? @jujuman200 loves them at 16Hz, they are just another level of animal with that tune

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post #1159 of 1175 Old 02-23-2020, 07:02 AM
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I will take a look at it when I'm on HR next. I would guess 2000 watts would be close to where the sub is running out of excursion. That is what I remember for the 21DS115, the SW might have a little more excursion left, but velocity would probably be a limiting factor at that point. What tune are you running on the LFE? @jujuman200 loves them at 16Hz, they are just another level of animal with that tune
I am running it with the 16hz tune. Thanks. My question mainly is should i limit peak or rms to 2000 watts? Because the BC manufacturer page says it handles 1700RMS and 3400 Program in free air.
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post #1160 of 1175 Old 02-23-2020, 11:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vilius Abeciūnas View Post
@Red Five
Hello again,
I have finally built my 2 devastators LFE's and my FP20000Q from Simbossen has just arrived. These things are absolute beasts.
Hey Vilius Abeciūnas welcome to the LFE club. So far, we are the only 2 members....LOL.

A recent tweak has developed which I don't know if you are aware of. Placing 2 cheap bed pillows inside kills the high end ringing the box has at high volume. I just stacked mine one on top of the other on the port board under the driver and attached them to the side.... works great.



Juju

Sub List: 1- Red Five Mini Devastator 18" w/460HO, 1- Red Five Devastator LFE 21", 1- BOSS platform [The Hideaway Theater], 1- 21" "Marty" tuned to 20Hz, 1- 18" "Marty" tuned to 17Hz
Wish List: Anthology http://www.speakerdesignworks.com/Anthology_1.html

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post #1161 of 1175 Old 02-23-2020, 11:54 AM
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Hey Vilius Abeciūnas welcome to the LFE club. So far, we are the only 2 members....LOL.

A recent tweak has developed which I don't know if you are aware of. Placing 2 cheap bed pillows inside kills the high end ringing the box has at high volume. I just stacked mine one on top of the other on the port board under the driver and attached them to the side.... works great.



Juju
Is this just for the LFE or all DEV variants?

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post #1162 of 1175 Old 02-23-2020, 12:09 PM
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Is this just for the LFE or all DEV variants?
All, but the smaller ones may only need 1 pillow....


Juju
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Sub List: 1- Red Five Mini Devastator 18" w/460HO, 1- Red Five Devastator LFE 21", 1- BOSS platform [The Hideaway Theater], 1- 21" "Marty" tuned to 20Hz, 1- 18" "Marty" tuned to 17Hz
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post #1163 of 1175 Old 02-23-2020, 01:13 PM
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Originally Posted by jujuman200 View Post
All, but the smaller ones may only need 1 pillow....


Juju
Good too know, ordered two of the GSG kits to use with NSW’s. I’ll give it a shot.
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post #1164 of 1175 Old 02-23-2020, 02:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Vilius Abeciūnas View Post
I am running it with the 16hz tune. Thanks. My question mainly is should i limit peak or rms to 2000 watts? Because the BC manufacturer page says it handles 1700RMS and 3400 Program in free air.
I would limit peak. I am not entirely sure of the frequency used on the random pink noise for the power handling rating. If you threw something in the mid teens at 3400 watts the sub might come out alive, then again it might not. Distortion will be getting ugly around 20mm of excursion maybe a mm of two more. I would set the peak limiter to 2/3 gap power estimate and run a steep HPF just to play it safe. Anything beyond or even at 2/3 gap is most likely pushing 10% THD or more. What those numbers are exactly will depend on what HR looks like. The two LFEs have the potential if in good room locations to make you tap out or something in the room tap out before they get to 1000 watts.
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Stormbreaker | WI HT Meet Thread | The Devastator Index | Mini Devastator Build
You can always turn it down, but you can only turn it up so much (before you run out of power, excursion or structural integrity).
7.2.4 | A3070 | XLS 1502 | 3000DSP | 2x Aphex 124A | 2x Bic EV15 | 7x Bic FH6 LCR | 2x Bic FH65-B | Epson 5010e | 120" DIY AT Screen | 2x Mini Devastators

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post #1165 of 1175 Old 02-23-2020, 05:19 PM
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[snip].... The two LFEs have the potential if in good room locations to make you tap out or something in the room tap out before they get to 1000 watts.
ABSOLUTELY TRUE...... way before 1000 watts....


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Sub List: 1- Red Five Mini Devastator 18" w/460HO, 1- Red Five Devastator LFE 21", 1- BOSS platform [The Hideaway Theater], 1- 21" "Marty" tuned to 20Hz, 1- 18" "Marty" tuned to 17Hz
Wish List: Anthology http://www.speakerdesignworks.com/Anthology_1.html

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post #1166 of 1175 Old 02-23-2020, 05:45 PM
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I have 8 pa460's and a nx6000d laying around. Thinking about 4 mini devastators up front. Or are there other options I should look at?

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post #1167 of 1175 Old 02-23-2020, 06:25 PM - Thread Starter
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I have 8 pa460's and a nx6000d laying around. Thinking about 4 mini devastators up front. Or are there other options I should look at?

