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post #91 of 286 Old 01-29-2019, 08:41 AM
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It works for me.
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post #92 of 286 Old 01-29-2019, 09:30 AM
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It works for me.
The homepage, as in if I google DIYSG and click the link, does not work, but if I choose a link to the 99s for example, I can get to the page, and navigate from there.
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post #93 of 286 Old 01-29-2019, 09:31 AM
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Theater speakers are typically crossed to subs in the home where a music speaker can dig deeper on its own, usually not good enough for the bass in a movie. Of course there are exceptions.

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post #94 of 286 Old 01-29-2019, 02:00 PM
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The idea is to bring back the Fusion name/line with new speakers designed to have a more full range response making them better for mixed use then the HTM's which are more strictly HT oriented and meant to be used with subs.

Last I heard the Alchemy's will be brought back but I am not sure what line they will fit into.
While I am happy to hear the fusions will live on, I am sad to hear it will be in a new format. I was REALLY wanted to build 2 more fusion 10s at tax time to have 5x fusions as my main 5 channels.

Now I'll have to look at either the Volts, or maybe doing 1099s for the left and right speakers and moving 2 of the fusions to the side surrounds.

Last edited by STL D; 01-29-2019 at 02:11 PM.
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post #95 of 286 Old 01-29-2019, 02:05 PM
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While I am happy to hear the fusions will live on, I am sad to hear it will be in a new format. I was REALLY wanted to build 2 more fusion 10s at tax time to have 5x fusions as my main 5 channels.

Now I'll have to look at either the Volts, or maybe doing 1099s for the left and right speakers.
I wanted to build a pair of Fusion 10s also. I'd like to see SEOS/CDs/xover schematics available so we can build some of the older designs and source the rest of the parts from PE.
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post #96 of 286 Old 01-29-2019, 02:50 PM
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I wanted to build a pair of Fusion 10s also. I'd like to see SEOS/CDs/xover schematics available so we can build some of the older designs and source the rest of the parts from PE.
I absolutely love the 3 fusion 10s I already have, I'd just like 2 more of them.
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post #97 of 286 Old 01-29-2019, 03:23 PM
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I'm in a similar situation. Have fusion 8's for l/r and the fusion 8 center. I was hoping to round it out with cinema 8's or fusion towers to match the sensitivity of the center. I'd settle for the plain jane 8's just to have all matching drivers all the way around.

Also I squared off the center and veneered it in cherry but the l/r are black with roundovers and I want them to match.
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post #98 of 286 Old 01-29-2019, 03:36 PM
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I absolutely love the 3 fusion 10s I already have, I'd just like 2 more of them.
Considering you already own the Fusion 10, you already have the crossover so just duplicate it.

Erich sells the SEOS 10 waveguide and PE sells the Eminence Delta 10 used in the Fusion 10.

https://www.diysoundgroup.com/speake...waveguide.html

You can even get the Fusion 10 flatpack....

https://www.diysoundgroup.com/denovo...flat-pack.html

The only thing left is the DNA205 B&C compression driver, it is used in the 1099 so maybe Erich can hook you up with a pair of them.

Now Tux, the designer of the Fusion 10, 1099 and others loves the SEOS 10 crossed at 1,300 Hz to the B&C DE250--the same compression driver used in the 88 Special. Now that would be an interesting design, sort of a Fusion 10+. Drop the crossover point from 1,450Hz to 1,300Hz and use the DE250 with the SEOS 10. The DE250 (DNA360) is not inexpensive but does provide the love with the 88 Special. It is also available from PE and many other vendors so no supply line hassles.

I'd contact Erich about the F10 flatpacks (if desired) the SEOS 10 and DNA205 compression driver availability and roll your own. Won't hurt to ask--good luck!
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post #99 of 286 Old 01-29-2019, 03:50 PM
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Some of the kits that had been around for 6-7 years just rarely got built any more. I think in all of 2018 there were 4-6 Fusion-10/12's shipped. The minimum order for me from Parts Express is sets of 10 which at that rate would sit here for a couple years.

