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-   -   Great Heil thoughts and guidance please (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/155-diy-speakers-subs/3068740-great-heil-thoughts-guidance-please.html)

JonfromCB 05-21-2019 09:54 AM

Great Heil thoughts and guidance please
 
I've always loved the great Heil because it's the only driver I've heard that leaves me with the illusion that cymbals are actually in the room. Driven by that, I'm considering a three way design using the great heil. I'm unable to find tried and true designs or consensus that it would be wise to attempt especially in regards to the crossovers. Does anyone know of any acknowledged and available designs using the Heil?

So I'm looking for opinions and input here. Are there other "extremely brilliant" drivers that can come close to the cymbal realism from the Heil? If so, that seems like it might be the
route to a more predictable and successful build. Emphasis on: an acknowledged plan/design that really makes the dynamics of drums and cymbals come alive would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Trimlock 05-21-2019 11:28 AM

There are a couple of Heil builds on DIYAudio forums. Even though I own the large Heil's I'll admit that I don't think they are that special. They can be crossed lower, they have excellent sensitivity and if properly placed in the room can give great characteristics. If placed on top of a good woofer these offer very good performance, especially for their new price.

JonfromCB 05-21-2019 06:32 PM

Thanks, I understand and agree, but not quite what I was asking.

asarose247 05-21-2019 07:01 PM

1 Attachment(s)
got my curiosity up
after viewing the freq. range for drums and cymbals,
seems like it should be easy to do given how limited it is

How many different rooms have you heard these Heils in ?
and
They sounded fantastically the same every time?
and
at the same SPL every time?
and
You have some charts with before and after REQ, it shows where the brilliance comes in. .
and
Can't 'brilliance' be a matter of boosted EQ, the room notwithstanding?
and
Other extremely Brilliant drivers like what you're asking for

perhaps others here can speak to their knowledge of such performing equipment

still feels like something is missing . .

Javs 05-26-2019 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonfromCB (Post 58078888)
I've always loved the great Heil because it's the only driver I've heard that leaves me with the illusion that cymbals are actually in the room. Driven by that, I'm considering a three way design using the great heil. I'm unable to find tried and true designs or consensus that it would be wise to attempt especially in regards to the crossovers. Does anyone know of any acknowledged and available designs using the Heil?



So I'm looking for opinions and input here. Are there other "extremely brilliant" drivers that can come close to the cymbal realism from the Heil? If so, that seems like it might be the

route to a more predictable and successful build. Emphasis on: an acknowledged plan/design that really makes the dynamics of drums and cymbals come alive would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Check out the Beyma TPL150. Check out my builds in my sig. I've got 7 of them in my room.

I've also got in depth hands on time with a few different ESS speakers. My father and grandfather both have a set, they are great, but the TPL definitely surpasses them. I have a pair of heils under the house gathering dust ;)

Same great transient response. But can handle significantly more power and SPL. Clearest tweeter I've heard.

JonfromCB 05-26-2019 09:09 AM

Asarose247, Javs, Thanks for the replies. I had a pair of ESS AMT 1Bs purchased in the late 70s. I was in the military and moved them quite a bit. I have a high degree of confidence that I've probably set them up in more types, sizes, and shapes of rooms than perhaps anyone. Having access to the military "audio clubs" in the 80s, I had quite a few very good speakers during that time ...JBLs, Infiniti's, Dahlquist's, ARs,,and others so I was able to A/B them with the best in their day and regardless of all their faults and weaknesses they "just worked" for me. To answer your question, I always found the Ess/Heil as easy or easier to adjust to the room than many other speakers with simple placement and tow-in and controlling how live or dampened the room. I'm sure it's both the speed and bi-directional pattern and reflections of the Heil AND the reflections/delay from the rear radiator that make the magic in my brain...increasingly over time I've grown fonder of OB and bi-directional sources because they most realistically reproduce how sound radiates from drums and cymbals as compared to any point source speaker reproducing even the best recordings. I chalk it up to my preference for what musicians hear from many instruments and musicians around them which is much less point source sound....as compared to what comes out of eq'd monitors or recorded, processed and played back via point source.

Javs, Can you recommend any TPL150 three way designs I can chase down and listen too? I've also thought about using a second wide dispersion back firing/directively adjustable tweeter that allows me to adjust level and direction of reflected high end. Thanks guys, I appreciate your thoughts and input. Happy Memorial Day.


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