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Any of the Mini 18" variants would be good for that. The 460 will not push too much air so port plugging V1s Minis or V2 Minis would make sense, the extension is worth it!
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You can always turn it down, but you can only turn it up so much (before you run out of power, excursion or structural integrity).
7.2.4 | A3070 | XLS 1502 | 3000DSP | 2x Aphex 124A | 2x Bic EV15 | 7x Bic FH6 LCR | 2x Bic FH65-B | Epson 5010e | 120" DIY AT Screen | 2x Mini Devastators
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post #1168 of 1175 Old 02-24-2020, 08:00 AM - Thread Starter
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@Red Five
Hello again,
I have finally built my 2 devastators LFE's and my FP20000Q from Simbossen has just arrived. These things are absolute beasts. I do have some follow up questions though. My devastators are with B&C 21SW115 4ohm drivers. And I was wondering what limiter I should set on them in my amp. It has voltage limiter and knowing my resistance I can calculate power limiter (P=V^2/R). But my amplifier manual provides Vpeak and Vrms limiter options. they are as follows:
Vpeak Vrms
195 138
170 121
140 99
116 82
100 71
80 57
66 47
54 38

If I calculate correctly 116V peak option is the max allowed for this driver because the power limit becomes 3364W Peak, 1681W RMS. Is that correct or I am misguided on something? How much power can these drivers handle in this enclosure. Thanks a lot.

2000 watts would be a little beyond 2/3 gap running a 19Hz 2nd order (12db an octave) HPF. 2/3 gap looks to be 20.67mm from the spec sheet. 2000 watts is pushing 21.5mm of excursion based on the simulation. I also redid the math on the LFE, I think the tune will come out closer to 15Hz than 16Hz. 1900 watts would be a little less stress on the woofer for a peak limiter, that would be 82.7 volts into 3.6 Ohms.





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You can always turn it down, but you can only turn it up so much (before you run out of power, excursion or structural integrity).
7.2.4 | A3070 | XLS 1502 | 3000DSP | 2x Aphex 124A | 2x Bic EV15 | 7x Bic FH6 LCR | 2x Bic FH65-B | Epson 5010e | 120" DIY AT Screen | 2x Mini Devastators
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post #1169 of 1175 Old 02-24-2020, 09:40 AM
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2000 watts would be a little beyond 2/3 gap running a 19Hz 2nd order (12db an octave) HPF. 2/3 gap looks to be 20.67mm from the spec sheet. 2000 watts is pushing 21.5mm of excursion based on the simulation. I also redid the math on the LFE, I think the tune will come out closer to 15Hz than 16Hz. 1900 watts would be a little less stress on the woofer for a peak limiter, that would be 82.7 volts into 3.6 Ohms.
Thanks for the calculation. I will limit the sub to 82volt peak. Do not want to be annoying but I have one more question - what crossover slope should i set on my MiniDSP 2x4HD? I see you calculated with 12dB octave slope, wouldn't increasing it protect the subs more? Because now I have it on 17Hz BW 30dB slope. These are my in room responses:
Green line - Raw response without any filters.
Purple line - 30dB BW slope on 16hz (increased it to 17hz later on), no PEQ
Cyan line - 24dB BW slope on 16hz, no PEQ

Is this a good in-room response? And should i change my crossover to 19hz 12dB? Thanks.
Also I am thinking about lining it with polyfill instead of adding pillows, would that be any more beneficial? Or I shouldn't bother and just throw in a couple of Ikea pillows in each box?

PS. these things are absolute monsters, the mini martys do not compare at all. I would recommend these LFE boxes to anyone I know.
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post #1170 of 1175 Old 02-24-2020, 09:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Vilius Abeciūnas View Post
Thanks for the calculation. I will limit the sub to 82volt peak. Do not want to be annoying but I have one more question - what crossover slope should i set on my MiniDSP 2x4HD? I see you calculated with 12dB octave slope, wouldn't increasing it protect the subs more? Because now I have it on 17Hz BW 30dB slope. These are my in room responses:
Green line - Raw response without any filters.
Purple line - 30dB BW slope on 16hz (increased it to 17hz later on), no PEQ
Cyan line - 24dB BW slope on 16hz, no PEQ

Is this a good in-room response? And should i change my crossover to 19hz 12dB? Thanks.
Also I am thinking about lining it with polyfill instead of adding pillows, would that be any more beneficial? Or I shouldn't bother and just throw in a couple of Ikea pillows in each box?

PS. these things are absolute monsters, the mini martys do not compare at all. I would recommend these LFE boxes to anyone I know.

When I set the HPF slope I went for a 2nd order that keeps the excursion even over and under the tune pretty equal. This also keeps velocity down to 24m/s too as another bonus. High order filters get the excursion too hot over and under the tune with 82 volts. If you tried pushing that much voltage you would end up around 25mm of excursion. The 2nd order filter still protects the subs, it just starts the roll off sooner to keep too much signal from pushing things too far. In this case it helps protect the woofer above the tune since the woofer also wants to move in the mid to upper 20s and the 2nd order slope will start rolling off in that region. The LFE is still cranking 100db at 10.8Hz with this second order filter, that is a big time beast of a sub.



The wavelengths are so long at these frequencies, they only get obstructed and bounce off very large areas. Full range speakers would benefit from the detail padding, the subs do not require as much detail. The pillows just absorb the energy creating the standing waves in the box. Staple a couple pillows on the side panels of the LFE and you should be all set.
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You can always turn it down, but you can only turn it up so much (before you run out of power, excursion or structural integrity).
7.2.4 | A3070 | XLS 1502 | 3000DSP | 2x Aphex 124A | 2x Bic EV15 | 7x Bic FH6 LCR | 2x Bic FH65-B | Epson 5010e | 120" DIY AT Screen | 2x Mini Devastators
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