But I could count up the remaining flat packs on the Fusion-10 and order another 10 kits from PE if needed.
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post #100 of 286 Old 01-29-2019, 06:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Erich H View Post
Some of the kits that had been around for 6-7 years just rarely got built any more. I think in all of 2018 there were 4-6 Fusion-10/12's shipped. The minimum order for me from Parts Express is sets of 10 which at that rate would sit here for a couple years.

But I could count up the remaining flat packs on the Fusion-10 and order another 10 kits from PE if needed.
Hi Eric
Are Htm6 going to be available in near future? its not on site anymore .
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post #101 of 286 Old 01-29-2019, 07:07 PM
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@Rcris

Read my review of HTM6's at the site.

After more break-in, and good toe in, and taller speaker stands

for most stereo and non -ATMOS specific content . .they can easily "upstage" most "up-mixing", DSU, Neo:X, Audi DSX. and some other available "sound fields"

they do a center fill very well

could be worth the wait

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post #102 of 286 Old 01-29-2019, 07:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Erich H View Post
Some of the kits that had been around for 6-7 years just rarely got built any more. I think in all of 2018 there were 4-6 Fusion-10/12's shipped. The minimum order for me from Parts Express is sets of 10 which at that rate would sit here for a couple years.

But I could count up the remaining flat packs on the Fusion-10 and order another 10 kits from PE if needed.
I'm in for 2 now, with or without flatpacks, with or without Delta 10a's. I don't mind ordering any of the Parts Express stuff myself. I definitely don't want you stuck with half kits or left over parts that you can't sell/use.

I don't even need the roundovers on the baffle.

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post #103 of 286 Old 01-29-2019, 10:22 PM
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Still down? I just logged on to my account yesterday. And just now: https://www.diysoundgroup.com/
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post #104 of 286 Old 01-30-2019, 05:27 AM
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Hi Eric
Are Htm6 going to be available in near future? its not on site anymore .
+1. Wouldn't mind getting my hands on a pair.
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post #105 of 286 Old 01-30-2019, 05:48 AM
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Still down? I just logged on to my account yesterday. And just now: https://www.diysoundgroup.com/
Try starting with this page.

https://www.diysoundgroup.com/home-t...-monitors.html
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post #106 of 286 Old 01-30-2019, 07:16 AM
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I was able to upload photos of the buyout 15" last night and the site seems to be working okay. I tried clearing all the cache folders just now so maybe that will get everything back to normal.
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post #107 of 286 Old 01-30-2019, 02:03 PM
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I was able to upload photos of the buyout 15" last night and the site seems to be working okay. I tried clearing all the cache folders just now so maybe that will get everything back to normal.
Not yet fixed...still says unavailable if i try just the site's "home" page address. https://www.diysoundgroup.com/

I can get in if I use the address of a specific item though. Once in, if i click your upper left logo(home page) it will come up unavailable again.

I'm using chrome btw.

Also, I seen the pics of the 15" sub...it's construction(frame, mag, cone,etc) looks like the "Lab" 15.
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post #108 of 286 Old 01-30-2019, 02:52 PM
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@Erich H , I’ll commit to 4 HTM-6’s with flat packs if you can’t do another run. With the commitments above looks like at least 10 just in this thread?

SPEAKERS: 3 x DIYSG 1099's LCR; DIYSG HTM 6's and 8's surround; 4 x RSL C34E Atmos; 4 x UM18-22 Mini Marty's.
COMPONENTS: Denon X4400; Minidsp 2x4 HD; 2 x Jensen Iso Sub 2RX; 2 x NX6000d; Epson 5040UB.
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post #109 of 286 Old 01-30-2019, 03:06 PM
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It's similar to the Lab15 but was a custom model made for another company with a few other changes. I think the main reason they're buyouts is because they weren't supposed to get the shiny finish that Eminence puts on the Lab15 cone, but they realized that after some were already made up. They said another difference was a bolted on back plate (?), or maybe more bolts used, I'll have to double check the email to be sure.

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post #110 of 286 Old 01-30-2019, 05:12 PM
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just to clarify: Is the Fusion-8 and/or the HTM-6 going to be added back to the site?
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post #111 of 286 Old 01-30-2019, 08:06 PM
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I lost last weekend from the site going down and couldn't do much. The Fusion-8's and center will be going back up.

HTM-6: The designer and I talked about the cheaper version of that speaker (HT-6). It would use a 6" Celestion and the same compression driver as the rest of the HT models. That would make them significantly cheaper than the neo magnet 6" Eminence and overkill compression driver used in the current HTM-6. I also wondered if we should just make it fit in an angled enclosure for surrounds. We're just not sure because the HTM-6 rarely got built and we don't really know why. Too expensive? Too tall? No angled surround? Not sure.

While debating the HT-6 we wondered if more people would be interested in bringing back the Fusion-6 MT and MTM instead of the HTM-6 or HT-6???

Basically we've come to a point where we're not exactly sure what people want. Unfortunately the more kits that get done as a shot in the dark and don't break even on cost, the more money is taken away from other projects that people might want. Fusion-4, Fusion-6, HTM-6, Marksman, Ares, Marksman Pro, Maximus-12, Magnum-12, Titan-615, Cinema-10, 893, Concentric-8, Continuum, Beta Vee, and some others never broke even on cost.

Having said that, I know we need to get some smaller kits done. There were plans to redo the Fusion-8's with a new woofer and the SEOS-8 back in late 2017. That's why I didn't get more flat packs cut for the originals. As many of you know the designer (Jeff) had some big health issues and got a kidney transplant so it wasn't done in 2018. Another speaker designer could have reworked the kit, but I didn't feel like that was the right thing to do.

Curt and I thought the 8" Cobalt MT and MTM's would do good and people would consider them as an alternative because there were many people asking for a high sensitivity dome tweeter speaker kit. MT, MTM, center channel, and a matching angled surround were done. 100 flat packs for each of those....excited to get them on the site.......I think only 10 kits total have been built in one year. Break even point: maybe 25 years at the current rate.

That's why we're all kind of cautious and debate what new models to do or which originals should be revamped. But I don't like to just sit and stagnate either. So there will be more small, big, and crazy kits done either way.

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post #112 of 286 Old 01-31-2019, 12:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Erich H View Post
I lost last weekend from the site going down and couldn't do much. The Fusion-8's and center will be going back up.

HTM-6: The designer and I talked about the cheaper version of that speaker (HT-6). It would use a 6" Celestion and the same compression driver as the rest of the HT models. That would make them significantly cheaper than the neo magnet 6" Eminence and overkill compression driver used in the current HTM-6. I also wondered if we should just make it fit in an angled enclosure for surrounds. We're just not sure because the HTM-6 rarely got built and we don't really know why. Too expensive? Too tall? No angled surround? Not sure.

While debating the HT-6 we wondered if more people would be interested in bringing back the Fusion-6 MT and MTM instead of the HTM-6 or HT-6???

Basically we've come to a point where we're not exactly sure what people want. Unfortunately the more kits that get done as a shot in the dark and don't break even on cost, the more money is taken away from other projects that people might want. Fusion-4, Fusion-6, HTM-6, Marksman, Ares, Marksman Pro, Maximus-12, Magnum-12, Titan-615, Cinema-10, 893, Concentric-8, Continuum, Beta Vee, and some others never broke even on cost.

Having said that, I know we need to get some smaller kits done. There were plans to redo the Fusion-8's with a new woofer and the SEOS-8 back in late 2017. That's why I didn't get more flat packs cut for the originals. As many of you know the designer (Jeff) had some big health issues and got a kidney transplant so it wasn't done in 2018. Another speaker designer could have reworked the kit, but I didn't feel like that was the right thing to do.

Curt and I thought the 8" Cobalt MT and MTM's would do good and people would consider them as an alternative because there were many people asking for a high sensitivity dome tweeter speaker kit. MT, MTM, center channel, and a matching angled surround were done. 100 flat packs for each of those....excited to get them on the site.......I think only 10 kits total have been built in one year. Break even point: maybe 25 years at the current rate.

That's why we're all kind of cautious and debate what new models to do or which originals should be revamped. But I don't like to just sit and stagnate either. So there will be more small, big, and crazy kits done either way.
recently got some of your htm-12s for front 3 duty and absolutely love them, they sound amazing on just my avr power (x6400h) i do wonder now what you might recommend for surround duty on my sides and rears my room is only 12ft wide but i do have a bit of room behind me to the wall where the rears would be (6.5ft to 8ft) wondering which of either new offerings or old you would recommend initially i planned on picking up 4 of the htm-6s but i noticed they are gone
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post #113 of 286 Old 01-31-2019, 02:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Not yet fixed...still says unavailable if i try just the site's "home" page address. https://www.diysoundgroup.com/
Clear your cache. The site's back up.
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post #114 of 286 Old 01-31-2019, 03:26 AM
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, Cinema-10, 893, ...
That is interesting as both of those designs looked to be really amazing.


I guess one of the problems with having so many designs is what do people pick? They see one design with more sensitivity than another one and thing "well duh, that one" but its hard to state which would be better than the other and for what.
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post #115 of 286 Old 01-31-2019, 03:52 AM
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recently got some of your htm-12s for front 3 duty and absolutely love them, they sound amazing on just my avr power (x6400h) i do wonder now what you might recommend for surround duty on my sides and rears my room is only 12ft wide but i do have a bit of room behind me to the wall where the rears would be (6.5ft to 8ft) wondering which of either new offerings or old you would recommend initially i planned on picking up 4 of the htm-6s but i noticed they are gone
Erich H may suggest something different so I don't want to step on his toes, but I recently built HTM-12's for front duty and Erich suggested Volt-6's for surrounds. It was a good suggestion, they sound great and I really like them. He may have something new on the horizon in mind though. But if you wanted something right now, the Volts will keep up with the HTMs for surround duty.
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post #116 of 286 Old 01-31-2019, 05:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Erich H View Post
I lost last weekend from the site going down and couldn't do much. The Fusion-8's and center will be going back up.

HTM-6: The designer and I talked about the cheaper version of that speaker (HT-6). It would use a 6" Celestion and the same compression driver as the rest of the HT models. That would make them significantly cheaper than the neo magnet 6" Eminence and overkill compression driver used in the current HTM-6. I also wondered if we should just make it fit in an angled enclosure for surrounds. We're just not sure because the HTM-6 rarely got built and we don't really know why. Too expensive? Too tall? No angled surround? Not sure.

While debating the HT-6 we wondered if more people would be interested in bringing back the Fusion-6 MT and MTM instead of the HTM-6 or HT-6???

Basically we've come to a point where we're not exactly sure what people want. Unfortunately the more kits that get done as a shot in the dark and don't break even on cost, the more money is taken away from other projects that people might want. Fusion-4, Fusion-6, HTM-6, Marksman, Ares, Marksman Pro, Maximus-12, Magnum-12, Titan-615, Cinema-10, 893, Concentric-8, Continuum, Beta Vee, and some others never broke even on cost.

Having said that, I know we need to get some smaller kits done. There were plans to redo the Fusion-8's with a new woofer and the SEOS-8 back in late 2017. That's why I didn't get more flat packs cut for the originals. As many of you know the designer (Jeff) had some big health issues and got a kidney transplant so it wasn't done in 2018. Another speaker designer could have reworked the kit, but I didn't feel like that was the right thing to do.

Curt and I thought the 8" Cobalt MT and MTM's would do good and people would consider them as an alternative because there were many people asking for a high sensitivity dome tweeter speaker kit. MT, MTM, center channel, and a matching angled surround were done. 100 flat packs for each of those....excited to get them on the site.......I think only 10 kits total have been built in one year. Break even point: maybe 25 years at the current rate.

That's why we're all kind of cautious and debate what new models to do or which originals should be revamped. But I don't like to just sit and stagnate either. So there will be more small, big, and crazy kits done either way.
Here are my thoughts:

- I'm impressed by the variety of speaker kits you offer. It might help to par them down to the essentials.
- The drive to get more reviews out there really helps. Is there a way to get prototypes demod at GTGs before committing to production? That way interest can be drummed up from attendee reviews. People are always wary of dipping their toes into diy designs and need assurances that it is worth the trouble.
- For new designs it might be a good idea to require buy-in first. A group buy would be good though I understand it can run into problems. Maybe a wait list and only once enough people sign on is when the project moves forward?
- Make people aware of the limited availability - That kits may be discontinued, and to plan accordingly. And possibly list sales charts. That way potential customers get an incentive to get off their backside and buy before the kits run out. I know I was caught out by the discontinuation of a couple of kits. A way to do so could be to list batch information for each product. Doesn't have to be detailed, just to make potential customers aware that availability is not perpetual.

*Edit: ..And links to relevant AVS discussion threads and reviews in the product notes in order to engage potential buyers. Customers may have trouble figuring out the goals of a design, and why they should pick it, without the background information.

At the end of the day I am in awe of what you've pulled off. An incredible resource for DIY kits!!
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Last edited by impreza276; 01-31-2019 at 06:22 AM.
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post #117 of 286 Old 01-31-2019, 06:35 AM
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Having said that, I know we need to get some smaller kits done. There were plans to redo the Fusion-8's with a new woofer and the SEOS-8 back in late 2017. That's why I didn't get more flat packs cut for the originals. As many of you know the designer (Jeff) had some big health issues and got a kidney transplant so it wasn't done in 2018. Another speaker designer could have reworked the kit, but I didn't feel like that was the right thing to do.
Is there any benifit to using the SEOS vs the EOS besides maybe vertical dispersion? I know the main reason I bought the Fusion 8 besides glowing reviews and respect for the designer was the looks. That EOS just looks so much nicer than the SEOS and blends so well visually with round drivers. I have htm-12s in the theater but I just don't like the look of the squaty wave guides when they're in a room that puts them on display. It's a personal thing of course. I wish the f10 was available with EOS as I'd love to build a larger version of what I have now.

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post #118 of 286 Old 01-31-2019, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by cdy2179 View Post
Is there any benifit to using the SEOS vs the EOS besides maybe vertical dispersion? That EOS just looks so much nicer than the SEOS and blends so well visually with round drivers. I have htm-12s in the theater but I just don't like the look of the squaty wave guides when they're in a room that puts them on display. It's a personal thing of course.
Lots of info about that in the big SEOS design thread that would explain it better than I can. The SEOS also allows for closer spacing between the woofer and tweeter which allows a lower crossover point. One nice that doesn't really have to do with the original SEOS design idea is that it also allows for shorter speakers. The HTM-12 with an EOS waveguide would have to be about 4" taller. The 1099 center would be almost 3" taller which really cuts down on where it could fit.

I can see using the EOS design for full range tower speakers where the height or vertical dispersion might not matter as much. I made some of those a couple years ago with an EOS-12 and considered using them for a full range Fusion line.
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post #119 of 286 Old 01-31-2019, 07:57 AM
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Making all the flat packs and whatnot certainly adds to the cost. For me personally I would prefer a bare bones kit, or just the front baffle from 3/4" MDF. Also, and I know this is going to sound a bit weird, but the form factor is a big driver. There are those that have AT screens and can put up whatever, but then there are folk what's got a TV and need something reasonably sized to fit either just above it just below the TV.

The other factor is room size. So, in the end based on room size and TV the number of designs could be paired down as long as there isn't a gap in the form factor. The fusion 8 center is a good example of that -- it's about as big as you can get and still keep it under the TV. I was always going to get the cinema 8s (MTM) over the fusion 8s because I wanted two 8s to better mesh with the subs and I was attached to the very high efficiency. A 10" would have ended up with a wider box and a 10" MTM would have been too large. Sometimes it's not exactly about ultimate performance, but what will work within the confines of your room. But that's just me.

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post #120 of 286 Old 01-31-2019, 08:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kennyandersen View Post
Making all the flat packs and whatnot certainly adds to the cost. For me personally I would prefer a bare bones kit, or just the front baffle from 3/4" MDF.
The option is there to buy the kits with just the front baffle, and at no shipping cost. That is an awesome value!
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